pirx Posted February 16, 2015 Share Posted February 16, 2015 Great job Tezz! Is the Kettle of Fish broken beyond repair? I remember being the most curious about it as a kid. Best, pirx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pavros Posted February 16, 2015 Share Posted February 16, 2015 Fantastic work Tezz! Thanks a lot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rybags Posted February 16, 2015 Share Posted February 16, 2015 Looks good. I didn't ever get into the original largely due to it having poor playability and missing features the C64 one had. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Dragon Posted February 16, 2015 Share Posted February 16, 2015 Love it. Poured hours into the original so many years ago, game was bit too slow paced for my tastes at times, but used to love the pause mode. Fantastic work here.... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tezz Posted February 16, 2015 Author Share Posted February 16, 2015 Is the Kettle of Fish broken beyond repair? I remember being the most curious about it as a kid. Yea it's a shame as it's just the 32 bytes of overwritten code that we're missing. Shahid mentioned that he hand wrote this small game some years earlier and got the chance to make use of it in Chimera as an Easter egg. The hand written notes were probably lost in the burglary that he suffered unfortunately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tezz Posted February 16, 2015 Author Share Posted February 16, 2015 I actually spoke with Shahid yesterday by email as somebody had posted a link to the YouTube video on his Twitter feed. He's intending to continue working on the sequel for release this year for its 30th anniversary 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emkay Posted February 16, 2015 Share Posted February 16, 2015 I actually spoke with Shahid yesterday by email as somebody had posted a link to the YouTube video on his Twitter feed. He's intending to continue working on the sequel for release this year for its 30th anniversary Sorry, for sounding blunt, but do we need a sequel of that "Chimera" of the Atari Version? I also don't understand all the "thankfullness" to S. Ahmad? In other ranges someone should stand in some corner and be ashamed to put such poor work offered.... You actually showed, or better teached him, "how it had been done right" . So, thanks in addition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+therealbountybob Posted February 16, 2015 Share Posted February 16, 2015 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emkay Posted February 16, 2015 Share Posted February 16, 2015 What? That piece of loveless adapted code with available level design of other machines , resulted in an unplayable game and even didn't use a single "special" of the Atari. Please compare the game with other platforms. Have you ever seen the C64 version? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emkay Posted February 16, 2015 Share Posted February 16, 2015 Just for saving time Helpless coded stuff: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snicklin Posted February 16, 2015 Share Posted February 16, 2015 Lets be fair to Shahid though, he probably had months to do his work and Tezz has had years. Yes, Tezz's version is a lot more playable and graphically a bit better, but even he thanks Shahid for his work. Whatever is put out first will be beaten by a later version. The Amiga is better than the Atari 8-bit (technically), why, because it had something to work from and improve. I must admit though, I don't see why the original Chimera on the C64 is faster than on the A8. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heaven/TQA Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 I credited Jeff Miner and mailed with him regarding meta galactic Llamas even it is no high tech game . And Doug neubauer's star Raiders is not a technical masterpiece either... So fair enough to tAlk with original coder. He used atari specific stuff like DLIs compared to c64... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heaven/TQA Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 Wasn't chimera not a budget game? So maybe he converted the game and went down the road to finish to reach deadlines without best optimized routines? Happened to me everytime with Arsantica and Ad:6502 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+MrFish Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 And Doug neubauer's star Raiders is not a technical masterpiece either... Yes, but it was gaming masterpiece, especially in its day on a home computer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rybags Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 I tend to agree, the Atari version was fairly attrocious and gave the impression of a rushed port with little attention to taking advantage of many features. Possibly the C64 has an advantage in that occlusion of sprite data is probably faster than rendering a softsprite and doing the occlusion there as well but this remake clearly shows what could be done if some more effort was put in. I don't know how much time Tezz has put into it, but would be surprised if it's greatly more than was put into porting the original. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heaven/TQA Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 (edited) Yes, but it was gaming masterpiece, especially in its day on a home computer. No doubt.... I just wanted to point out that blaming coders work with the argument of not being a "technical masterpiece" is like... hmmm... Maybe Tezz did asked why it was so slow on A8... maybe there was a "wrapper" code? When porting Metagallactic Llamas over to A8... the VIC-20 source code was so... beginners assembling code... and it was written by Jeff Minter! but would I blame him for that? I guess not... not because he is THE Jeff Minter but well... I was not there nor do I know the constraintes back in the 80s when he wrote the game on VIC-20... same with the A8 Gridrunner port... (yeah... I know I need to release Gridrunner original ) Edited February 17, 2015 by Heaven/TQA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+MrFish Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 No doubt.... I just wanted to point out that blaming coders work with the argument of not being a "technical masterpiece" is like... hmmm... Maybe Tezz did asked why it was so slow on A8... maybe there was a "wrapper" code? When porting Metagallactic Llamas over to A8... the VIC-20 source code was so... beginners assembling code... and it was written by Jeff Minter! but would I blame him for that? I guess not... not because he is THE Jeff Minter but well... I was not there nor do I know the constraintes back in the 80s when he wrote the game on VIC-20... same with the A8 Gridrunner port... (yeah... I know I need to release Gridrunner original ) Point taken. I'm just defensive of Star Raiders in particular. It holds a special place in the Atari game library. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emkay Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 Point taken. I'm just defensive of Star Raiders in particular. It holds a special place in the Atari game library. Starraiders has that special position, as it has no competitor back in 1979. Games like "Chimera" came in herds... in 1985.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Dragon Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 Without knowing just how long Shahid had to do the A8 version or indeed what the publisher wanted (i.e given how 'small' the UK A8 user base was compared to the C64/ZX Spectrum and Amstrad CPC, i personally cannot see them 'greenlighting' a version that might have taken longer to write, yet used the A8 hardware strength's a lot better), it's a bit hard to call judgement. There are a lot more, high profile games i'd liked to have seen done a lot better on A8-Green Beret, Rampage, Arkanoid etc or done at all...Elite! and i seem to recal a claim from Firebird that there was a chronic shortage of skilled A8 coders willing to take on conversions for them, so personally as a game starved 800XL owner of that era, whilst game could of been coded better, it was never so 'poor' as to make me think, ohhh bloody hell, this is rubbish. I'm sure if you asked Shahid , what he could of done differently, if he could do it all over again, he'd explain why it turned out the way it did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Dragon Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 Maybe Tezz could email Shahid and get his version of events? (the story behind A8 Chimera) and put the info up here, before his work is commented on much further, as currently he's being judged as it were without any of us really knowing the full facts behind the differences between the 2 versions. Youtube is a useful comparison tool for a quick reference, but it does'nt explain the development process involved in either. I bought the game, enjoyed it, but i'd love to know a lot more about the Making Of...the A8 version. Over to Tezz, if he does'nt mind asking Shahid 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heaven/TQA Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 good point with experienced A8 programmers... as in UK I doubt that there are a lot... (most of them with PET/C64 6502 background or Z80 speccy/armstrad) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetboot Jack Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 What? That piece of loveless adapted code with available level design of other machines , resulted in an unplayable game and even didn't use a single "special" of the Atari. Please compare the game with other platforms. Have you ever seen the C64 version? WTF? You are aware that Shahid programmed ALL the versions of Chimera, Z80 and 6502 platforms when he was 18? You are aware he has coded and produced DOZENS of games of over the years and this was one of his first - we all have to start somewhere! Get off your high horse - it's clearly easier to be rude and insult others than actually make something! sTeVE 12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emkay Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 WTF? You are aware that Shahid programmed ALL the versions of Chimera, Z80 and 6502 platforms when he was 18? You are aware he has coded and produced DOZENS of games of over the years and this was one of his first - we all have to start somewhere! And what is it to prevent some true words about it? Actually , I saw people trying to play the A8 version, back in the days. No one wanted to see more than 4 rooms. The slow movement , the horrible FX and also horrible control. No one couldn't stand that for even half an hour. Game Fun ? And, well , if it's about an "18" Years old , writing games on different computers. Did he grab them out of the thin air? Get off your high horse - it's clearly easier to be rude and insult others than actually make something! sTeVE Not sure WHO sits on his high horse. But, if you get your 1st computer after being 18 Years old to handle it, you surely cannot write software on it before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetboot Jack Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 (edited) WTF are you rambling about. Shahid wrote ALL THE VERSIONS - you know ones that play rather well too - so forgive him for being a multi-platform talented programmer and having a stumble on one, marginal platform! If you could do now what he could, 20 years ago, I would accept your criticisms, but as all you can do is whine - away with you you tiresome little moaner! sTeVE Edited February 17, 2015 by Jetboot Jack 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emkay Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 (edited) WTF are you rambling about. Shahid wrote ALL THE VERSIONS - you know ones that play rather well too - so forgive him for being a multi-platform talented programmer and having a stumble on one, marginal platform! Yawn. When you're younger, you learn faster. It's a human fact. "Multi-Platform Talented" . You mean, he dreamed in the night of the code, beeped them on Tape and on the next day the games ran on the customer's computers? If you could do now what he could, 20 years ago, I would accept your criticisms, but as all you can do is whine - away with you you tiresome little moaner! sTeVE You're having an interesting sight of life... And: Sorry, for having my own business running that keeps me too busy to code for the A8. Edited February 17, 2015 by emkay Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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