DarkForce! BBS Info/News/Prizes

[+DarkLord]

Just out of curiosity, since it's a Mega ST, why are you running at 9600 baud? It will easily do 19.2k

with HSModem and the WiModem232.

 

AT&K1 thru K3 all do the same thing, AFAIK. I run mine with K3.

 

I'd suggest that you try some other comms software besides Uniterm. I'm not familiar with it but I've

had good results with TAZ, STalker, Freeze Dried Terminal, Flash (Xmodem 1k only - that's all it offers

that I can see), and CoNnect95.

 

I'm still working on things here at DarkForce!. According to the Express Times, Issue21, that has an

article written by an actual BBS Express! ST SysOp, if you're getting errors during downloads, it's most

likely due to the receive and transmit buffer values. He recommended 32768 (rec) and 256 (transmit)

with the RSVE mod in place. I tried those. If not, he recommended making changes in 128 increments.

 

Yesterday, for upwards of 4 hours, I started at the minimum of 16, then went 32, 64, 128, and increments

of 128 after that, 256, 384, 512, etc,... For close to 4 hours... Yes, I think I would have had more fun

watching paint dry. In a humid, jungle environment. Yes, that was making the changes in HSModem,

restarting the system, launching DarkForce!, calling in with another computer, trying a download, failing,

logging off, going back to DarkForce!, making the changes in HSModem, wash - rinse - repeat. Think

about that people. 

 

Now this was all attempting downloads at 19.2k or *less*. With just about any setting above, 38.4 with

a Win10 box and SyncTerm, or Kubuntu Linux and SyncTerm or my Mega STe on serial port2/Lan with

CoNect95 or STalker, works.

 

Since then, I've reverted back to 19.2k just to see if things go back to normal. I'm curious to see what

everyone results are now. For me, most downloads with Zmodem and my Atari's, work.

 

Thanks to everyone for being patient through all this...

 

[+DarkLord]

Oh, BTW - I probably asked this before, but you have done all the firmware updates

on the WiModem232, right? Reason I'm asking is, there was a bug in the Zmodem

/transfer stuff that Jim Drew fixed a couple of updates ago...

 

 

[+DarkLord]

Okay, just thought I'd post a brief run-down on HSModem and it's use. What I'm not going to do is go into

a lengthy explanation of everything. I am including *just* the English versions of the docs needed for DRVIN.PRG

and MFP.PRG as an attachment.

 

We all know Atari's ST serial ports were bugged and flowed. Given.

 

There have been multiple attempts at fixing them, software wise. HSModem

is the best, from my own personal experience.

 

There's a lot in the original archive that isn't needed for your basic Atari ST.

 

(no RSVE mod installed)

 

What you need: DRVIN.PRG and MFP.PRG. Both go in the AUTO folder.

 

DRVIN.PRG must load before MFP.PRG in the AUTO folder.

 

Adjust the settings in each with SETTER.TTP. (command line with older TOS versions, drag 'n drop with newer ones)

 

DRVIN.PRG Settings:

 

FASTINT: Yes

 

EXOPEN: No

 

MFP.PRG Settings:

 

RSVE: No (unless you have the RSVE mod installed)

 

HISP: Yes (this option seems to be deleted in HSModem v7, but it's there in v6)

 

REPL: u  (these 6 settings are for remapping baud rates - not needed without the RSVE mod)

         u

         u

         u

         u

         u

 

DTR: Yes (TOS behavior)

 

RBL: 256 (this is the receiving buffer, 16 -> 65534 limits)

 

TBL: 256 (this is the transmission buffer, 16 -> 65534 limits)

 

Configuration complete/save? Yes

 

And that should do it. Of course, you might have to play around with the buffer settings for your particular setup

and I sincerely hope that some of you will post results that work and/or fail so others can learn from your attempts.

 

(including me!)

 

Hope this helps... 

 

PS If something is not correct here, let me know ASAP and I'll correct it.

 

HSMDOCS.ZIP

 

 

[+DarkLord]

I've been playing around with settings this evening and after a little bit of trial and error, I

was able to successfully download a 57k file (DANCERS.ZIP) at 19.2k, via Zmodem, with

the following comms software\platforms:

 

Win10 box - SyncTerm

 

Kubuntu Linux - SyncTerm

 

Atari Mega STe (WiModem232) - CoNect95

 

Atari Mega STe (WiModem232) - STalker

 

Atari Mega STe (WiModem232) - Freeze Dried Terminal

 

Atari Mega STe (WiModem232) - TAZ

 

Atari Mega STe (WiModem232) - FLASH 1.0/1.6 (Xmodem only

but it's the software - it doesn't support Zmodem)

 

All with -0- errors...

 

[Tillek]

Damn dude... you’re up late on this homework assignment......

[JamesWD]

On 1/28/2023 at 4:01 PM, DarkLord said:

Just out of curiosity, since it's a Mega ST, why are you running at 9600 baud? It will easily do 19.2k

with HSModem and the WiModem232.

 

AT&K1 thru K3 all do the same thing, AFAIK. I run mine with K3.

 

I'd suggest that you try some other comms software besides Uniterm. I'm not familiar with it but I've

had good results with TAZ, STalker, Freeze Dried Terminal, Flash (Xmodem 1k only - that's all it offers

that I can see), and CoNnect95.

 

I'm still working on things here at DarkForce!. According to the Express Times, Issue21, that has an

article written by an actual BBS Express! ST SysOp, if you're getting errors during downloads, it's most

likely due to the receive and transmit buffer values. He recommended 32768 (rec) and 256 (transmit)

with the RSVE mod in place. I tried those. If not, he recommended making changes in 128 increments.

 

Yesterday, for upwards of 4 hours, I started at the minimum of 16, then went 32, 64, 128, and increments

of 128 after that, 256, 384, 512, etc,... For close to 4 hours... Yes, I think I would have had more fun

watching paint dry. In a humid, jungle environment. Yes, that was making the changes in HSModem,

restarting the system, launching DarkForce!, calling in with another computer, trying a download, failing,

logging off, going back to DarkForce!, making the changes in HSModem, wash - rinse - repeat. Think

about that people. 

 

Now this was all attempting downloads at 19.2k or *less*. With just about any setting above, 38.4 with

a Win10 box and SyncTerm, or Kubuntu Linux and SyncTerm or my Mega STe on serial port2/Lan with

CoNect95 or STalker, works.

 

Since then, I've reverted back to 19.2k just to see if things go back to normal. I'm curious to see what

everyone results are now. For me, most downloads with Zmodem and my Atari's, work.

 

Thanks to everyone for being patient through all this...

 

I find 19.2k is quite jerky and don't find the speed (visually at least) that much improved from 9600 (could be buffer settings maybe - will have to play with them).

 

Just downloaded FDT and have tried Connect97.

 

Re. firmware, yep latest firmware downloaded and updated (pretty cool it does it itself rather than messy updates via PC).

 

Cool will try download via Zmodem @19.2K with those HSMODEM settings and see if any different.

 

Thanks for the tips/suggestions. 👍

 

Still have to try my Falcon to see if any different but will let you know if it is.

[JamesWD]

right just tried the following :

 

FDT uses an external app for Zmodem which happens to be the same i use in Uniterm so for these tests we can consider terminal irrelevant here as both using Alan Hamilton's software for Zmodem.  

 

downloaded cheetah.zip on Darkforce. HSMODEM settings are as yours except increased both mfp buffers to 512 and FASTINT disabled

 

@19200 both Uniterm+FDT worked, had 1 CRC error midway but most important recovered and continued till end.

@19200 Connect97 using its own internal Zmodem worked again had 1 CRC error midway but most important recovered and continued till end.

 

@9600 both Uniterm+FDT had sub packet too long errors and ultimately failed.

@9600 Connect97 also had sub packet too long errors and ultimately failed.

 

HSMODEM settings now changed - both mfp buffers to 256 and FASTINT enabled

 

All the same as above except @19200 Connect97 using its own internal Zmodem had 1 CRC error midway and failed, tried again using CRC16 (instead of default 32) and recovered after CRC error, then completed successfully.

 

Will try again with bigger buffers, i suppose the random thing here also is the packet distance over the internet can vary (ping times) when just using local dial-up comms latency was minimal. 

 

I'm supposed to be WFH today but too much Atari stuff to do

 

Edited January 30, 2023 by JamesWD

[+DarkLord]

7 hours ago, Tillek said:

Damn dude... you’re up late on this homework assignment......

 

An Atari SysOp's work is *never* done!  

 

[+DarkLord]

1 hour ago, JamesWD said:

I find 19.2k is quite jerky and don't find the speed (visually at least) that much improved from 9600 (could be buffer settings maybe - will have to play with them).

 

Just downloaded FDT and have tried Connect97.

 

Re. firmware, yep latest firmware downloaded and updated (pretty cool it does it itself rather than messy updates via PC).

 

Cool will try download via Zmodem @19.2K with those HSMODEM settings and see if any different.

 

Thanks for the tips/suggestions. 👍

 

Still have to try my Falcon to see if any different but will let you know if it is.

 

Yeah, something needs to be adjusted 'cause there is a difference there. 

 

Did you get the registered version of FDT? Bikerbob posted about it some time back and it

is available from multiple BBS's (including mine) and other sources as well. It's been worked

on, and functions just like the fully registered version from BITD.

 

I absolutely love so many features about the WiModem232 - that easy update is just one of

a long list of really nice features.

 

Start out with your buffer settings at 256 and 256. That's a good place to start.

 

There shouldn't be any real difference with the Falcon unless I've got the 38.4 mod enabled,

then you should see a considerable download speed difference.

 

[+DarkLord]

1 hour ago, JamesWD said:

Will try again with bigger buffers, i suppose the random thing here also is the packet distance over the internet can vary (ping times) when just using local dial-up comms latency was minimal. 

 

I've not used CoNect97 - I use the '95 version and it's been fairly reliable here. Zmodem downloads work.

 

I've tried to emulate what everyone calling in experiences by using 2 different address entries:

 

First, I have a "local" entry for the actual quad IP address for DarkForce! on my LAN.

 

Second, I have an entry just like everyone else uses, "darkforce-bbs.dyn.dns.org 1040"

 

(BTW, just to remind those who need it, there is a 2nd entry I maintain without the dash

in that address)

 

Theoretically, the LAN address should be the fastest, quickest, most reliable, etc, etc. It's only going to

the LinkSys router and back to DarkForce!...

 

The second one should fairly represent what calling from across the 'Net is like. It's going out, accesses

the .dyn service, then comes back.

 

For what it's worth, the download message I posted above was using actual .dyn address, across the 'Net.

 

I've downloaded via both routes and I can't tell a difference in performance or reliability here.

 

We really need more people involved, and a broader exchange of ideas, IMHO, to help iron out the issues

we're seeing.

 

I truly appreciate the input. It really does help.  Thanks!   

 

[+DarkLord]

Okay, I've pulled DarkForce! offline. I'm attempting to do the upgrade to enable 40 column support. I've worked pretty hard on this for the last month (longer really).

 

This is very much a layered approach. First, I installed a "test bed" on my Mega STe, identical to the "live" installation on the Mega ST4 that actually runs DarkForce!.

I redid a lot of things there in regards to 40 column support and have it working there. Second, I backed everything up on my test bed install to various places (SD card,

Win10 box, Kubuntu Linux laptop, 2 TB external drive, SCSI CD-ROM, EZ-135 cart). Then, after pulling DarkForce! offline, I'm currently doing the same thing there.

 

Hey, I believe in Murphy's Law when it comes to data loss!

 

After the backup is complete, I'll copy everything over from the test bed install to the Mega ST4 that actually runs the BBS. This is a pretty large undertaking and I know

there will be issues. There were close to 200 graphic screens that had to be adapted from 80 columns to 40 columns alone.  We're not even talking about all the scripts,

.inf and text files, etc, that also had to be adapted, or the games.

 

Speaking of games, by far and away the majority of online games that run under BBS Express! ST were absolutely designed with 80 columns in mind. I'm working on

getting just as many as I can to work under 40 columns. Currently, there are 29 games in our games section. We'll be lucky if I can get 8-10 working in 40 column mode.

Other areas will be affected too. Several components of DarkForce! rely on aftermarket or 3rd party software that is no longer supported. It's also closed source. The

Sigatizer software for the file areas for example. There's just no way, without the source code, to make it work at 40 columns. So that had to be changed. Many menu's

will now have 2 pages instead of one. Some menus's will also have fewer choices.

 

One of the things I've always liked about BBS Express! ST is the way it "flows". Things are usually pretty snappy, intuitive, and move along briskly. I've tried to keep that in

all the changes I've made for the 40 column side of things. In the past, users have complained about 40 column support being "clunky" and hard to use. Well, it was, simply

because there wasn't really any 40 column support - or token support at best. I'm trying hard to change all that.

 

So many unexpected issues came up. The standard command;

 

VIEW <FILENAME> SHOWALL PAGEBRK

 

which, works great in 80 columns, showing <page><scroll><quit>, is just awkward and ugly at 40 columns so I had to employ another solution for that.

There are about a dozen files under BBS Express! ST known as .XES files. They are still script files that are then compiled (tokenized, to be more accurate),

then renamed from *.COM to *.XES. These sit in the MENUS_80 folder and are executed from there. For whatever reason, the Universe only knows, these

files won't run from MENUS_40. Express! ST ignores them and spitefully runs their counterparts from the MENUS_80 folder instead. Ugh. SO I had to insert

code in the MENUS_80 .XES files, that if user was logged in in 40 column mode, and these files ran from MENUS_80, to instead redirect to their 40 column

counterparts in MENUS_40. Exhausting and ridiculous, but that's just a small portion of the things I've encountered.

 

If anyone is curious, I used the following code:

 

DEFINE VW
DEFINE VW_DRIVE = 'C'
DEFINE VW_PATH = 'C:\BBS\LOGS\'

OPEN ('[VW_PATH]VW.DAT,' INPUT)
FINPUT VW
CLOSE
IF VW = '40' THEN
GOTO EOF2
ENDIF

--------------------------------

80 column XES files code here...

--------------------------------

EOF2:
CLOSE
DEFAULT_PATH
EXECUTE ('C:\BBS\MENUS_40\NAME-OF-XES-FILE')
EXIT

 

Crazy, right? 

 

If everything goes according to plan (which it rarely does!), we should be back online sometime this evening.

 

Please report any anomalies, crashes, glitches, errors, etc, to me as soon as possible. E-mail, PM, screenshots of what you're seeing posted here would be very helpful.

 

Thanks everyone, and thanks for supporting us all these years.

 

[+DarkLord]

Okay, we're back online.

 

Keep in mind, when I say we're in the beta testing stage I really mean we're in the pre-pre-pre alpha testing stage!

 

Please report anything that seems off, here or vie e-mail or PM.

 

Thanks everyone.

 

[+DarkLord]

Oh, kinda missed a milestone (for us) this week.

 

We've now officially topped 50,000 calls.  Sure,

there's a lot of repeat callers in that mix but

still... I'm happy with that.  

 

PS Oh, and just for the record, no SysOp calls

are logged and recorded in that number.

 

[Tillek]

1 hour ago, DarkLord said:

Oh, kinda missed a milestone (for us) this week.

 

We've now officially topped 50,000 calls.  Sure,

there's a lot of repeat callers in that mix but

still... I'm happy with that.  

 

PS Oh, and just for the record, no SysOp calls

are logged and recorded in that number.

 

Congrats!

 

 

[+DarkLord]

10 hours ago, Tillek said:

Congrats!

 

 

 

Thanks (and thanks for being in that number!).   

 

[Tillek]

Eh, just hanging out with the other zeros......

 

[+DarkLord]

Hey, Zero is my hero! 

 

 

 

 

[+DarkLord]

So anyone having any better luck with downloading?

 

Thanks for any input...

 

[JamesWD]

On 2/7/2023 at 12:59 AM, DarkLord said:

So anyone having any better luck with downloading?

 

Thanks for any input...

 

Got my Falcon out again and downloading using my old setup of Magic v5 + Connect97 every download worked without any issues or even any CRC error @19200. ANSI looks lovely windowed in a small corner with high-res (Blowup2 hard) while i'm browsing a web page with CAB at the same time, all in lovely colour, difficult to go back to an ST after . . .

 

Obviously lots of variations to try here, need to try basic TOS on the falcon (with HSMODEM) Connect97 again, FDT, Untierm etc.

 

 

[+DarkLord]

Great! When you get some free time (I know how hard that is), please try

with a standard ST setup again and see if anything has changed. ANSITerm

on the ST does a great!!! job with ANSI graphics. It's amazing. I don't care

much for it's interface, but the results speak for themselves.

 

While not as graphical as ANSI, VT52 on Darkforce! is supported and it is

colorful. I recommend Flash, TAZ, FDT, etc for VT52...

 

The key is to go into the control panel (some of the comms packages let you

do this as well internally) and change the standard green color to a nice shade

of something like blue. When you do, you'll get an attractive screen like this:

 

 

I have the standard green changed to a much more pleasing shade of blue on all my ST's.

 

Works for me...  

 

[+DarkLord]

Hmm, because I don't like to comment on things I've not used, I downloaded Uniterm v2.0 and

have been trying to play around with it. The archive I grabbed was an .MSA one and after I

converted it back to files and copied them to my Mega STe's internal US, I wound up with 4

files.

 

I can't seem to quite come to grips with it. I tried setting my WiModem232 to 19.2k, 9600,

and 2400. Uniterm would not let me communicate with the WiModem at any of those speeds.

 

Right-clicking brings up a menu where I can choose "help" and a nice screen is shown. "V" it

says to bring up the RS232 parameters. V from the main screen results in gibberish. It seems

it's set to some speed different than any of the 3 I tried.

 

Is there a trick to this? It did not come with any documentation... Thanks.

 

[+DarkLord]

Okay, never mind. I downloaded the version from the Crawly Crypt CD volume 2

on DarkForce! and it seems to be working okay.

 

Gonna play around with it a bit....

 

[+DarkLord]

Okay. I've got it working. Sort of.

 

I connected to DarkForce! at 19.2k, no problem there. The screen output from

this program is...well, jerky. I tried both "jump" and "smooth" settings but did

not really like either. (and this is on a Mega STe @16mhz and NVDI).

 

I couldn't figure out how to get VT52 to work. I set it in Terminal 1 but I never

could get it to actually show VT52.

 

Ymodem downloads worked great. Started, no errors, ended correctly too.

 

If I could get it to actually show VT52 graphics and speed up the screen

output I guess it would be okay...

 

[+DarkLord]

This month, March 2023, the DarkForce! BBS is giving away a new copy of:

 

Droids: The Definitive Collection!

 

Droids: The Definitive Collection contains Droids I + Droids II plus a special STe version. More details here:

 

https://tinyurl.com/56yy86km

 

Great Atari game collection. Good luck to all, and thanks for calling! 

 

[+DarkLord]

Just thought I'd add a picture.