Maze Man

[Opry99er]

Here's a little issue I'm having... I found this tape today and tried loading it.... It worked!!!!

 

 

I ran the program and it's pretty cool... One obvious enemy SPRITE and a bunch of gold to collect.

 

 

So---I wanted to transfer this program and put it online, but I received a little surprise.....

 

 

I know there is a CALL LOAD to disable the protection, but what is it?? I want to share this game.

[jchase1970]

Is one of those that you have to load and list before you run it?

[Opry99er]

No, it runs great, but I cannot LIST or SAVE it to DSK1.. I get the above

Violation message.

[Bones-69]

Try CALL LOAD(-31931,0)

[Opry99er]

Thanks Bones!! I'll give that a shot. Might be a day or two because I've left my sister's place (where my gear is set up) and might not be back til Sunday.

[Opry99er]

Wanted to mention something... When I was trying to transfer this game, my TI dedicated PC wouldn't boot properly. It started up properly, but then the monitor began to act like there wasn't a connection between it and the PC. I tried re-starting the computer, but it never came back online... It started, the HD was spinning, fan was on-- but it never registered on the screen. Meanwhile, my TI fired right up and hummed right along....

 

First, the TI is awesome---

 

Second, anyone know what may be the problem with the PC? Bad video card? Who knows... Not me anyway.

 

If I can't get it up and running, I'll need to do something quick... My laptop won't run the terminal program I use--- I'll need to do some transfers soon...

[InfernalKeith]

Wanted to mention something... When I was trying to transfer this game, my TI dedicated PC wouldn't boot properly. It started up properly, but then the monitor began to act like there wasn't a connection between it and the PC. I tried re-starting the computer, but it never came back online... It started, the HD was spinning, fan was on-- but it never registered on the screen. Meanwhile, my TI fired right up and hummed right along....

 

 

 

 

Jeez, that's some wicked copy protection.

[jchase1970]

No, it runs great, but I cannot LIST or SAVE it to DSK1.. I get the above

Violation message.

 

I didn't say run it. Some games load a protect in a call load after the program runs. On these you can load the program and then list it. The copy protect never starts if you don't run the program.

 

I didn't know about the other call load trick bones mentioned.

[Opry99er]

I suppose I should use my CF7. It would eliminate the need for using MFM... Load Maze Man via CS1---CALL LOAD(-31931,0)---SAVE DSK1.MAZEMAN

 

I'll maybe video tape this for posterity... Make a nice YouTube video.

[Opry99er]

John--- I wasn't aware of that... I loaded, RAN and THEN tried to LIST and SAVE.. . What you said makes perfect sense!!

[Opry99er]

Jeez, that's some wicked copy protection.

 

HA!!

[Bones-69]

In the normal unprotected state the value of -31931 is zero. I suppose if there was a command line in the program which was CALL LOAD(-31931,128) it would protect the program only after the first time this line was encountered, but prior to this no protection would exist. Would be a strange way to do things but it should work….

[unhuman]

I vaguely remember some programs you could load but not list or save - even BEFORE a run. Forget what it would do, but it wasn't good

[jchase1970]

Here's a question for the TI tech people on here.

 

When you load a cassette into the TI, does it start loading the program at a default address and then just continues storing it in sequential memory locations until it is fully loaded?

[matthew180]

From the XB manual SAVE command, pg 163:

 

Format

SAVE device.program-name [,PROTECTED]

SAVE device.program-name [,MERGE]

 

Options

Only the PROTECTED option is available with cassette recorders.

 

By using the keyword PROTECTED, you may optionally specify that a program can only be run or brought into memory with OLD. The program cannot be listed, edited, or saved. This is not the same as using the protection available with the Disk Manager Module. NOTE: Be sure to keep an unprotected copy of any program because the protection feature is not reversible. If you also wish to protect the program from being copied, use the protect feature of the Disk Manager module.

 

--- end quote ---

 

Funny, the text says the PROTECTED option can only be used with the cassette, but then gives this example:

 

SAVE DSK1.PRG1,PROTECTED

 

I wonder what the PROTECTED option really does?

 

Matthew

[Opry99er]

I'm going to test some stuff out with it... I wonder if I can get the CALL LOAD suggested by Bones-69 to disable the copy protection on a proteted DSK file... I'll post updates as I get along with my tests.

 

 

[InfernalKeith]

From the XB manual SAVE command, pg 163:

 

Format

SAVE device.program-name [,PROTECTED]

SAVE device.program-name [,MERGE]

 

Options

Only the PROTECTED option is available with cassette recorders.

 

By using the keyword PROTECTED, you may optionally specify that a program can only be run or brought into memory with OLD. The program cannot be listed, edited, or saved. This is not the same as using the protection available with the Disk Manager Module. NOTE: Be sure to keep an unprotected copy of any program because the protection feature is not reversible. If you also wish to protect the program from being copied, use the protect feature of the Disk Manager module.

 

--- end quote ---

 

Funny, the text says the PROTECTED option can only be used with the cassette, but then gives this example:

 

SAVE DSK1.PRG1,PROTECTED

 

I wonder what the PROTECTED option really does?

 

Matthew

 

 

Matthew, I read that sentence to mean that cassettes could ONLY use protected -- not MERGE format -- but that disk files could use both. I don't recall ever saving anything to CS1 in MERGE format, or wanting to, but I think that may be what they meant.

[Opry99er]

Very cool. Here's what I did.... I wrote a program and save it as ,PROTECTED

 

 

Then I tried to LOAD and LIST

 

 

Obviously, it wouldn't work... Violation notices... Then, I CALL LOADed (-31931,0)

 

 

Guess what.... =)

 

 

Worked brilliantly. I wonder if I learned anything here.... at least I know I'll be able to post MAZE MAN in the near future. Thanks to Bones-69 and Matthew for helping out with this test.

[jchase1970]

"at least I know I'll be able to post MAZE MAN in the near future" - can't wait to try it. Don't keep us waiting, lol.

[Opry99er]

Hey John,

I'll try to put it on my CF7 this weekend... perhaps tomorrow if I can get up to Louisville. Once I get it to my CF7, it's just a matter of copying and posting. =)

 

BTW, as a disclaimer:

 

Maze Man is very cool, but not that exceptional as far as XB games go. The method it uses to create the mazes must be pretty unique, because it makes you

 

"WAIT 30 SECONDS WHILE THE MAP IS CREATED"

 

It then looks like it PRINTs strings of characters (ASCII 32 'space' and "FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF" 'block') line by line until the screen is filled.

 

**It then loads up the (P)layer ©haracter and sets the "big bad" enemy SPRITE in motion--- the SPRITE moves in an automatic motion and doesn't pay attention to the maze walls... The closest thing I could equate it to is the bat in "Adventure" on the Atari 2600.

 

I have a feeling I'll learn something by looking at the code. =) Might convince me to do a sequel at some point... In the vein of InfernalKeith's work.

 

I'm actually pretty excited to take a look at the code. Hopefully you guys get a kick out of it too. As I said previously, I'm going to try to film the entire process (including the disabling of copy protection and transfer to/from CF7) and post it to YouTube. I actually take alot of pleasure in posting TI videos to YouTube... I feel like there's not enough of it, and I'm happy to submit my time for posterity's sake. =)

[Opry99er]

Matthew,

I imagine this program uses a maze generator... probably a poor-man's version of your Hunter Killer maze generator in XB. When I get to look at the code, I'd be interested in comparing it with your HK code...

 

Obviously it's not using "room" cells and creating paths to it, but it MUST be some variation thereof. Might be a nice tutorial for people interested in learning to write self-modifying code to create mazes and such. =)

[matthew180]

"WAIT 30 SECONDS WHILE THE MAP IS CREATED"

 

Actually, that is not atypical for TI BASIC. Generating a maze takes a while in BASIC and 30 seconds is not too bad. My hunter/killer algorithm in XB takes about 2 minutes to make a maze that is only 15x15 tiles! That same generator in assembly generates the maze in less than 1/60th of a second.

 

If you do anything, you should remake the game in assembly!

 

Matthew

[Bones-69]

I remember in the day as a bum-fluff teen boy being able to tell from the sound of a loading cassette if it was protected or not. There was a distinct "stutter" sound right at the very start or right at the very end of the program. (I think it was at the start)

 

I was once able to list a protected program by messing with the fast forward/rewind/pause buttons while loading. It took a few goes (usually just ending in data errors), but when it did work you could list most of the program. There was always some corruption though with strange coloured characters mixed amongst the LISTing.

 

Heh.. The things you do when memory expansion was equivalent to 6 months weekend part time work.

[Opry99er]

That could be cool... If the game proves to be actually a GOOD game, forgetting the speed... Perhaps I should do this in assembly, as you say... TurboForth may also be a candidate. I understand Forth a bit more than I do TMS9900 assembly language. I'm still very much enjoying learning more about assembly every time I sit at my terminal--- but I haven't had that "AHA!" moment the fella was talking about. =)

 

To me, it's just very abstract. I can do simple things, but when it gets to setting up all the tables and whatnot, I get lost. Hopefully SPECTRA2 and its documentation will help me with this... I believe having a set of rules or guidelines in a package like that will drastically increase my passion for assembly. =)

 

TurboForth--- now this excites me just as much as SPECTRA2... I love Forth... it's a very cool language and I've been messing with Wycove Forth v3.0 for a while now. Don't have enough knowledge to write a whole game yet, but I've been able to write words which are the culmination of ten or fifteen other words to clear the screen, "draw" a picture on the screen and wait for user input. Post-fix notation and a stack... That took some getting used to, but it comes very naturally to me now.

 

I hope to do SOMETHING with this game (Maze Man), beyond ripping it to CF7 and posting it here. I might do a SPECTRA2 assembly version AND a TurboForth version... =) But I'm getting ahead of myself. I'm doing everything possible to avoid finishing Calimari Carl... I just need to get it done and off my plate. Hard to get inspired when you're hitting your head against a ceiling, though.

[snume]

Hard to get inspired when you're hitting your head against a ceiling, though.

 

Put the trampoline outside, brother!!