Nintendo needs to fire people...

[xg4bx]

...and I can't say that I disagree-

 

[JamesD]

Was there a link to go with that or are you just saying Nintendo needs to firs people and you don't disagree with yourself?

<edit>

Ok, the video wasn't showing up for me for some reason.

 

 

<edit>

I agree totally. Adam Sessler pretty much hit the nail on the head with his comments.

Edited July 10, 2013 by JamesD

[Gabriel]

I don't disagree with the ReviewTechUSA video, but I find the video it's wrapped around to be suspect. At this point, the gaming press is explicitly the advertising arm of EA, Activision, and whoever else makes deathmatch modern military shooters. Anything they say is highly suspect. If anything, this declaration makes me think Nintendo is doing something right. What that might be, I have no idea, but if the propaganda arms of the big publishers are desperately trying to prove that Nintendo's leadership needs to be fired, then they must be afraid of something.

 

You know, play what you want, but terms like "AAA title" and "hardcore gaming" have come to mean modern military shooters, recycled zombie game, or something similarly done to death and regurgitated in grey and brown. At this point, I have to say that I don't even consider fans of those kinds of things to be in the same hobby as me. Every time I hear that the Wii U lacks or is going to lack those kinds of titles, it sounds more and more attractive to me.

[Necron99]

I don't know about firing management but they were 100% right that there is still no games that are selling consoles for Wii U. those games should have been Day 1 games....period. even if Nintendo puts them all out in the next few months, the Console still has a rep of "no good games" and it will be years before that reputation is wiped...if ever.

[cimerians]

I agree completely including firing someone but that is NOT how Japanese companies do it instead they move people around usually promoting them "out of the way". They abandoned the Wii for a few years. WTF were they doing in that time?

 

Then they release the Wii U and again....nothing. Absolute nothing.

 

I have no clue what mindset they are in. I have no idea and cannot understand it at all.

 

They can easily do very well with what they have and the throng of followers that will never leave them.....so whats the deal Nintendo?

 

It's easy to go on a slow start with a cheaper handheld unit like the 3DS, PSP\Vita and then make up for it over time but I'm not so sure about a console.

 

I don't think the Ouya can do any damage to any other console but since it's been released in retail stores thats just another couple of sales to another console that could have been a Wii U or maybe a 3DS.

[JamesD]

@Gabriel. Highly suspect? I disagree.

 

This whole thing about the Wii U being more attractive do to lacking certain titles is a total cop-out. If you don't like a title, don't buy it! If someone else likes those titles and it's not there, they won't buy the Wii U. It's that simple! If you want to outsell the competition you have to appeal to everyone, not just Nintendo fans. And if you want to appeal to Nintendo fans, you have to fork over the exclusives. If the games aren't ready, the console wont sell as well and we are already seeing that.

Edited July 10, 2013 by JamesD

[JamesD]

...

I don't think the Ouya can do any damage to any other console but since it's been released in retail stores thats just another couple of sales to another console that could have been a Wii U or maybe a 3DS.

The Ouya has a problem.

It lacks the power to compete as a hardcore gamer system.

It lacks the motion controller that is now a standard expectation for a casual gamer system.

It lacks disks a kid can trade with their friends.

It's unique software is beta at best, leaving an opening for other Android devices.

[Hatta]

Hardcore gamers don't need power. Hardcore gamers need hardcore games. If all you care about is the graphics, you're a casual. The biggest advantage the Ouya has is that it frees designers from the burden of high quality art, forcing them to focus on high quality game play.

[JamesD]

Hardcore gamers don't need power. Hardcore gamers need hardcore games.

Define what a hardcore game is.

Is it determined by sales? Then Angry Birds would be a hardcore game.

Is it determined by game genera? But don't hardcore gamers play pretty much everything?

 

Hardcore gamers play and BUY a lot of games. They are a key market for game devs because they are repeat business.

Casual gamers buy Wii Sports, Dance Dance Revolution and Rock Band 5... and that's about it. You'll sell a lot of consoles but they only buy a couple games on special occasions. They aren't buying the limited edition Halo 12 with working blaster for $$$$ either.

 

I'm not sure there is such a thing as a hardcore game due to the fact that hardcore gamers play whatever they want.

Which raises the question, how do you tell what isn't a hardcore game?

Frankly, I don't think there is such a thing.

I think you argument is more RAH RAH OUYA than anything else.

 

If all you care about is the graphics, you're a casual.

Which is clearly why hardcore gamers go out and buy the most expensive graphics cards (x2) and why the non-HD Wii and phones are the kings of casual gaming.

 

The biggest advantage the Ouya has is that it frees designers from the burden of high quality art, forcing them to focus on high quality game play.

The biggest advantage of the Ouya is that anyone in their basement or garage can develop for it.

You'll get a huge amount of trash on the Android but it's destined to produce the next big game studios.

Notice I said Android and not Ouya. Ouya may get a custom version but I don't see the point in not supporting the bigger phone/tablet market.

 

You don't have to do high quality art to have a hit on another console. Angry birds has about the simplest art you can get.

Who has not played that stupid addictive game? Some angry kid in his parent's basement that says it's not a hardcore game???

Look at a lot of the indie games on the 360 marketplace. Many don't have fancy artwork or hyper real textures but they are fun!

Admittedly, the better games usually come with better graphics, but they don't have the "we spent $10 million on graphics design" like the major studios do.

 

<edit>

BTW, having really fancy graphics doesn't mean you'll have crappy gameplay and having simpler graphics does not mean you'll have good gameplay.

Edited July 10, 2013 by JamesD

[HammR25]

It's because they didn't realize how many artists they'd have to hire to make HD games. Insert Picard facepalm here.

 

"When it comes to the scale of software development, Wii U with HD graphics requires about twice the human resources than before," Miyamoto said. "Please allow me to explain that we may have underestimated the scale of this change and as a result, the overall software development took more time than originally anticipated just as we tried to polish the software at the completion phase of development. However, we are almost out of this phase, and we are also trying to create something unique utilizing an easier development approach called 'Nintendo Web Framework.'"

 

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2013-07-05-miyamoto-we-underestimated-cost-of-hd-development

[iswitt]

What Nintendo needs to do is actually market their own console.

[JamesD]

What Nintendo needs to do is actually market their own console.

Why? Did they start marketing someone else's console?

[iswitt]

Why? Did they start marketing someone else's console?

 

By way of not marketing at all lol. Remember how much they pushed the Wii? I do, too. Remember all those ads for the Wii U you've seen? Me neither.

[Gabriel]

@Gabriel. Highly suspect? I disagree.

 

 

Oh, I agree with the ReviewTechUSA video. The WiiU desperately needs some exclusives, and not just games which everyone can easily play on their PS3. I just don't think the sub-video he incorporates shares the same sentiment. It's just using that as a springboard to propaganda towards the ends of the people paying the bills.

 

Perhaps that view was created merely by the train of threads I read before I hit this one. I just found the main video to be fairly accurate in ReviewTechUSA's typical somewhat abrasive manner while the sub video seemed only intended to break out the pitchforks and torches and create a scenario for later quotation.

[Pixelboy]

By way of not marketing at all lol. Remember how much they pushed the Wii? I do, too. Remember all those ads for the Wii U you've seen? Me neither.

 

It doesn't make much sense to throw a lot of money into a marketing campaign when your prime titles (Mario, Zelda, etc.) are still many months away from release. In fact, I would argue that Nintendo's Wii U marketing campaign was directly proportionate to the number of Wii U games that were available at the launch of the console, and that's how it needed to be.

 

With this said, however, the video is essentially correct in its general statement that Nintendo's execs have been living in a bubble for too long. Staying a generation behind in terms of console hardware has worked in Nintendo's favor in the past, but that strategy simply doesn't work anymore, because third-party publishers are forced to make their games multi-platform to maximize their return on investment (or in other words, to break even) and the difference in hardware power between the Wii U versus the Xbox One and PS4 is great enough that they have to choose sides.

 

Any way you look at it, it's actually a valid strategy for third-parties to band together and publicly reject Nintendo, because then they only have to develop for two consoles of the same "compatible" hardware generation (Xbox One and PS4) and the consumers will "hopefully" drop Nintendo as well, which will help to level the playing field for the entire games industry. Third-parties would have a lot to gain from such a turn of events.

 

As things are now, Nintendo is just a thorn in third-parties' sides, because the Wii U just doesn't cut it.

 

EDIT: I should mention that my comment above are relative to the north-american video game market only. Things can evolve quite differently in Asia, Europe, etc.

[cimerians]

Unlike last time they don't have kids googling over an iPad all day long. Then when the good kid wants to play a console video game...him and his friends jump on an Xbox 360 for some Minecraft or Call of Duty. For fear of ridicule, he won't be caught asking his friends to come over to play a Wii (U).

 

Those things could be the biggest challenge to Nintendo.

[Austin]

Is anyone else sick of the term "Hardcore Gamer"? Does anyone remember 10 to 15 years ago when "hardcore gaming" meant owning a SuperGrafx? Importing the latest and greatest challenging shmups that never saw the light of day in your region? When the Neo-Geo was synonymous with the term? I find it sad how things have changed. Having your hand held through the latest brown and grey sludge or yelling to your bro-tard friends is considered "hardcore", yet skill-oriented games like Ikaruga are considered "casual" games now.

 

As far as Sessler's point of view, I don't agree. Yeah, it's obvious Nintendo screwed up. But firing people? Just to bring in a new team that is more hip to the "in" thing? Screw that, I say. Yes, Nintendo needs more games, and yes, they need to make money. If it means a first person Mario or your other run-of-the-mill shooters, then no thanks, I will gladly pass. As it stands now, I'm siding with Gabriel on this one.

 

I also think the doom & gloom shit needs to stop. Yes, they screwed up. However, we already know a nice amount of likely high-quality games that are on the way. I say give it another year and then see where Nintendo stands.

[cimerians]

I dunno...if it was my company I'd slap someone by now.

[Jess Ragan]

I don't think it's the message that's the problem here; it's the product. The Wii U was a non-starter from day one, with all the problems of the Nintendo Wii but none of its strengths. Did Nintendo really think people were going to pay $350 for a machine that struggles to keep up with eight year old technology? Why would anyone do that? What's the draw here? Sure, there's all of Nintendo's exclusives, and that seven inch tablet that doubles as a controller, but beyond that you're not offered many reasons to "upgrade" to hardware that's strictly last decade caliber. Nintendo got away with it when the price was dirt cheap and the interface was new and exciting, but the Wii U doesn't have any of that going for it. To say the very least, the machine was a miscalculation, and I think even Nintendo understands this.

 

Also, Sessler looks dumb without hair.

[Jinks]

The wii u is 250 and 100 for the expensive controller.. wait till n exlusives All come out. Its a bargin machine compared to the overpriced ps boxes. its too much work for 3rd party to program as have to take the tablet into account in the game so they just wont develop. all the best systems with odd stuff never get support. its too bad but thats the way it goes. easier and more profitable to make games for triangle circle square x does this and that than trying to make games that can do lots at the same time with gyro sensors mics cameras and touch screens on the controller.. too far ahead of its time. worked for wii cause programming was not as difficult but not this time..

I really dont care either way but its great to be playing on the very first hd console from an exclusive video game company!!

Edited July 11, 2013 by Jinks

[iswitt]

It doesn't make much sense to throw a lot of money into a marketing campaign when your prime titles (Mario, Zelda, etc.) are still many months away from release. In fact, I would argue that Nintendo's Wii U marketing campaign was directly proportionate to the number of Wii U games that were available at the launch of the console, and that's how it needed to be.

 

I don't agree with this. If this were true, why put out the console when they did? Why sell it at all? And if this was really their marketing direction, it's really done a good job of not selling consoles, causing publishers and developers to basically abandon the console entirely. If you don't advertise, you aren't going to sell as many consoles (which happened). Nintendo has sold roughly 3.5 million units, which is pretty laughable 8 months in. It's no wonder no one wants to develop for them. Prime titles or no, your console has to be in the hands of as many gamers as possible if you want developer support.

Edited July 11, 2013 by iswitt

[JamesD]

The Wii received a lot of free advertising.

Geeze, I remember a woman on the today show flat out saying that the Wii was the one to buy and she'd never even seen any of them.

It was all due to motion control.

[JamesD]

Oh, I agree with the ReviewTechUSA video. The WiiU desperately needs some exclusives, and not just games which everyone can easily play on their PS3. I just don't think the sub-video he incorporates shares the same sentiment. It's just using that as a springboard to propaganda towards the ends of the people paying the bills.

Adam Sessler was on an epic rant. Basically saying Nintendo management had totally f***ed up by not having titles ready and then saying oops the games took more work than we thought.

I got the impression early in the rant he was a Nintendo gamer when he was young because he seemed honestly upset with Nintendo for blowing their lead.

In the US such a blunder would get you fired. Look at Microsoft and the ONE.

 

It's possible Sessler is getting some cash from somewhere to say what they want but he wasn't very obvious about it.

His remarks were similar to my thoughts on the subject.

 

How do you plan to beat your competitors to the market with your console by a year and then not have enough games or more importantly THE GAMES to make it sell?

Someone somewhere should have started screaming at the top of their lungs they needed more artists as soon as work started but maybe someone didn't want to loose face.

I've personally seen that happen with developers from certain cultures.

[+Sargon]

I agree with most of the comments in this video. I think the Wii U has missed its window and now has very little chance for success. By the time the premier first party titles are available, the PS4 and Xbox One will both be available and will almost certainly surpass Nintendo's installed user base within a few months. To make matters worse, Nintendo has lost the support of most third party publishers and I can't say that I blame those publishers.

 

Nintendo is still operating with the mindset of "We're Nintendo and we're going to do things our way because we know better than everyone else", but in doing so they continue to lose touch with both the gamers and the developers/publishers. They are also failing to capitalize on a huge back catalogue of games that could be made available in the Virtual Console. Instead, Nintendo continues to trickle out 1 or 2 games per week (often games that nobody even cares about) and sell them at outrageous prices.

 

I just don't think they have a strategy that can be successful in today's marketplace, which is unfortunate because I own a Wii U and I like the hardware.

[JamesD]

<insert console manufacturer's name> continues to loose touch with both the gamers and the developers/publishers.

It's not just Nintendo.