Heaven/TQA Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 (edited) i would have bet my house on Crownland. It's a brilliant work of coding, gfx, msx and design. But there are things I personally would change (its no offence to the brothers who coded the game). 1. I loved the "Monster in Mayhem"-lookalike Level Intro Text in the Preview which is missing in the "final". 2. No "Flag"-post or "Here is the End of the Level"-Sign like in Mario, Sonic. It's kind of "strange" that you have to walk out of the "screen" to get to the next level... could be strange to "newbies" 3. Sprite Multiplexor. The Multiplexor is really good (i know as i made several attemps in that) as it plays animations, changes the shapre plus position. but the level design could be optimised little bit as there are places where it really gets flicker... sometimes it remind me as a master system game... just kidding. the end boss is plexed as well and well done. 4. Powrooz gfx is the king! i really love Pow's style but i personally found the big font not good and what i really missed as PoW is G2F Master a nice "Rainbow Island" like title screen prior the game, same goes to the title Screen... I could not even read "Crownland" to be honest. As the game is really colourfull and pop art i was little bit disappointed in that. 5. the game ends too short... i am sure that's simply because of the deadline and as i had expected 8 "worlds" with several stages... but don't get this wrong! If Crownland would had little bit more levels it would got my 10.... Still a masterpiece so what about a 64k version / disc based? with more levels + title screen + more msx? i know it was a hard work to get there but i am dreaming of... Edited October 29, 2007 by Heaven/TQA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
www.atarimania.com Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 (edited) I'm disappointed and my initial fears are justified. Not from a coding point of view but in terms of gameplay. IMO, this is a wasted opportunity to show the Atari can have a Mario clone that stacks up against the competition (Spectrum, C64, Amstrad CPC, MSX, NES...). Maybe the authors ran out of time but don't overhype the game in the first place then. Why do Atari games have to be so short? Something I don't get either is the deep hidden secret to having 128KB games as executables instead of disk-based multi-load programs running in 64KB (which would also allow more stuff to be crammed in). I have to agree with Heaven about the rest as well. Still a fantastic effort, don't get me wrong, but I'm pretty sure some of the C64 or Spectrum guys will come up and say mostly the same thing... and they'll be spot on. So, can we expect a Crownland II with some added features and a real long game like on other systems? -- Atari Frog http://www.atarimania.com Edited October 29, 2007 by www.atarimania.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marius Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 This is what I don't understand: The released demo of this game was very cool, and has much better looks. Ok the gameplay is too hard in demo (the player has no health buffer). But the gfx/fx is better. I'd say this demo has some kind of game engine, and the next levels are not complete different programs? I'd say next levels could be implentend easy in that demo. What made the coders decide to change things? That demo is there... so there was a moment they were able to make it better. So... I hope the coders will take the demo they released, and work on that one further and extend it with many levels. It is ok when it is a disk-based game for 64K or 128KB machines. But I'd love to have a file version for my 576KB XL or my 320XE. Anyway: goodluck. Marius Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heaven/TQA Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 What about Albert putting the news about the result / games on the front page? even if they are just PALs at the moment? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fröhn Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 (edited) She said, and she has a point, Yoomp has a very original game-concept, a complete NEW game, which everybody is curious about, because it is not familiar with something we've already seen. Actually Yoomp is just a horizontal wrap-around Trailblazer. A bit like Cosmic Causeway. Ofcourse the tunnel shape makes it way more confusing, but in the end it's the same game concept. Also, this game concept ("hop from tile to tile") doesn't have to be 3D. There are a lot of games which do it in 2D, for example Bounder and Re-Bounder. Edited October 29, 2007 by Fröhn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TMR Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 IMO, this is a wasted opportunity to show the Atari can have a Mario clone that stacks up against the competition (Spectrum, C64, Amstrad CPC, MSX, NES...). Maybe the authors ran out of time but don't overhype the game in the first place then. i've been playing the release version and personally i feel the playability has been greatly improved; th demo had a jump system that drove me up the wall and that's been sorted now. Why do Atari games have to be so short? Something I don't get either is the deep hidden secret to having 128KB games as executables instead of disk-based multi-load programs running in 64KB (which would also allow more stuff to be crammed in). How about what a lot of recent C64 jewel cracks do, they look for a RAM expansion and use it as a RAM drive if it's present, otherwise they run on 64K from disk. Still a fantastic effort, don't get me wrong, but I'm pretty sure some of the C64 or Spectrum guys will come up and say mostly the same thing... and they'll be spot on. What can i say, i enjoyed what's there far more than the demo led me to believe i would - but put my name down on the advance order list for Crownland 2 as well, please. =-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TMR Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 What about Albert putting the news about the result / games on the front page? even if they are just PALs at the moment? Is there an official Crownland site or page so i can put a linky item on the news at Oldschool Gaming perhaps? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gury Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 Actually Yoomp is just a horizontal wrap-around Trailblazer. A bit like Cosmic Causeway. Ofcourse the tunnel shape makes it way more confusing, but in the end it's the same game concept. Also, this game concept ("hop from tile to tile") doesn't have to be 3D. There are a lot of games which do it in 2D, for example Bounder and Re-Bounder. Absolutely wrong. Yoomp is very addictive and original. Ballblazer/Trailblazer is different. Ofcourse the tunnel shape makes it way more confusing, but in the end it's the same game concept. No, the 3D tunnel shape actually makes it very original. Also, this game concept ("hop from tile to tile") doesn't have to be 3D Why not? It's good to see another 3D game. Atari platform also already has 2D type of such games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emkay Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 Ofcourse the tunnel shape makes it way more confusing, but in the end it's the same game concept. No, the 3D tunnel shape actually makes it very original. The tunnel makes the difference! The difference between an old 8 bit game and 3D fun action. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fröhn Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 (edited) Absolutely wrong. Yoomp is very addictive and original. Ballblazer/Trailblazer is different. What makes Trailblazer so different? In the end it's very similar. You hop from tile to tile, some tiles let you jump higher, others speed you up and some invert your controls etc. Yoomp adds a few elements like warp tiles, but I have seen those elements in 2D tile jump games before. Ofcourse the tunnel shape makes it way more confusing, but in the end it's the same game concept. No, the 3D tunnel shape actually makes it very original. Ofcourse. Still the game itself is that old tile hopping idea. I don't say that it's bad, I only say that it isn't new. Also, this game concept ("hop from tile to tile") doesn't have to be 3D Why not? It's good to see another 3D game. Atari platform also already has 2D type of such games. You are misunderstanding me. I never said that Yoomp should not have been done, I only opposed that "Yoomp is a brand new game concept and Crownland isn't" stuff. Yoomp is a cool game, the tunnel view is a cool idea. The 2D link was only drawn to show that the same gameplay can be achieved independent how the game engine presents it to you. The tunnel makes the difference! The difference between an old 8 bit game and 3D fun action. Trailblazer is 3D too, and it's from 1986 so it also fits into the "old 8 bit game"-category. Edited October 29, 2007 by Fröhn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emkay Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 Trailblazer is 3D too, and it's from 1986 so it also fits into the "old 8 bit game"-category. LOL? Trailblazer is some "depth created by some rasters" . No 3D. Rescue on Fractalus is 3D. Games like Koronis Rift and the Eidolon look like 3D (by movement) . But Trailblazer has nothing to do with 3D. It is done in the "ego" perspective, but that is not the "primary" definition for 3D.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allas Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 (edited) Crownland and Yoomp! are old ideas but enhanced as never as seen on Atari machines. In the case of Yoomp! after al lot of time seeing tunnels demos, was the time to mix some demos ideas with games. I'm agreed with enhanced playability of Crownland game. The game is better that demo. I guess the demo is tricky designed, because not show more than 2 multicolored sprites on one horizontal line. That's the reason why the Crownland demo doesn't have flickering. But, in the real game we can found until 4 multicolored players on one horizontal line, with 3 or 4 players the sprites flickering in the common area. I guess, the demo have on e a basic multiplexed sprite routine, meanwhile the game have the whole completed routine. I think, the main reason of Crownland critics was the release of the demo at December 2006. Always people adjust the expectations more and more, and logically, always could be more. It's good to see that LaResistence have a good engine that can be enhanced for other type titles "Crownland 2". So, I think we could see more quality titles on the next soon future. Edited October 30, 2007 by Allas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emkay Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 By the way. Crownland is definately not the first Mario-land clone for a8 ofcourse. One of my favorites is still Wlockzikij (could me misspelled). Anyone who does not know that game: you really should give it a try. The control of your player is a little bit 'strange' and it is sometimes very hard to do, but it is so cool. Wooch'ki is by far not as good as Crownland. The control in Crownland is fabulous and in Wooch'ki it is horrible like the scoreboard and the colour usage. I really hope they do an "upgraded" version of Crownland 'til next year. So, it will be placed first then.... Except someone releases an A8 Wolf 3D version there Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heaven/TQA Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 (edited) Jason, I guess it will appear here soon: http://www.laresistance.pigwa.net as you can download the game http://www.laresistance.pigwa.net/crownland.zip Edited October 29, 2007 by Heaven/TQA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
www.atarimania.com Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 I think, the main reason of Crowland critics was the release of the demo at December 2006. Always people adjust the expectations more and more, and logically, always could be more. Crownland was hailed as the masterpiece to end all masterpieces and a number of things were left out from the final version, that's why I'm disappointed. It's a unique game in the Atari library for sure and would've been a killer budget game if released in 1990 or so! Thing is it's nothing like Super Mario Bros., The Great Giana Sisters or Mayhem in Monsterland. A comparison with, say, Turbo the Tortoise on the C64 would be more like it (again, not saying this is a bad thing, just that there was room for so much more). -- Atari Frog http://www.atarimania.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
www.atarimania.com Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 The graphics in Wloczykij are nice but ripped from a number of C64 games... Playability is pretty much flawed: it was made as a difficult game because of its shortcomings and lack of substance. -- Atari Frog http://www.atarimania.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allas Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 (edited) Crownland was hailed as the masterpiece to end all masterpieces and a number of things were left out from the final version, that's why I'm disappointed. It's a unique game in the Atari library for sure and would've been a killer budget game if released in 1990 or so! Thing is it's nothing like Super Mario Bros., The Great Giana Sisters or Mayhem in Monsterland. A comparison with, say, Turbo the Tortoise on the C64 would be more like it (again, not saying this is a bad thing, just that there was room for so much more). -- Atari Frog http://www.atarimania.com Maybe Crownland have some adds missed, but for sure is far superior to those old C64 games, including Flimbo Quest and others. Memory is volatile I think. Edited October 30, 2007 by Allas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heaven/TQA Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 If someone else is reading this thread he might think that Crownland is crap which it isn't. It still got my Kudos. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fröhn Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 But Trailblazer has nothing to do with 3D. It is done in the "ego" perspective, but that is not the "primary" definition for 3D.... Same for Yoomp. The game world is 2D, it's only presented with a perspective. Yoomp is NOT in the real 3D category like Rescue of Fractalus is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
puppetmark Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 If someone else is reading this thread he might think that Crownland is crap which it isn't. It still got my Kudos. I agree. Its an amazing game! I think we have to be carefull not to cros a line here and make sure we appreciate these programers for there hard work and talents! They aren't doing this for money and They all deserve our gatitude and support. Don't get me wrong, discusing game play and features is fun and offering suggestions is great but I think we should make sure it stays as positive as possible. I hope to see more games the quality of acrownland and Yoomp. When I showed these to non atari people they just can't believe these games are on 8-bit computers from the 80s! Many thanks to all the great atari programmers out there. Keep up the great work!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TMR Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 Absolutely wrong. Yoomp is very addictive and original. Ballblazer/Trailblazer is different. Well Ballblazer wasn't mentioned because it's a totally different kind of game but, thinking about just Trailblazer lets see... checkerboard effect coming out of the distance? Yes. Ball for the player? Yes again. Holes and special squares that affect progress? Yes once more. Difference? It's a tunnel and not a plane. Addictive it might be (although i didn't find it to be myself, certainly not in the same way Crownland got my attention) but original... bit of a hard claim to make to be honest. The very first thing i thought when i played the thing was "oh, this is just like Trailblazer but wrapped around a tube". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miker Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 Any chance to see the rest of entries? @TMR: no website of Crownland, pure link only: http://www.laresistance.pigwa.net/crownland.zip Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TMR Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 @TMR: no website of Crownland, pure link only: http://www.laresistance.pigwa.net/crownland.zip 'Kay, i'll fudge the linking a bit because i want to get that item onto the news. =-) If anyone else is putting their games up somewhere i can link to from the OSG news (and therefore the RSS feed) lemme know, okay? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GameEngine Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 Well Ballblazer wasn't mentioned because it's a totally different kind of game but, thinking about just Trailblazer lets see... checkerboard effect coming out of the distance? Yes. Ball for the player? Yes again. Holes and special squares that affect progress? Yes once more. Difference? It's a tunnel and not a plane. Addictive it might be (although i didn't find it to be myself, certainly not in the same way Crownland got my attention) but original... bit of a hard claim to make to be honest. The very first thing i thought when i played the thing was "oh, this is just like Trailblazer but wrapped around a tube". I find Crownland very successful inroad into C64 domain of platformers (It gives C64 a whooping in its own game!) Yoomp is to me the pinnacle of Atari style. Trailblazer? - evolution has just leaped forward. (Dream on C64. Dream on...). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emkay Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 But Trailblazer has nothing to do with 3D. It is done in the "ego" perspective, but that is not the "primary" definition for 3D.... Same for Yoomp. The game world is 2D, it's only presented with a perspective. Yoomp is NOT in the real 3D category like Rescue of Fractalus is. Pffff..... The Tiles in Yoomp are perspectively correct zoomed in 360° around the viewers eye. How much more 3D do you want to see on an 8 bit from the early 80's ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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