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JagCF last news before the before the launch of final proto.


GT Turbo
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SCPCD give some news about the JagCF ;)

 

I'm working on the last hardware part of the JagCF before the launch of final proto.

 

This is both new boards for testing JagCF new hardware that are not including onto my actual prototype :

the first one : Spy Board (for spy the network with a PC)

- JagCF Network

 

the second one : Test Board

- new JagCF Power circuitry (to have a better efficiency)

- JagCF Network (because I haven't this onto my actual jagcf proto)

- Integrated Catnip

 

SCPCD

 

P.S. : If you want to see the photos, come here

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What's a JagCF? What is in the picture? A modified board from a Jag console?

 

 

Hi SatNoob,

 

The JagCF is a plug and play add-on for the Jaguar, more infos here :

 

http://www.jagware.org/index.php?s=&sh...post&p=7797

 

Let's have a look at the video ;)

 

If you have any questions, ask ;)

 

Regards,

 

GT Turbo

 

Edit : a little problem, the link for the video is dead, i will try to find another link :)

Edited by GT Turbo
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Hehe I guess I'm just dumb. I still don't understand what the actual 'addon' is? Does it allow you play a different consoles games? Does it modify graphics? Allow you to make games? Stream media through the Jaguar onto the TV?

 

It's mainly for a much bigger format (CF card) but there's supposed to be an extra processor in it to add some power to the system but the details are sketchy on what exactly it will do.

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Hehe I guess I'm just dumb. I still don't understand what the actual 'addon' is? Does it allow you play a different consoles games? Does it modify graphics? Allow you to make games? Stream media through the Jaguar onto the TV?

It's basically a "cheaper" alternative to cartridge games and to some extent the Jag CD (mostly because not everyone has one and their price is going up lately) and to give people who don't have access to a flash cart or alpine to program and test their own programs on the Jag. It also allows MP3 streaming so future games may be able to use mp3 instead of mods or redbook audio. Most controversial is the prospect is playing commercial roms on it which is a very sore subject. The game of note that is suppose to be released for this game is Out of this World (Another World) which is an official port in the works by the Jagware team (havn't heard much on it other then when they announced it awhile back). Thats about all there is to note from what I've gathered on the device.

Edited by EmOneGarand
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Hehe I guess I'm just dumb. I still don't understand what the actual 'addon' is? Does it allow you play a different consoles games? Does it modify graphics? Allow you to make games? Stream media through the Jaguar onto the TV?

 

Hi SatNoob,

 

At the beginning when Jagware was born, the first question on which support the new games ? Cartridges was too expensive and hard to done and CD games were cheaper but JagCD are very expensive and hard to found. So the only solution was found in using CF card for new games but the Jag can't read CF. so SCPCD has done a first try with the JagCF, an add-on allowing to use CF card for games and softwares. After this proto, SCPCD has decided to do a better version with the JagCF V2. This version includes PS2 mouse and keyboard support, new networking system, 8 megs of additionnal ram, streaming and the last option is a new DSP running at 96 Mhz with special instructions for some special things in video and sound, in same time, we have talked about a new Development Kit, Zerosquare has done a box called CatNip who allows to use a USB port for transfering file into the Jaguar. JagCF+CatNip can be used instead of a expensive Alpine.

 

In the last news, we announce that the CatNip will be included into the JagCF, that means one plug and play add on who allows you a lot of things never seen on a Jaguar and allows a lot of things. Example, before the JagCF if you wanted to run a homebrew game, you must use Alpine board, Bjl, or all kinds of uploading system. Now you have just to recopy the file on a CF card with a simple CF writer and put into the JagCF and run the Jaguar nothing else or send the file using the CatNip.

 

A CF card is bigger than any Jaguar cartridges, that means a lot of True Color graphics, a lot of sounds, etc...

 

Streaming that means we can read data from the CF Card during the game was playing, no more additionnal time for loading :)

 

A nice photo of the JagCF :

 

JagCF.JPG

 

GT Turbo (Jagware)

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Hi,

 

Thats good news I guess but what about CF compatable software?

 

At this time, 11 projects are dedicated to the JagCF.

 

 

I'm really interested in how developers will put the extra processor to use, and how the games using it will play and look.

 

 

For developers that will be 'just another' processor, like the two risc inside the stock Jaguar, the differences come from the clock 96 Mhz instead of 26.6, some special and dedicated instructions ;) and a very big 'internal ram'. Not 4 kbytes like Tom, or 8 kbyte like Jerry, but 8 megs :lust: That means we can code a full 3d game just using the JagCF ram ;)

 

GT Turbo poulpe.gif

Edited by GT Turbo
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I'm really interested in how developers will put the extra processor to use, and how the games using it will play and look.

 

 

For developers that will be 'just another' processor, like the two risc inside the stock Jaguar, the differences come from the clock 96 Mhz instead of 26.6, some special and dedicated instructions ;) and a very big 'internal ram'. Not 4 kbytes like Tom, or 8 kbyte like Jerry, but 8 megs :lust: That means we can code a full 3d game just using the JagCF ram ;)

 

GT Turbo poulpe.gif

 

Wait...I thought the extra DSP could be used in addition to the Tom and Jerry chips. Is it used instead of those, or with those?

 

And, if it can be used in conjunction with Tom and Jerry those, why so powerful? I mean, 96 Mhz and 8 megs of RAM is a bit much. It's a whole different machine, really. Personally, I'd rather an extra RISC in there at 33 Mhz with around 8 kbytes, or something that would act like the MIPS 3000 used in some CoJag games (32 kbytes or so). Yes, the potential would be lessened than the current design, but it would be less expensive and it would probably have been along the lines of what Atari could have done with the Jaguar had they replaced the 68K or even just added another RISC (in essence, something like CoJag as a home console) at the time when they were releasing Jag.

 

Of course, that's if the DSP on JagCF is used in conjunction with the the two RISCS in the stock Jaguar. If it is instead used instead of those processors, then I can understand the thought behind making it so "powerful". But if used with the stock components in Jag...it's just too different and not what would've been done at the time. And I thought trying to come to grips with older tech available at the time was the whole purpose behind the hobby development. Yeah, there were 96 Mhz RISCS with 8 megs of RAM at the time...but they sure as heck weren't in home consoles, and certainly well beyond what Atari was capable of putting into the machine.

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Hehe I guess I'm just dumb. I still don't understand what the actual 'addon' is? Does it allow you play a different consoles games? Does it modify graphics? Allow you to make games? Stream media through the Jaguar onto the TV?

 

Hi SatNoob,

 

At the beginning when Jagware was born, the first question on which support the new games ? Cartridges was too expensive and hard to done and CD games were cheaper but JagCD are very expensive and hard to found. So the only solution was found in using CF card for new games but the Jag can't read CF. so SCPCD has done a first try with the JagCF, an add-on allowing to use CF card for games and softwares. After this proto, SCPCD has decided to do a better version with the JagCF V2. This version includes PS2 mouse and keyboard support, new networking system, 8 megs of additionnal ram, streaming and the last option is a new DSP running at 96 Mhz with special instructions for some special things in video and sound, in same time, we have talked about a new Development Kit, Zerosquare has done a box called CatNip who allows to use a USB port for transfering file into the Jaguar. JagCF+CatNip can be used instead of a expensive Alpine.

 

In the last news, we announce that the CatNip will be included into the JagCF, that means one plug and play add on who allows you a lot of things never seen on a Jaguar and allows a lot of things. Example, before the JagCF if you wanted to run a homebrew game, you must use Alpine board, Bjl, or all kinds of uploading system. Now you have just to recopy the file on a CF card with a simple CF writer and put into the JagCF and run the Jaguar nothing else or send the file using the CatNip.

 

A CF card is bigger than any Jaguar cartridges, that means a lot of True Color graphics, a lot of sounds, etc...

 

Streaming that means we can read data from the CF Card during the game was playing, no more additionnal time for loading :)

 

A nice photo of the JagCF :

 

JagCF.JPG

 

GT Turbo (Jagware)

 

 

Actually, no. At the beginning when Jagware was born, they were a division of Atari that distributed stuff like Jaguar keychains, shirts and hats, you have just appropriated the name, or stolen it, whichever you like. At least tell the story right. The beginning of your thing should read, "At the beginning, when Jagware was born, it was an outlet Atari used to sell Jaguar related merchandise. We decided that we wanted to hack together games and hardware and since Atari wasn't useing the name anymore, we took it." From there on, you can continue with what you were saying.

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I'm really interested in how developers will put the extra processor to use, and how the games using it will play and look.

 

 

For developers that will be 'just another' processor, like the two risc inside the stock Jaguar, the differences come from the clock 96 Mhz instead of 26.6, some special and dedicated instructions ;) and a very big 'internal ram'. Not 4 kbytes like Tom, or 8 kbyte like Jerry, but 8 megs :lust: That means we can code a full 3d game just using the JagCF ram ;)

 

GT Turbo poulpe.gif

 

Wait...I thought the extra DSP could be used in addition to the Tom and Jerry chips. Is it used instead of those, or with those?

 

And, if it can be used in conjunction with Tom and Jerry those, why so powerful? I mean, 96 Mhz and 8 megs of RAM is a bit much. It's a whole different machine, really. Personally, I'd rather an extra RISC in there at 33 Mhz with around 8 kbytes, or something that would act like the MIPS 3000 used in some CoJag games (32 kbytes or so). Yes, the potential would be lessened than the current design, but it would be less expensive and it would probably have been along the lines of what Atari could have done with the Jaguar had they replaced the 68K or even just added another RISC (in essence, something like CoJag as a home console) at the time when they were releasing Jag.

 

Of course, that's if the DSP on JagCF is used in conjunction with the the two RISCS in the stock Jaguar. If it is instead used instead of those processors, then I can understand the thought behind making it so "powerful". But if used with the stock components in Jag...it's just too different and not what would've been done at the time. And I thought trying to come to grips with older tech available at the time was the whole purpose behind the hobby development. Yeah, there were 96 Mhz RISCS with 8 megs of RAM at the time...but they sure as heck weren't in home consoles, and certainly well beyond what Atari was capable of putting into the machine.

 

 

My only concern abou this DSP is it is no more known than the current riscs. I hope there are tools other

than a simple assembler for this. You guys cant be seriously thinking of releasing this with out a C compiler

are you? 96 mhz is great but until you have a compiler, you wont be porting anything to this device.

You 'll be struggling to write code like it were the jag RISC's

 

But you are correct. I think this changes it from Jaguar. It's like the JAguar is simply playing host to

another console. I think you should go all the way and just do another console. You guys are going to

have to go through the same amount of work. A sound chip, video chip and case and there you go.

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Wait...I thought the extra DSP could be used in addition to the Tom and Jerry chips. Is it used instead of those, or with those?
This is up to the developers. They can choose to use the new DSP almost exclusively. Or you can have the DSP work in collaboration with existing processors, as a graphics coprocessor, for example. Or not use it at all if you consider it "cheating" :)

 

And, if it can be used in conjunction with Tom and Jerry those, why so powerful? I mean, 96 Mhz and 8 megs of RAM is a bit much. It's a whole different machine, really. Personally, I'd rather an extra RISC in there at 33 Mhz with around 8 kbytes, or something that would act like the MIPS 3000 used in some CoJag games (32 kbytes or so). Yes, the potential would be lessened than the current design, but it would be less expensive
The DSP is a custom design made by SCPCD. It is not a separate chip, it's integrated into the FPGA (which would have been present anyways, since it is handling the Compact Flash card and other features). So there is no extra cost to worry about.

 

But if used with the stock components in Jag...it's just too different and not what would've been done at the time. And I thought trying to come to grips with older tech available at the time was the whole purpose behind the hobby development. Yeah, there were 96 Mhz RISCS with 8 megs of RAM at the time...but they sure as heck weren't in home consoles, and certainly well beyond what Atari was capable of putting into the machine.
I understand your point of view. But if developers want to keep the original spirit, they don't have to use the new DSP or other "modern" features. Nothing prevents them from using the JagCF purely as a mass storage device like the JagCD.
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My only concern abou this DSP is it is no more known than the current riscs. I hope there are tools other

than a simple assembler for this. You guys cant be seriously thinking of releasing this with out a C compiler

are you?

Don't worry, we know the importance of a good set of tools.

 

But you are correct. I think this changes it from Jaguar. It's like the JAguar is simply playing host to

another console. I think you should go all the way and just do another console.

Actually, this is planned :P
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My only concern abou this DSP is it is no more known than the current riscs. I hope there are tools other

than a simple assembler for this. You guys cant be seriously thinking of releasing this with out a C compiler

are you?

Don't worry, we know the importance of a good set of tools.

 

But you are correct. I think this changes it from Jaguar. It's like the JAguar is simply playing host to

another console. I think you should go all the way and just do another console.

Actually, this is planned :P

 

I think you would have a better level of support making a new console. You should also

release the instruction set to the DSP to interested developers so they can start getting

it in their heads.

 

I only wish my friggin FPGA software license did not expire(cant afford a new one yet)

I'd be doing everything to revive Oberon and Jag II.

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While true that you don't have to use the DSP, I still think that when using the DSP, it would've been better served giving something new and different while also keeping the spirit of the original rather than just giving something completely different.

 

At 96 MHz and 8 megs...it's too different, IMHO.

 

Had it been another RISC at 30-40 MHz and, say, anywhere from 8-32 or so kbytes, then it would be sufficiently different enough to get better looking stuff running on Jag without taking it so competely away from the original design or from Atari could've done at the time. Essentially, as stated, it would be almost like a CoJag, which wasn't out of the realm of possibility at the time Jag was officially "alive" and supported by Atari.

 

I'd liken this design to something like 32x, but even 32x had to be used with the stock chips in Genesis/MegaDrive, thus making it a definite add-on rather than an entirely different thing altogether.

 

Is there any possibility of having a version of JagCF with a less powerful RISC after you guys get this one out?

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Hey guys at Jagware, to boot, just because I am again curious, are you ever going to design your own logo also? Just wanted to know man as that has been a great question as it should be that people that are tallented and resourceful should be able to ply that experience and knowledge towards a company logo of their own by now. The way I look at it, you already took the name, at least try to make it your own without having to use the same logo Atari designed on their pamphlets.

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Actually, no. At the beginning when Jagware was born, they were a division of Atari that distributed stuff like Jaguar keychains, shirts and hats, you have just appropriated the name, or stolen it, whichever you like. At least tell the story right. The beginning of your thing should read, "At the beginning, when Jagware was born, it was an outlet Atari used to sell Jaguar related merchandise. We decided that we wanted to hack together games and hardware and since Atari wasn't useing the name anymore, we took it." From there on, you can continue with what you were saying.

 

Hi,

 

You must know one thing, i have know that Jagware was an Atari division that distibuted jaguar goodies only when Jagware was born, because some people have shoot : rippers. When we have choosed this name, a search under google haven't give this thing, if you try under google, Jagware is all except Atari division, even if we have know that, what's the problem with the name ? For me any. The best demomaker crew on Atari ST, The Carebears they have choose a name from a cartoon and nobody have told something. That's just a name, it's all.

 

 

Hey guys at Jagware, to boot, just because I am again curious, are you ever going to design your own logo also? Just wanted to know man as that has been a great question as it should be that people that are tallented and resourceful should be able to ply that experience and knowledge towards a company logo of their own by now. The way I look at it, you already took the name, at least try to make it your own without having to use the same logo Atari designed on their pamphlets.

 

Some of use are busy to make games, software and tools and i think we have no time to waste for that, we got really great graphists and designers inside Jagware, that's sure, even some professionnals :) but better working on games that on this little thing.

 

This post is only my thought, not there from the Jagware community.

 

Regards,

 

GT Turbo

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