Starscream

This is a good thought. As it is, games have an unlimited lifespan. No used games could actually limit that lifespan. Something I didn't consider.

Why shouldn't brick and mortar stores make money multiple times on a single product? They are in the business of selling used goods, regardless of what the product is or how many of a specific item they have. The creator puts their product out there and the market decides how successful it is. They sink or swim on the quality of their marketing, product integrity, and price point. The gaming industry doesn't deserve any special consideration compared to other industries just because they feel entitled to profits from the resale of their product. If the creator wants to make money multiple times on the same game, I suggest they get in the used games business. Or plead with their publishers about some form of buy-back program. Otherwise, maybe they should try the things I mentioned in an earlier post. Maybe, just maybe, it's not a matter of consumers "wanting something for free", "being miserly", or feeling "entitled". Maybe it's the publisher's business model, their budget, and their price points that need some serious reconsideration. Consider this: - There is no data that suggests a used game sale would have equated to a new game sale had the used product not been available. I don't know anyone who buys a new used game at GameStop just to save $5 (maybe we should conduct a poll?). - More and more people may drop out of the hobby if used sales are stopped. Those people that used to buy used games are now buying no games at all. Do you know what publishers will do after that? Whine about how piracy is killing their sales when there is no evidence of that, either. They will never own up to their own mistakes when there's a perfectly good army of strawmen out there. Once they eradicate used games and piracy, they will probably whine about how mobile devices are stealing money from them and that they deserve a piece of that. But that's for tomorrow's headlines. You actually bring up good points. I don't have any idea if used games or piracy hurt intial sales. Do you know if DLC was removed from a game just to be sold later on at an additional cost? In the gamer community, the answer to the first part is no, yes to the second part. I don't think either can easily be determined. There is nothing wrong at all with Gamestop as a business doing what they do - sell used merchandise. What is fundementally wrong with the devs eliminating that step and making sure they receive all profits from sales? Nothing at all. Same practice, no middle man. As I pointed out, the game industry as it is, generates one sale, one chance at profits. If they can change that profit margin,without asking more money for their product, they should. How is that a special consideration. You still think they are just like every other industry? FWIW, I disagree completely with everything you just said. I don't have a problem with ANYONE in the gaming industry making money, but as their customer, that money comes from me, and as me, I have the right to decide how I'm going to part with it. The issue in the past few years hasn't been "entitlement from the gamers, thinking the industry owes them games for no money", rather, it's been "entitlement from the producers, thinking the gamers owe them profits, for no effort." Time and time again, we've been hearing execs and other company mouthpieces say "this is they way it is, and they'll have to get used to it" every time they raise prices, or remove features, or in other ways take away from us the choices we've had for decades. Yes, they have a right to try and do it... but NO, we don't have to take it, and deciding that we reject their new business model doesn't make us misers. Sure, in a business, you don't want to leave money on the table... but in a SMART business, you know what money will cost you more to gain than it'd be worth. Could the game companies shut down used game stores? Sure... but I'd suggest that the cost of shutting them down, combined with the damage from the bad PR, would end up showing them a very negative return. The money they spent shutting down Gamestop could be better spent... oh, I dunno, MAKING BETTER GAMES! Finally, if you think the video game industry is lacking in ways to make new money on the same old product... I might ask where you've been lately, and have you heard of this awesome new game called "Pac-Man"? The industry is booming, online gaming is growing and growing, and games are becoming bigger. So if sales are booming, who then, doesn't like what's being done? This makes no sense. Kinda like GM had problems because they built stuff nobody wanted but were the global sales leader in the auto industry for decades. How exactly do you sell the most and not make what people want? This argument just simply does not work.Game sales are up, but it's forced against everones will? How?! If anyone wanted to shut down Gamestop, then why would they give them exclustivity to in game items/DLC? When was the LAST price increase on games? When the 360 came out. Before that? Maybe 1990 games became $50. Where are you guys coming up with these constant increases? They haven't happened. What "no effort"? Not including the wii, how many current gen games have been total and utter crap? I'll say 50%. Maybe some are too ambitious and fall short, maybe some are overhyped, maybe some just miss the mark. If every game was 100% perfect, I could STILL come here and see complaining. Does someone who makes $100,000.00 a year work better and harder than someone who makes $15000.00? Who gives less effort? I need to know. I'm not against anything anyone has said in here. Everyone has good points. I also don't think I am right. But I have yet to see valid and realistic arguements. I think the devs have the most reasonable arguements. Gamestop can make multiple sales. Devs shouldn't. Why? Increasing costs of games, enough is enough. When did this happen? Paying too much as it is Why and to what standard? Games suck now Why are sales increasing? ( could also search this forum and see the identical complaints from 10 years ago, yet sales keep increasing) Collectors don't like this. Since when do a group of people who find a secondary reason to make a purchase of a product become the standard? I own it, I can do what I want with it. Very true. If that comes to an end, will you adapt? I should make money, everyone else already makes enough. Why? Who determines? Game budgets are too big Huh? I just like to complain and have conversation Ok, I am totally with everyone on this

Not specifically talking to you but... What kind of arguement is that? I didn't ask for speed rated tires, supporting welfare leechers that can only produce more kids to get more of my money so they can do crack, I didn't ask for a bad economy, and I certainly didn't ask for a low rez system with crappy motion controls and an exercise game. There's tons of stuff I didn't ask for. I do expect evolution and revolution in tech driven stuff. Sure I can go buy an ipad and get 1 speaker built in, like most devices had for 8 or so decades, or I can realistically expect that a tech driven device should be up to par give or take 2 years. Better graphics are an evolution, achievments are a revolution and both fit very well for technology segment that they are part of. Buy a wii, it will provide you with everything you want. No 3d, no online, very little if any dlc, cheap budget games without good graphics. See? What you want is available right now. But if I was to guess, that wouldn't make you happy either. Understandably btw. So you are kinda bitching without any real substance to bitch. Prices too high for new games? Not if you ask me. The value that dollar amount gives to each customer will vary, but a slim increase of roughly $20 in 3 decades is insignificant for how much more the games have evolved in those 3 decades. Being cheap isn't justification for claiming things aren't worth their cost. So we covered price and features, all that's left is greed I suppose. These devs see money sitting on the table that somebody else is helping themselves to. Nobody is at fault for this, but good business sense says let's take another look. Why should a brick and mortar flea market make money multiple times on the same game, but the creator can't? Stop and let that sink in. In every industry everyone keeps trying to compare this to, the creator CAN make money multiple times. Games, not yet. So you wanna compare, fine let the devs stop used sales or charge for online passes. If not, then don't compare because there isn't a common ground to do so. The cheap and collector in everyone here is breeding this reasoning why this is so evil of the devs, take that mentality out and you can see a different picture. I don't collect, I'm not cheap, and I have a business. Only fools would leave money on the table for someone else. Fools don't make a business grow. Fools don't succeed. There isn't one of you that would pass up a pay raise even if you didn't work harder for it. You would never pay me to be a middleman to go get your games. Not one of you would leave any money sitting on the table. Don't be so judgemental with this corporate greed BS that is the internet sensation. Making money isn't dirty and evil, making lots of money is cool. These guys aren't greedy for wanting to make more money without raising game prices. What's greedy is wanting cheap games because you're a miser, all the bells and whistles for free, the entitlement that YOU deserve what you want and everyone else has enough and can make do, while you totally are worth way more than you get paid.

I'm not gonna be popular, but, I agree with the devs. Books - Not too much money involved in creating, publishing and fairly inexpensive to purchase. Music - Concerts, merchandise, fees to use music on the radio, etc all generate good income on top of the sale of the cd or song Movies - 1 showing at a theater has many paying customers, rentals, fee for HBO and the like Netflix, etc, retail sales, networks eventually showing them in prime time. Some serious bank can be made for years Games - may cost quite a bit up front to make, sell it, no additional income can be generated with the exception of rentals but I haven't seen anything suggesting the publisher directly supplies rental companies, in some cases servers need to be maintained Cars - Because I know someone will try to make them seem the same, they aren't and won't ever be so no need to get into that. The system will be changing for sure. Remember when we only wanted to buy 1 song from an album and couldn't? They tried cd singles, but way too much $$$ then Napster came along and changed the system. Apple provided a perfect legal vehicle and the music industry, as far as sales go, is changed forever. These devs, they work hard even if the game sucks. All of them for the most part are really trying to provide some good stuff with all that's available now like 3d, online, dlc, achievments ,etc. Alot is new to them too, so growing pains are expected. Once that game is sold, they can't make another dime from it unlike other industries that everyone wants to keep comparing them to. DLC? Sure, but how much? I think Online pass is a great solution. Online rentals thru the respective system would be great. 1 week rental, $15, beat the game and no worries. Cheaper than new or used, no shelf space needed, good value for everyone. I know everyone is used to the idea that you bought, own it, can do what you want. None of us would be on this site if it wasn't for used games. But I don't see the problem with that changing.

It makes no sense. MS isn't really hurt by used game sales ( first party but not too many of those) so I see no benefit whatsoever for them to impliment something like this.

http://www.joystiq.com/2012/01/12/npd-xbox-360-earns-6-7-billion-in-2011/

Yup, too bad too, Netflix isn't worth paying for once. Think you can swing $4 a month? About 14 cents a day. You can't even feed a starving kid overseas on that kinda bank.

Maybe people are waiting to see what the 1st major firmware update removes.

Ok so now this? http://www.joystiq.com/2011/12/30/nintendo-ea-and-sony-also-rescind-sopa-support/

My opinion may be unpopular regarding this but, let's see what anonymous can do. Just read Google, Facebook, twitter, and amazon are planning blackouts in response to sopa. Together with anonymous, a huge impact can be made. Way I see it, somebody is looking to control what I am going to be able to do and the lasting affects of big industry and the government would totally not be the most beneficial, so I am more than content for some temporary setbacks because of anon and the others because the affects may benefit us all in the long run. I'll tell ya though, I honestly cannot even believe we are all in the state we are now, everything, in this whole entire world. Totally screwing up my whole vision of what the future was gonna be.

You really should look into ONLIVE, Starscream. It sounds like a really good fit for you. Yea I know. I was able to beta it but never did. I was kinda being a smartass but at the same time, I really would prefer that type of service.

I'm all for going all digital, but I don't collect. I'd rather not have to go get a game or wait for it to be mailed if I can sit on my couch and have it instantly. I would however, prefer a subscription model where I can play an unlimited amount of games for x amount of dollars.No need for storage space on a console for games or saves. It would be a nice model if the console was around $100 and a monthly fee of even $75 to play whatever was available. Sign me up.

gears is the best so far mainly towards the end underwater. I had issues with crysis because in 3d the text was too small to read. In any case, I love games in 3d.

360 did over 800k on black Friday alone. About 1 million that week.

The original Xbox turns 10 today. Like them or hate them, MS changed gaming in so many good ways and I hope we see them around for at least 10 more. Halo also turns 10. Every once in a great while does a game come around that won't be forgotten and Halo has left it's mark. Gonna go fire up the Anniversary Edition now, can't wait to spend some time again with my favorite game of all time.

Yup. Picked up a Samsung Plasma 3d this past January. Love 3d movies, but generally, the PS3 has very few games I am interested in so I can't comment on anything other than the Killzone demo which was cool. Currently, I am playing Gears Of War 3 in 3d on the 360 and it's freakin sweet. Looking very forward to Halo CE in 3d too.

This sounds more like a random generator than actually having to do with the PS3 hacking. Happens to checking accounts all the time. First clue is the low charge, then, if I was to guess, the second charge was made within 4 minutes. The first charge was to see if it was an actual account that was generated, after the charge goes through, the second, and more often than not, final charge is made.

Same here, initial DL update and nothing with Reach.

I'm in.

You will need to restart and make sure before going through any gates that open, it says checkpoint on the screen. Can't remember how many there are but you need em all. Don't forget to go in the one underground tunnel (just before the Banshees come out I think) and get the unlimited ammo rocket launchers. Makes things more fun

ohhh ok, I remember that now.... Tantrum Blue, right? I forgot you're XBL screen name.. It's hard to rememeber names when some people have a XBL name that's different from their AA name. Is starscream your XBL name? sorry if it's not... kinda off topic, anyone wanna help me beat 3 levels in reach on legendary? -rick btw: good luck with odst Metal Ghost... hit those checkpoints.. I am Bl1tzw1ng on there If I'm on, I'll be glad to play some Reach.

Actually, the achievement will only unlock if you reach every single checkpoint on the highway level. It is technically possible to advance through without hitting a checkpoint. So it isn't a glitch, it's really you missing a checkpoint. I think me and Tantrum did that with you Rick. Remember how we had to keep shooting the Banshees until it said "checkpoint"?

I hope the wii has better titles than Kinect, it's been out 9 years longer.

I would have to say Halo Reach. Being as the other thread has it rated overrated so much, it is now an under appreciated game.