x=usr(1536)
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Posts posted by x=usr(1536)
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Ok, I just found this being new to Atariage forums. Searching Indegogo for Ataribox yields nothing. There are no videos or even much information on their web site. Y'all talking about this back in June and now it's late November.
This, right here, explains a very large part of why this is (currently) a 113-page thread.
We're coming up on half-a-year of hype with nothing to show for it.
Until there's an ASIN or SKU assigned to it, it's vapourware. Pretty vapourware, but vapourware nonetheless.
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"Do you have any idea what it feels like to take a woman for twenty bucks?"
"No, I'm afraid that's a bit out of my league."-
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I can speak to this one. The video game had already been in development as production of the film began (the game then named "Agent X"); when Atari was consulted to provide a game as an element of the movie, they tweaked "Agent X" and renamed it Cloak & Dagger. Dabney Coleman's character was then named "Agent X" in the movie. The game saw limited arcade release. The arcade version of Cloak & Dagger appeared in 1983 prior to the release of the film.
Totally unrelated to anything Ataribox-related: I can claim a Six Degrees of Bacon connection to that film. Admittedly, it's tenuous, but I'm gonna roll with it
One of the Atari consoles in my collection is a Super Pong. It's still in the box, complete with styrofoam, manual, warranty card, etc.... And it also has the original sales receipt from when it was purchased new.
The receipt shows that it was sold through The Game Keeper store at the Glendale Galleria in Glendale, California. This was the location that was used for Morris' game store in the Cloak & Dagger film.
Hey, I said it was tenuous
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Question: Do they really need to list Doctor Pong sepprately from regular Pong? I thought Doctor Pong was just Pong in a special case.
I would hazard a guess that Doctor Pong was a trademark registered separately from Pong (or the other Pong variants), so having both listed may make sense even though the gameplay was identical.
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Coleco Chameleon II: Electric Boogaloo
To AtariBoxCorp, Inc.'s credit, they don't seem to have anyone on their development staff who has served time for multiple counts of felony Grand Theft committed against arcade game collectors. By way of comparison to the Chameleon fiasco, that puts them light-years ahead!
Well, as far as we can tell, anyway...
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Zenposting.
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The joystick is nice there is no doubt about it, however i hardly believe it will cut the cake for this day and age. Times have moved on and im getting flashbacks of the VW/Dodge gimmick of revamping the classic Beetle/PT cruiser. We all know how they just flew off the showroom floors with a wow factor... When in reality they only sparked the interest of a few, with the huge loss of R&D investments that most other motor companies are not whiling to risk.
Those two models may not be the best analogy for the point that you're making: both the PT Cruiser and New Beetle were sales successes (mainly in the North American market) with long model lifetimes (PT Cruiser, 2001-2010; New Beetle, 1998-2011 and 2012-present as the Beetle) and solid returns on investment for their respective manufacturers. Additionally, development costs for the pair were significantly lower than for a completely new model as both borrowed heavily from existing platforms - the Chrysler Neon in the case of the PT Cruiser, and the VW Golf in the case of the New Beetle.
As this relates to AtariBox, they could have used this approach to good effect by lowering manufacturing costs through buying in a pre-designed platform. And maybe they have: we don't really know what the tie-up with AMD is going to produce in that regard. But software is what sells systems, and a good software library could overcome reviews in which an off-the-shelf hardware design is mentioned.
I really want the Ataribox to succeed but without making the right moves this could turn into a disaster.
In a sense, it already has. There's no clear direction from leadership, a ton of hype with little to no substance behind it, and two other Atari products on the market (one of which has actually made it into consumers' hands) that have next to no relation to the AtariBox under development. It's a mess, and it doesn't bode well for AtariBoxCorp, Inc's ability to actually deliver on their promises; they're fitting many of the failed Kickstarter stereotypes to a T.
For any real chance of success the system needs a modern pack-in controller even if generic in design. You can't promote an open system running Linux and endless opportunities yet we're handing you this controller to work with; endless my backside, it has one button... You also can't say to those curious for the first time "well if you want a D pad then use a 360 controller". Makes the system you're promoting look like Joe' down the streets hack job prototype.
Point taken re: the pack-in controller. And, in defence of the controller that was shown, it really does have lovely aesthetics. But it doesn't seem to have good design, at least not from the standpoints of either customer expectations or human interface considerations.
That said, I don't think that having an 'open system' (a term that's still going undefined no matter how many times or for how long we keep mentioning it) is dependent on the controller in use. If anything, the 'open system' designation should at least imply a BYOC approach - if you don't like the (or don't have a) pack-in controller, provide your own. Linux has excellent support for virtually every type and variety of gaming controller out there, so this should be a no-brainer for them.
However, if that is the case, it needs to be communicated. And AtariBoxCorp, Inc. has been extremely poor at actually communicating. They certainly know how to hire PR flacks to generate a ton of cut-and-paste Twitter traffic, though.
Listen to the public and fans because negative news is more useful for then positive.
See above re: Twitter shitposting. The fact that they engaged in this (as well as their poor communications track record) is one reason why I am reluctant to accept the idea that they might actually receive, process, and understand valid criticism.
I hope they listen to all the feedback though.
I do too. I also hope that they understand the difference between 'listening to' and 'acting on'.
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Atari's dedicated consoles consisted of variations on Pong, Stunt Cycle and Video Pinball. That was pretty-much it (unless you count Video Music). Those titles are covered in the IP list (if you download the PDF - the Pong entry mentions "multiple platforms").
As for the computers - all that really matters are the software titles. Again, those are also covered in the IP list. Star Raiders for instance, mentions the 2600, 5200 and 8-bit computers.
Whether or not Atari still owns the hardware designs... it doesn't say. Presumably, all of that stuff stayed with the Atari Corp. properties.
Agreed that the software is the key; reproductions (as opposed to Flashback-style reinterpretations) of the 8-bit, ST, or console lines would be both ungodly involved to undertake and not likely to result in appreciable sales in relation to the development effort involved. Then again, as long as none of those devices would be required to accept a USB 3 cable, they might just pull it off
Having said that, given that some of the dedicated consoles were TTL devices, there is no software to work with, so the IP would be entirely hardware-related. Granted, that doesn't prohibit writing a simulation of it in software and using the original name to identify the version done in software - but if the IP rights of ownership are limited to software and identifying marks for that software, ownership of the rights to those consoles may be unclear.
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Not all arcade releases have asterisks, and not all home/arcade releases have duplicates. I can't figure out any pattern to it. Probably has to something to do with copyrights or trademarks.
Understood, and I caught that as well. There really doesn't seem to be a 100% discernible pattern, but the asterisks are weighted towards the arcade games.
I did go through the entire slide deck contained in that PDF, and amongst the things that stood out to me was that vector games were almost inevitably shown running on arcade hardware, not as home ports, with Tempest being a notable exception.
If this document can serve as any kind of roadmap for future Ataribox game releases (and I'm not saying that it does, but given ownership of the games' IP, it's not a stretch to say that it's likely not an unrealistic association to make), that brings up something of an interesting point: MAME would almost certainly have to be used for those games as (IIRC) it's the only currently-maintained arcade emulator capable of rendering a vector display on raster hardware. And if you're going that route for the vector games, might as well build it with MESS support and also knock out the 8-bit and ST line at the same time.
So, without trying to leap to conclusions but rather inferring what may be possible from the evidence presented, the Ataribox is likely to be a wrapper around a Linux distro running MAME. We could pretty much surmise that from the start, and it would make sense to take this route rather than reinventing the wheel several times over. But there's nothing really exciting about that, even if it does look nice.
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Atari CORP owns the stuff in Atari Vault. Arcade and VCS versions of Asteroids, Centipede, Missile Command, Super Breakout, and so on. The AtariBox people have that, plus their original (unlicensed) stuff on the Atari 2600/7800/5200/Lynx/Jaguar. I presume they have rights to the home computer line too, but they never talk about it. They rarely seem to do anything with platforms other than 2600 and arcade games, ostensibly because not enough people remember it. Which is probably true enough for business purposes.
You actually bring up something I've wondered about for a few years: who does have the rights to the 8-bit and ST computer lines these days?
The 5200 could possibly be an interesting corner case in that regard, given the number of titles that were common to both it and the 8-bit line with virtually no changes between them.
Thinking about it... Who owns the rights to the (mostly) pre-VCS dedicated consoles?
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I don't know what the asterisks are for, nor why there are several duplicate entries.
From what I can infer, the asterisks appear to indicate arcade releases. Duplicates may be explained by cases where there was both an arcade and home version of the same title.
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As it doesn't really have any special programming features that later machines lack, I wouldn't expect there to be any "made for 1200XL" software. Until the world had noticed that the 1200XL had arrived and software and books got "400/800/1200XL" stickers it was pretty much gone again and replaced by the 800XL.
Yeah, I see your point. I should have probably picked a better title for the thread.
What I'm really after is anything that shows off the 1200XL's unique features - or bugs. Granted, it's not really all that far off from other XL-series machines, but from what I've read it does have its own quirks.
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It's undeniably terrible, period. It has few redeeming qualities other than looking especially nice. With that said, like any retro tech, it can still be fascinating to work with and even occasionally game on. I don't think it's outrageous to say that a lot of the vintage stuff we still use we do so not because it's especially amazing, but because it's interesting and scratches a particular nostalgic itch.
Those are certainly valid points.
I will give the Aquarius credit for one thing: it did manage to ingrain itself into my memory. Granted, the impression wasn't even remotely favourable, but at least it did manage to make one.
That said, it was the stepping stone to an Atari 800, which did manage to successfully keep me off of the parents' Apple. So it's got that going for it
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but why? The Android back button in particular is terrible design. Sometimes it takes you back to the last screen/page you were on, while other times it takes you out of the application completely, and it feels like a complete crapshoot which behavior you get.
Point taken (and agreed), but that's more down to crappy UI / UX than the actual glyph printed on the button.
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Playing Centipede with a joystick causes me great pain and suffering and I intend to sue for damages.
Come on, Atari, do you really think the VCS version is better than the arcade original? It's been 35 years.
You know, if you sued for damages and won, that would be a delightful lesson to all of the crowdfunders.
Let's make it a class action. That way we can all play at home!
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Also, the shape of the icons used are specifically the icons for Android..but hey, let's go ahead and split atoms. I'm willing to bet next year's salary that this thing is an Android box.
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Ehhh.... I get what you're saying, but the 'Home' and 'Back' glyphs used for Android have become pretty much de facto standards at this point. Note that I'm not ruling out the possibility of the thing running Android (because Linux! Sorta.), but the presence of those buttons doesn't really tell much.
Along those lines, I do still occasionally see icons originally designed for BeOS being used in places (online and in applications) to this day. While a BeOS-based AtariBox would rock, and RAWK HARD, that would kill the OMG LINUX!!inspanishthefirstoneisupsidedown!!! claims...
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Found out last night that, at some point early next year, the contents of the storage unit I have on the other side of the country will be able to be moved to where we actually live.
One of the items still in storage is a 1200XL, which was passed down to me shortly before it went into storage. I never had one of these growing up since they weren't available where we lived, but was always sort of intrigued by them. Unfortunately, I never really had a chance to play with it before it went into storage, so I'm still fairly clueless about their capabilities beyond what I've read about them.
Anyway, on to the actual question: are there any demos or other software worth checking out that illustrate any of the 1200XL's pecularities compared to the other XL/XE (or 400/800) machines? 1200XL-specific bugs, weird behaviours, capabilities, etc. are all on the cards as are BASIC or assembly listings. Basically, I'd like to get a feel for what makes it what it is.
Hopefully it's survived the last decade without developing any issues - thankfully, it's in a climate-controlled unit (along with the rest of my Atari stuff), so chances are decent that it still works.
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That was a joke, and there has been no mention that it will run Mint. I'm betting SteamOS (debian based) or Ubuntu (which Mint is based upon). Personally I think they'd do a disservice to their users if they based it upon Mint. It's a decent distribution, but I think it's like a second generation bastard of Debian (Debian -> Ubuntu -> Mint). Then again, if they did just pure Debian on it, I'd be okay with that as well.
Ha, for all we know, it could be based on OpenSuSE! Arch would be an interesting choice, but could you imagine the breakage on that? I tend to think most distributions move too fast, and some not fast enough (RHEL/CentOS). Debian has done better in it's latest releases with the backports repo, making it much nicer as a desktop as well as something to base a console off of.
Guess we'll find out! But to be fair... opening up the lid and finding Mints would be kind of refreshing! (see what I did there?)
Edit: Oh god, Yahoo or Bing? Are you mad? What century is this? I use duckduckgo!
For the full-on retro experience, it should be capable of booting a kernel with some base utilities from a 1.44MB floppy. Used to do it with Slackware all the time; Mint's just bloated by comparison
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I picked up an Odyssey2 with about 10-12 cartridges at Goodwill about a year ago. Other than that, I don't see much classic gaming stuff at thrift stores.
Funny you should mention the Odyssey2; I ran across one at the local Habitat for Humanity store a couple of months ago.
It had arrived in the box. That had been broken down and tossed into a trash can, evidently fairly close to when I had arrived at the store.
Five boxed cartridges (nothing that could be classed as either rare or unusual) were included with it. Their boxes were in great shape right up to the point where they were double-wrapped with packing tape to hold them together, then taped down to the keyboard so that they wouldn't get lost in the store.
The asking price? $150. I made some enquiries as to how they had arrived at that number, and was given the usual 'according to our research...' line, which, upon further investigation, meant 'we looked at eBay'.
They weren't very happy when I pointed out that they had effectively dropped the system's worth to around parts value by how they had handled it. It sat on the shelves at $150 for a couple of weeks, and (I believe) was eventually sent to e-waste.
Thrift stores and the like are more or less a waste of time these days.
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Preface: the point of asking this question is not to be antagonistic; it's something that I've wondered about since the age of around nine or so. With that in mind:
Did anyone actually like their Aquarius?
I had one; it even included the Mini Expander and 16K RAM cartridge. And I hated it. Nobody else had one, magazines never carried any interesting program listings for it, and the game selection was scant. Its capabilities were... Limited. Years later, when I heard how it had been described as the 'system for the Seventies' inside of Mattel, I totally understood what it must have been like to know that this was what had been selected to ship.
About the kindest things I could find to say about it was that the green power light was sort of a neat colour, and putting an appropriately-tuned AM radio next to it and forcing BASIC to do some heavy FOR/NEXT loops could cause some interesting-sounding interference on the radio.
So was I just an ungrateful kid (bear in mind that the sole purpose of my parents obtaining this computer for me by sitting through a timeshare presentation was to keep me away from the Apple ][+ that they had, a stratagem that backfired significantly on them), or was my loathing at the time completely justified?
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I think that's a great idea.
As long as any lights on the stick can be turned off, I'm fine with the idea. There are times where they could be a visual distraction, which would be considerably less than desirable.
That said, I'll also admit that I like the stick's design. Yes, more buttons would be more bueno, but could also be ergonomically-difficult to achieve outside of a gamepad format. The 7800 did it reasonably well, though, for a design where one hand is on the stick itself and the base is in the other hand.
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I have to say Blade Runner 2049 was a most excellent sequel.
Agreed. I thought that it was a really good continuation of the original story, and very much appreciated the way in which it was handled.
Similarly, Tron: Legacy also gets my vote for excellent continuation of story. Seeing two films that had massive impacts on me growing up receive sequels that lived up to the originals was incredibly refreshing - it tells me that the filmmakers also understood why the original films were important to as many people as they were, and full credit to them for handling that material with care.
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Okay, we've solved the AtariBox software problem. Anyone know a good package manager for making hardware?
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sudo apt-get install all_the_emulators
PROFIT!
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