JohnnyRockets Posted May 14, 2012 Share Posted May 14, 2012 Hi, Need some help from some C64 gurus out there... How much does a C64 go for these days? I'd like to snag one if I find it. Also, is there a way to program it with some form of cartridge rather like the "harmony" cartridge for the Atari 2600? I'd rather not deal with tapes, etc. like back in the day.... Just wondering what is available these days in the way C64...? Thanks! JR Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/197907-like-to-get-a-c64-couple-questions/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rybags Posted May 14, 2012 Share Posted May 14, 2012 Price - variable, you might get lucky and score for $20 or might pay nearer $45 for machine only + power supply. There's various modern-day devices around as alternatives to disk or tape drive. IMO it's well worth getting a real 1541 in any case. EasyFlash cartridge allows you to run games specifically written for it, and some older file-based games will run from it. Not really a cure-all solution but worth getting hold of. Cartridge was never a big media form on the C64, the best games were mainly disk, some also on tape. There's various tape and disk emulation devices that run SD cards but you're looking at probably $70 minimum. A self-made XM1541 adaptor can be made from about $10 worth of parts, lets you talk to a real 1541 drive from PC parallel port which in turn means you can create real floppies from downloaded .D64 image files. If you can tolerate tape loading times (which aren't totally bad if they use turboloaders) there's utilities to create audio files from .T64 files which you can then record to cassette. Tape drives for the C64 are practically throw-away items, you should get one under 10 bucks. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/197907-like-to-get-a-c64-couple-questions/#findComment-2521523 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirage Posted May 14, 2012 Share Posted May 14, 2012 If you want the gold standard and don't mind paying for it: http://1541ultimate.net/content/index.php If you want something that is much less expensive, but still very good and a lot of fun: http://store.go4retro.com/products/uIEC_SD.html Either way, agree with Rybags, get a real 1541 either way (don't pay much, look for one locally, like CraigsList where you can probably get a C64, 1541, and monitor for a good price if you're patient). The XM1541 is a good and inexpensive solution if you don't mind it being tethered to your computer. Other than the 1541 Ultimate-II having a lot more features than any of the other solutions, it's main selling point is that it pretty close to 100% emulates a real 1541, meaning the compatibility is exceptional, including with copy protected disk images. Pricey, but amazing. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/197907-like-to-get-a-c64-couple-questions/#findComment-2521635 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulBlazer Posted May 14, 2012 Share Posted May 14, 2012 (edited) I might suggest trying to get what I had as a kid -- the 128D. Built in disk drive that's quite fast and reliable, easy to place a monitor or TV on it, and a keyboard you can place on your lap (seperate from the computer). Very much like a modern system. Some people have said the power supplies have issues sometimes but I had and used mine for almost ten years, every day almost, with no issues. Edited May 14, 2012 by SoulBlazer Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/197907-like-to-get-a-c64-couple-questions/#findComment-2521767 Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyRockets Posted May 14, 2012 Author Share Posted May 14, 2012 Thank you all! Very informative! I appreciate your knowledge greatly. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/197907-like-to-get-a-c64-couple-questions/#findComment-2521829 Share on other sites More sharing options...
fernando marrin Posted May 22, 2012 Share Posted May 22, 2012 I would say Go for 1541 ultimate if you have the money, can even run easyflash carts,tapes and disk files Or The less expensive ide 64 can run 1 file games very fast Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/197907-like-to-get-a-c64-couple-questions/#findComment-2526716 Share on other sites More sharing options...
hardhat-ric Posted May 23, 2012 Share Posted May 23, 2012 FWIW (which isn't much) what was once the world's largest user group in still in parlous existence, and will help Commodore and Amiga users where possible. See www.icomm.ca/tpug/ Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/197907-like-to-get-a-c64-couple-questions/#findComment-2527973 Share on other sites More sharing options...
mimo Posted May 23, 2012 Share Posted May 23, 2012 fit jiffydos, you will be banging your head with the loading times if you dont! Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/197907-like-to-get-a-c64-couple-questions/#findComment-2527978 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seob Posted May 24, 2012 Share Posted May 24, 2012 why has everything have to be fast? I use a 1541 floppydrive, and I don't have a problem with the loading time. Have yet to build the xe1541 cable, but since I already am used to transfer file from pc to msx using a floppy drive, I don't think it is a lot of trouble working like that. maybe I'm a bit to nostalic, but I love to customize a disklable and put it on a disk and then flip trough the games and pick on out to play. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/197907-like-to-get-a-c64-couple-questions/#findComment-2528383 Share on other sites More sharing options...
high voltage Posted May 24, 2012 Share Posted May 24, 2012 Thing is if you load FSII on a 1541 you might as well dig your grave. Pushing up daisies will come earlier. 1 Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/197907-like-to-get-a-c64-couple-questions/#findComment-2528403 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirage Posted May 24, 2012 Share Posted May 24, 2012 why has everything have to be fast? I use a 1541 floppydrive, and I don't have a problem with the loading time. Have yet to build the xe1541 cable, but since I already am used to transfer file from pc to msx using a floppy drive, I don't think it is a lot of trouble working like that. maybe I'm a bit to nostalic, but I love to customize a disklable and put it on a disk and then flip trough the games and pick on out to play. Once in awhile I don't mind waiting, but I don't get all that much time anymore to play with computer or videogame systems, so I want stuff to just load! Plus, sometimes I just browse through randomly to see what I can find, trying games I've never heard of. If I had to wait forever for every one of them, it wouldn't be practical. Using a bunch of utilities is much less painful with a quicker drive solution too. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/197907-like-to-get-a-c64-couple-questions/#findComment-2528724 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seob Posted May 25, 2012 Share Posted May 25, 2012 (edited) For browsing trough games and trying out, one could also use a emulator. You can have them with screenshot, or even gameplay movies showing to see what the game is like. It is just taking away the charm of playing on original hardware I think. I haven't got to much time to play games also, but using the diskdrive or even the tapedrive, let's you try the game loaded a bit longer. Because you don't want to load a new game, you try the game longer, and discover that some games aren't that bad. Edited May 25, 2012 by Seob Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/197907-like-to-get-a-c64-couple-questions/#findComment-2528944 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirage Posted May 25, 2012 Share Posted May 25, 2012 For browsing trough games and trying out, one could also use a emulator. You can have them with screenshot, or even gameplay movies showing to see what the game is like. It is just taking away the charm of playing on original hardware I think. Yes, I like to play on original hardware. I've found that messing with the emulators, even in this context, isn't worth the trouble, nor is it appealing to me in any way, so, no, that's not a good option for me. Been there, tried that. I haven't got to much time to play games also, but using the diskdrive or even the tapedrive, let's you try the game loaded a bit longer. Because you don't want to load a new game, you try the game longer, and discover that some games aren't that bad. Erm, no, I don't see it that way at all, don't have that problem. Hey, if it works for you, that's great, not arguing that, I'm just saying that for some of us, there is definitely an appeal to having a fast SD/CF solution over old, slow drive hardware. More reasons!!! There's also the issue of space for me, and I already have way too many floppies around as it is. Actually, the biggest reason I don't like messing with too many of the original disks anymore is that it not only takes time to load them, but I'd have to create them too in many cases, from downloaded files. Forget all that. It would take forever, and I'd never do it. I can try out at least several titles in the amount of time it would take me to create one floppy, then load it up... no way. By then, the baby is screaming, and I have to go tend to him lol. Oh, yet another reason... I have, on one computer desk, my C64, A8, and Vic-20. If I had floppy drives for each of those (even if the 2 C= machines shared a drive), they wouldn't fit, or at least not nearly as nicely. Yeah... SDrive micro for the A8, 1541-Ultimate-II for the 64, and MegaCart (& 1541-U-II) for the Vic-20 are the best things I've ever bought for retrocomputing, hands down. I'd probably give it all up by now if it wasn't for these amazing products making it more time-effective, and therefore, possible for me to enjoy as an adult. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/197907-like-to-get-a-c64-couple-questions/#findComment-2528961 Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyRockets Posted May 25, 2012 Author Share Posted May 25, 2012 If you get the 1541, that would be all you would need right? The Megacart is more just pre-loaded games right? You can't put your own programs on the Megacart right? Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/197907-like-to-get-a-c64-couple-questions/#findComment-2529020 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatta Posted May 25, 2012 Share Posted May 25, 2012 The cartridge side of the 1541U-II only works on C64&128 machines. You can run the serial cable of the 1541U-II over to a VIC, or any other device that supports a real 1541 drive. But if you do that, *all* you get is a 1541 drive. You don't get to load PRGs via DMA, you don't get to load CRT images, you don't get the freezer functionality, etc. Still, it should be better than working with a real 1541, if you have enough room on your desk to keep a 64 AND a VIC at the same time. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/197907-like-to-get-a-c64-couple-questions/#findComment-2529129 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirage Posted May 25, 2012 Share Posted May 25, 2012 What Hatta says is true for the Vic-20. It works great though. As for the MegaCart, no, you can't put your own stuff on there. But the Vic-20 library was small enough that it has most of the cart games on there, a few newer homebrews, and a bunch of tape games also. It even includes all the RAM expansions, util carts, and so on. It's a great item for the Vic-20. Here is a link to the site telling all about it. From what I have seen on here, it's taking quite a long time to get ahold of one now. The guys doing the project are reliable, I'm sure you'd get it in time, but not as quickly as when it was first released, apparently. http://www.mega-cart.com/ Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/197907-like-to-get-a-c64-couple-questions/#findComment-2529176 Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyRockets Posted May 27, 2012 Author Share Posted May 27, 2012 So if I got a c64 with the 1541U-II, and I wrote a game for it. How would someone else with just a C64 play it? Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/197907-like-to-get-a-c64-couple-questions/#findComment-2530464 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirage Posted May 27, 2012 Share Posted May 27, 2012 So if I got a c64 with the 1541U-II, and I wrote a game for it. How would someone else with just a C64 play it? You would put the SD card from the 1541U-II into your modern computer and pull the disk image from the SD. You'd then upload it to wherever, then they would either play it on an emulator, or write it to a real floppy with an XE1541 cable or similar. Some people use various devices where they can run disk images (or .prg files) off a modern computer tethered with a cable. BUT... really, so many people nowadays have an SD/CF solution for the C64, that they'd probably just use one of those. If you are thinking of going with one of the SD options, unless you're super serious and know you'll use it all the time, I'd recommend a cheaper solution like the Jim Brain unit. It'll do all the basic tasks just fine and be a whole lot cheaper. I always recommend the 1541-U-II because it's "the ultimate", and because I love it, but again, unless you're extremely serious, it's probably overkill for casual use. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/197907-like-to-get-a-c64-couple-questions/#findComment-2530489 Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyRockets Posted May 28, 2012 Author Share Posted May 28, 2012 Thanks Mirage, great points. What is the Jim Brain unit? I can't seem to find much in an internet search on this device. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/197907-like-to-get-a-c64-couple-questions/#findComment-2530602 Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyRockets Posted May 28, 2012 Author Share Posted May 28, 2012 Also when you say that most people have and SD solution for their C64, does that mean that most have the 1541-U-II? Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/197907-like-to-get-a-c64-couple-questions/#findComment-2530603 Share on other sites More sharing options...
TMR Posted May 28, 2012 Share Posted May 28, 2012 (edited) Thanks Mirage, great points. What is the Jim Brain unit? I can't seem to find much in an internet search on this device. He means the uIEC (link to category in Jim's store, the $50 item is the one you'll want to look at) which is in turn based on the SD2IEC. Also when you say that most people have and SD solution for their C64, does that mean that most have the 1541-U-II? i wouldn't have said "most" based on personal experience, it's probably between a third and a half give or take. As to what they're using, there's the MMC64 and MMC Replay, quite a few variants of the SD2IEC system, the 1541 Ultimate and Ultimate 2, the Turbo Chameleon and a few others for SD cards, an older version of uIEC that had a daughtercard to use Compact Flash, even a few folks loading audio signal through a car stereo adapter in the C2N. Edit: just seen the question about writing a C64 game with a machine equipped with a 1541U2 - don't! Considering the age of the hardware, ou'd be far better off writing it i a PC or Mac based emulator (or cross developing it entirely) and just testing it with the real hardware on a regular basis. Edited May 28, 2012 by TMR Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/197907-like-to-get-a-c64-couple-questions/#findComment-2530675 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirage Posted May 28, 2012 Share Posted May 28, 2012 Maybe not most, but certainly a lot either way. There's always some holdouts for old school, or people who aren't even aware of modern storage solutions. If they will know about some game or program you've created, then they probably are aware of these solutions (whether they use one or not). It doesn't really matter though, with emulation or any of the other methods mentioned, anyone will be able to play your game. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/197907-like-to-get-a-c64-couple-questions/#findComment-2530725 Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyRockets Posted May 28, 2012 Author Share Posted May 28, 2012 So what method do most people use to develop? A modern PC with emulation or on the original machine? Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/197907-like-to-get-a-c64-couple-questions/#findComment-2530771 Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyRockets Posted May 28, 2012 Author Share Posted May 28, 2012 What is this then? http://www.atariage.com/forums/topic/198522-for-sale-commodore-gaming-usb-internal-card-readers/ Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/197907-like-to-get-a-c64-couple-questions/#findComment-2530775 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rybags Posted May 28, 2012 Share Posted May 28, 2012 (edited) They're just C= branded things for modern PCs. My C64 setup has nothing modern-day except an Ezyflash cart - rough equivalent of Atarimax flash. Those things aren't reallly general storage devices, more a case of periodically changing the software on them. If you took a survey of people who still use C64, I doubt the percentage using modern storage devices would be real high - but we're talking probably 10,000+ users here. A lot of it comes down to how serious you are about it. And there's still those "purists" on all platforms who insist on legacy storage no matter what... not to mention those who insist on persisting with cassettes. Edited May 28, 2012 by Rybags Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/197907-like-to-get-a-c64-couple-questions/#findComment-2530798 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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