Starscream

Technically only once is required. Anything after that is a choice.

Yea just like Nintendo. Why?

Ok, read up a little. Looks to be Move compatible, has a touchpad on the controller, comes out Holiday 2013, appears that you can upload in game play to social networks, Vita remote play, and backwards compatible through downloads, No price that I can see, and I didn't see a picture of the unit itself. Has a good list of developers onboard, and some Killzone footage.

Sony had a live conference not too long ago about the PS4. I didn't read too much but I figured I'd start a thread so everyone can continue to talk about how this will destroy video games, Sony is evil, etc

Ok so I read the article again and I'm still scratching my head. I believe the 360 was the 1st console to support indie games about 4-5 years ago (?) and this was before the smartphone/tablet craze of $1.00 games. Microsoft did indeed see the potential and entry cost at the time of it's introduction wasn't far-fetched. The hoops that an indie had to go through at that time also weren't unrealistic. Now, today, that landscape has changed. Well, I guess realistically it started to change about 4-5 years ago. I don't think anyone then could guess what was going to happen with 360 indie games, ipod/iphone apps/games, or the upcoming Android based devices. So this whole part of his argument is......pointless. Jeep, for example, didn't know LED lighting was going to become very inexpensive or common when they made the Liberty 2007, so did they really miss the boat overall? The fact alone that the 360 was out BEFORE any of this stuff took place weakens his argument. But they did not have a good model for developers, that can't be denied. If his anger should be pointed anywhere, it should be at Nintendo. The wii was the perfect vehicle to deliver cheap cheap cheap games to tons of people, many of whom, didn't want any intricacies to the games they played. Problem is, Nintendo didn't believe in the "fad" of online infrastructures and did nothing but slam indies. But I guess if this guy had ties to MS, then he's more compelled to talk of disappointments about them instead on the indie crusade he "claims" to support. It's reasonable to state Sony MS and Nintendo dropped the ball on something nobody knew was going to happen. Live and learn. The Apple TV thing. Wow, ummm, yeah. I have an Apple TV. I like it. It works as I expect and does a great job. It's not a gaming device. It could possibly be one with some improvements and a controller but then what do you have? Pretty much the upcoming OUYA. So, besides a different APP store, what exactly is the idea? I keep seeing all this news and love for these cheap game devices for indie games that will be inexpensive. Has anyone ever taken a look at all of the indie games in any App store? Is it unrealistic to claim that most of it sucks? Does sucking for a dollar mean better value than sucking for $40-$60? Sucky is sucky no matter how you deliver it or how much you pay for it. The games industry has always had more weak spots in software than strengths. Will OUYA change that? An Apple device? No. To me, it just all plays out like a rebirth of the whole industry that will come to the same conclusion. OUYA UNO is replaced a year later by OUYA DOS but is more powerful. OUYA TRES is more powerful. Apple igame has 32 gig storage, igame mini does 1080p, igame2 had a 10 core processor, etc, etc. Isn't that where we are right now? We all love to dislike Microsoft, Sony, Nintendo, sometimes one or two of them, sometimes all. What problems have they caused? From where I'm sitting, the past 3 decades or so, have not delivered hardware that sucked. Some were expensive, some too ambitious, some misguided, but all were capable of delivering good entertainment. The problems have always been at the software end. Does anyone think you won't hear complaints from any of these indies that game size limits are the issue, storage, online, ram, controllers on and on and on? They do that now, what's going to change? There are many types of games. All good games have depth in one way or another. Mario platform series games work because they challenge just enough, are whimsical and have a feel good vibe at say a $40 price point. Angry Birds works because, even though it's physics based, it doesn't frustrate, and even though it's repetitive, it can hold your interest for short periods,,for about $2. COD series delivers graphics, story, and huge online mutliplayer experience for about $60. They all offer more than a price point, they offer an entertaining experience. Why is this concept so hard for people to grasp? You are going to end up with just as many crappy $2 games as you will $60 crappy games. I'm lost on this whole concept.

wonder how so many can't grasp the concept that cheap can't replace depth.

Same thing happened with the Gamecube and it still did ok. Did anyone believe for a second anyways that Rayman was gonna clean shelves of systems?

I totally agree. I have no issues with sequels myself. I also have no issue with reissues of games. But Nintendo doesn't love anyone, just their wallets.

lol

Wait...wut? Nintendo? The company that's repackaged the same hardware in 2 markets for the past decade and has been reselling the same games on different media some of which is 2 1/2 decades old? Yea, Nintendo doesn't treat anyone like a bank account lol. Trust me, if they had enough knowledge to set up an online network that mattered and worked they'd be selling the dots for the mushrooms to you for another few decades.

It was the knitting right?

Nope, I'm serious. For that 1 crappy game you used as an example, I could rattle off 50 that DLC has added to the experience without even really getting started. Atarifever gave an example of what most DLC has been about with his Halo example. The doomsday prediction of what DLC was going to do 8 years ago never happened. Yes it's not perfect but should we have a zero tolerance policy on something like DLC? Not any allowance for growing pains? Experiments? It's silly. I'm a few days younger than dirt and I still don't get everything right on a daily basis. Why is it that other things that don't hit the mark 100% of the time are a ripoff? I mean, if you misspell a word in your post, I wouldn't think you are a failure. Mistakes and imperfections just kind of happen. As for the video, yea, I don't really have much to say..... but the video's of angry video game players who post videos for video game players to watch that always complain and moan about the state of video games but yet both the narrator and his/her audience spend a great deal of time playing video games, don't leave an impression on me. Seriously, I googled some knitting stuff and knitting forums and websites seem to have much less angst. I'm thinking some people on here just picked the wrong thing to, ahem...."enjoy" during their lifetimes. Knitting may be a good thing for some peeps on here.

lol microtransactions haven't destroyed games. all this doomsday stuff constantly is humorous and silly. they are games. entertainment. how do you react to the important things in life?

I'll still get one. MS hasn't disappointed me in the past 11+ years for video games and entertainment. They are pretty smart. Hey do you guys remember the discussions on here in 2004 about microtransactions destroying games? Yea, you would have to buy a weapon to play a game or you could buy Madden but the actual football wouldn't be included and poor gamers would only get like a straw with one spitball in deathmatch but the rich kids would always win cuz microtransactions would let them but a rocket launcher. Wow good memories........we should do that again. Wait.....my bad

Final thoughts on all of this. I already said that this is my favorite game series ever and the games individually are probably all in my top 10. While I always said it was a great series, I finally figured out why. All of the games never sacrifice anything along the way. Campaign isn't half baked for a great Multiplayer experience, both are always equal. Graphics aren't concentrated on more than controls. Character development isn't shallow just to make the story bigger. Weapons and vehicles aren't so over the top so your character can just waltz through a challenge. Enemies aren't dumb and predictable to make you feel like a hero, you really do have to earn it. Even in the event of say Halo 2 where the game wasn't the one they wanted to release and had a very disjointed story line, the overall game and it's ingredients still came together very well done. Somewhat linear gameplay is still somehow not so linear in HOW you play. This series has a certain passion behind it. It's Microsofts baby and they are very protective of it. Bungie existed for this series for over a decade, this is what they lived for. 343 needs to carry that torch and so far so good. At no point in any of the series can you think or see that everyones heart wasn't 100% into what they were creating. If nothing else, it's refreshing to have that in not only the video game market but also entertainment in general. I would never argue if it's the best series ever or even say they are perfect. One thing that can't be denied is everything these games do, they do very well with a shine that a majority of games never achieve. I've really enjoyed everyones thoughts so far on these games. I think it's really cool who likes which best and which are disliked. Judging from this thread, it's apparent that even as these are dismissed as FPS games that always have sequels, that there is obviously enough difference from game to game that each comes off as unique experience on it's own.

Alright just played through ODST today. Going into it, I didn't remember a whole lot. Out of all of the Halo games, this one is totally dependent on the story being told. Without the story, it's just a few short missions that seem pointless. Playing though it on easy I think I died twice, by my own grenades so it was kind of a breeze. I do remember on Legendary it being pretty difficult because you can't take high jumps without damage and you need health packs. I've always thought of this game as 2 parts - night stuff and day stuff. Not going to lie, the night missions are not very enjoyable. They are cool and not too long but I don't enjoy them because there is nothing to see. I've always considered the Halo games as a visual experience as well as many other great aspects and when that aspect is removed, it doesn't hold my interest. I just rushed around to get them over with but I did get all the terminals and let them play to get the other ongoing story. Now the day missions are what you would expect from a Halo game. Hands down, I find Coastal Highway the best mission, but I also enjoyed capturing the Covenant dropship and following in Banshees. Overall, none of the missions take to long and aren't a far stretch from any typical Halo missions so again, it seems that the story is the main goal of this game. The game itself is very short, I'm thinking it only took about 2 1/2 hours for us to co-op though it. The story itself showing the roles everyone played in the overall war, is a decent story but I guess because it's very short, it seems kind of plain to me. Thinking back, Firefight is where ODST stood out. Even now I think it was the only good Firefight Mode and some of those achievements I still don't have. Also, to anyone that messages me while I'm on XBL, I'm not being a dick and ignoring you, I forgot I turned off Notifications during split screen a few weeks back. When a Notification pops up during the game, the bottom screen ( mine cuz Foxy is boss) gets blocked and it annoyed me. So Notifications are off and I don't see that someone is trying to contact me. Moycon, I wrote this because of you!

Think you get 'chieves for it so that should double your interest

thats good to know. may have to play it with kinect

Yes the multiplayer went kinda wrong in Reach. There was no balance which left Armor Lock so powerful and a huge advantage as a load out. They did at least attempt to rectify it somewhat with I think a 5 on 5 Team Slayer with no load outs but still..... Halo 2 to me hands down had the best multiplayer. We did split screen and it seemed to only black screen when you attempted to switch to old graphics. There were some glitches and even though they said they left it alone, they did add terminals and a few small things. I think the controls were perfect since Halo 3. Halo CE is very sluggish and vehicle controls are very loose. It was something I didn't notice until I played them all in a few days span. With each game you notice the tweaks with controls. Halo 2 got the horn on the Warthog which means nothing but I still hold that trigger in the whole time, the Ghosts got boost which really made for a better experience. Dual wield was introduced in 2 and carried to 3 and the kickback form certain guns and control was nailed in 3.Halo 4 has bigger character models which lead to better accuracy and more flexibility with the weapons. If you play them all as they were released, you really notice improvements.

There isn't any logical reason why ODST wasn't included. As we played through, I grabbed ODST and said " Not sure if I wanna play this right now" and Foxy said " Skip it". So we did. But, we will go through it this weekend more than likely and I can tell you what I think. I don't remember much of it because I mainly played Firefight but I do recall thinking it was an excellent addition to the series. I also didn't include Halo Wars because I never played it. I'm not interested in that style of game. But, I did watch all of the story scenes and the story of it was incredible. Few things I forgot in the original post. In the Halo series so far, there are actually 5 factions fighting for different goals at the same time. Everyone has their own agendas/beliefs/goals. Master Chief aligns with them all at one point or another. The Flood, The Covenant, UNSC, Elites, and Brutes. The story has so many things going on for so many different reasons that it's hard not to look at it from every view point and respect some seriously great story telling. Now we have the Forerunners who have just been mentioned until Halo 4 and the Prometheans. This is Star Wars but in a less fantasy sort of way. In fact, I've always felt it was a perfect replacement for Star Wars and probably explains why I've shifted my focus entirely to Halo over the past 10 years. I'm not a reader so I've never read any of the books but I do have a general knowledge of what happens in them. Another major thing I forgot regarding Halo 4 is the Spartan Ops side story. Big props to 343 for adding this to Halo 4 and getting a deeper look into exactly what you are fighting for and against. Just like ODST, the non heroic characters aren't forgotten and the impact of what they do gives a vision of how huge this battle is without ever caring about good and evil. Like the attention to detail in every game, nothing ever seems insignificant. Any time you guys wanna play, you know I'm good to go

Figured I'd put this in Modern Gaming instead of Xbox forum as there are PC versions. Hope that's cool. Haters welcome in this thread. It won't matter. On a whim, me and Foxy decided to play the Halo series again but this time one after another withouta gap of time in between. I really never did this before and figured being it is my favorite series ever, so why not? This more about campaign and not so much about multiplayer. Started off of course with Halo Combat Evolved. We played the Anniversary Edition with updated graphics. First off, wow, did I spend lots of time back in the day with this game. I couldn't even guess exactly how many times I played through it. Playing on Legendary as we always have happened to be frustrating. We got our asses handed to us through and through but it did bring back many great memories. I had actually forgotten quite a bit of the game and how huge it really was. Oddly, it ended up being my least favorite of the series after playing though all of them. Don't get me wrong, this game stands up well to time and was an incredible experience on it's own, but with company of other games in the series, it feels pretty weak. Seemed to be lots of non action periods, wandering to the next battle and not much happening until you get there. It could be because you move slow, like 95 year old walking pace slow. I had mentioned back when the Anniversary Edition was released that Halo CE was my favorite game ever but I can no longer say that. I found myself wanting to get it over with instead of enjoying the ride. Excellent story, Chief is awesome, and many epic moments, but just didn't engage me like the others. Halo 2 Starting the second Halo, I really only remembered a few things so I was looking forward to playing it. It wasn't a fan favorite, the story split between Arbitor and Master Chief was always a sore spot and I recall everyone hating the end. Anyways, we did this on Normal difficulty and it was still challenging for the most part. Graphics are dated but hands down, best music in any of the Halo games period. To me, this was actually more interesting than CE and a really great story. I didn't mind the Arbitor/MC split at all and as we played through, I remembered how many outstanding scenes and scenery this game had. Some of the visuals were mind blowing. Also, the amount of time spent in vehicles was huge, and I forgot about that. Seriously awesome experience from start to finish and I think one fine game that could stand on it's own. Halo 3 Again, normal difficulty. This one I remembered some stuff going in, but playing through was pleasantly surprised at it's overall awesomeness. Great story, great graphics, good music, and tons of vehicle time again. This one had tons of humor and great interaction with NPC's. It was a blast start to finish and once again, polished in most every way. Character interaction is a benchmark that I still don't think has even come close to being topped. Reach Ok, this to me was the best Halo game and after playing it again, it still is but only by a slim margin. Halo 3 really gives this a run for the money. I love this story and I love all the characters. This story and watching everyone make sacrifices for nothing gives a sense of complete hopelessness. Once the story unfolds and you get a sense of what is happening and what needs done, it's a non stop ride til the end. The visuals in this game a so intense and huge that they actually seem to add to the feelings of how insignificant you are. This is some of the finest sci fi media ever. Graphics are incredible, music is good, character interaction is great. Halo 4. Check the Halo 4 thread for my thoughts there as they are still the same. That wraps up the Bungie made games. I miss Bungie. I really do. In the Halo 4 thread I had mentioned some things I wasn't fond of that 343 did. After playing these 4 games, I realized 343 really changed the overall vibe of the Halo series. Time will tell if it's because of the story or studio. I found myself laughing not only at grunts calling me a loser, but the UNSC troops arguing with each other or complaining you stole their kill. Or my all time favorite, letting a Marine drive you around in the Warthog and just watching disaster after disaster unfold. I miss the funny little things posted on computer screens or signs on the wall. I miss the great music. I miss the fact that the games just never took themselves too seriously. I miss Master Chief and Cortana being smartasses to everyone and each other. I miss what Bungie did so well. I'm not hating on 343 for everything. Halo 4, like all the games before it, has an exceptional story. They carried on the tradition of linear gameplay that somehow, you could play your way at your pace and never end up playing the same way twice. They also upheld the standard of probably the best enemy AI in video games. For those not familiar, playing Halo means you get your ass kicked and not by cheap shots. The enemies are smart and strong. They almost think as well as you can improvise. Then if you feel like being embarrassed, you play on Legendary. Hopping in a vehicle to do a mission is generally an option but adds so much to the gameplay. The weapons all have a purpose but you can always choose to do whatever you see fit. Sadly, these games are all dismissed as just "FPS games" but they are so much more. You'd be hard pressed to find such engrossing stories, interesting characters, weapons and vehicles, great gameplay, outstanding graphics, and so much polish and though into every single aspect even down to a mark on your armor. To me, this is sci fi and gaming at it's greatest.

Of course I will. By the time you get it, I should be on my 10th playthru

Agree with everything but it besting Halo 2 multiplayer. The lack of hearing the other team taunt, talk shit, or joke around was one of the best parts of Halo 2 multiplayer hands down. It is better then Reach multiplayer for the fact that Slayer maps now have vehicles again. After so many Halo games having the same basic MP, this one is taking some time to warm up to. Weapons being marked wasn't needed at all, and the lack of matchmaking gives an unbalance that was never an issue in the past. I won't comment on all of the good improvements as there are too many to remember. Yes the little touches have carried over, but the humor did not sadly, except for the part you noted. The grunts in Covenant in Reach, being it was a prequel, didn't have the ability yet to speak "English" so the whole tone was a bit different than what we had become used to. But the Marines, they still said funny crap and did funny crap. Overall, Reach had a serious and desperate undertone but the fun stuff from other characters was always present. There is none of that in Halo 4. Cortana says some smartass stuff and Chief has good things to say though, so all is not lost. Finished up Campaign on Legendary for the 2nd time tonight and after that play-through, the story is less confusing and extremely solid. In fact, the story is flat out awesome. I did notice that even though both times I played thru on Legendary, tonight, after the credits, the final part of the story, I got a quick extra scene. I won't spoil it, but it didn't make me too happy. Go out and buy it, you will not regret it.

My opinion is.....it's Halo 343 did a pretty good job with taking over as far as the campaign. I have yet to play multiplayer but from what I've heard, unfortunately it's trying to be a little closer to COD, which to me, is an awful thing. I won't comment until I play it myself though. Back to campaign......as always, a great story that is somewhat confusing and it's great having Chief back. Enemy AI is even better than previous games which means you're gonna die lots. Music is ok but probably the weakest part of the game. New weapons and revisions of old ones are refreshing but they are more scarce this time. I found myself many times with no bullets and running around to find something to use. Assassinations are back and extremely satisfying. You have a few new extras......you can run anytime instead of needing an ability and there are a few new abilities such as a shield to block enemy fire but you can't use your weapon while in use, and auto-turret, and Promethean vision. Shields seem to regenerate much slower. Graphics are probably the cleanest most polished I have seen. At some points, I swear it was really people acting. Once again, the in game engine is what's used for cutscenes, so the polish is full time. Everything has been tweaked like Master Chiefs armor, the weapons, every sound is new even for old weapons and vehicles. Speaking of vehicles, there are a few new ones to play around in. There's a Mech, the Broadsword ( I think), and the Pelican, in addition to older ones like the Warthog, Mongoose, Wraith, Ghost, and Banshee. If I were to rate it, I'd give it an 8. To me, Reach was perfect in every way. Halo 4 kinda falls short in a few places. There's no humor....at all. One thing I always loved about the Halo series was that it never took itself too seriously. The Marines and the grunts provided some really funny moments.....not this time. The tone is serious start to finish. Another thing is Chief talks way more than every other Halo game combined. I get why but I still am on the fence about it. All of the Bungie style touches are absent like a Marine looking at his weapon or The Chief touching something for no reason as he walks by.Maybe I am nitpicking but the Halo series always had it's own personality and it's kinda lost in Halo 4. Hopefully, it's just to introduce this new trilogy. 1 gameplay annoyance in my opinion, is you can now see a marker appear when a grenade is thrown close to you so you can avoid them. That shit coulda stayed in one of the testosterone oozing teenage angst game of the week shooters. Halo wasn't about holding your hand to get you through, it was about enjoying the ride with many WTF moments. Overall, as soon as you start to play, you know instantly that it's as Halo as Halo ever was and that's always a good thing.

Nintendo - Over-promising just to under-deliver again Microsoft - Wanting to take over pretty much everything, but still playing it too safe Sony - Still just aimlessly wandering So, yup, a rerun of the past 10 E3 expos.