Profanity

[VectorGamer]

I've heard in the past from the classic gaming community of getting the younger generations interested in classic gaming. Yet time and time again I come across classic gaming YouTube content, DVDs and podcasts that have profanity and with that I can't share that content with my kids.

 

We need more content that is suitable for all audiences.

 

Time's yours...

[+Random Terrain]

That's one reason why I try to link to YouTube videos that just show the game without commentary. You never know if the idiot is going sprinkle the F word through the whole thing to prove that he's a big boy. "If me say F word and smoke cigarettes, everyone will know me is big boy! No, me not big boy! Me man! Me big man! Me big grown-ass man!"

[+ls650]

To me, profanity is a sign of a weak vocabulary. If the best adjective you can come up to describe something is a cuss word, you need to read a thesaurus.

 

Profanity is the spice of language: a little salt and pepper can enhance the flavour, but too much can ruin the meal.

[Papa]

I don't use profanity openly. I may mix it up in conversation with my wife, but avoid it entirely outside of that. In forums I spell it using symbols, a$$, f**K, etc..

I totally agree that it's been overused as of late. I noted to my wife that when watching documentary videos of the war in Vietnam and comparing them to movies that are supposed to be 'accurate' depictions of the events therein, there is an overuse of profanity in movies, even considering the high stress and insane environments of war. Today people swear far too much, in my opinion. Language has been loosened. Consider the word "frack". It's a method of oil extraction that just a short time ago gained popularity as the "F" word in the Galactica series. Atari is pretty much completely safe for kids (although they have AO games that are rare and, in my opinion, ridiculous) and I think the forum should make an extra effort to be that way too!

[BigO]

Isn't there a guy calling himself "No Swear Gamer" doing videos?

 

I don't use profanity in my real world conversations or in my internet postings. That's one reason I appreciate the AtariAge forums and members. While there doesn't seem to be an official rule about swearing, most contributors at least keep it to a minimum here.

[VectorGamer]

Isn't there a guy calling himself "No Swear Gamer" doing videos?

 

 

 

Yes and I don't swear in my videos either obviously because my kids are in them.

[Nutsy Doodleheimer]

Most classic game room episodes refrain from it, but here and there an F bomb can be dropped.

[The Usotsuki]

CGR is usually bleeped, isn't it?

[RJ]

All you guys are right on. More people need to see this thread.

 

You never know if the idiot is going sprinkle the F word through the whole thing to prove that he's a big boy. "If me say F word and smoke cigarettes, everyone will know me is big boy! No, me not big boy! Me man! Me big man! Me big grown-ass man!"

I mentioned this same notion over in the giant podcast thread as part of WHY people swear in podcasts. I call it the "parents away" syndrome. Edited April 28, 2015 by RJ

[TheObscureGamer]

To me, profanity is a sign of a weak vocabulary. If the best adjective you can come up to describe something is a cuss word, you need to read a thesaurus.

 

Profanity is the spice of language: a little salt and pepper can enhance the flavour, but too much can ruin the meal.

not necessarily.I have read the dictionary and thesaurus TWICE but I occasionally use cuss words as they sometimes are the only words that "fit" but I totally get your message

 

If you haven't already,Classic gameroom, and Gamesack are great VG reviewers who rarely curse.

[KeeperofLindblum]

The group of "My Life in Gaming" seems pretty family friendly.
I have watched many episodes and don't recall any real profanity in there.

My Life in Gaming

 

Also find their videos pretty entertaining and informative. (More of the latter than the former though. lol)

[accousticguitar]

I totally agree. It is difficult to find a decent game reviewer who reviews Atari 2600 games and doesn't swear. As a result I don't watch very many video game reviews on youtube.

[Austin]

I don't mind swearing in videos, but I do prefer it to be unexpected and bleeped out. It's funnier that way to me.

[Chris++]

Allow me to play devil's advocate. This could be an enjoyable and perspective-widening debate, at least in this relatively minor context, so I'd like to keep it from becoming personalized. I'm not criticizing anyone.

 

You (in the abstract) decided to have kids, so therefore, every podcast must now be tailored to children? This I can't agree with. Speaking personally, I don't care whether or not younger people become interested in old games. I don't see what that would change or improve. But that's subjective; I'm not "against" it, like some kind of irrational grump. I simply don't believe that everything should be made kid-safe. It narrows the creative palette.

 

Are you making a simple statement of aesthetic preference, and I've taken a few of the above statements too seriously? That's obviously possible.

 

Either way, it seems that it would be much better for your kids if you were to teach them that words have no power over them, unless they give those words power. I mean, they're only words. Mere sounds made with the human mouth, sounds that we use for release or emphasis more than anything literal, cannot hurt you, unless you give them permission. Your kids are going to hear plenty of what you consider profanity; it's much more useful to explain to them that they don't have to grant those words any power.

 

But I have no experience as a parent. I do remember being somebody's kid, however, and no attempt was made to keep verbal vulgarities away from my ears. I could watch R movies and speak as I wished, as long as I was polite outside the house. As a result, I very rarely swear as an adult, I don't find realistic gun violence entertaining, and I don't make the mistake of thinking sex is made of gold. The mystique was removed, you see. It does much more damage to a kid's psyche to see his folks freaking out about such things than to merely see or hear them.

 

My upbringing is just one example, though, and I'm genuinely curious as to others' thoughts on the above arguments.

[+Random Terrain]

It's not just about children. My web site needs to be G or PG for the most part since kids, uptight snooty cultivated people, religious nuts of all flavors, and highly evolved beings from other planets or other dimensions might visit. I also can't embed videos that contain naughty words if I want to have any kind of ads on my web site.

[potatohead]

My view is a bit outside the conservative norm.

 

Profanity breaks down two basic ways:

 

One way is the lazy way. To test for it, take the profanity out of the expression and see what value is lost. In this way, profanity is used for it's intrinsic shock value, and I consider it lazy, low value speech to be discouraged. Lazy profanity adds little value, and it's easy to see the words being used for shock value only, not any meaningful purpose beyond that.

 

The other way is more valuable. Sometimes, the world has ugly things, people, places, ideas in it. Ugly words are needed to express ugly things. To test for this, remove the profanity and see whether or not the meaning and value are diminished. If so, that profanity is adding value. Often profanity can add very considerable value. Sometimes it's necessary, if it is to be expressed properly. That's real.

 

Frankly, I raised my kids on that basis. Good form is OK. Bad, lazy form reflects badly on them, and the world is less for it. I really don't have a problem with profanity personally, and I prefer good form. So I nailed 'em for lazy profanity, and let good form, real dialog pass. Turns out my older son is funny as all get out! Not only does he know how to use it, but he's got real potential in stand up one day. I would never have known had I shut the door on it for purity reasons.

 

Disneyland type dialogs are often as painful as lazy profanity is, and I much prefer real dialogs, and those may well include profanity.

 

What I find most painful and low value is the idea that words are bad in and of themselves. They are just words, and it's all about the context and meaning in the expression they are part of. Some people will rule out profanity on the mere "bad word" basis, and that is frankly as shallow as using profanity in a lazy way is.

 

My kids grew up and use profanity in the good form sense well. I'm good with that. They can have real conversations just as I did, and that is as good as it gets. Seeking purity in expression takes considerable time, and it's a near constant thing to manage. I've much better things to do with my life and time.

 

Besides, there just isn't purity. People, will hear profanity. And it's there because it's part of real expression made by real people living in the real world doing real things. Better to understand it than invest so much in avoiding it. Disneyland is a great place to visit, but is pure hell to live.

 

Put another way, I have always seen the quest for purity in expression as an effort as dubious as Peril Sensitive Sunglasses are. Think, if you can't see it, then it can't see you, and it's about right.

 

Let the nay-saying commence!

Edited April 29, 2015 by potatohead

[Chris++]

Lazy profanity adds little value, and it's easy to see the words being used for shock value only, not any meaningful purpose beyond that.

 

We agree completely on this. In fact, I love your entire post. And you end it with a Douglas Adams reference? I wish you'd write a book or something.

 

In one of her rare lucid moments, my last girlfriend said something akin to ls650's "vocabulary" comment above: "Cussing sometimes means that you don't know enough words to use one that's closer to being your own expression, so you just go with something more generic and universal." That sang to my selfishly individualistic approach to life.

[Algus]

I cuss like a sailor. I never bothered with kids or a family either.

 

Maybe there's just something about us no-kid types LOL

 

I'm not unsympathetic to VectorGamer's position though. To many reviewers want to try and capture the success of early YouTube reviewers like AVGN so they think incessant cursing will do that but the truth is they are neither funny nor informative. Personally my favorite game videos are silent speed-runs. You get the game for what it is, not how someone is trying to interpret it for you.

[Chris++]

Too many reviewers want to try and capture the success of early YouTube reviewers like AVGN so they think incessant cursing will do that but the truth is they are neither funny nor informative.

 

An excellent point. If that's really what they're going for, it's pathetic. Come up with your own style.

[potatohead]

Or don't be lazy in profanity.

 

It's a hard thing with really young kids. I didn't deal with it until they were old enough to appreciate form and value.

 

One odd thing worked fantastically well though. A friend thought it up, and that is cussing night. For one evening, every once in a while, no taboos. Go for it, and just check it all out.

 

Of course they did, surprising even me, and I really hard to surprise on stuff like this.

 

And then the most amazing thing happened. They stopped, but for serious not lazy uses.

 

I'm not sure how it worked, but it was something to do with wiping that mistique away, along with the shock value.

 

I think they realized how stupid they were sounding.

 

This would go for a considerable time, then they would ask for another cussing night.

 

It was almost as if they collected a bunch and waited! Then during free time, explored it all, maybe getting that out of their system or something.

 

Anyway, recommended. It might seem irresponsible, but I don't think it is if you are there to help them realize things.

 

Crazy!

 

@Chris. Yeah, cool. Feeling the appreciation.

 

And everybody needs a little Douglas Adams. Just once maybe.

[Video]

I have zero problem with cussing in of itself. Cuss words are just that.....words. They aren't any more, or less valuable than any other word, their just a collection of sound put together to allow one to project an idea at another person. The word itself isn't proof of someones lack of intelligence or intellect, it's not "lazy" or heck, even vulgar (people seriously need to look up the meaning of THAT word sometime) It's words, just words, and while some can be overused for sure, there are opportunities where that may be the only appropriate word for the case, or maybe not only, but the most.

 

What I do have a problem with is, cussing for cussing sake. WAY to many people do that this day in age, but it's not the word, it's the laziness of the statement that really gets me. It's equally as annoying to hear someone say "and uh...and uh...and uh..." or "you know, you know, you know" Just as it is annoying to have someone post a response to a topic just to say "me too, Agreed, I know, right?" If nothing important is being said, maybe nothing should be said.

 

Oh, someone mentioned "frak" as a cussword. LOL, Yeah, I remember in the 70's and early 80's them saying that in Battlestar galactica. That show was awesome. I don't know the first instance of the word being used as a term in drilling, but I'm pretty sure the process is newer than the show. I remember thinking, "Aww, how cute, their trying to cash in on Battlestar Galactica" which had just recently been rebooted on TV, of course, that series has come and gone, I still like the original better. The new one started out OK, but they decided to try turning it into softporn and it quickly lost it's appeal after that.

[potatohead]

I got into trouble once for saying frak. They said the thought is what counts, to which I replied, well fuck it then. Might as well get full credit. Didn't go well.

 

So we turned ship into a cussword. After that shack. Carp. One after the other.

 

Was kind of a rough year for the powers that be on 8th grade year...

 

Anything can be profane really. It's all in the delivery.

 

Battlestar Galactica was so fake. Let's just say the delivery was lacking. They tried, but I always got the sense they were doing more takes due to laughing hard over the silly dialog.

[mbd30]

I totally agree. It is difficult to find a decent game reviewer who reviews Atari 2600 games and doesn't swear. As a result I don't watch very many video game reviews on youtube.

 

Lord Karnage / Classic Game Room

 

Huge number of Atari 2600 reviews and little or no swearing.

Edited April 30, 2015 by mbd30

[78001987]

I've always been of the opinion that sheltering kids from harmless things like profanity, nudity, etc is far more damaging to their human development than letting them experience it naturally, and taking the time to teach them why it is wrong or inappropriate.

 

Pretending the ugly parts of life don't exist sets them up for failure later on. Same goes with participation trophies and kids sports where nobody loses an no ones feelings get hurt. That's not real life. This only hinders their ability to process the full range of human emotions as they go through adolescence and into adulthood.

Edited May 2, 2015 by 78001987

[+Random Terrain]

I've always been of the opinion that sheltering kids from harmless things like profanity, nudity, etc is far more damaging to their human development than letting them experience it naturally, and taking the time to teach them why it is wrong or inappropriate.

 

Pretending the ugly parts of life don't exist sets them up for failure later on. Same goes with participation trophies and kids sports where nobody loses an no ones feelings get hurt. That's not real life. This only hinders their ability to process the full range of human emotions as they go through adolescence and into adulthood.

I'd feel pretty damaged as a kid if my teacher whipped out his willy. "It's just nudity, kids. Come on, look at it. It's perfectly natural. Why are you crying? I'm doing you kids a favor! Your human development will be damaged if you don't look at my wiggle stick and his bouncing buddies!"