Donkey Kong XM Pre-order and demo

[LoTonah]

I hope that Curt realizes that he could use some help seeing this to the end. Even if he was 100%, it seems like between the XM, the book, and other projects that he could use a helping hand with the administration of Syzygy (if he doesn't already have one). This is supposed to be a fun hobby, perhaps even a fun business--not something that'll put you 6 feet under.

 

Look, my intention was just pointing out something obvious, Curt's not up to doing the XM. The is an indefinate delay and he has no idea when or even if he can get back to it. Given his reason, that's fair enough. Maybe someone else can take the reigns (GroovyBee sounds like the best candidate), maybe not. But, right now, the XM is on the back-burner for an indefinate time period. In any case, in all serious, Curt should probably let the XM project go. Health comes first, and this is obviously no longer beneficial for him.

 

Given that, since this particular game seems ready to release, I didn't want you (Tep) to have to shelve it. I looked at the current delay as an impetus for a 'regular' version, not as a stick to beat the horse with, which is why I suggested a 'deluxe' version if the XM gets going again - adding the Donkey Kong 2 levels.

[GroovyBee]

You release this for the 7800 on cart, I'll buy it. I've bought most of the homebrews through AtariAge's store at this point (see my thread on being new to the 7800), so I don't know why you would think otherwise.

 

There you go making incorrect assumptions again. This is a pre-order and WIP thread for an upcoming XM game. Not all games that run a pre-order end up in the store. Thats just the way it is. So if you don't get your name on a pre-order you might never get the game (at a price that is affordable to you) on the 2nd hand market.

 

For 7800 games in the store, Albert has brand new PCBs available for those that are 48K or less. As soon as you start needing POKEY, extra RAM, bank switching (128K) or two EPROMs (144K) then at the moment you are into reclaimed cart PCB territory. Once you need to add wires, cut tracks, add/remove components and bend chip legs the time spent per cart goes up considerably. With that in mind and given a fixed amount of free time should Albert spend ages building one "odd ball" 7800 game or should he instead build a few other carts in exactly the same time thus fulfilling more peoples orders? Thats a pretty easy answer to me.

 

I want Tep to make as many 7800 games as possible and he will get my money as he does (or, at least, AA will). I also don't want to discourage him - which is why I asked if it was possible to put this game on a 7800 Pokey cart. I honestly have no idea. If it is, it may be in the best interest to do so, and maybe to something more expansive (like adding the Jumpman II screens?) for the XM version down the road.

 

Plenty of people walk away from the scene and their projects when presented with trolling and unfair/unwarranted criticism. Don't forget this is a hobby with initial development (especially for hardware projects) done at their own expense. Why should people spend their free time and money on something they are going to get flak for? Doesn't sound like a fun hobby to me.

 

If not, it may not be a bad idea for him to knock out a couple of his other projects, which I will also gladly pay for, while things with the XM are in limbo.

 

tep392 likes to take the legacy games and make them much better than the originals. Reverse engineering a legacy game to source code (that you can make changes to, build and have it still work), changing the graphics and adding code for new graphics, sound, logic and AI is not "knocking out a couple" in my book but if you want to trivialise it that is up to you.

 

I'm sorry, I find it easier to shop through the AA Store than a lot of the third-party websites. I was under the impression that you're selling it here, so I wasn't seeing the problem.

 

But, hey, if you want to have a big-ass battleline in the 7800 fanbase over the XM, that's your business. I just thought you were doing good work and was trying to offer a way for it to come to fruition considering Curt's current, very unfortunate, status.

 

But, hey, if this has all actually been about establishing a 7800 fandom pecking-order rather than the love of classic consoles, games, and development, then I'm not interested. I'll get the game and the XM (when/if it comes out) on my own terms and leave the high-school drama to others, thanks.

 

If tep392 doesn't want to sell you a game that is entirely up to him. Whining about it won't help your cause and is a pretty pathetic reaction at your age to be honest.

 

Look, my intention was just pointing out something obvious, Curt's not up to doing the XM. The is an indefinate delay and he has no idea when or even if he can get back to it. Given his reason, that's fair enough. Maybe someone else can take the reigns (GroovyBee sounds like the best candidate), maybe not. But, right now, the XM is on the back-burner for an indefinate time period. In any case, in all serious, Curt should probably let the XM project go. Health comes first, and this is obviously no longer beneficial for him.

 

Curt isn't up to it in your opinion.

 

Given that, since this particular game seems ready to release, I didn't want you (Tep) to have to shelve it. I looked at the current delay as an impetus for a 'regular' version, not as a stick to beat the horse with, which is why I suggested a 'deluxe' version if the XM gets going again - adding the Donkey Kong 2 levels.

 

If tep392 wants to shelve the game its his choice and not yours. If he doesn't want to make a POKEY cart version just to please you then its his choice too.

 

I know the Pokey issue ups the cost and/or requires Ballblazer (etc.) repros, since I'm the one who DID that research, if you'll remember. A $10 markup for this particular cart doesn't seem out of line, really. What I don't know if the DK XM rom is in an arragement that precludes a regular 7800 cart.

 

Your research obviously didn't extend to how 144K games and POKEY will work on the same PCB. You might want to go off and look at the issues.

 

I also found emulated Pokey and SID chips much cheaper, so to bring up the 7800 Melody cart now seems more doable, but it would use today's tech, not that of 1985.

 

So how is your new homebrewer's POKEY cart design coming along. At proto PCB stage yet? You haven't mentioned it since October last year so maybe you aren't up to it. I bet the XM will ship before that .

[GroovyBee]

I hope that Curt realizes that he could use some help seeing this to the end.

 

Unfortunately Curt and I are an ocean apart which means having a ton of things shipped over to the UK will be pretty costly along with the added stresses of everything arrive in good shape.

[Jaynz]

So how is your new homebrewer's POKEY cart design coming along. At proto PCB stage yet? You haven't mentioned it since October last year so maybe you aren't up to it. I bet the XM will ship before that .

 

Well, I never said that I was making one, just curious about what would go into it. I thought it would be a good thing for AA in the future...

 

But for your argument to be valid, I need to get $20,000 from various people around here and a few other places, make four years of promises, occaisional photos of some plastic pieces, a few dozen flame wars as a response to anyone asking questions, somehow a conspiracy to get me to stop making the carts, get a few people to promise games on it and have only one actually show any work, then get to postpone it indefinately several times, abruptly change my company and financial information with no expanation, and finally have some people post here about how great I am despite not actually delivering anything in all that time.

 

Then you can come back to me with that argument.

[tep392]

Well, I never said that I was making one, just curious about what would go into it. I thought it would be a good thing for AA in the future...

 

But for your argument to be valid, I need to get $20,000 from various people around here and a few other places, make four years of promises, occaisional photos of some plastic pieces, a few dozen flame wars as a response to anyone asking questions, somehow a conspiracy to get me to stop making the carts, get a few people to promise games on it and have only one actually show any work, then get to postpone it indefinately several times, abruptly change my company and financial information with no expanation, and finally have some people post here about how great I am despite not actually delivering anything in all that time.

 

Then you can come back to me with that argument.

 

Thats it! No DK XM for you. Come back one year. Next.

[tep392]

STOP REHASHING HISTORY IN THIS THREAD. MOVE ON FOLKS.

[Jaynz]

My last post on the XM, for good...

 

Thats it! No DK XM for you. Come back one year. Next.

 

Fine. Thanks for confirming that it's never been about the game or enjoyment, but instead about who're the "important" people in the 7800 fandom and who is not. Sad to see it, but there it is.

[tep392]

My last post on the XM, for good...

 

 

 

Fine. Thanks for confirming that it's never been about the game or enjoyment, but instead about who're the "important" people in the 7800 fandom and who is not. Sad to see it, but there it is.

 

No, it's because your a dick.

[7800 Emucoder]

[Ron Burgandy]Boy, that escalated quickly.

 

Tep killed a guy. [/Anchorman]

 

Here's a suggestion out if left field:

 

Would be possible to add back in the TIA sound from the original 7800 DK, or maybe the 2600 DK which is less annoying, and have the cart detect whether the XM is present or not like Kenfused did with Beef Drop and Schmutzpuppe did with Froggie?

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Jinks]

Lets all stay positive..

This thread is about Perry's awesome work on DK xm .. Thanks for putting the extra effort into going from what I paid for was a pokey sound enhancement to an all out DK ass kicking port of a game.. For the same price!!

Whether your a fan of a system and like to collect games and are excited about the games and hardware these talented people create. Or if you are a talented person who is looking to share their creation. AA is a good place for it. And it should be kept as such.

I apologise as I have fell into the drama before and caused some shit.. Lets all work together to keep this forum one cut above. Who else is gonna talk 7800.??. My wife thinks its all lame and dumb. There is no one in real life as in not on the net that I have ever came accross that could give 2 shits..

[Jinks]

[Ron Burgandy]Boy, that escalated quickly.

 

Tep killed a guy. [/Anchorman]

 

Here's a suggestion out if left field:

 

Would be possible to add back in the TIA sound from the original 7800 DK, or maybe the 2600 DK which is less annoying, and have the cart detect whether the XM is present or not like Kenfused did with Beef Drop and Schmutzpuppe did with Froggie?

Maybe so but has not our ears bled enough?!

[GroovyBee]

Well, I never said that I was making one,

 

I made an assumption that you were making one based on the hints you'd been dropping in your various posts. See how assumptions work now .

 

I thought it would be a good thing for AA in the future...

 

The XM is a good thing too in many more peoples opinion than yours.

 

But for your argument to be valid, I need to get $20,000 from various people around here and a few other places, make four years of promises, occaisional photos of some plastic pieces, a few dozen flame wars as a response to anyone asking questions, somehow a conspiracy to get me to stop making the carts, get a few people to promise games on it and have only one actually show any work, then get to postpone it indefinately several times, abruptly change my company and financial information with no expanation, and finally have some people post here about how great I am despite not actually delivering anything in all that time.

 

So its four years now is it? Considering the original XM development team only started talking about the hardware in real terms in May/June 2010 I count 2.5 years. Maybe you should reread this post because it contains lots of information that I assumed you'd read. I agree Curt hasn't done anything Atari related apart from the XM, a book, the Flashback 2+, consulted on the other Flashbacks, a Taco Bell promotion... So... Errrr... What have you done in that time apart from whine, complain, troll and create drama around projects you clearly haven't bought into.

[+Allan]

Here's a general request to anybody in the future who wants to come here on Atariage and troll. At least contribute in some way (writing a game, creating something classic video gaming related, archive something classic video game related,etc.). At least there would be some benefit to you being here and having us all put up with your crap!

 

Allan

[mmervine]

Here's a general request to anybody in the future who wants to come here on Atariage and troll. At least contribute in some way (writing a game, creating something classic video gaming related, archive something classic video game related,etc.). At least there would be some benefit to you being here and having us all put up with your crap!

 

Allan

I agree completely! Edited January 6, 2013 by mmervine

[GroovyBee]

Seconded! Trolls must be productive and funny as well.

[Bill Loguidice]

I agree that demanding stuff is not going to get things done, but there is a certain defensiveness around here at times even if what someone says doesn't cross the line from "suggestions" to "demands," let alone crossing over to trolling. We also have to remember that valid criticism and, in particular, concerns, are valid whether or not someone is a creator or not. We're all entitled to that (these are discussion forums after all) and I think that entitlement goes up when real money changes hands and expectations - which are naturally raised when such a thing happens - go up. I think those of us who haven't gotten burned in the past (and, frankly, some of us have gotten burned several times) and/or don't have a deeper appreciation for how things can go wrong when creating something on our own needs to be cut some slack on occasion. We can try for the fruitful, positive discussion before taking something nuclear.

 

As it applies to this particular situation, we know it's common for Curt and team to promise and not deliver when it's indicated and for the delivery date to slip many times. We also have to understand that some people don't realize this when going in and may even have less free money than others do to "tie up" in something without a clear delivery date. Again, this is common for many of US who choose to support the wonders of homebrew, but maybe not for everyone... Let's try to support and understand each other, no matter which "side" you fall on.

[ChuckH]

Perry,

Another fantastic update! You are getting so close to it being completed. The barrels falling off to the side on the first screen and the general game play is just great. I like that you added points for jumping over the pies too on the factory stage. One thing about that, the color of the points for jumping over the pies is blue and hard to see. It's white in the arcade version as well. Other than a couple of other things I've mentioned before and the additions that you mentioned, I think that you've got it!

I'm not trying to add to any controversy that there is but releasing it on cartridge and people not being able to hear sound until the XM comes out might be disappointing to those that get it. One of the best parts of your project is the Pokey sound but even the old sounds would be better than nothing in my opinion. Good luck with whatever you decide. You should be proud of what you have come up with Donkey Kong for the 7800!

Chuck

[GroovyBee]

I'm not trying to add to any controversy that there is but releasing it on cartridge and people not being able to hear sound until the XM comes out might be disappointing to those that get it.

 

Interesting take on it but its an XM enhanced game. The enhancements are POKEY sound and HSC. Anybody on the preorder list knows upfront its not going to have sound until its plugged into an XM.

[tep392]

I just want to take a moment to remind people that the topic of this thread is the game Donkey Kong XM. Your welcome to makes comments, requests, etc. on this game. If you want to talk about the XM module or it's history or anything also not specifically about this game, please take it somewhere else.

 

Thank you.

[7800 Emucoder]

Staying in the topic of Donkey Kong XM specifically, would it be possible for someone to provide a parts list and schematic or wiring diagram to add the necessary Pokey chip to the cart to enable sound in the absence of the XM, if the old TIA sound can't be added back in?

 

I'm pretty handy with a soldering iron and reading schematics. In the meantime while waiting for the XM to become available, this might be a fun project for those of us who like to tinker.

[desiv]

Staying in the topic of Donkey Kong XM specifically, would it be possible for someone to provide a parts list and schematic or wiring diagram to add the necessary Pokey chip to the cart to enable sound in the absence of the XM, if the old TIA sound can't be added back in?

While interesting, and I would love to seen an answer too, I think the issue (if I understand correctly, which is highly doubtful) is a cart with a Pokey (which is standard, just look at a BallBlazer or Commando cart) AND 144k RAM.

I think it's the RAM AND Pokey that is making it difficult.

 

My guess is this is why you can't get sound on a CC2 also. There are Pokey mappers and 144kRAM mappers, but no Pokey AND 144kRAM mapper.

 

While this game appears to use this combination, nothing that I am aware of is specific to this game. It's more a mapper/cart design issue and not a Donkey Kong XM issue.

 

Perhaps, if it doesn't get answered here, another thread asking for specifics about that combination for a cart??????

 

Just a thought.

 

desiv

[LoTonah]

Yes. Sorry for contributing to the threadjack.

 

And I also think that DK XM looks amazing. You're doing fine work!

 

I just want to take a moment to remind people that the topic of this thread is the game Donkey Kong XM. Your welcome to makes comments, requests, etc. on this game. If you want to talk about the XM module or it's history or anything also not specifically about this game, please take it somewhere else.

 

Thank you.

[tep392]

Staying in the topic of Donkey Kong XM specifically, would it be possible for someone to provide a parts list and schematic or wiring diagram to add the necessary Pokey chip to the cart to enable sound in the absence of the XM, if the old TIA sound can't be added back in?

 

I'm pretty handy with a soldering iron and reading schematics. In the meantime while waiting for the XM to become available, this might be a fun project for those of us who like to tinker.

 

I'm sure it could be done but it's going to take a lot of wires and probably some additional logic. The most strait forward way might be to do something like what I did to make the Ballblazer cart work with 48k of ROM. The POKEY and ROM overlapped at 0x4000. I wired it so that writes would enable the POKEY and reads enable the ROM. One of the ROM chips on the Jinks cart is dedicated for 0x4000 so it might only required a few gates to get the chip enable and r/w lines wired properly. I suggest you start another thread to explore the idea and solicit help designing it.

[Rev]

Can i be put on the dkxm pre order list, ill just take jaynz spot in line!

 

Groovybee can vouch for me, im awesome!

 

Oh wait, there goes my credibility. :-(

[gambler172]

Hi Guys

seems that some have problems

this is the thread of Perry

so,be honest

we 7800 guys should be happy to have a great

programmer like him

Perry,please keep up your great work

and ignore the i........

greetings Walter

Edited January 7, 2013 by gambler172