How has this not been posted yet? Retro VGS

[+CyranoJ]

I can Bet you guys, if someone came out in a couple months, offered a worse product but much better Marketing they'd do better thasn the RVGS did.

 

 

Forgetting the critical bit here tho... that you will not find a developer for older consoles who would rather not put the game out on the target console instead of this bastardisation with a smaller target audience than the already small target audience of the original system.

 

No games = No point.

 

And it looks like the 150+ devs interested really weren't.

[ninja_gaiden2015]

At least the RVGS Team are trying to do things with some dignity.

 

 

I was the first one on board with the project and had the money set-aside to purchase one of the consoles. I guess my criticism comes from someone who wanted to support an FGPA console project with support and licensing old new oldschool titles again, along with the opportunity for homebrew dev's to release titles. That item doesn't exist and the vision put forwarrd by Mike may never have been possible to exist to begin with.

 

They just never updated the Website. Just ignore this text. It's pretty much the System they wanted to sell for 450 bucks (more or less their 3.8mi Dollar Stretch goal)

 

If a company seeking investors of between $2-4 million, the fact that they don't have accurate information of what the investment will deliver is my criticism. It's either disorganisation is misleading funders/potential funders. If they were able to deliver this mythical NEO GEO FGPA system, I would be the first to purchase it.

[leods]

 

Forgetting the critical bit here tho... that you will not find a developer for older consoles who would rather not put the game out on the target console instead of this bastardisation with a smaller target audience than the already small target audience of the original system.

 

No games = No point.

 

And it looks like the 150+ devs interested really weren't.

How does your Response relate to anything I said? I agree with you.

 

It's just frustrating to see backlash go up when they actually start Fixing something in their campaign. Seems like they'd have done better if they had just ignored the criticysm. Wouldn't matter in the end, because I can't see their IGG campaign reaching it's funding Goals no matter what they did, I just think People should be rewarded properly for good and bad behaviour. And this community just doesn't give People/companies the apropriate Feedback.

[+CyranoJ]

How does your Response relate to anything I said? I agree with you.

 

 

It didn't. Sorry, I meant to quote this. Then I heard 'foods ready' and didn't check after I hit post. Sorry, it all went a bit Mike Kennedy there....

 

I guess its up to everyone out there to figure out whether he outright fibbed to backers or potential backers, or just let his excitement get the better of him

 

[StopDrop&Retro]

Lon Seidman is a typical youtuber. He brought Mike on, played Mikes ballgame on the interview, pretty much free advertisement. How come he didin't ask anything relevant about the campaign when Mike was on his Show? He did the interview very shortly before the IGG campaign went up.

 

Lon Seidman's interview was published on July 8th. That's almost two months before the price hike was announced, and it was back when they were still avoiding the issue of whether they had a prototype or not and still promising that they would launch on Kickstarter with one. Why didn't he make a bashing video, I dunno, didn't his last video do exactly that but in a very fair and classy form? He's not really the type to go on an angry YouTube gamer rant.

 

Does anyone really feel they Need a working prototype?

 

Umm... yes! MANY people do.

 

My gripe was never the fact they had no proto, but the fact they claimed it couldn't be done. That was a lie.

 

I say they still haven't done it. Until they can show a prototype game console- i.e. a prototype sample that does what their product is supposed to do, then I'm sorry but I don't buy it.

 

It's sad, but the truth is, the RVGS Team did fix a bunch of Problems in the campaign, but the public perception on their product is getting worse instead of better. Sadly public perception is not really related to the Quality of the product.

 

They haven't fixed much of anything. They've released a cryptic video of a supposed prototype that brought more questions than answers and we may never even see it again because "patents." Many of the issues that people had from the beginning remain unsolved.

 

I can Bet you guys, if someone came out in a couple months, offered a worse product but much better Marketing they'd do better thasn the RVGS did.

 

I'll do you one better- I guarantee you we'll see a "worse" (highly subjective word) project with better marketing that gets funded many times over. That's just the way the world works. If you think three guys working in a kitchen can raise more money than one guy with a marketing team behind him then you're sorely mistaken. Marketing is a huge factor in today's world, people build careers doing just that. Why do you think the Retro VGS can't get on any major news sites ever since their campaign launched? That's how stuff like OUYA takes off, they hire a marketing firm and they take care of getting your name out there because the more money they can bring into the campaign the more the marketing firm makes. A marketing firm could have gotten their name out there or at least given Mike & Co. a reality check when they walked in.

[ninja_gaiden2015]

 

It didn't. Sorry, I meant to quote this. Then I heard 'foods ready' and didn't check after I hit post. Sorry, it all went a bit Mike Kennedy there....

 

 

Hey mate - looking at your profile you are from Adelaide too

[game_escape]

I also find it interesting that despite of all the PR stuff, the campaign does not seem to having much public attention. The promo video at YouTube is still under 10K views, in ten days, with about 100 persons cared enough to like or dislike it. Even if each view would be from an actual person who'd pledge $100 (pretty good average), that would still be not enough to fund the campaign. And considering realistic expected convertion rate of about 2% at best, which is the case, they're doing pretty well with average pledge being $320. There is just not enough people interested or aware of the campaign, and even with that average it would need to be about 6000 pledges, which is very far from ~200.

This is a great point. You would think that the RVGS team would have reached out to the major press outlets and paid to get some coverage, but when they launched, I only saw articles on two smaller scale English websites (Hardcore Gamer and Power Up Gaming) and two articles in the German gaming press (Game Star and Gamona). I think some coverage on sites like Kotaku, IGN, etc. would have piqued the interest of the casual-retro crowd. It probably wouldn't have drastically changed the way things are going , but it couldn't have hurt. I am kind of shocked that their "media blitz" post IGG launch has only been the Gamester81 infomercial and the interview with triverse, which did more to hurt them than help them.

[Algus]

 

Forgetting the critical bit here tho... that you will not find a developer for older consoles who would rather not put the game out on the target console instead of this bastardisation with a smaller target audience than the already small target audience of the original system.

 

I feel like this is one of the better ideas in the RVGS "project" So I'm Mike and I have the moldings for the Jaguar so I can easily produce new console cases and cartridges. Now I put an FPGA like what kevtris is designing in my Jaguar cases. At this point I can take any homebrew out there and put it in my cartridges to run on my system. This could be a valuable tool for homebrewers on more obscure systems (say TG-16) to get their games to more people.

 

So if I'm a developer, I go to Mike and say, "hey, here's my game. Can we get it on your system too" then I can push my game out not just to the hobbyists on my preferred platform but to the retrogaming community at large. Pretty neat!

 

The downfall, of course, is that if you're a retrogamer you're probably emulating the systems you don't have and not really caring about paying a premium to collect physical copies of homebrews for platforms you don't own (I'm not going to go out and buy an Intellivision homebrew...no matter how good the game and packaging are). If I have an RVGS on the other hand, maybe I buy this game if its good since I dont need to buy new hardware to play it.

 

When Mike talks about this aspect of RVGS, he seems to imagine his console as being the central node for all things retro gaming. It could work but it doesn't change the fact that we're still talking about a niche market. The funny thing is, when kevtris is done this is basically what we will end up with, sans Jaguar cartridges, so we'll be able to use the Kevtris VGS to play all our homebrews off SD card, which makes a lot more sense than buying expensive cartridges.

[PlaysWithWolves]

As a Tea Party type I was about to throw down, but... oh, nevermind. I can do politics a thousand other places.

 

For those that don't have FB or want to click over:

http://retrogamingmagazine.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/09/sillerdenial.jpg

 

Thank you very much. I've suspected that's what was happening, but wasn't sure. I think something similar may be going on with the "in negotiations" games, too. Developers hear they might be able to get extra sales with little work so they leave it open. "Sure, sell 10,000 consoles and we'll talk!"

 

Just caught this video by Lon Seidman a great Tech and gadget review I am subbed to "Withdrawing my Retro VGS Pledge" - smart choice LON lol. He touches on some good points and even mentions Atariage beginning around 4m45s mark

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YU2O32xMn6c

 

What a misinformed hater. He probably was promised a percentage of sales from kevtris' "competing device" too!

His suggestion that a new business should come up with at least half the necessary capital when crowdfunding was interesting.

 

Lon Seidman is a typical youtuber. He brought Mike on, played Mikes ballgame on the interview, pretty much free advertisement. How come he didin't ask anything relevant about the campaign when Mike was on his Show? He did the interview very shortly before the IGG campaign went up.

 

And when the IGG went up he didin't really make a critical update Video either did he? The campaign is better now than it was day one. How come he pledged when there was NOTHING on the page, and now that they actually clarified a lot of things and put up specs he whthdraws? Does anyone really feel they Need a working prototype? I somehow do believe that John can make this System no Problem. My gripe was never the fact they had no proto, but the fact they claimed it couldn't be done. That was a lie.

 

He's human and got caught up in the excitement, maybe? Or perhaps just didn't realize that Mike's "Just Trust Us" campaign has more holes than a colander until he read more about it? I mean, just PikoInteractive and kevtris bombshells alone didn't come out until the day of the campaign. Who'd have known how flippantly they treated developers like them until that point?

 

I see SD&R already pointed out that his interview with Mike Kennedy was from back on July 8th.

[Clint Thompson]

While it's only been a few days, every day I check the IGG, it goes down by about $1k more... it was at 66k and is now at 63k. So, if you back out, do you get an instant refund of your money basically?

[Austin]

and paid to get some coverage

 

Sadly, paying for worthwhile press coverage probably costs a good bit more than it does to make a working prototype.

[001 Influence Device]

 

I feel like this is one of the better ideas in the RVGS "project" So I'm Mike and I have the moldings for the Jaguar so I can easily produce new console cases and cartridges. Now I put an FPGA like what kevtris is designing in my Jaguar cases. At this point I can take any homebrew out there and put it in my cartridges to run on my system. This could be a valuable tool for homebrewers on more obscure systems (say TG-16) to get their games to more people.

 

So if I'm a developer, I go to Mike and say, "hey, here's my game. Can we get it on your system too" then I can push my game out not just to the hobbyists on my preferred platform but to the retrogaming community at large. Pretty neat!

 

The downfall, of course, is that if you're a retrogamer you're probably emulating the systems you don't have and not really caring about paying a premium to collect physical copies of homebrews for platforms you don't own (I'm not going to go out and buy an Intellivision homebrew...no matter how good the game and packaging are). If I have an RVGS on the other hand, maybe I buy this game if its good since I dont need to buy new hardware to play it.

 

When Mike talks about this aspect of RVGS, he seems to imagine his console as being the central node for all things retro gaming. It could work but it doesn't change the fact that we're still talking about a niche market. The funny thing is, when kevtris is done this is basically what we will end up with, sans Jaguar cartridges, so we'll be able to use the Kevtris VGS to play all our homebrews off SD card, which makes a lot more sense than buying expensive cartridges.

 

I'll just add a bit to this: If we do away with cartridge collecting fetish altogether, getting online capabilities on these old systems would actually be a way of both distributing software easily and getting some new interesting games on these systems. Why not play online multiplayer on a Genesis? Why not use an SD card with an online steam-playstore-like market behind it? Software emulation would be fine if you want something cheap and don't mind waiting for compatibility updates.

[Shiru]

 

so we'll be able to use the Kevtris VGS to play all our homebrews off SD card, which makes a lot more sense than buying expensive cartridges.

One problem, though, that it likely means less and less new homebrew games, maybe occasional quality stuff by hardcore enthusiasts, but certainly small scale. Projects like Gunlord or Pier Solar just won't be created, unfortunately they're not possible without money involved.

[TheClassyGamer]

I may not really understand what I'm talking about so If I'm way off base here just say so. I was thinking about this and thought it would be cool if it were set up where the cart contains the info to program the system to be whatever system you want, while acting like a flash cart. So you would have one cart that was the nes programming that you could put a sd card into, then another cart that was the snes and would have an sd card slot for your game files as well. Would be a set up with its own style of flash carts but could play all the old school consoles, having a different cart to unlock each console you want to replicate.

[Algus]

One problem, though, that it likely means less and less new homebrew games, maybe occasional quality stuff by hardcore enthusiasts, but certainly small scale. Projects like Gunlord or Pier Solar just won't be created, unfortunately they're not possible without money involved.

 

Well, you're on AA lol most of us are used to small scale. Space Rocks is a brilliant game but its an Atari 2600 game, it won't be getting any mainstream exposure soonish.

 

Pier Solar is certainly remarkable and good on Watermelon for being able to monetize it the way they have. They still had to kickstart their efforts to get it on a "modern" system even after the blinding success of the Genesis runs they did though. Doing runs of games on old systems just isn't really much of a money-making endeavor. Unless you're NG:DEV and are marketing to crazy ass Neo Geo fans that don't mind dropping $400 on a game, heh.

[ninja_gaiden2015]

as there hasn't been a peep from the Retro VGS Team in the last few days and the crowdfunding has stagnated, do we assume the project has been let go of?

[sh3-rg]

Kevin B is another story entirely.

I believe this is that guy's yt account, if anyone cares. He seems to be a real idiot person, not a marketing tool.

But that would force out more than 90 percent of all AtariAge members. About the only members left would be those in the chat room.

Hmmm, I thought the chat room was where all the dicks hang out

I feel like this is one of the better ideas in the RVGS "project" So I'm Mike and I have the moldings for the Jaguar so I can easily produce new console cases and cartridges. Now I put an FPGA like what kevtris is designing in my Jaguar cases. At this point I can take any homebrew out there and put it in my cartridges to run on my system. This could be a valuable tool for homebrewers on more obscure systems (say TG-16) to get their games to more people.

I wasn't so sure at first, but was keen to see what might be a Jaguar 2 (lol), but the more I learned of how the FPGA stuff worked and what it resulted in, the more interesting it became. I was never a believer in the RVGS, though. I left carts and collecting behind for good reason (OK, apart from a famicom/clone fetish I can't shake). But then kevtris showed his stuff and I was ready to throw money at the screen, just probably not enough for him to make it worthwhile.

[Keatah]

I'll just add a bit to this: If we do away with cartridge collecting fetish altogether, getting online capabilities on these old systems would actually be a way of both distributing software easily and getting some new interesting games on these systems. Why not play online multiplayer on a Genesis? Why not use an SD card with an online steam-playstore-like market behind it? Software emulation would be fine if you want something cheap and don't mind waiting for compatibility updates.

 

Yes all that. And some classic machine emulation software has been in development for 20 years as of now. While some issues remain, a whole hella-lot has been worked out. And some emulator authors fix freshly reported bugs rather quickly.

 

FPGA is also emulation. Or synthesis to be more accurate. It does not transform its circuitry into a VCS or Intellivision. It configures an array of truth tables so to speak. And its accuracy depends on how well the author of the core examined the logic and signals coming in and out of the original chip(s).

 

With software emulation you will gain a whole host of features not currently found in other ways of playing the classics. And those ways include the original machines, web-broswer, fpga, cartridge converters. The huge advantage of software emulators is that any ol'PC can run them. Oh sure, "PC" is a boring box, full of tricky tedious setups, and all that. But it doesn't have to be that way! You can do loads of cool things with a small set-top-box housing a mini-ITX i7. Or of you're budget minded a Raspberry Pi - which has a full emulation-specific OS available for free. We're hobbyists and we can figure it out. Don't despair, software emulators are getting better and better every year. And multi-core processors have yet to be tapped!

 

I guess I'm a strong proponent of software emulation because I've had really good luck in setting up the displays just right and making everything work smoothly. Never met an emulator I couldn't tweak to perfection. And that is rewarding!

[tcdev]

 

Calm down, guy. He accidentally attributed the quote to you instead of me.

 

The WTF was "What the Fuck is happening here?", not "What the Fuck are you talking about?" All good!

 

When I posted that response I was thinking that the system had quoted me, but then soon after realised it was actually possible to misquote with careless use of the delete key.

[leods]

 

Yes all that. And some classic machine emulation software has been in development for 20 years as of now. While some issues remain, a whole hella-lot has been worked out. And some emulator authors fix freshly reported bugs rather quickly.

 

FPGA is also emulation. Or synthesis to be more accurate. It does not transform its circuitry into a VCS or Intellivision. It configures an array of truth tables so to speak. And its accuracy depends on how well the author of the core examined the logic and signals coming in and out of the original chip(s).

 

With software emulation you will gain a whole host of features not currently found in other ways of playing the classics. And those ways include the original machines, web-broswer, fpga, cartridge converters. The huge advantage of software emulators is that any ol'PC can run them. Oh sure, "PC" is a boring box, full of tricky tedious setups, and all that. But it doesn't have to be that way! You can do loads of cool things with a small set-top-box housing a mini-ITX i7. Or of you're budget minded a Raspberry Pi - which has a full emulation-specific OS available for free. We're hobbyists and we can figure it out. Don't despair, software emulators are getting better and better every year. And multi-core processors have yet to be tapped!

 

I guess I'm a strong proponent of software emulation because I've had really good luck in setting up the displays just right and making everything work smoothly. Never met an emulator I couldn't tweak to perfection. And that is rewarding!

"mini-ITX i7"

Are there many Emulators out there using more than 4 threads? I'd be inclined to think a, i5 or an i3 (damn, even a Pentium g3258) might actually be all most Emulators can use.

 

I think even PCSX2 still only uses 2 threads. Did they go to 4 threads already?

 

But yeah. The whole Marketing the RVGS guys did about preserving games, and having a good stable platform to program for is all bullshit. You can do all that right now without the RVGS. What they actually mean is that they want better means to monetize These games. For some reason they don't feel confident going into Steam, or just releasing their games for the old Systems, so they were trying to build a platform and an install base to work with. They were very naive though to not realyze this is damned hard to do. They thought People would buy into the Hype, probably because they see Projects that get hyped up and are a huge success. They just forgot that for each huge success in Kickstarted you have 10 failed or meh Projects that don't really have any Impact.

Edited September 29, 2015 by leods

[Keatah]

"mini-ITX i7"

Are there many Emulators out there using more than 4 threads? I'd be inclined to think a, i5 or an i3 (damn, even a Pentium g3258) might actually be all most Emulators can use.

 

I think even PCSX2 still only uses 2 threads. Did they go to 4 threads already?

 

But yeah. The whole Marketing they did about preserving games, and having a good stable platform to profram for is all bullshit. You can do that. What they actually mean is that they want better means to monetize These games. For some reason they don't feel confident going into Steam, or just releasing their games for the old Systems, so they were trying to build a platform and an install base to work with. They were very naive though to not realyze this is damned hard to do. They thought People would buy into the Hype, probably because they see Projects that get hyped up and are a huge success. They just forgot that for each huge success in Kickstarted you have 10 failed or meh Projects that don't really have any Impact.

 

Oh I agree. But I like the rest of the system to operate as quickly as possible. Fast booting, fast loading. I also run a few select other things on my emulation box - just a few. A flight simulator and space simulator, for moody evenings. And I like my utilities and support activities to cruise on by effortlessly.

 

PCSX2 is till 2 threads, but you can assign GSdx renderer to use more. A reasonable amount more like 3 or 4. There will come a point of diminishing returns. Increase the number of threads till your fps speed drops then back up by one. Easy as pie!

 

I tend to agree the cartridge thing isn't really about preservation. I suspect it's about monetization. Agreed.

 

And cartridges suck for preservation anyway - granted masked rom is long-lived. No doubt, 100-200 years or longer. But you can't store them in multiple locations at the same time. You need to purchase 2 or more to do that. And we don't even know the exact technology inside their carts to begin with.

 

A conventional rom collection stored on various forms of media in different locations is just as good. Probably better. And easier to migrate across the gulfs of time.

[PlaysWithWolves]

Gamester81 was shilling for RVGS and blaming the "haters" (adult language) and blaming AtariAge for the IGG failure on a recent All Gen Gamers podcast. Good synopsis at the NeoGaf link.

 

At least this time he disclosed up front that he's got games and that The Adventures of Tiny Knight will be a pack-in (~ 01:27:00).

 

Other points aside from the NeoGaf synopsis:

 

- Basically parrots everything Mike Kennedy has said; co-hosts are 100% on board. Sounds exactly like another infomercial.

- gamester says he'll just be able ot port AoTN to RVGS via a Unity plug-in.

- Mike says there are 100s of game developers ready, "including SEGA".

- He promotes the now-disproven idea that RVGS FPGA cores will emulate classic systems; even going so far as to give NeoGeo as an example. Also mentions adapters. We know that these would only happen with successfully-funded stretch goals.

- Can't do a prototype for a couple thousand dollars but then says that throwing together some boards and playing games on it would have been dishonest.

- "Mike says the, I forget his name, ex-president of LucasArts is interested in porting games ..." and mentions exclusive sequels to series that he can't name (recall?).

-Throughout the interview, mentions AtariAge; refers to anti-RVGS as toxic, hate, negativity, "kind of sad"; "Not trying to 'dis' on the AtariAge guys, but ..."

-Cohosts say that if you spend a lot of money collecting but don't want to spend $300 on this system, "you should shut up" (heavily paraphrasing).

- Says for Mike to make his own console molding, it "can cost $30-40,000, easy". [Wut? Not $500,000?]

- AoTN "... will be an exclusive for about a year-and-a-half, or so."

 

Like the NeoGaf poster, I wonder how gamester gets away with saying, "I'm not in this financially." Sure, he's not put money into it, but I doubt he's giving away AoTN for free. He mentions toward the end that Kennedy was thinking of not having a pack-in game, but CollectorVision offered AoTN "at cost". Err... didn't someone here say AoTN was funded via Kickstarter? And doesn't this mean he is in this financially?

 

Oh, my head. Toxic hating full of negativity sure is confusing and hard.

[sh3-rg]

EDIT: lol, damn you PWW :0)

I am kind of shocked that their "media blitz" post IGG launch has only been the Gamester81 infomercial and the interview with triverse, which did more to hurt them than help them.

He continued that in his All Gen Gamers Podcast 196

Listen from the 1:26:50 mark, it's... interesting. Nothing new, but plenty of "love" for AtariAge.

"People are tearing it to sheds it's crazy... go on to AtariAge..."

"Why?"

"I don't know why... here's the three main things..."

There's nothing new in there, it's just more promo stuff. But it is misleading. He mentions Shovel Knight - nope. Pier Solar - maybe? $300 price - that's limited to 500 isn't it? "100s of game developers interested including Sega who are interested in porting games over to this Retro VGS" - lol no.

He's definitely filled to the brim of his mate Mike's PR, some of it seems word-for-word almost, other parts it just doesn't seem to have filter through him 100%. But that's understandable as he's in the same position as anyone else who has listened at length to various versions of the sales pitch.

This is his attempt to convey some of the criticism of RVGS "Why would developers be interested in porting games over to this thing, this is shit". Well Fucking Done, gamester81, that's why this thread is 127 pages, because the concerns amount to that.

"Financially, I'm not in this thing at all. I'm not trying to sell people on it. I'm not trying to convince people... what I'm hoping to do is shed some light and, like, educate people... if you go on the AtariAge forums and the facebook, he's getting slammed. It's really toxic, man. It's sad.". Not wanting to sound too much like a rabid AA hater at this point, I'd like to say it sounds a heck of a lot more like you _are_ involved financially and you're doing damage control for a good friend of yours, and you absolutely _are_ trying your best to convince people. Whether that's out of noble intentions regarding a good friend who is seeing his dream fall around him, I don't know or care, it seems deceitful.

He then goes on to talk up FPGA, "Mike wants to do a Neo Geo core, but these things cost money..." completely fictional. That's stretch goals and a non-existent FPGA core. The two of them then attempt to strawman more criticism of the RVGS: "Why would people be up in arms about this thing coming out? What is the downside? What is this going to do to the collecting community besides enhance it in a way?"...

"if they don't want it, don't buy it". Well, he got one thing right - around 150 people backed it for a console so far, I think that shows it's exactly what people have done.

gamester: "people are literally like scoping this thing, eyeballing it and like 'oooh, you knooooow, I can't wait until it faaaaails'".

"I don't want to call these people trolls, because there are some people with really legitimate concerns" - so what the f*** was all that junk you spouted over the previous 10 minutes?

Then gamester's buddy does a long-winded "if they build it, games will come" speech and some 'value proposition' PR.

gamester "The developers are behind this 100%"... "I encourage people to go to the IGG campaign... read up on it... everything you need to know is right there". "A lot of people are seeing the hate, seeing the negativity, seeing it has slowed down, and they are hesitant... people don't have to ruin it for everyone else".

BEST BIT:

gamester: "If you go to IndeiGoGo now and you go to our campaign..."

Edited September 29, 2015 by sh3-rg

[Keatah]

I'm just trying to wrap my head around the logic of someone designing a VCS or ColecoVision native game, and then publishing it on a RetroVGS cartridge that ONLY operates on RetroVGS.

 

To maximize exposure it would make sense to publish on the native format - a real VCS or CV cartridge and then make the rom available for lower cost in parallel with or for free once the game has sold X amount. That is how you touch every possible player. You get the original console owners and you get the emulator junkies and the multi-cart (harmony) users.

 

Crap.. RetroVGS doesn't come with SD capability, I can only interpret that to mean they don't want you running roms on it. Could be legal issues if it went retail, could be it would reduce sales of their carts. Dunno. Don't care now.

[leods]

What I don't understand really, is that These Forums are their audience. If old guys who go to the extent of registering in Forums to discuss their Passion aren't going to buy this, who is? How don't they see that they Need to try to bring atari Age back to them and not confront?

 

I don't want to talk much about John, but I did post in his Video that if he goes down this patch of turning his channel into a pure advertisement outlet he lost me. And I mean it.