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SIO2BT


TheMontezuma

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  • 7 months later...

I bought one of the BT modules several years ago and played around with it using Mr-Atari's patched OS (IIRC).  I would say that my experience with it was "iffy" -- lots of transmission errors and retries. My memory of this is a bit fuzzy since I didn't play with it for very long.  But I haven't read much about it since then. Have there been any significant improvements?

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5 hours ago, Larry said:

I bought one of the BT modules several years ago and played around with it using Mr-Atari's patched OS (IIRC).  I would say that my experience with it was "iffy" -- lots of transmission errors and retries. My memory of this is a bit fuzzy since I didn't play with it for very long.  But I haven't read much about it since then. Have there been any significant improvements?

Hi Larry,


you shouldn't actually have transmission erros or retries with Mr-Atari patched OS. Something must have obviously gone wrong...

Here is Mr-Atari's download:

http://www.mr-atari.com/Mr.Atari/MyBIOS/MyBIOS-V04.zip

and the doc: http://www.mr-atari.com/Mr.Atari/MyBIOS/MyIDE PLUGIN.doc

 

There are two ways, you can use Mr-Atari software:

- MyBIOS-ROM.ROM to be used as a standalone OS (burned in EPROM)

- MyIDE-][.bin to be used for flashing My IDE II (in this case you need MyIDE-II in the cart slot, to use SIO2BT)

 

How to flash MyIDE II firmware:

Put myide-][.bin in your FAT-directory, boot your atari, use the FAT-loader
Select myide-][.bin and press cntrl-F (flash)

do not power down when flash is in progress!!

 

@mr-atari
Have I missed something?

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Regarding other possibilities:
1) I prefer Ultimate 1MB memory extension with firmware from FJC. You can enable SIO Driver and configure it for SIO2BT in the U1MB settings.

2) If you have Sparta Dos X, just type:

SIOSET WAITACK 16

and you should be able to use SIO2BT without having transmission errors

3) You can burn an EPROM with a standalone OS, either from mr-atari or you can use my SIO2BT OS patcher:
https://github.com/TheMontezuma/SIO2BT_OS_Patcher/releases

Just grab the original Atari OS ROM and patch it using various available options:

https://github.com/TheMontezuma/SIO2BT_OS_Patcher/blob/master/README.md

If you decide to enable HiSpeed, the OS will be patched with the high speed code from Hias, which also supports now SIO2BT (3 x SIO speed).

 

Of course you do not need all of the above options - just one of them is enough.

Edited by TheMontezuma
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  • 4 weeks later...

Question for @TheMontezuma - when I turn on the Atari with the SIO2BT inserted it wont re-connect to RespeQt, I have to manually stop emulation and then restart.  It seems that RespeQt is totally controlling the BT connection, only activating it when emulation is running and doesn't attempt to reconnect.

 

Am I doing something wrong?  Should SIO2BT re-establish connection to RespeQt on its own or do I have to walk across the room every time I turn on the Atari?  :)

 

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2 hours ago, tuf said:

when I turn on the Atari with the SIO2BT inserted it wont re-connect to RespeQt, I have to manually stop emulation and then restart

If I'm right, the problem is that the BT dongle shuts connection down when it is turned off with the Atari, and it needs to be paired again.

 

To avoid that, provide power to the dongle even when the Atari is turned off or hack the ROM OS to perform a coldstart at some keypress (SHIFT+RESET). I did both in my mod.

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2 hours ago, vitoco said:

If I'm right, the problem is that the BT dongle shuts connection down when it is turned off with the Atari, and it needs to be paired again.

 

To avoid that, provide power to the dongle even when the Atari is turned off or hack the ROM OS to perform a coldstart at some keypress (SHIFT+RESET). I did both in my mod.

Very cool mod!

 

It seems like since RespeQt seems to control the state of the BT connection, having it retry the connection every so often seems like it'd do it.  I think there's even an option for this called "Try to restart emulation when SIO connection..(the end is cut off here)" but this doesn't appear to work.

 

I'll post a question over in the ResqeQt forum about that feature.

 

Edited by tuf
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2 hours ago, _The Doctor__ said:

Restarting the SIO connection works just fine, provided the pairing is not lost.

 

Well yes, it restarts just fine if I click the start emulation button twice in RespeQt.  What it doesn't do is notice the BT disconnecting.

 

Are you saying that your BT reconnects (and emulation re-establishes) from a power off reboot of the Atari?

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If you asking if RespeQT can issue instructions to the Bluetooth to perform a pairing and re-connection... that's not what that means...

 

So long as the devices remains paired RespeQT can and will restart a lost or failed emulation connection. If pairing has failed during disk/io timeouts happen before another pairing can complete.

 

RespeQT does not monitor the BT's wireless connection, it has not provision to do so. It is aware of USB, VCP, and Serial connections (hardwire) to a device.  So long as the virtual comm port is fine, serial port is fine, usb is fine... there is nothing to do. All the other stuff is in the prevue of the Device itself retaining it's pairing data, and that Windows or Linux etc has automatic reconnect set for BT connections with the appropriate pairing information already in it. If your SIO2BT SIO side device forgets pairing data, you need to either hack a battery method to keep it remembering / powered when the Atari is off or run a line from the Atari's power jack to provide a constant 5V to SIO with a backflow preventing/protection diode. You could externally power it as well.

Again, so long as the virtual comm port is fine, serial port is fine, usb is fine... there is nothing for RespeQt to do.

Edited by _The Doctor__
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10 hours ago, tuf said:

Question for @TheMontezuma - when I turn on the Atari with the SIO2BT inserted it wont re-connect to RespeQt, I have to manually stop emulation and then restart.  It seems that RespeQt is totally controlling the BT connection, only activating it when emulation is running and doesn't attempt to reconnect.

 

Am I doing something wrong?  Should SIO2BT re-establish connection to RespeQt on its own or do I have to walk across the room every time I turn on the Atari?  :)

 

 

You are doing nothing wrong.

The BT module used in SIO2BT is a "slave" module and does not trigger BT connections.

RespeQt does it indirectly by opening a (virtual) serial port.

 

However you don't have to walk across the room, because you don't need to turn off an on the Atari to load another game.

Instead you can trigger a cold start, for example:

- with Ultimate 1MB (or with Incognito): enter the BIOS menu and press 'C' key

- with a patched OS: press SHIFT+RESET (instead of RESET)
 

8 hours ago, vitoco said:

If I'm right, the problem is that the BT dongle shuts connection down when it is turned off with the Atari, and it needs to be paired again.

 

To avoid that, provide power to the dongle even when the Atari is turned off or hack the ROM OS to perform a coldstart at some keypress (SHIFT+RESET). I did both in my mod.

 

It does not need to be "paired" again. Pairing has to be done only once (unless you delete SIO2BT pairing information on the PC or Phone).

The PC (or phone) has to re-establish a BT connection after you power cycle the Atari (for example, when you start emulation in RespeQt, it opens a serial port and this establishes a BT connection).

 

 

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23 minutes ago, flashjazzcat said:

Or press SELECT+RESET at any time after first enabling this feature in the settings.

That actually brings up the MIO menu, but if you let off RESET after SELECT, it seems to do a cold boot.  Depends on which button you release last I guess :)

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28 minutes ago, tuf said:

That actually brings up the MIO menu, but if you let off RESET after SELECT, it seems to do a cold boot.  Depends on which button you release last I guess :)

It's not intended to be used with other upgrades which utilise the same key combo (which is the reason it can be turned off). When MIO is not present, SELECT+RESET coldtstarts the OS when the feature is enabled.

Edited by flashjazzcat
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6 hours ago, TheMontezuma said:

It does not need to be "paired" again. Pairing has to be done only once (unless you delete SIO2BT pairing information on the PC or Phone).

The PC (or phone) has to re-establish a BT connection after you power cycle the Atari (for example, when you start emulation in RespeQt, it opens a serial port and this establishes a BT connection).

Right! I meant "reconnect". No need to enter the PIN again.

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 7/20/2020 at 9:36 PM, tuf said:

Question for @TheMontezuma - when I turn on the Atari with the SIO2BT inserted it wont re-connect to RespeQt, I have to manually stop emulation and then restart.  It seems that RespeQt is totally controlling the BT connection, only activating it when emulation is running and doesn't attempt to reconnect.

 

Am I doing something wrong?  Should SIO2BT re-establish connection to RespeQt on its own or do I have to walk across the room every time I turn on the Atari?  :)

 

 

Today I was thinking about you use case one more time.

You can use the SIO Splitter from Lotharek with an external power supply:

https://www.lotharek.pl/productdetail.php?id=158

Just plug the SIO2BT in the splitter and it will be powered all the time (in the connected mode, its power consumption is very low).

 

 

 

Edited by TheMontezuma
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1 hour ago, TheMontezuma said:

 

Today I was thinking about you use case one more time.

You can use the SIO Splitter from Lotharek with an external power supply:

https://www.lotharek.pl/productdetail.php?id=158

Just plug the SIO2BT in the splitter and it will be powered all the time (in the connected mode, its power consumption is very low).

 

 

 

That.is a good idea - I use one of those splitters now.  Can the SIO2BT co-exist with other SIO devices?

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10 hours ago, tuf said:

That.is a good idea - I use one of those splitters now.  Can the SIO2BT co-exist with other SIO devices?

 

Electrically - yes (nothing will get damaged).

Logically - yes if you only read and no if you also write data to other SIO devices (it is safe when you disconnect BT, but going to the PC running RespeQt is something you wanted to avoid in the first place).

This applies whether you use the splitter or not.

 

I use SIO2BT with a dedicated SIO splitter (external power supply) with my Atari 400 (upgraded with SCCC).

SIO splitter keeps SIO2BT alive even when I switch off and on the Atari 400 to load a new game.

 

 

 

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10 minutes ago, TheMontezuma said:

 

Electrically - yes (nothing will get damaged).

Logically - yes if you only read and no if you also write data to other SIO devices (it is safe when you disconnect BT, but going to the PC running RespeQt is something you wanted to avoid in the first place).

This applies whether you use the splitter or not.

To clarify I meant can I use the SIO2BT along with a 1050 plugged into the splitter?  Can the SIO2BT coexist with a physical disk drive?  (for example my SIO2USB and SDrive Max cannot)

 

Thanks!

Edited by tuf
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47 minutes ago, tuf said:

To clarify I meant can I use the SIO2BT along with a 1050 plugged into the splitter?  Can the SIO2BT coexist with a physical disk drive?  (for example my SIO2USB and SDrive Max cannot)

 

Thanks!

Yes, they can.

However writing to 1050 (for example copying a file to a real floppy disk) while BT connection is active, may fail. As long as you only read from 1050, it should coexits friendly with SIO2BT.

 

 

 

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  • 2 years later...

Nice project!

Handling the whole SIO protocol over bluetooth is cheap, but a big timing issue. Things like ATX support would be unthinkable. Patching the atari OS is a no go for me!

I think, there should be a small microcontroller to handle the SIO protocol, and only the payload should be transmitted via bluetooth.

 

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  • 3 months later...
On 7/3/2023 at 9:54 AM, kbr said:

Nice project!

Handling the whole SIO protocol over bluetooth is cheap, but a big timing issue. Things like ATX support would be unthinkable. Patching the atari OS is a no go for me!

I think, there should be a small microcontroller to handle the SIO protocol, and only the payload should be transmitted via bluetooth.

 

Thanks!

Regarding a micro-controller between Atari and BT - I got some promising results with ESP32 (no need for OS patch!), but had no time to finish it:

https://github.com/TheMontezuma/SIO2BT_ESP32

 
By the way - I have a small update regarding:
 
SIO2BT and Android 14
 
I finally got the Android 14 on my Pixel 7.
The good news is, that the new OS has not removed SIO2BT app and it continued to work as before.
However after I manually removed the app, I could not install it anymore.
The only option is to connect the mobile phone over adb and to type the command:
 
adb install --bypass-low-target-sdk-block Sio2Bt.apk

 

Edited by TheMontezuma
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On 10/25/2023 at 9:53 PM, TheMontezuma said:

Regarding a micro-controller between Atari and BT - I got some promising results with ESP32 (no need for OS patch!), but had no time to finish it:

https://github.com/TheMontezuma/SIO2BT_ESP32

Nice, i am working on a similar project right now, but have nothing published yet, because it's in raw alpha state...

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