+Ksarul Posted May 9, 2014 Share Posted May 9, 2014 UberGROM is a 512K EPROM cartridge (using PLCCs) that also has the option of adding an Atmel ATMega 1284 to it to simulate an additional 128K of GROM. This will let you build cartridges that would otherwise have to be in a GRAM device--so they can (assuming they aren't dependent on the 32K memory like the Cartridges Gazoo populated for us, and which are also excellent use-cases for these boards) be available to everyone from the console-only user to the Uber-programmer. This means the board can have up to 640 of mixed ROM and GROM on it--and can also give you physical copies of such useful programs as Tony Knerr's XB 2.7, Winfried Winkler's XB-3, and Rich Gilbertson's RXB or REA cartridges. You can also use it to make physical copies of ultra-rare cartridges like Test Trainer, the SMU Engineering module, Crossfire, the Disney cartridges, Lasso, Plant Genetics, Advertizer, TI Calc, or any other module you can think of. . .once we have the loader for it, and Tursi has been working on that on an as-time-allows basis. With luck, hee'll get the time he needs for that sometime this year, but the cartridge is usable for any form of EPROM cartridge now (working much like the 128kx4 (inverted) and 512k (non-inverted) boards you have from me). Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/224528-setting-up-a-512k-cart/page/6/#findComment-2986890 Share on other sites More sharing options...
+acadiel Posted May 9, 2014 Share Posted May 9, 2014 Fixed my problem. Looking at the adapter board, I noticed the contact for pin 4 was flattened down. A little surgery with one of my Wife's sewing needles solved the problem. Gazoo I have a love hate relationship with those PLCC sockets. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/224528-setting-up-a-512k-cart/page/6/#findComment-2986914 Share on other sites More sharing options...
+acadiel Posted May 9, 2014 Share Posted May 9, 2014 The UberGROM boards work fine. It seems to be these damn, flaky, budget EPROM adapters that are the problem. I think they were all assembled in China by the noted Wun Dum Gai. They don't seem to work consistently well. I guess my next influx of PayPal money will go for one that really works as it should. Not only that but the chips themselves are picky and/or get bent pins easily. :-) Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/224528-setting-up-a-512k-cart/page/6/#findComment-2986916 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gazoo Posted May 10, 2014 Author Share Posted May 10, 2014 Not only that but the chips themselves are picky and/or get bent pins easily. :-) I've been popping these chips in and out of vending machine computer boards for quite a few years. There's definitely a knack to it. You also need glasses that let you see the pins very clearly as they're really easy to bend. If you bend one of the pins on the chip or the socket contacts, don't panic. Get a sewing needle and very carefully apply the correct pressure to the pin or contact to bend it back into place. Don't press too hard or get in a hurry or you'll break off the pin and then all bets are off. Gazoo 1 Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/224528-setting-up-a-512k-cart/page/6/#findComment-2987222 Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Ksarul Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 That is a very useful tip, Gazoo. May I add it to the manual? Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/224528-setting-up-a-512k-cart/page/6/#findComment-2987226 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gazoo Posted May 10, 2014 Author Share Posted May 10, 2014 That is a very useful tip, Gazoo. May I add it to the manual? Nothing I post is ever copyrighted, it's all beer-ware. Gazoo Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/224528-setting-up-a-512k-cart/page/6/#findComment-2987232 Share on other sites More sharing options...
+remowilliams Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 Use a good PLCC extractor, not screwdrivers. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/224528-setting-up-a-512k-cart/page/6/#findComment-2987265 Share on other sites More sharing options...
+acadiel Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 Use a good PLCC extractor, not screwdrivers. Got one of those... a nice one too. I still manage to mangle the pins from time to time. It might also be the sockets I used; there's three different variables at play there (chip, socket, PLCC puller). At least i can rule out the PLCC EEPROM DIP adapter.. that thing rocks. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/224528-setting-up-a-512k-cart/page/6/#findComment-2987271 Share on other sites More sharing options...
+acadiel Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 The limit is 512k minus 8k for the menu program. Individual programs can be anywhere from 8k to 32k in size. The limitation is that is has to be an ea5 program for the way I'm doing it. It's possible to put some c>6000 single bank carts in there, depending on the length of the menu name. Gazoo Just a little bit more clarification on the EPROM image... rather the GROM images like A-Maze-ing that seem to run as EA/5 programs... are these using those little GROM emulator stubs like in the DiskIt archive which I posted earlier? It was simply a E/A 5 program called LOADER/B, which you copied as CART1, and you then essentially daisy chained the hex-edited GROMs with a small PROGRAM header on them (12 bytes) that told the EA/5 loader if there was another segment or not, and where to load that segment. CHIP BEING DUMPED: 1 2 3 4 NEW VALUE FOR FIRST "0000": A000 B800 D000 E800 NEW VALUE FOR SECOND "0000": E000 E000 E000 E000 NEW VALUE FOR THIRD "0000": F7FF F7FF F7FF F7FF So, essentially, it was copying it to 32K (>A000, >B800, >D000, >E800), which were 6K increments. So, in other words, the upper 24K of expansion memory, for up to four GROMs and then RUNNING the GROMs natively (with the GROMs in the upper 32K memory expansion space.) So... my questions for the group in general: 1) Were the "recompiled GROMs linked as assembly (or however everyone is phrasing it)" in this Games GROM using the same tactic as this GPL loader stub which enabled GPL to run from >A000? 2) Who originally wrote these "run GROM from non GROM memory space" programs? 3) Can we put TOD in a cart using this same method (by putting the first 6K in the upper 8K of lower memory expansion and fixing this method slightly?) TOD is 5 GROMs, or 30K. It would even be super cool if we could put the PENNIES and KING quests in a ROM bank. Pardon my questions... but I want know more. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/224528-setting-up-a-512k-cart/page/6/#findComment-2987284 Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Ksarul Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 I don't think this method will work for any of the larger GROM cartridges, Acadiel--at least not without doing some form of GROM packing first. The other question is how much space does the loader need to set up and execute (both for itself and the GROM files in RAM). I think this loader is just tricking the system into thinking that the GROM data in RAM is still in a GROM when it executes. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/224528-setting-up-a-512k-cart/page/6/#findComment-2987290 Share on other sites More sharing options...
+acadiel Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 I don't think this method will work for any of the larger GROM cartridges, Acadiel--at least not without doing some form of GROM packing first. The other question is how much space does the loader need to set up and execute (both for itself and the GROM files in RAM). I think this loader is just tricking the system into thinking that the GROM data in RAM is still in a GROM when it executes. Yeah, I'll have to look at that LOADER/B and see in its header where it's loading and how much space it's taking. I'm gathering it's loading in the lower 8K at >2000. Too bad I can't have the address lines for >4000 in the cart slot and stick some temporary RAM in the DSR space :-) That would open up some possibilities. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/224528-setting-up-a-512k-cart/page/6/#findComment-2987328 Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Ksarul Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 You just need to build one of my TI 128K cards, Acadiel--it has 8K or RAM paged into the DSR space already. . . Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/224528-setting-up-a-512k-cart/page/6/#findComment-2987330 Share on other sites More sharing options...
+acadiel Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 You just need to build one of my TI 128K cards, Acadiel--it has 8K or RAM paged into the DSR space already. . . Yeah, we need to make that a pass through side car for NanoPEB and Corcomp sidecar users :-). Need any help? :-) Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/224528-setting-up-a-512k-cart/page/6/#findComment-2987337 Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Ksarul Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 BTW, here's the deluxe adapter for doing PLCCs: http://www.ebay.com/itm/271325542721? The version I have now won't work that way--but it might be possible to modify the circuit for the Speech Synthesizer 32K daughter board to do that--it still has some extra outputs on the 138. . .and it would just need to use one of them. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/224528-setting-up-a-512k-cart/page/6/#findComment-2987342 Share on other sites More sharing options...
RXB Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 Just a little bit more clarification on the EPROM image... rather the GROM images like A-Maze-ing that seem to run as EA/5 programs... are these using those little GROM emulator stubs like in the DiskIt archive which I posted earlier? It was simply a E/A 5 program called LOADER/B, which you copied as CART1, and you then essentially daisy chained the hex-edited GROMs with a small PROGRAM header on them (12 bytes) that told the EA/5 loader if there was another segment or not, and where to load that segment. CHIP BEING DUMPED: 1 2 3 4 NEW VALUE FOR FIRST "0000": A000 B800 D000 E800 NEW VALUE FOR SECOND "0000": E000 E000 E000 E000 NEW VALUE FOR THIRD "0000": F7FF F7FF F7FF F7FF So, essentially, it was copying it to 32K (>A000, >B800, >D000, >E800), which were 6K increments. So, in other words, the upper 24K of expansion memory, for up to four GROMs and then RUNNING the GROMs natively (with the GROMs in the upper 32K memory expansion space.) So... my questions for the group in general: 1) Were the "recompiled GROMs linked as assembly (or however everyone is phrasing it)" in this Games GROM using the same tactic as this GPL loader stub which enabled GPL to run from >A000? 2) Who originally wrote these "run GROM from non GROM memory space" programs? 3) Can we put TOD in a cart using this same method (by putting the first 6K in the upper 8K of lower memory expansion and fixing this method slightly?) TOD is 5 GROMs, or 30K. It would even be super cool if we could put the PENNIES and KING quests in a ROM bank. Pardon my questions... but I want know more. I do believe the first one was in 1986 by Monty Schmidt called the GPL Linker v1.0 from RYTE DATA. This is the one I use in all of my GPLHOW2 videos. Never heard of one written before that one. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/224528-setting-up-a-512k-cart/page/6/#findComment-2987348 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gazoo Posted May 10, 2014 Author Share Posted May 10, 2014 The last 2 little bugs I am aware of have been fixed. Rabbit Trail now uses the actual cartridge code, so no more screen artifacts when it starts. A-Maze-Ing and Hangman no longer cross over into each other's startup selections. Nobody's reported any other bugs, so I 'think' it's done now. Gazoo Gamecart.zip 4 Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/224528-setting-up-a-512k-cart/page/6/#findComment-2987665 Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Ksarul Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 Nice! Many thanks for your work here! Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/224528-setting-up-a-512k-cart/page/6/#findComment-2987713 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gazoo Posted May 11, 2014 Author Share Posted May 11, 2014 (edited) I'm starting on a new game cart. So far I've got these games in the correct format: Ant ColonyBarrageBlack HoleBoxerBreak ThruBurger BuilderCarwarsChicken CoopD-Station ID-Station IIDriving DemonEscapeFace ChaseFrog StickersHenhouseMouse AttackMunchman IIMicro Pinball II Nibbler Princess And FrogRotor RaidersShanghaiSolitaireSpies DemiseSt NickStar Gazer IStar Gazer IIStar Gazer IIIStar TrekStar WarsStarTrapTopperTRISVideo Vegas I'm looking for EA5 versions of these games if anyone's got them: Othello Football The Attack Yahtzee ... and anything else you may want to see included on the cart. The only requirement is that it be in EA5 format. It's only a little over half full, so there's plenty of room. Thanks, Gazoo Edited May 11, 2014 by Gazoo 1 Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/224528-setting-up-a-512k-cart/page/6/#findComment-2988170 Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Ksarul Posted May 11, 2014 Share Posted May 11, 2014 You could try to put Lobster Bay, Lasso, or Crossfire in there. . .I'm pretty sure I've seen The Attack as an EA5 file, but I've not seen the other three you listed as anything but module BIN files. You could almost fill a whole 512K with 8K cartridge files in BIN form and the menu would launch them from their bank without any problems at all--giving you a 512K multicart of games that you could use in a console-only mode. I think Acadiel did one like that a while back for the 512K cart that was broken into four 128K banking zones via switches (using the V4 boards, which are very uncommon, as we only made about 25 of them between us, and I have most of those). . .I seem to remember that he had a bit of trouble finding cartridges to fill the last few slots to get all 64 banks full of 8K images. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/224528-setting-up-a-512k-cart/page/6/#findComment-2988181 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gazoo Posted May 11, 2014 Author Share Posted May 11, 2014 (edited) It's full. Cart files to be posted soon. Ant ColonyBarrageBlack HoleBoxerBreak ThruBurger BuilderCarwarsChicken Coop Crossfire D-Station ID-Station IIDriving DemonEscapeFace Chase Football Frog StickersHenhouse Lasso Lobster Bay Mouse AttackMunchman IIMicro Pinball II Nibbler Princess And FrogRotor RaidersShanghaiSolitaireSpies DemiseSt NickStar Gazer IStar Gazer IIStar Gazer IIIStar TrekStar WarsStarTrap The Attack TopperTRISVideo Chess Video Vegas Yahtzee Gazoo Edited May 11, 2014 by Gazoo 1 Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/224528-setting-up-a-512k-cart/page/6/#findComment-2988378 Share on other sites More sharing options...
+acadiel Posted May 11, 2014 Share Posted May 11, 2014 I'm starting on a new game cart. So far I've got these games in the correct format: Ant Colony... Video Vegas I'm looking for EA5 versions of these games if anyone's got them: Othello Football The Attack Yahtzee ... and anything else you may want to see included on the cart. The only requirement is that it be in EA5 format. It's only a little over half full, so there's plenty of room. Thanks, Gazoo I have fixed versions (some of those ROMs actually write to ROM) of the 8K ROMs all in the multicart.bin which I uploaded earlier in the thread... the 8K Tursi Multicart I've also uploaded it below. No EA/5 versions; they were all actual 8K ROMs (I tried to be pretty inclusive about every 8k ROM that was ever released in cart format). MultiCart actually switches banks for you. This will work in the UberGROM board or the 512K ROM Board. Atrax and myself both have working copies of this. You will also notice multiple copies of Multicart in some of the sections; this was either because there were too many menu options, or we just wanted to fill stuff out. I've attached the reversed version that works with the first power up bank (>00000 and >7E000 switched). It will also work with a 379 version with the switches (2 switches - up/up, down/down, up/down, down/up) as a 128Kx4 Multicart if you switch those two back, because the 379 needs the Multicart executable at the last "bank". 1/2/2010 This is a 128Kx4 multi-cart, using the www.hexbus.com cartridge board and the www.harmlesslion.com MultiCart program. You can either program a 27C040 and perform the switching necessary to get four 128K segments, or you can break this ROM into 128K parts, burn each to a 27C010, and run with a slightly modified 64K cartridge board. Pictures and guides are on www.hexbus.com. Almost every 8K ROM program ever made for the TI is in this EPROM, except: 1) Super Sketch (can't run without real hardware) 2) Typewriter 99 3) FigForth V2.1 4) DOS Offset Title ------ ----- 00000 Chicken Coop 02000 Console Writer 04000 Database Management 06000 Disk Fixer v2.0 08000 Frog Stickers 0A000 Homework Helper 0C000 Paint N Print GP-700 0E000 Paint N Print IBM 10000 Speed Reading A 12000 Speed Reading B 14000 Super Duper 16000 Topper 18000 Multicart 1A000 Multicart 1C000 Multicart 1E000 Multicart 20000 Ambulance 22000 Ant Colony 24000 Driving Demon 26000 Henhouse 28000 Rabbit Trail 2A000 Schnoz-ola 2C000 Shanghai 2E000 St. Nick 30000 Video Vegas 32000 Ant Eater 34000 Princess and Frog 36000 ROMOX Demo 38000 Rotor Raiders 3A000 Typo 3C000 Typoman 3E000 Multicart 40000 99 Home Sentry 42000 Black Hole 44000 Boxer 46000 Break Thru 48000 Burger Builder 4A000 Escape! 4C000 Midnite Mason 4E000 Corcomp Peripheral Test 50000 Pro Typer 52000 Space Patrol 54000 Spies Demise 56000 TI Planner 58000 TI Toad 5A000 TI/IBM Copier 5C000 Multicart 5E000 Multicart 60000 Giving/Letter World/Speed Key 62000 Link v0.99 64000 Tris 2 66000 Centipede 68000 Defender 6A000 /4A Flyer 6C000 D-Station I 6E000 D-Station II 70000 Face Chase! 72000 Munchman II 74000 Star Gazer I 76000 Star Gazer II 78000 Star Gazer III 7A000 Star Trap 7C000 Star Wars 7E000 Multicart Modifications needed to carts to get them to work in this multicart (from a stock ROM). References are assuming that it's an 8K ROM (>0000 to >1FFF), and note that these are all in hex. 99 Home Sentry Change the bytes at >1602 from 7320 to 0000. /4A Flyer Change the bytes at >1C7A from 783E to 0000. TI Planner Change the bytes at >04BE from C6DB to C01B. Change the bytes at >04DA from C6DB to C45B. Change the bytes at >04A2 from C6DB to C4DB. TI Toad Change the bytes at >160E to 0000. Disk Fixer Change the bytes starting at >0956 from "A0,60,83,2A" to "02,01,20,20" Change the byte at offset >05E3 from 24 to 28. Super Duper Change the bytes starting at >087E from "A0,60,83,2A" to "02,01,20,20" Change the byte at offset >055F from 24 to 28. Thanks to Tursi for help with the modifications to get the carts to run. -acadiel (www.hexbus.com) multicart_rev.BIN.zip Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/224528-setting-up-a-512k-cart/page/6/#findComment-2988476 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gazoo Posted May 11, 2014 Author Share Posted May 11, 2014 (edited) I have fixed versions (some of those ROMs actually write to ROM) of the 8K ROMs all in the multicart.bin which I uploaded earlier in the thread... the 8K Tursi Multicart I've also uploaded it below. I admit to stealing some of them out of the cart you posted. The difference between this and the Multicart you posted is that this cart will return to the menu after a quit, you don't need to turn the console off and back on to get back to the menu. Gazoo Edited May 11, 2014 by Gazoo Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/224528-setting-up-a-512k-cart/page/6/#findComment-2988485 Share on other sites More sharing options...
+acadiel Posted May 11, 2014 Share Posted May 11, 2014 I admit to stealing some of them out of the cart you posted. The difference between this and the Multicart you posted is that this cart will return to the menu after a quit, you don't need to turn the console off and back on to get back to the menu. Gazoo Yeah, it really needs a reset button (maybe a DPST that remove power from the 378 as well as reset the console). But with this cart, you don't need the 32K expansion; it'll work on a stock console. Thus, it worked for someone like my father, who still has a stock console which he and his other grandkids play with. A couple cool things about the program; just as trivia; Tursi did a really cool job with the 256 bytes in VDP making this work, and Sometimes99er did an outstanding job on the font and the graphics! (I really do like the font and graphics....) Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/224528-setting-up-a-512k-cart/page/6/#findComment-2988488 Share on other sites More sharing options...
marc.hull Posted May 11, 2014 Share Posted May 11, 2014 You want my scuzzy hard drive image? Has a couple hundred ea3 & 5 games including the ones you were looking for? Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/224528-setting-up-a-512k-cart/page/6/#findComment-2988501 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gazoo Posted May 11, 2014 Author Share Posted May 11, 2014 Yeah, it really needs a reset button (maybe a DPST that remove power from the 378 as well as reset the console). But with this cart, you don't need the 32K expansion; it'll work on a stock console. Thus, it worked for someone like my father, who still has a stock console which he and his other grandkids play with. A couple cool things about the program; just as trivia; Tursi did a really cool job with the 256 bytes in VDP making this work, and Sometimes99er did an outstanding job on the font and the graphics! (I really do like the font and graphics....) Yes, it does need the 32k. But I think the benefits outweigh the drawbacks. And that's why there's a project to put the 32k in the Speech Synthesizer. A couple of 512k carts, a console, and a Speech Synthesizer with 32k in it would seem to be a game player's dream. Gazoo Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/224528-setting-up-a-512k-cart/page/6/#findComment-2988515 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Like us on Facebook
Follow us on Twitter
AtariAge on Instagram
Watch us on YouTube
Chat on Discord
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.