barnieg Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 I'm trying to get my head around the compatibility of the Aquarius mini-expander soundchip, It's seems that it is the less common AY-8914 is this correct? If so how does this effect porting sound from another Z80 based system that might use an AY-8910 or AY-8912 are they functionally identical in regards to programming? Finally is it exact same chip in the Intellivision? Barnie Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/239752-aquarius-ay-8914-programming/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaybird3rd Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 The AY-3-8914 was the sound chip used in the Intellivision. I don't have any Intellivision docs handy, but for whatever it's worth, here's something from Wikipedia: "The AY-3-8914 has the same pinout and is in the same 40-pin package as the AY-3-8910, except the control registers on the chip are shuffled around, and the 'expected input' on the A9 pin may be different. Otherwise it is exactly the same as the AY-3-8910. It was used on the Mattel Intellivision." The Aquarius Mini Expander uses an 8910: 1 Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/239752-aquarius-ay-8914-programming/#findComment-3264278 Share on other sites More sharing options...
+nanochess Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 The greatest differenced (pinpoint by intvnut) is that the volume for activating the envelope register is 48 decimal instead of 16 as commonly used for AY-3-8910. Not sure about the I/O bits for Aquarius, but in Intellivision the wrong bits for mixer register turns off the second controller. Otherwise both are the same. 1 Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/239752-aquarius-ay-8914-programming/#findComment-3264346 Share on other sites More sharing options...
+nanochess Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 . Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/239752-aquarius-ay-8914-programming/#findComment-3264347 Share on other sites More sharing options...
GroovyBee Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 The greatest differenced (pinpoint by intvnut) is that the volume for activating the envelope register is 48 decimal instead of 16 as commonly used for AY-3-8910. This is mentioned in the "Your friend the EXEC" PDF document in the "VOLUME CONTROL" section (page 103 of 119). Not sure about the I/O bits for Aquarius, but in Intellivision the wrong bits for mixer register turns off the second controller. On the Inty bits 6 and 7 in the mixer register determine if the I/O ports used to interface to the controllers are inputs or outputs. 1 Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/239752-aquarius-ay-8914-programming/#findComment-3264367 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aquaman Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 I'm trying to get my head around the compatibility of the Aquarius mini-expander soundchip, It's seems that it is the less common AY-8914 is this correct? If so how does this effect porting sound from another Z80 based system that might use an AY-8910 or AY-8912 are they functionally identical in regards to programming? Finally is it exact same chip in the Intellivision? Barnie Here are some documents which say the Aquarius uses the AY-8910 and how it is incorporated within the Mini Expander. Aquarius AY-3-8910.pdf 3 Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/239752-aquarius-ay-8914-programming/#findComment-3264654 Share on other sites More sharing options...
GroovyBee Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 Looking at that schematic its the same situation as the Inty. If you get the direction bits wrong in the mixer register you'll stop the controllers from working. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/239752-aquarius-ay-8914-programming/#findComment-3264659 Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaybird3rd Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 Looking at that schematic its the same situation as the Inty. If you get the direction bits wrong in the mixer register you'll stop the controllers from working. Yes. That also explains why the 8910 can't be used as a drop-in replacement for the 8914, even though the pinout is supposedly the same. I seem to remember trying it with one of my Intellivisions in the days before I knew better, and unsurprisingly, I didn't get any response from the hand controllers. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/239752-aquarius-ay-8914-programming/#findComment-3264661 Share on other sites More sharing options...
GroovyBee Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 Page 9 of 15 in that PDF tells you what to do with the controller port's direction bits. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/239752-aquarius-ay-8914-programming/#findComment-3264667 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aquaman Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 Another question pops up discussing the AY-8910. Has anybody ever tried to use any of the ZX Spectrum, MSX etc. special tools to rip the AY-8910 based music from their programs, or use the already ripped music and convert these to the Aquarius? Here are some webpages, just to give you some idea how many of these exist, and it would be great if we could use one of these for the Aquarius, without reinventing it especially for the Aquarius. http://www.worldofspectrum.org/utilities.html http://bulba.untergrund.net/main_e.htm It would be great to have something like these tunes inside any home-brew game Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/239752-aquarius-ay-8914-programming/#findComment-3264673 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aquaman Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 And another nice manual for everyone who is interested GI_AY-3-8910_Feb-1979.pdf 1 Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/239752-aquarius-ay-8914-programming/#findComment-3264684 Share on other sites More sharing options...
GroovyBee Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 Several of the Spectrum/Amstrad trackers come with the source code to play back the tunes in Z80 machine code. Converting one shouldn't take very much time for somebody that knows the Aquarius well. As far as I can tell they don't use file I/O or anything particularly machine specific and basically just work off a pointer to the tune. 1 Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/239752-aquarius-ay-8914-programming/#findComment-3264689 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aquaman Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 Several of the Spectrum/Amstrad trackers come with the source code to play back the tunes in Z80 machine code. Converting one shouldn't take very much time for somebody that knows the Aquarius well. As far as I can tell they don't use file I/O or anything particularly machine specific and basically just work off a pointer to the tune. Someone who know the Aquarius well you say...... I can send you some documentation on the Aquarius too you know . 2 Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/239752-aquarius-ay-8914-programming/#findComment-3264704 Share on other sites More sharing options...
GroovyBee Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 Someone who know the Aquarius well you say...... I can send you some documentation on the Aquarius too you know . True! But I haven't done Z80 for a very, very long time. Perhaps if I ever get an Aquarius (at a reasonable price on ebay) I might have a go. 1 Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/239752-aquarius-ay-8914-programming/#findComment-3264708 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aquaman Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 True! But I haven't done Z80 for a very, very long time. Perhaps if I ever get an Aquarius (at a reasonable price on ebay) I might have a go. A there is hope ! Barnieg finally managed to get hold of a reasonably priced UK Aquarius, so maybe the next one lucky enough will be you Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/239752-aquarius-ay-8914-programming/#findComment-3264714 Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaybird3rd Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 A bankswitched cartridge can provide LOTS of room for nice music, so I definitely plan to do something with one of those AY trackers, once I have some development tools which will make testing easier. For now, I've got to get back to work on those ... 1 Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/239752-aquarius-ay-8914-programming/#findComment-3264718 Share on other sites More sharing options...
GroovyBee Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 A there is hope ! Barnieg finally managed to get hold of a reasonably priced UK Aquarius, so maybe the next one lucky enough will be you I have checked ebay.co.uk far more frequently for Aquarius machines since Barnieg mentioned he'd snagged one for a good price. To be honest, there are other machines that I'd quite like to tinker with before the Aquarius. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/239752-aquarius-ay-8914-programming/#findComment-3264721 Share on other sites More sharing options...
barnieg Posted June 25, 2015 Author Share Posted June 25, 2015 I picked up one of the "new old stock" Amstrad GX 4000's recently - there are a few left... I'm going to stick to Z80 based machines with AY sound chips for the time being :-) I have checked ebay.co.uk far more frequently for Aquarius machines since Barnieg mentioned he'd snagged one for a good price. To be honest, there are other machines that I'd quite like to tinker with before the Aquarius. 1 Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/239752-aquarius-ay-8914-programming/#findComment-3264774 Share on other sites More sharing options...
GroovyBee Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 I picked up one of the "new old stock" Amstrad GX 4000's recently - there are a few left... I have a few of those myself. I'm tempted to pick up the new multi-cart that came out for it recently. I'm going to stick to Z80 based machines with AY sound chips for the time being :-) Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/239752-aquarius-ay-8914-programming/#findComment-3264777 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aquaman Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 I have checked ebay.co.uk far more frequently for Aquarius machines since Barnieg mentioned he'd snagged one for a good price. To be honest, there are other machines that I'd quite like to tinker with before the Aquarius. Of course there is a choice in so many systems to pick from and the Aquarius is not the most obvious one. That said if you are an Inty fan, some love must also exist for the humble Aquarius ! Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/239752-aquarius-ay-8914-programming/#findComment-3265755 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aquaman Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 I have a few of those myself. I'm tempted to pick up the new multi-cart that came out for it recently. Here is a thought: why not just wait for the Aquarius Superfont from Jay to be available, refresh your memory a bit on the Z80 and develop a cross selling game for several similar Z80 machines including the Aquarius? 1 Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/239752-aquarius-ay-8914-programming/#findComment-3265757 Share on other sites More sharing options...
GroovyBee Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 Its a nice idea but the Aquarius does have quite a few limitations compared to other machines of the time. Making a game that takes advantage of what it offers is probably a much better approach. Something like LumASCII from the Speccy would be good :- 2 Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/239752-aquarius-ay-8914-programming/#findComment-3265758 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aquaman Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 (edited) Its a nice idea but the Aquarius does have quite a few limitations compared to other machines of the time. Making a game that takes advantage of what it offers is probably a much better approach. Something like LumASCII from the Speccy would be good :- Of course you are right, but an Aquarius with Mini Expander and Superfont upgrade would probably match a ZX-Spectrum, which games are ported to the Amstrad CPC a lot of times. Also an MSX1 and Colecovision version would not be very different. Only if you want to make use of the hardware sprites of those two, it would take some re-coding. Edited June 27, 2015 by Aquaman Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/239752-aquarius-ay-8914-programming/#findComment-3265769 Share on other sites More sharing options...
GroovyBee Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 Of course you are right, but an Aquarius with Mini Expander and Superfont upgrade would probably match a ZX-Spectrum, which games are ported to the Amstrad CPC a lot of times. Also an MSX1 and Colecovision version would not be very different. Only if you want to make use of the hardware sprites of those two, it would take some re-coding. The problem with internal mods is not everybody has them installed. So if you write software for them, the percentage take-up of your game is a niche of a niche. If it plugs in the cart slot then its worth doing a game that targets the advanced hardware. I think the Aquarius needs an SD drive of some kind. That would make it much more fun to use as a system and to develop new homebrews for. 2 Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/239752-aquarius-ay-8914-programming/#findComment-3265775 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aquaman Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 The problem with internal mods is not everybody has them installed. So if you write software for them, the percentage take-up of your game is a niche of a niche. If it plugs in the cart slot then its worth doing a game that targets the advanced hardware. I think the Aquarius needs an SD drive of some kind. That would make it much more fun to use as a system and to develop new homebrews for. If the games are good enough, I think most serious Aquarius users will eventually feel the need to upgrade with Superfont, to be able to enjoy these. But I can see your point and that's why I thought of the multi-system approach. As for an SD drive or something like that, Jay and I think even Martin are working on a solution to get some kind of speedy mass storage available for the Aquarius. This would make the Aquarius a more serious homebrew system. 1 Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/239752-aquarius-ay-8914-programming/#findComment-3265780 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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