Atari Games in .com Format

[The Galaxer]

When i went to atarimania to download the dig dug prototype for the atari 400 i noticed that the game was in .com format.

 

Why does a game have to be in .com format?

 

 

If somebody can tell me why the game is in .com format and how to convert it to .rom format, i would be happy.

[olavese@online.no]

When i went to atarimania to download the dig dug prototype for the atari 400 i noticed that the game was in .com format.

 

Why does a game have to be in .com format?

 

 

If somebody can tell me why the game is in .com format and how to convert it to .rom format, i would be happy.

 

No need for anything really. It's a loadable file and will do with .XEX, .EXE or no extension at all ... On real Atari's anyway. It might not be a .rom, if you want to load by attaching a cart on the emulator. Just drag the file onto the emulator (at least AtariWin)

[The Galaxer]

When i went to atarimania to download the dig dug prototype for the atari 400 i noticed that the game was in .com format.

 

Why does a game have to be in .com format?

 

 

If somebody can tell me why the game is in .com format and how to convert it to .rom format, i would be happy.

 

No need for anything really. It's a loadable file and will do with .XEX, .EXE or no extension at all ... On real Atari's anyway. It might not be a .rom, if you want to load by attaching a cart on the emulator. Just drag the file onto the emulator (at least AtariWin)

 

 

I am trying to play it with MESS!

[russg]

When i went to atarimania to download the dig dug prototype for the atari 400 i noticed that the game was in .com format.

 

Why does a game have to be in .com format?

 

 

If somebody can tell me why the game is in .com format and how to convert it to .rom format, i would be happy.

 

No need for anything really. It's a loadable file and will do with .XEX, .EXE or no extension at all ... On real Atari's anyway. It might not be a .rom, if you want to load by attaching a cart on the emulator. Just drag the file onto the emulator (at least AtariWin)

 

 

I am trying to play it with MESS!

 

A ROM file can only be played on an emulator whereas a .COM file can be played on a real Atari or emulator.

A ROM file can also be used to burn a new cart, but that requires special equipment.

A ROM file also must be cracked to play on an emulator, a pure ROM dump of the original cart would crash. So, if you're going to have to crack it anyway, then make a .COM file that can be used in real Ataris and emulators.

Edited July 24, 2011 by russg

[Kr0tki]

A ROM file also must be cracked to play on an emulator, a pure ROM dump of the original cart would crash.

Bollocks.

 

Galaxer, if your emulator does not support the binary file (COM) format, you should consider switching to another emulator.

Edited July 24, 2011 by Kr0tki

[Mclaneinc]

A ROM file also must be cracked to play on an emulator, a pure ROM dump of the original cart would crash.

Bollocks.

 

Galaxer, if your emulator does not support the binary file (COM) format, you should consider switching to another emulator.

 

Not sure of the bollocks bit, surely a direct memory dump of a rom would still need a header of some sort for the emulator to pick it up.

 

The cracking it bit isn't 100% right I agree.

 

Back on topic tho, as Krotki says, change the emulator, Mess is truly 'a mess', both to setup and the emulation quality..

 

I suggest Altirra, its so much better than anything out there.

 

http://virtualdub.org/altirra.html

 

But just thinking about it, you might not be on windows?

 

If you are then Altirra is just what you need...

 

Also, you won't need to adjust the file you have with the emulator.

Edited July 24, 2011 by Mclaneinc

[Fres]

Heheh. You guys are nutty.

 

 

"Missing original cartridge image!" on atarimania indicates that there is no ROM available (there).

[+orpheuswaking]

ROMMMMMMM!!!!!

[russg]

A ROM file also must be cracked to play on an emulator, a pure ROM dump of the original cart would crash.

Bollocks.

 

Galaxer, if your emulator does not support the binary file (COM) format, you should consider switching to another emulator.

I don't know how emulators 'attach' a ROM file. Many carts are bank switched, so it'd have to have more than one dump. My point was/is that ROM files are only good for emulators where as .COM files from carts, which require configuration/hacking/cracking to work, work on real Ataris and emulators. I suppose ROM files could be used on an EPROM burner or Atarimax flash cart, but still require some 'hacking' to work.

[Kr0tki]

Not sure of the bollocks bit, surely a direct memory dump of a rom would still need a header of some sort for the emulator to pick it up.

Most of the available cartridge images are header-less, an emulator works with them after the user sets the cartridge type correctly.

 

I don't know how emulators 'attach' a ROM file. Many carts are bank switched, so it'd have to have more than one dump.

Not really. Most cartridges ontain one ROM chip, and a staight dump of the chip's memory is a perfect single-file ROM image for an emulator.

 

My point was/is that ROM files are only good for emulators where as .COM files from carts, which require configuration/hacking/cracking to work, work on real Ataris and emulators.

I don't think that you have a point at all, because you seem to change your stances faster than it takes to refute them (previously you claimed that ROM images themselves require cracking to make them work with an emulator - entirely different story). Besides, ROM files are as good for emulator as for real machines, once you take the file and burn it to an EPROM.

 

I suppose ROM files could be used on an EPROM burner or Atarimax flash cart, but still require some 'hacking' to work.

Nope, you can burn a ROM image to an EPROM without any hacking, with the rare exception of using a multiple-EPROM cartridge board, in case of which the only 'hacking' (that's an overstatement) involved is splitting an image into several parts.

[+wood_jl]

Someone please explain the names of the file extensions.

 

 

When I got my first disk drive in the early 1980s, it was .OBJ for object code. Makes sense.

 

Also, would see .EXE for executable. Makes sense.

 

Later, when MS-DOS systems were popular, started seeing .COM since that's what MS-DOS used, I guess? What was wrong with .OBJ or .EXE? Conformity with the MS-DOS world?

 

The .XEX seems to be a johnny-come-lately. It wasn't until much more recent years (I'd been away from Atari scene for a long time) with the popularity of SIO2PC (etc) that I saw this? Was it the Xformer emulator that started this? What does XEX stand for?

 

Thanks....just been curious about this.

[Bryan]

Because DOS/Windows uses the EXE extension, XEX became a way of differentiating Atari files. Plus, it starts with 'XE'!

[kheffington]

Because DOS/Windows uses the EXE extension, XEX became a way of differentiating Atari files. Plus, it starts with 'XE'!

 

 

Try again. DOS also uses COM extension as an executable file and always has.

 

So by that logic why not XEM or XOM instead of COM?

Edited July 24, 2011 by kheffington

[Bryan]

Ummm...

 

The Atari used EXE, COM, etc... but XEX didn't come along until people starting using emulators to run games. The Atari EXE files could 1. be confusing on a system that also used the EXE extension and 2. would cause an error if accidentally double-clicked. An alternate, but similar extension for keeping track of Atari games (mostly) appeared for this reason according to what I've seen. But if you know the real reason, please share it.

[Rybags]

The "standard" for games is nothing official - in any case, practically all commercial games were bootable disks anyway and usually had no directory structure.

 

The .COM extension is handy for some DOSes in that you just need to type the filename and the DOS assumes it's got a .COM extension and will run it for you.

 

.OBJ - I never used it for executables. IMO it's more an intermediate type of thing, a load module that you'll usually link with others or tack the run info onto then call an execuatable.

 

In modern day use, I favour XEX for binary files - it's just annoying to have Atari files that don't have proper application association although that said I usually run the emulator and use the menu to run stuff anyway.

 

Re MESS - I've not used it in years. It's a Jack of all and master of none, and does a fair job at best of emulating the Atari.

Plus, it's interface favours ROMs but is cumbersome for file or disk usage.

And I doubt it's got any sort of H: device patch, which further limits it's usefullness.

Edited July 25, 2011 by Rybags

[russg]

Not sure of the bollocks bit, surely a direct memory dump of a rom would still need a header of some sort for the emulator to pick it up.

Most of the available cartridge images are header-less, an emulator works with them after the user sets the cartridge type correctly.

 

I don't know how emulators 'attach' a ROM file. Many carts are bank switched, so it'd have to have more than one dump.

Not really. Most cartridges ontain one ROM chip, and a staight dump of the chip's memory is a perfect single-file ROM image for an emulator.

 

My point was/is that ROM files are only good for emulators where as .COM files from carts, which require configuration/hacking/cracking to work, work on real Ataris and emulators.

I don't think that you have a point at all, because you seem to change your stances faster than it takes to refute them (previously you claimed that ROM images themselves require cracking to make them work with an emulator - entirely different story). Besides, ROM files are as good for emulator as for real machines, once you take the file and burn it to an EPROM.

 

I suppose ROM files could be used on an EPROM burner or Atarimax flash cart, but still require some 'hacking' to work.

Nope, you can burn a ROM image to an EPROM without any hacking, with the rare exception of using a multiple-EPROM cartridge board, in case of which the only 'hacking' (that's an overstatement) involved is splitting an image into several parts.

I said ROM files can't be used in real Ataris, except to burn an EPROM or MaxFlash cart. COM files can be used on real Ataris or emulators.

I did a dump of an OSS cart, can't remember which one, .... here's from my archives:

 

"To dump BXE and ACTION!, any access to d500, d501 or d509

selects the bank of the cart that goes in a000 to afff.

ie. bits 0 and 3 of d5xx do the select. b000 to bfff remains

constant. afff will show a 0, 1 or 9 depending which bank is

active (d500, d501 or d509).

 

BXL and Mac65 use d500, d503 and d507.

 

MIO control address = d1ff. 4, 8, 16, 32 value here banks

the ROM in the MIO to d800-dfff. "

 

I used Omnimon and alter $D5xx to make complete dumps of the cart. Yes, a normal 8K cart can be made in one file. Almost all commercial 8K carts have copy protection, so you can't just load them into $A000-$BFFF, it would crash, and just making a file version would require a header.

I guess emulators, when you load a ROM file, don't allow any writes to the $A000-$BFFF area, circumventing copy protection writes.

Yes, I changed my opinion because of your input, I still say I have a point.

Thanks

Edited July 25, 2011 by russg

[Kr0tki]

OK then, I'm glad that we've sorted this out.

[+wood_jl]

... but XEX didn't come along until people starting using emulators to run games. The Atari EXE files could 1. be confusing on a system that also used the EXE extension and 2. would cause an error if accidentally double-clicked.

 

Aha, this makes good sense! I knew I hadn't seen this in the old days. And yup, I've browsed in my PC directories at Atari executables that I wasn't too sure which system they were for.

 

Plus, it starts with 'XE'!

Hah, what's not to like? :)

[Kr0tki]

The first reference to XEX I've found is in the Atari800Win 2.5d (the first version after Richard Lawrence abandoned the project) from 2000-02-29, in the "File Associations" dialog.

[576XE]

And another thing.

 

Is it possible to change xex extention to com and use any xex file as com file?

[MaPa]

You can have whatever extension you want. The binary file is defined by it's structure not a name or extension.

[576XE]

I only asked if xex is only standard ATARI executable dos file?

[pseudografx]

I only asked if xex is only standard ATARI executable dos file?

Yes. a xex file is just a renamed com file.

[+skr]

Actually it is a renamed Atari *.exe-file. But to avoid confusion with the windozers out there it is renamed to *.xex.

[576XE]

And what is the difference between com and exe ATARI files?

Where can I read about this?

I never heard about ATARI exe-files standards.

 

Really I remember something like MSDOS exe files have some loadable segments in extended/expanded memory but com files lays clearly in first 640K of plain memory.