HighScore.com Contest: $50 AtariAge gift certs to winners

[Serious]

What if it were your role to be a "gatekeeper'' for the repeal vote? In other words, someone would have to contact you about a particular score and state the reason why it is believed that the score should be rejected. If sufficient reason is given, then you can institute the repeal vote along the lines that Lid describes?

I'll think on it. I am trying to keep myself away from the role of being directly involved in score acceptance (outside of my 1 vote), as this is supposed to be peer review. I might have to do something like what you are suggesting until a better process can be devised.

[Serious]

Ouch.

I just erased cookies I used to log in to my account in Highscore.com.

Those cookies had my password and I hadn't to type it everytime, so I also forgot my password.

 

What a bad time to show my stupidity. :dunce:

No worries. I'll get in touch with you via email to sort it out.

 

Once I can get the site to send emails, I'll build a password recovery method.

[Serious]

Speaking of Cosmic Bugs, what's with the 2 million insignificant variations for which somebody posted scores? I find this to be a nuisance, as it clutters up the site with boring, needless repetition. Can a limit be placed on these little variations?

One of the things that has been somewhat problematic is newer games that present scores by level. The first time this came up before now was with Candy Crush Saga, but it is a common trait of many modern games.

 

In the case of this game, it does provide a cumulative score, but there are players who compete based on percentage complete per level.

 

In the case of these submissions, the player had already achieved these scores when they were participating on other sites, and wanted to share their records relevant to these games on High Score. The submitter of these scores has himself pointed out to me the problem I have with how these scores are organized and presented to the site's users, and has made constructive suggestions on how I can better organize and present these types of scores.

 

On Cosmic Bugs, it has been argued that High Score should not accept these percentage complete scores since their is a cumulative total (though that cumulative total is not the sum of the percentage complete achieved on each level). The primary concern I have with disallowing these types of submissions is that it would essentially alienate users who already play/compete on newer games.

 

Because these scores were submitted in bulk, as a result, we are all running into them over-and-over in the voting, which isn't very fun or interesting (in my opinion).

 

I have been planning for months to make it possible for the user to set preferences or make other choices on what kind of games they see while voting. This wasn't a high priority for me previously, but it is near the top of my list now.

 

I am also working on ways to group these types of scores into a table, so a person can search for "Candy Crush Saga" (or whatever) and see all scores for all levels of that game. (As well as every game setting for 2600 Asteroids, for example)

[Gorfy]

@ Serious -- I see there's a lot that goes into running a site like this that one wouldn't expect from the gitgo. Don't take my comments as criticisms. You're obviously doing a great job, and the site keeps getting better!

[Serious]

@ Serious -- I see there's a lot that goes into running a site like this that one wouldn't expect from the gitgo. Don't take my comments as criticisms. You're obviously doing a great job, and the site keeps getting better!

 

Thanks, Gorfy. I very much appreciate your supportive comments.

 

I'm always appreciative of any feedback you and others have. I really want to make High Score something special, and all of the feedback I get from you and others is very helpful in guiding me on what I should be working on next, and also giving my ideas for improvements that I never could have thought of on my own.

 

One of the most challenging aspects of doing the site is when I get conflicting feedback where very strong opinions are involved. There are a few individuals who have very strong opinions of what High Score should be (which they express to me privately), and they are not at all in agreement. In situations like this, I go back to my original vision that motivated me to invest in creating the site in the first place, and I let that guide me.

 

I have many feature improvements in mind for the future that I plan to incorporate (in addition to changes based on the feedback I get from you guys) that I'm excited to get done. It is probably going to be a while, but I think you all will like what I have planned.

 

I'm also building relationships in the gaming community that I expect to lead to increased participation in the site and increased competition in multiple categories, which will help with the main feedback I get from users all of the time (which is that more participation is the main thing that will make the site better).

 

I'm 100% committed to this project and I'm more excited than ever about the potential for it.

 

Please keep the feedback coming! It really does help.

[S.BAZ]

I keep forgetting to come back here to talk about stuff!

 

Is anybody having trouble accessing HighScore.com? I can't get to it, I hope everything's ok...

 

 

---> @cncfreak ---> my input: I think the Game Boy player for Game Cube is definitely NOT emulation. Same as with the Super Game Boy for SNES.

 

from Wikipedia: "Unlike devices such as Datel's Advance Game Port, the Game Boy Player does not use software emulation, but instead uses physical hardware nearly identical to that of a Game Boy Advance."

Edited March 20, 2014 by S.BAZ

[cncfreak]

Cool thanks for the vote of approval. I've been using it for videos because it makes the job of recording so much easier and the presentation is excellent.

[Gorfy]

I keep forgetting to come back here to talk about stuff!

 

Is anybody having trouble accessing HighScore.com? I can't get to it, I hope everything's ok...

 

Did you see the other Highscore.com thread?

 

http://atariage.com/forums/topic/219028-highscorecom/page-3

[S.BAZ]

ah, thanks Gorfy!

I miss a lot !

[Serious]

 

Based on the feedback I got from everyone, I have identified a number of enhancements that I will be working on:

1. Provide an easier way for a user to browse through all of the scores in the database.

2. Add more ways to sort/organize the trophy case.

3. Make it easier for a user to leave comments while voting, so the score submitter gets better feedback on their submission.

4. Better support for smartphones and tablets.

5. Add more ways to share videos and photos.

6. Make it easier to keep track of your friends' scores.

7. Notifications should link to a page containing the event that the notification is about.

8. Users should receive a notification when they crack someone else's trophy.

9. Give users the ability to add evidence after a score has been submitted.

10. Allow the user to set preferences on what types of scores they see when voting and browsing the site. (Some retro games may not want to see Candy Crush scores, and vice versa. Some users only want to see games for a specific console. Etc.)

11. Allow users to record their scores in the database for their own personal reference, and not without submit them for voting.

12. Let a user see the status of their requested additions to the game database.

 

 

Hi everyone,

I thought this would be a good point for me to update you on progress made on the items that were identified as to-do's from the feedback you all provided last Fall.

The list above is all of the to-do items that I have been working on since that time (in addition to handling other feedback received since then, and adding other improvements).

Here is the status of each:

 

1. Provide an easier way for a user to browse through all of the scores in the database.

 

I have done some work here, but I want to do more.

Here is what is done:

1. Top Scores page now has sub-pages based on category/system.

2. The game title under each category now links to the list of all of the top scores for that game, not just the details on the top score.

I want to also provide a way to easily access and browse all of the scores in the database without being logged in. You can currently access the list of scores for any game without being logged in by searching, but I want to add a drill-down directory of all of the scores as well. This is something I should be able to implement soon.

 

2. Add more ways to sort/organize the trophy case.

This is something I haven't worked on, yet, but I know it is important for those of you who have an extremely large number of trophies.

 

I plan to add these additional methods of sorting and customizing your trophy cases:

 

1. Hide lower-value regional trophies and only show the highest-value trophy you won for a certain game.

2. Hide cracked trophies.

3. Sort/organize/group all of the trophies in your trophy case by trophy type. (Special trophies first, Worldwide trophies first, etc.)

4. Sort/organize/group all of the trophies by the game name.

 

 

3. Make it easier for a user to leave comments while voting, so the score submitter gets better feedback on their submission.

What has been done: Link provided directly to the score page (where comments can be left) from the voting page.

What is planned: Allowing the voter to send anonymous feedback to the score submitter on the reasons why they voted against their submission.

(A pop-up with a multiple choice list of the reasons why you voted against their score will appear after clicking 'No').

 

4. Better support for smartphones and tablets.

This is a big one, and I haven't worked on it, yet. This is the largest amount of work still on my plate for any to-do list item, and it is also one of the most important.

I will probably be tackling this after I have finished most of the other improvements/enhancements on my list at present.

Now that there is support for direct uploading of photos to High Score, I want to make it easy for you when you have a smartphone to take a picture of your score and submit it directly to the site with your score from your smartphone.

I also want to make is so that people clicking through on a link from Twitter or Facebook on their smartphones will see your score rendered in a way that fits the smartphone display better.

 

5. Add more ways to share videos and photos.

Many improvements have been made here.

1. You can now directly upload your photos to High Score. This eliminates the need to support multiple photo-hosting services.

2. You can submit archived Twitch videos as evidence.

3. Facebook video support has been added to help out anyone using the "Share" button on their PS4 to upload a video (since Facebook was the first option offered for PS4 sharing).

4. Embedding of video hosted at Photobucket is now supported.

 

6. Make it easier to keep track of your friends' scores.

The news feature I've launched today lays the groundwork for this. You will soon be able to "follow" your friends on High Score and see events related to them (scores submitted, scored passed, trophies won/cracked, etc) in your news feed.

 

7. Notifications should link to a page containing the event that the notification is about.

You will now see news items in an activity feed on your home page. These contain links that will take you directly to the page that contains the event that the news item is about (comments made, scores accepted, trophies cracked, trophies won, etc).

Many more news types will be added in the future.

 

8. Users should receive a notification when they crack someone else's trophy.

Done. This now appears in your news feed.

 

9. Give users the ability to add evidence after a score has been submitted.

Done. There is now a button on your score pages that will allow you to add additional evidence. This button will disappear after your score has been voted legit.

 

10. Allow the user to set preferences on what types of scores they see when voting and browsing the site. (Some retro games may not want to see Candy Crush scores, and vice versa. Some users only want to see games for a specific console. Etc.)

Some work has been done here, more is planned.

 

What is done: When you go to the voting section, you now have the option of choosing what category you want to vote on.

 

This will be expanded in the future so that you can also choose to vote on (or not) some specific games that have more of a niche following (i.e. Candy Crush Saga). This will help make the site better for people who are only interested in one game, and will also allow other to ignore these games if they are not interested in them.

 

11. Allow users to record their scores in the database for their own personal reference, and not without submit them for voting.

Done. If you do not add evidence to your score, it will never go into voting.

I want to add more features to enhance this in the future. I think there are many users who might want to just log their own personal scores for their own record-keeping, but who aren't interested in competing with others or doing the work to prove their scores to others.

12. Let a user see the status of their requested additions to the game database.

 

This is going to soon appear in your news feed.

 

I will also be adding a page where you can see the items you requested that have not been added, yet.

 

 

Many other improvements have been made in addition to the ones listed above, and many others are planned.

 

I will provide another update on this thread when I have finished with the rest of the enhancements in this list.

 

Thanks!

[MagnaFarce]

This site is really coming together. These are some great improvements.

[kamakazi]

I wanted to personally thank Serious for the gift certificate. Secondly, since my wife and I have had to let our internet go right at the Halloween holiday I've been playing some catch-up. The site looks really great! I have to try and get back some of the trophies I lost (lol) but I feel that High Score is turning into a huge success. I hope that someday soon I will be able to have my own high score database others will want to use. I would not, however, want to be competitive with any other high score website but rather would want to join them as friends as the struggle to keep what video games were originally about alive and well. It's more fun and challenging to try and beat a high score than it is to try and complete a modern console game in my opinion.

 

Now I just need to figure out what I want to use that gift certificate on. I'm heavily leaning on Tempest for the 5200. I have been waiting for that game for a long time and it would make a great addition to the library of games for my all-time favorite console.

[kamakazi]

This is something I've been giving some thought to, as well:

 

What to do with scores where some type of rule violation or cheating is found after the score is accepted through voting. I don't have any ideas on it yet that feel like an ideal solution.

 

I don't view it as my role to remove these on my own, but the community should probably have a means to correct issues like this.

 

What do you all think of allowing a user to change their vote? Do you think this would be a good solution? Or would it be too likely to be abused?

 

Some changes I already plan to introduce:

 

1. The rules that are displayed to the submitter at the time of submission will also be displayed to voters on the voting page. I'm thinking that some of the voters in this situation may not have been aware of the rules prohibiting cheat codes.

 

2. User Legit ratings below a certain amount will be highlighted in another color on the voting page. (Maybe orange if below 80, red if below 70).

What you could do Serious is give a limit to each member on how many times they can reject the score of a game after a game has already been approved and for a set time limit. For example; if a game has been noticed to use a cheat to accomplish a score, and other members point this out and vote to have it removed, then they should not be allowed to vote on another score removal for thirty days. The final score removal, however, should be left up to a few final people that will be honest and give the reasons for the score to be removed, plus view all proof, before allowing or rejecting and score removals. Since you sound like you wouldn't want that role then it might be required, at some point in High Score's future, to allocate High Score members who will be honest to take on the role. Considering the amount of members High Score has you might be looking at a few dozen. High Score, at the rate it is going, will eventually require refs for any score removals. Not so much for the voting part as that is up to standard members, for lack of a better word. I hope that makes sense.

 

In a lot of ways, High Score could easily become an alternative to Twin Galaxies. It could also replace them completely at the rate it is going. It's good to get the members involved not only in submitting scores but involving them in checking the quality of any proof to a scores legitimacy. I see a legacy in the making to be honest.

[S.BAZ]

the anonymous comments when voting "no" is a great idea! people will give their feedback a lot more often that way.

[kamakazi]

I think that there is an issue with the 2600 Othello Rules. On the site it states:

 

"Both difficulty switches set to A. Game 1 unless otherwise specified. Must be played on a real 2600-compatible console or expansion module. No frying or use of hacked ROMs. No continues. 1 player only."

 

In the instruction manual it states:

 

 

 

left difficulty switch - In the a position, this switch causes the game to go into a setup mode in which either players' joystick can be used to position squares on the grid.

 

Unless the left difficult switch is in the "B" position. By official Othello game rules black always goes first so the right difficulty switch needs to be in the "A" position as well. You might want to modify your rules to express this or there might be some confusion. If I am understanding it correctly, the only variation of the game allowed is Game 3 "B" position, "A" position. Correct?

[kamakazi]

the anonymous comments when voting "no" is a great idea! people will give their feedback a lot more often that way.

 

I believe that what S.BAZ mentioned should be a requirement when voters are giving a "No" to a score. If they are voting "No" then they should have to tell why they are voting "No". This allows the feedback to become top priority so that those submitting scores can have better proof. They don't have to say who they are but the feedback should be mandatory.

[LidLikesIntellivision]

I like the "no" coming with standard comments choosen from a list. Examples: "i don't believe this score", "It needed a video to know this is legit", "Your evidence isn't signed, it could be from anyone" and even "others".

 

On the other side, the list (and free comments more!) will slow down the voting process, making it more painfull.

[S.BAZ]

*******************************************************************************************

"... scores where some type of rule violation or cheating is found after the score is accepted through voting. I don't have any ideas on it yet that feel like an ideal solution.

I don't view it as my role to remove these on my own, but the community should probably have a means to correct issues like this.

What do you all think of allowing a user to change their vote? Do you think this would be a good solution? Or would it be too likely to be abused?"

*******************************************************************************************

 

...

I'm thinking users should not be allowed to change their vote, except maybe over the first 24hrs. I've accidentally voted the opposite of my intention a couple times, I would like to be able to change it if that happens. I'm not sure, but it seems a little more open for abuse that way & doesn't seem as much like a real "vote." I'm glad when my scores have passed and are locked in, so to speak. You can see that a score went up for a vote, and this was the result. 92%. BAM! That's what you got, like having taken a test or like any vote really! after the vote has been done, the results are in and that's that, isn't that how a vote normally works? Also I guess that might be a problem if a score is borderline & wavers back & forth, going in & out of "accepted" status. Then would people be losing & regaining their trophies & points, etc.?

 

One idea which I sort-of mentioned elsewhere -- the option to request a re-vote -- At any time if enough users had recently submitted a request for a re-vote (maybe half the number required to pass a score, maybe more?), then that score could go back into the voting process for everybody to vote on. If it passes again, it could have a little marker indicating it had passed twice! if it gets into the vote a third time and passes it would be looking pretty strong having passed the vote 3 times. each time getting re-accepted could increase the # of requests required for a re-vote.

 

This would not only be a way to remove illegitimate scores, but also a help to keep the scores up-to-date with the opinion of the growing & changing user base.

 

I think the re-vote option would be a better solution because it would present the issue to everyone who is voting, to reconsider a score which has been called into question by a significant number of users. you would have a better portion of members brought into the decision.

 

-- how does that sound?

[kamakazi]

I am making a request for a rather odd game system. It was mostly used for educational purposes but it also had a few PC games ported over to it. I'm pretty sure that anyone here who had a PC with MS-DOS (286/386/some 486 systems) might remember a game developer called Access Software. I only had two of their games called Crime Wave and Links Pro 386.

 

My wife and I took a stroll in our town's downtown district. I asked to stop at a thrift store there since I had seen a small stack of 2600 games for $20 for all a few days ago. So...we stopped. They had already sold the Atari games and I was introduced to the guy who had more. During our conversation the other store operator (or whatever he was) dropped a box between us. At first I thought it was just another piece of audio or video hardware and then I got a good look at it. The person that dropped it on the floor said if the other guy doesn't want it then you can have it for $20. He just wanted it out of his store. The other guy used ebay to try to research it. Found nothing. I knew what it was after doing some short research on it a few years back but had no interest in it at the time. What caught my eye was the system came with a large pile of software...all of them complete in their boxes. Some boxes are not in too good of shape but most were intact. Two of the games were titles I haven't seen since my 386 days. Links and Sherlock Holmes. Needless to say the other guy passed on it since he couldn't find anything on it. I did get into some trouble over it because I was suppose to get Atari games and instead walked out with this "thing".

 

 

The system is a Tandy/Magnavox Video Information System (VIS). It was made in 1993 to compete with the Philips CD-i. Well, any serious gamer knows how the CD-i did against the likes of Nintendo and Sega. More research on this system turned up some interesting information. I never knew Tandy owned Magnavox at the time. I also discovered that it had a high price tag. Gamers turned it down because they had no interest in the "educational" thing. But it wasn't a bad concept and, after reading the system's specs, could have been a decent gaming system for the time. It's only possible downfall would have been the fact that it used an already obsolete AMD 286 CPU and came with only 1 MB of System RAM. In all honesty, it seemed like Tandy threw some left over old computer parts together to try to get rid of them. However, it is what it is...a game system whether educational or not. Gamester81 at Youtube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l0kIZ2WeAZo) has considered the system a rare console and only serious collectors should pick one up. I just found it in the wild thinking it would be something new to try out and if I didn't like it I could pass it on to someone else. Whether I got lucky or not remains to be seen.

 

So...Serious...it's your call. Can you add the Tandy/Magnavox VIS to the list and Links: The Challenge of Golf for it? I spent $20 on it and if just for this game then I feel it was worth it. The Sherlock Holmes game isn't all that bad either for those that like to solve mysteries. I'm surprised that no one has tried to make homebrewed games for it since it uses a slimmed down version of Windows 3.1.

 

Edited April 20, 2014 by kamakazi

[kamakazi]

Hey!! The sampler disc for the VIS has a space shooter on it. Nothing to write home about but still a fun little game.

[Serious]

I think that there is an issue with the 2600 Othello Rules. On the site it states:

 

"Both difficulty switches set to A. Game 1 unless otherwise specified. Must be played on a real 2600-compatible console or expansion module. No frying or use of hacked ROMs. No continues. 1 player only."

 

In the instruction manual it states:

 

 

Unless the left difficult switch is in the "B" position. By official Othello game rules black always goes first so the right difficulty switch needs to be in the "A" position as well. You might want to modify your rules to express this or there might be some confusion. If I am understanding it correctly, the only variation of the game allowed is Game 3 "B" position, "A" position. Correct?

 

Thanks for pointing this out!

 

The rules that you're seeing are specific to the category. I don't yet have game-specific rules in place.

 

I will move these variations into the categories that don't specify difficulty switch settings, which will hopefully eliminate any confusion caused by the conflict in what the rules are saying and what the game title specifies.

[Serious]

 

So...Serious...it's your call. Can you add the Tandy/Magnavox VIS to the list and Links: The Challenge of Golf for it? I spent $20 on it and if just for this game then I feel it was worth it. The Sherlock Holmes game isn't all that bad either for those that like to solve mysteries. I'm surprised that no one has tried to make homebrewed games for it since it uses a slimmed down version of Windows 3.1.

 

 

 

Certainly. Can you let me know how the scoring works on "Links"?

[Serious]

 

I think the re-vote option would be a better solution because it would present the issue to everyone who is voting, to reconsider a score which has been called into question by a significant number of users. you would have a better portion of members brought into the decision.

 

-- how does that sound?

 

I like this approach. I already have spent some time trying to implement a "recall" system, and it has been more complicated to implement (with the approach I took) than I anticipated.

 

One of the complexities is how to get the score in front of users for voting.

 

My thinking now is that instead of this being a separate workflow, the score should be dumped back into the normal voting system, with a special status that alerts the voter that it is a recall vote, and notes from the user who flagged it as to why they think it should be reconsidered.

 

Some things I haven't worked out, yet:

 

What happens if a score passes the recall vote? Should it be ineligible for another recall vote? Or maybe just the person who initiated the recall vote cannot do so again?

 

Should the person who initiates the recall pay some kind of cost (perhaps in points?) to discourage frivolous recalls? (And given that I plan to only allow black-belt-level users to initiate a recall vote, is it even necessary to impose a cost?) Right now, there is no one at the black belt level who I think would abuse this, but in the future there could be, so that's a problem I'm considering.

[Serious]

I like the "no" coming with standard comments choosen from a list. Examples: "i don't believe this score", "It needed a video to know this is legit", "Your evidence isn't signed, it could be from anyone" and even "others".

 

On the other side, the list (and free comments more!) will slow down the voting process, making it more painfull.

 

I will try to avoid doing this in a way that will be painful.

 

My plan is just to have a little dialog pop-up with some options to choose from (no free-text entry), which will immediately disappear, and the next score will load. I don't think it will add more than a second or two.

[kamakazi]

 

Certainly. Can you let me know how the scoring works on "Links"?

 

I use to play this game back in the good ol' DOS days. It is easily the first golf simulation I have ever come across. Scoring is the same as with real golf (or putt putt golf for that matter). It's score is based on the number of swings it takes to complete a hole. The player has a few options (I would recommend mentioning in the rules that Mulligans are NOT allowed as the game allows for this with every swing). They can practice each hole on an individual basis, they play the first nine holes or the last nine holes, or they can play the entire 18-holes. I played only one hole to see how well the game performs on the system that has been dubbed "Virtually Impossible to Sell". It actually performs faster than the copy I had for my old 386 running at 40MHz and this system runs at half that speed. The score recording needs to allow for negative numbers because the lower the score the better the game was played. I'm going to try to get a video of the game playing and post it here for others to see.

 

It's too bad that homebrew games can't be made for this system. Maybe I can find a way to crack it. But from what I read on other websites Tandy made every game developed go through them so they could make a profit off the games as well. They were the only ones that had the file for the system to check for authentication.

 

I'm also going to request another game as soon as the system is added. It's tucked away on the sampler disc. It's a complete game that I discovered Tandy developed to test the system's video and MIDI abilities. It's not the best game I've seen but I have seen worse. It's a 2D shoot 'em up. Sherlock Holmes has a scoring system as well but I have not played that game in a while so I don't remember how the score works.