FPGA Based Videogame System

[Pixelboy]

Way back when the Dock was first announced, when I saw that they were going to put USB ports on this thing for controllers, I immediately thought "Why USB? Just about every USB controller out there is designed for PCs and have proprietary drivers to install, or use the default gamepad driver under Windows at a minimum. None of them are going to be properly detected by a firmware-driven stand-alone device, except for the few controllers that Analogue's people happen to have on hand for testing."

 

Turns out I was right, it seems. They should have put Super-NES controller ports on the Dock. Then nobody would be complaining about this right now.

 

[Atariboy]

1 hour ago, roots.genoa said:

Well, @Atariboy and @Tanooki (among others) say the Dock is not working properly (controllers not syncing and settings not saved iirc), but I didn't use mine a lot to check tbh

I don't yet have a dock for my Pocket, although I have ordered one so that I can use it as a console (hopefully by the time it ships, many of these issues will at long last be ironed out).

 

Thus my comment about lackluster support for wired USB controllers is solely based off what I've read and not from personal experience

Edited May 19, 2023 by Atariboy

[Ricdeau]

Okay, well that was painless. Store up immediately at 10 (Central time). Looks like they are trying to prevent bots, but it wasn't too intrusive. Wait to checkout was pretty short. Hopefully pre-orders stay up for a bit so most people can attempt to get one. If that happens I'd say it would look like they have learned from how the Pocket went.

Edited May 19, 2023 by Ricdeau

[Razzie.P]

Yeah, that was probably the easiest/smoothest preorder I've done with them I less they drop the ball behind the scenes or something.

[Bill Loguidice]

I agree. Right on, wait a minute or so in queue, and then the order went through. It also helped I guess that that was the only thing you could order, i.e., no accessories were available.

[Atariboy]

Glad it seems to being going smoothly, judging by what I'm seeing here and elsewhere.

 

Deviating from this a bit, I've noticed a lot of the fixed issues with the official firmware updates that were recently issued for the Mega Sg/Super Nt/Nt Mini Noir are now marked as fixed on the Smokemonster GitHub issues page for each respective jailbreak where people report problems. I wonder what the logic is in that when the jailbreak firmware, the actual subject of the GitHubs, haven't actually been updated to these recent standards. 

 

They're only fixed for those on official firmware, which I'm pretty confident is the minority of users out there (And which isn't even the subject of the GitHub pages). Probably the only sizeable group utilizing the most recent firmware are the FX Pak Pro/SD2SNES folks on the Super Nt, since they don't gain much extra functionality by using the official jailbreak.

 

The casuals that just wanted a good way to enjoy their old cartridges probably don't know these have been updated or care enough to bother updating their system. Most everyone else is likely on jailbreak firmware due to all the extra functionality one gains, even if they own a top of the line multicart or have an extensive cartridge collection.

Edited May 19, 2023 by Atariboy

[Tanooki]

Agreed it is strange on the JBs for the others.  It's odd there is no update in sight given the fixes cleared a lot out of those complaint lists of bugs.  I had did the break on the SNES from them but never the Genesis, mostly because it rolled up some stuff so I figured whatever.  I never really did use it for any added features let alone roms given I have plenty of carts, a few multis, and my kits.  So I went with the new update, and nothings new other than it works better.

[NE146]

13 hours ago, cacophony said:

 

Out of curiosity, assuming Analogue introduced this as the next product, would you buy it?  openFPGA multisystem with built in CD drive, optional cart adapters and control adapters, and specs that would make it possible to port any existing/planned MiSTer cores

 

If so, how much would you be willing to spend?

Sure maybe!  Heck I forked it out for the NT Mini and the Noire.. so I'm always open to checking out any product that actually comes into fruition. 'Course that's all theoretical though. 😜

[cacophony]

7 hours ago, SegaSnatcher said:

I know you didn't ask me, but I would 100% buy this theoretical system and pay up to $349.99 for it. 

Question meant for all! 👍
$350 would be about my limit as well.

[Austin]

Nearly five hours later, pre-orders are still open. Nice. I was worried these were going to sell out immediately (who knows how many they are willing to produce).

 

Finances worked out better than expected so I was able to jump on one, along with a DAC. Since I'll now have the trifecta of Analogue's 16-bit era recreations, I figured I can finally justify the cost of it (which is not cheap, as they still want to ding you with $30 shipping on it, which is the same as the DUO itself, heh).

 

Really hoping the DUO will be jailbroken, but if it's not, I've at least already got a trusty Turbo Everdrive.

[roots.genoa]

8 hours ago, Pixelboy said:

Then nobody would be complaining about this right now.

Don't underestimate retrogamers. 🙂

[roots.genoa]

29 minutes ago, Austin said:

I've at least already got a trusty Turbo Everdrive.

Are you sure it can be inserted in the HuCard port, though? 😅

[DragonGrafx-16]

3 minutes ago, roots.genoa said:

Are you sure it can be inserted in the HuCard port, though? 😅

Would you even be able to insert thick HuCards like Street Fighter II and Populus?

[Pixelboy]

15 hours ago, cacophony said:

Out of curiosity, assuming Analogue introduced this as the next product, would you buy it?  openFPGA multisystem with built in CD drive, optional cart adapters and control adapters, and specs that would make it possible to port any existing/planned MiSTer cores

 

If so, how much would you be willing to spend?

Actually, I don't think I would buy this proposed system, personally. The main reason is that I already have an Nt-Mini and Super Nt, and I decided to skip over the Analogue Pocket and get a GB Consolizer unit instead, because what I really wanted was to play GB/GBC/GBA games on a modern TV screen via HDMI and a proper Nintendo controller, and the Consolizer gives me exactly that without all the extra baggage of the Analogue Pocket which I don't care for anyway. Handheld playability is not required or wanted since I already have a perfectly working GBA with a vivid modded screen.

 

Also, an openFPGA multisystem implies the notion of a single device that plays everything. What if this multisystem console breaks down? Then suddenly I don't have any means to play any of my games? If I keep other dedicated systems for redundancy, then doesn't that defeat the purpose of having a multisystem console to begin with? Of course you can argue for a minimum of hardware redundancy, but then can you really expect a multisystem console with every desirable cartridge adaptor imaginable to cost only 350$? Let's say you've got a general-purpose edge connector on the main console, the collection of all the cartridge adaptors that plug into this edge connector would likely cost quite a bunch of money. And then you have to look at controller adaptors, which alone sounds like a nightmare and a half.

 

I've said this before and I'll say it again: At this point, the only FPGA-based system I would buy from Analogue without any hesitation is an arcade console with custom cartridges that contain both the licensed arcade ROMs and the FPGA cores that are needed to play such ROMs. So think NeoGeo but with every arcade game you can think of, not just SNK titles. When I was a kid, I would dream of a super console that would play real arcade games, not just approximate home conversions on "inferior" one-size-fits-all hardware. Today we have the means to turn that dream into reality. Imagine owning a collection of real arcade games in cartridge format, with the early 80s arcade games being the cheapest to purchase, and later arcade games being a little more expensive. That's the kind of cartridge collection I would put real money on. And I'd buy all the dedicated controllers too (joystick, trackball, paddle, etc.) just to have the complete package. 

 

 

[roots.genoa]

4 minutes ago, DragonGrafx-16 said:

Would you even be able to insert thick HuCards like Street Fighter II and Populus?

People are wondering that as well, but renders show it's slightly larger so I guess it would work for (slightly) larger HuCards. But Everdrive Flashcarts are massive unfortunately.

[Ricdeau]

8 minutes ago, DragonGrafx-16 said:

Would you even be able to insert thick HuCards like Street Fighter II and Populus?

That would be a pretty bad oversight if it did end up being the case. I would think that any official HuCard size is going to fit. As an SFIICE owner I certainly do hope it fits. I just wish 8Bitdo had a 6 button wireless controller.

Edited May 19, 2023 by Ricdeau

[Austin]

50 minutes ago, roots.genoa said:

Are you sure it can be inserted in the HuCard port, though? 😅

Hahaha.. I am such an idiot. I didn’t even think of that. 🤣

 

Guess I am banking on a jailbreak then.

 

Unless.. the card slot actually isn’t that deep and they expect cards to hang out or something. 🤔

[Austin]

Hm, it looks like the cards slide just about all the way in.

But, the front view of it makes it look like the hole is cut for larger cards:

Still can't say for certain one way or another. I guess the verdict is out on Populous and Street Fighter II until people start receiving them.

 

If those fit, an OG Turbo Everdrive may mostly fit, but the reset button probably sticks out too high:

 

Edited May 19, 2023 by Austin

[Ricdeau]

Looking at that picture and my Street Fighter II CE HuCard I have very little concern that it wouldn't fit.

[dudeguy]

I'm not buying the Duo. Im still waiting for my Game Gear adapter and Dock which I ordered a long time ago. the idea of spending $250+ for a product that we wont even know the quality of for months from now doesnt appeal to me.

 

All these old systems work for me as they are. They look fine on my CRT and my upscaler. Id probably sell my Super NT and Mega SG as they mostly collect dust, and I know the Duo would as well

[Punisher5.0]

Yeah I fully expect the TED to work. Analogue knows people will be wanting to use them.

[Atariboy]

They're also just renders. So hopefully if such an oversight happens, they catch that before finalizing their case design.

[Reaperman]

The wife is pretty pleased that she secured our pre-buy. I am not going to share that I know orders are still open, and am laying gratitude on pretty thick tonight.

 

It went (and seems to still be going) very smoothly. (as has been pointed out here many times) Come to think of it the pocket adapters went pretty well too, so two good experiences in a row now. Wonder when those adapters are coming...

 

I didn't even think of the possibility that everdrives might not fit. I would have guessed they'd specifically do testing with it for odd games...unless they just use the SD slot. 🙄

I think it might be equally likely that an oopsie on the render just sticks the turbochip in too far.

Edited May 20, 2023 by Reaperman

[Reaperman]

4 hours ago, Ricdeau said:

That would be a pretty bad oversight if it did end up being the case. I would think that any official HuCard size is going to fit. As an SFIICE owner I certainly do hope it fits. I just wish 8Bitdo had a 6 button wireless controller.

that's also very odd. they haven't stated, but maybe the 6-button genesis unit will 'just work'

Hopefully the 8bitdo controllers don't need crazy firmware flashed to them to work with this, but historically I think it's been the case more often than it hasn't.

[Tanooki]

4 hours ago, dudeguy said:

I'm not buying the Duo. Im still waiting for my Game Gear adapter and Dock which I ordered a long time ago. the idea of spending $250+ for a product that we wont even know the quality of for months from now doesnt appeal to me.

 

All these old systems work for me as they are. They look fine on my CRT and my upscaler. Id probably sell my Super NT and Mega SG as they mostly collect dust, and I know the Duo would as well

You know in a way I don't find that all that bad of an idea either given how things have ended up.  I mean while it's not ideal, it's like 80-85% as good on output but Hyperturd(Hyperkin) ended up licensing their powered HDMI kits that actually do properly convert the old signal to a 720p output without introducing crappy lag nor does it just half ass take an old signal and make it all fuzzy/bleedy/blurry either.  I got one for free over a year ago and tried it on a SNES and was shocked how close it was to the SuperNTs output.  They sell the same kit with a different end plug on them to satisfy all models of the Sega Genesis/MD too.  They don't do a NES one though as far as I recall though.  The thought has crossed my mind on just going back to using my original hardware and that as a video bypass as it's beautiful for what it is.