Multi Wire Switch - Begginner :)

[myworldplz]

A couple of questions from a begginner and forgive my ignorance...

 

I need to know what the technical name is and where to buy a connector for an atari game. For example they would call them in the nes world "New 72 Pin Connector" I need a couple for the Atari 2600.

 

This is all for a project I would like to make as a begginer in hardware workings.

 

I am thinking of multiple carts all connecting to one Atari 2600 and you can flip around switches depending on what game you'd like to play without changing cartridges. Take a look at what I mean:

 

Anyways to accomplish this?

[Wickeycolumbus]

I'm not sure where you can get connectors, but to accomplish this, you will need to switch between the A12 lines (Chip Select) of the cartridges.

[myworldplz]

Ah any idea where the heck I can get the switch for this O.O!!!!

 

Thats the true rode block here...

[Wickeycolumbus]

Ah any idea where the heck I can get the switch for this O.O!!!!

 

Thats the true rode block here...

 

Do you have a local RadioShack? They should have them there. Any switch will work, as long as you only turn one on at a time.

[jamesk]

Ah any idea where the heck I can get the switch for this O.O!!!!

 

Thats the true rode block here...

 

A 4 position rotary switch would be rad for this, if you were planning to make a project box. Ebay should have the switch for fairly cheap. I get my project boxes from Walmart's tupperware section.

 

A 4 position dip switch would work for something easy. Again, check Ebay. Radio Shack has a 8 position one.

[myworldplz]

I defidentally thought about a DIP switch that seems logical however I would like to have one switch complete all of the connections, otherwise I have to flip all 12 something switches.

 

If you know what I mean. Any links are wanted

[Wickeycolumbus]

I defidentally thought about a DIP switch that seems logical however I would like to have one switch complete all of the connections, otherwise I have to flip all 12 something switches.

 

If you know what I mean. Any links are wanted

 

You only need one switch per cart (switch between the A12/chip select lines), you don't need to switch all 24 pins

[myworldplz]

Explain? With all those wires for each prong you would unless you had some kind of chip right?

[Wickeycolumbus]

Explain? With all those wires for each prong you would unless you had some kind of chip right?

 

Consult this diagram:

 

http://pinouts.ru/Motherboard/AtariCartridge_pinout.shtml

 

All of the pins can be connected to the 2600, except the A12 (AKA the Chip Select ) line. To enable a cartridge, switch the chip select line to that cartridge.

 

Here is an example of how you could hook it up:

 

--/ -- represents a switch

Cart 1 |  Cart 2 | Cart 3  | Cart 4 | 2600 Cart Port

1---------1-------------1--------1----------1
2---------2-------------2--------2----------2
3---------3-------------3--------3----------3
4---------4-------------4--------4----------4
5---------5-------------5--------5----------5

													 6
6---/ ----------------------------------------|
		 6  -----/ --------------------------|
						  6----/ ---------------|
									   6--/ -------|

7---------7-------------7--------7----------7
8---------8-------------8--------8----------8
9---------9-------------9--------9----------9
10--------10-----------10-------10--------10
11--------11-----------11-------11--------11
12--------12-----------12-------12--------12
13--------13-----------13-------13--------13
14--------14-----------14-------14--------14
15--------15-----------15-------15--------15
16--------16-----------16-------16--------16
17--------17-----------17-------17--------17
18--------18-----------18-------18--------18
19--------19-----------19-------19--------19
20--------20-----------20-------20--------20
21--------21-----------21-------21--------21
22--------22-----------22-------22--------22
23--------23-----------23-------23--------23
24--------24-----------24-------24--------24

[+selgus]

I believe this is what the Video Game Brain did; each push button just connected A12 from one of the ports to the extension cartridge. All the other lines were connected. I have one of these, if anyone really wanted it.

--Selgus

[myworldplz]

hehe cool ill look around

[Wickeycolumbus]

hehe cool ill look around

 

You may want to look at this, but it should be easy enough to build your own.

[Longhorn Engineer]

I believe this is what the Video Game Brain did; each push button just connected A12 from one of the ports to the extension cartridge. All the other lines were connected. I have one of these, if anyone really wanted it.

--Selgus

 

This is correct. I have a Video Game Brain and this is what is does.

[awace]

Explain? With all those wires for each prong you would unless you had some kind of chip right?

 

Consult this diagram:

 

http://pinouts.ru/Motherboard/AtariCartridge_pinout.shtml

 

All of the pins can be connected to the 2600, except the A12 (AKA the Chip Select ) line. To enable a cartridge, switch the chip select line to that cartridge.

 

Here is an example of how you could hook it up:

 

--/ -- represents a switch

Cart 1 |  Cart 2 | Cart 3  | Cart 4 | 2600 Cart Port

1---------1-------------1--------1----------1
2---------2-------------2--------2----------2
3---------3-------------3--------3----------3
4---------4-------------4--------4----------4
5---------5-------------5--------5----------5

													 6
6---/ ----------------------------------------|
		 6  -----/ --------------------------|
						  6----/ ---------------|
									   6--/ -------|

7---------7-------------7--------7----------7
8---------8-------------8--------8----------8
9---------9-------------9--------9----------9
10--------10-----------10-------10--------10
11--------11-----------11-------11--------11
12--------12-----------12-------12--------12
13--------13-----------13-------13--------13
14--------14-----------14-------14--------14
15--------15-----------15-------15--------15
16--------16-----------16-------16--------16
17--------17-----------17-------17--------17
18--------18-----------18-------18--------18
19--------19-----------19-------19--------19
20--------20-----------20-------20--------20
21--------21-----------21-------21--------21
22--------22-----------22-------22--------22
23--------23-----------23-------23--------23
24--------24-----------24-------24--------24

 

 

 

 

does this mean lift pin 6 on all conencted cart slots w carts in then when you want to play a certain game just rehook only that slots pin 6 w switch cool I know what internal bank switching does now also now i know what chip select does I thought that was bad I guess only flashing the POWER SWITCH is bad so chip select flashing on flashbackk II from original missile command and caverns of mars shouldnt do harm cool....

so the switch bank would have all pin6ex connected to a bar that the connects common to pin6 of carts then the pin6 of the Atari goes to the normaly open pinon switch meaning when switch for that game is on it connects that game THIS IS AWESOMELY COOL I HAVE A 9 postistion rotary switch. that means i could select 9 differnt games... that would mean 9 cart solderings I probably would want a 4 pakman arcade type switch using a bank select switch instead like taking a multi cart and changing roms in it... although that wouldnt be as easy as a caveman..

cool looks like the same chart they used for Birdie king II's dip switch layout...

Edited April 20, 2009 by awace

[GroovyBee]

You also have to pull the chip select on the ROM in the cartridge into the inactive state when the switch isn't connected to it. You don't want more than one cart driving the bus at the same time.

[BigO]

You also have to pull the chip select on the ROM in the cartridge into the inactive state when the switch isn't connected to it. You don't want more than one cart driving the bus at the same time.

Isn't that pin 6 on the cartridge that has been discussed? Do you mean that you'd need a pullup resistor on each cart socket's pin 6 connected to 5v so the input doesn't float to an indeterminate state?

 

I wonder how many non-selected cartridges could be connected to the 2600 at once (fanout) and still allow another cartridge to function. I'll have to see if I can find that spec somewhere. I've wondered if I couldn't have all my games plugged in all the time and just select the one I want to play. My other goofy thought, in lieu of all carts always plugged in, is a jukebox system that would select and plug in the cartridge. That could make for a more interesting display.

Edited April 20, 2009 by BigO

[GroovyBee]

You also have to pull the chip select on the ROM in the cartridge into the inactive state when the switch isn't connected to it. You don't want more than one cart driving the bus at the same time.

Isn't that pin 6 on the cartridge that has been discussed? Do you mean that you'd need a pullup resistor on each cart socket's pin 6 connected to 5v so the input doesn't float to an indeterminate state?

Yep! Thats exactly what I mean.

I wonder how many non-selected cartridges could be connected to the 2600 at once (fanout) and still allow another cartridge to function. I'll have to see if I can find that spec somewhere. I've wondered if I couldn't have all my games plugged in all the time and just select the one I want to play. My other goofy thought, in lieu of all carts always plugged in, is a jukebox system that would select and plug in the cartridge. That could make for a more interesting display.

You can increase the fan out on the address bus with 74LS245s. Its much trickier on the data bus with Super RAM carts and the like because you don't know when a write will occur so you can change the data bus direction. You could connect wires to R/W# and PHI2 inside the 2600 and bring them to the outside world. It wouldn't work on a stock 2600 then.

[BigO]

You also have to pull the chip select on the ROM in the cartridge into the inactive state when the switch isn't connected to it. You don't want more than one cart driving the bus at the same time.

Isn't that pin 6 on the cartridge that has been discussed? Do you mean that you'd need a pullup resistor on each cart socket's pin 6 connected to 5v so the input doesn't float to an indeterminate state?

Yep! Thats exactly what I mean.

I wonder how many non-selected cartridges could be connected to the 2600 at once (fanout) and still allow another cartridge to function. I'll have to see if I can find that spec somewhere. I've wondered if I couldn't have all my games plugged in all the time and just select the one I want to play. My other goofy thought, in lieu of all carts always plugged in, is a jukebox system that would select and plug in the cartridge. That could make for a more interesting display.

You can increase the fan out on the address bus with 74LS245s. Its much trickier on the data bus with Super RAM carts and the like because you don't know when a write will occur so you can change the data bus direction. You could connect wires to R/W# and PHI2 inside the 2600 and bring them to the outside world. It wouldn't work on a stock 2600 then.

I thought about bi-directional buffers, but figured there'd be complications, as you confirmed. I've successfully used solid state analog switches as bidirectional connections on a slow-ish bus (PC parallel port). I'm thinking if that would work on the 2600 bus, fanout could be improved by connecting/disconnecting groups of cartridges based on the location of the one selected. That could allow for a large number of connections without a complex bunch of circuitry.

 

Then again, if the fanout is 5000 then none of the tricks would be necessary. I'll have to poke around and find the specs on the typical ROM chip as a start.

[GroovyBee]

Looking at a couple of 6502/7 datasheets the address and data bus are capable of driving 1 TTL load and 130pF. It would be easier to use something like a CC2 or a Krok Cart. I have thought about doing the equivalent of a CC2 specifically for the 2600, but I'm not sure there is a market for a new device.

[BigO]

Looking at a couple of 6502/7 datasheets the address and data bus are capable of driving 1 TTL load and 130pF. It would be easier to use something like a CC2 or a Krok Cart. I have thought about doing the equivalent of a CC2 specifically for the 2600, but I'm not sure there is a market for a new device.

Who said anything about easy? Anybody can have a multi-cart.

 

I guess what I'm thinking of would amount to a larger scale "Video Game Brain" or similar selector. It would have to be something that could support at least 500 cartridges, given that I already have about 250.

 

There's just something appealing about playing the actual cartridges, even if it's in something as weird as a giant game selector. What would really suck would be having to unplug all of the games and reinsert them to keep them in alphabetical order when I acquire a new game. It's bad enough just sliding them around in boxes.

 

Maybe in a year or two after I find a new house and move.

[Longhorn Engineer]

Looking at a couple of 6502/7 datasheets the address and data bus are capable of driving 1 TTL load and 130pF. It would be easier to use something like a CC2 or a Krok Cart. I have thought about doing the equivalent of a CC2 specifically for the 2600, but I'm not sure there is a market for a new device.

Who said anything about easy? Anybody can have a multi-cart.

 

I guess what I'm thinking of would amount to a larger scale "Video Game Brain" or similar selector. It would have to be something that could support at least 500 cartridges, given that I already have about 250.

 

There's just something appealing about playing the actual cartridges, even if it's in something as weird as a giant game selector. What would really suck would be having to unplug all of the games and reinsert them to keep them in alphabetical order when I acquire a new game. It's bad enough just sliding them around in boxes.

 

Maybe in a year or two after I find a new house and move.

 

Ohhhh have like a Wall Of Atari Carts where you would walk up to the wall and press a button next to the cart you want to play and it auto turns on the TV and Atari.

[Wickeycolumbus]

Looking at a couple of 6502/7 datasheets the address and data bus are capable of driving 1 TTL load and 130pF. It would be easier to use something like a CC2 or a Krok Cart. I have thought about doing the equivalent of a CC2 specifically for the 2600, but I'm not sure there is a market for a new device.

Who said anything about easy? Anybody can have a multi-cart.

 

I guess what I'm thinking of would amount to a larger scale "Video Game Brain" or similar selector. It would have to be something that could support at least 500 cartridges, given that I already have about 250.

 

There's just something appealing about playing the actual cartridges, even if it's in something as weird as a giant game selector. What would really suck would be having to unplug all of the games and reinsert them to keep them in alphabetical order when I acquire a new game. It's bad enough just sliding them around in boxes.

 

Maybe in a year or two after I find a new house and move.

 

Ohhhh have like a Wall Of Atari Carts where you would walk up to the wall and press a button next to the cart you want to play and it auto turns on the TV and Atari.

 

That would quite possibly be the coolest thing ever! Good luck finding that many cart connectors though

[GroovyBee]

If the button indirectly selects a game on the equivalent of a CC2 then its doable. If each button generates a keycode (modulated at 27MHz or so, with a micro watching 10 to 20 buttons) to select the game then the wiring loom could be much simplified. All you'd need then would be cart holders and not actual connectors. As well as a master micro to convert the RF keycode into a game selection.

[CPUWIZ]

That would quite possibly be the coolest thing ever! Good luck finding that many cart connectors though

 

http://www.mikesarcade.com/cgi-bin/store.p...egory=Card+Edge

[Wickeycolumbus]

That would quite possibly be the coolest thing ever! Good luck finding that many cart connectors though

 

http://www.mikesarcade.com/cgi-bin/store.p...egory=Card+Edge

 

Cool, I have been looking for those for a while, but never knew where to get them, thanks for the link