If Battlesphere were all that...

[ZylonBane]

Snowflake meant to represent the programmers. I'm a programmer, and snowflakes (the non-political meaning) in my area of employment represent computer programmers who have crazy demands (IE: I only want blue M&Ms, etc...)

 

Dude, give up on "snowflake". The Trumpsters have ruined that word for the next few years.

 

"Prima donna" is a far better term in this case anyway.

[+Sauron]

Guys, just a quick reminder from your friendly neighborhood moderator to keep the thread from turning political.

[Jagosaurus]

This is why flash carts are important IMO. Others will get to experience this game on real hardware assuming this ROM runs. Preserve the game & allow it to be enjoyed by more than an elite few.

 

Some folks will freal about this, but if the game isn't being produced or sold, it is fine IMO.

 

Before it even gets brought up, current devs will find a way to "lock" their titles (see how Pier Solar doesn't work on mega everdrives). I agree with this practice. Regarding BS/BSG in particular... wait for the flashcart. See if it's worth the price of admission for you personally to own it. Don't worry about what others say about the gameplay & definitely don't care about what others think of your gameroom shelves...

 

This one has always interested me & appreciate the effort by a small dedicated team to get it out, well after the systems commercial life.

 

(Long post on mobile)

[+madman]

The game has already been "preserved."

[LianneJaguar64]

Before it even gets brought up, current devs will find a way to "lock" their titles (see how Pier Solar doesn't work on mega everdrives). I agree with this practice. Regarding BS/BSG in particular... wait for the flashcart. See if it's worth the price of admission.

If they ever actually release the ROM... I don't believe they have yet

Edited April 11, 2017 by LianneJaguar64

[+Stephen Moss]

And the obnoxious weirdness of friendlies being red and enemies being green on the radar.

 

I agree that with red commonly used for danger and the danger coming from your enemies that having enemies in green seems counterintuitive however I spent many hours playing Tie Fighter and I am sure that was the same, in all honesty it does not take long to adjust.

 

At $600 plus dollars, I would be pretty let down. but for the $90 I paid, its a damn fine game, you just have to put some time into it.

 

I agree, being a fan of Elite, Tie Fighter and Heroes of the Pacific who has spent many hours playing those games I really wanted to like BattleSphere but I just could not get on with the control system. As with Frontier I just found that control system to slow & cumbersome to line up faster ships and I missed the lack of ability to make the manoeuvres that I could in Tie Fighter & Heroes of the Pacific which would have made it much more playable for me.

If I had been fortunate enough to get a first run $90 copy I would probably still have it and play it occasionally as IMO that's about what it is worth, at the $300 I paid when BS Gold was released I was very disappointed.

 

@ LianneJaguar64: If there are no plans to produce more carts (at a sensible price) it would be nice if the ROM was officially released for people to enjoy. Unfortunately, considering how extremely vexed the creators were about certain issues I would not hold my breath waiting for it if I were you.

[+Stephen Moss]

sorry - double post

Edited April 11, 2017 by Stephen Moss

[+CyranoJ]

It would be nice if the ROM had an official release, but like most ROMs for any system you can name, Google can find it.

 

Not sure why this is even an issue for anyone.

[rayik]

assuming this ROM runs.

It does

[Jagosaurus]

The game has already been "preserved."

 

Yeah, I meant "preserved" as in the average fan (not super collector ) can play it on actual hardware. Not simply a ROM dump.

 

It does

 

Well there isn't a working SD cart yet, but yes it likely will.

 

It would be nice if the ROM had an official release, but like most ROMs for any system you can name, Google can find it.

 

Not sure why this is even an issue for anyone.

 

I know. Agree. I've see it on 2 major ROM sites right now with quick search.

[LianneJaguar64]

 

@ LianneJaguar64: If there are no plans to produce more carts (at a sensible price) it would be nice if the ROM was officially released for people to enjoy. Unfortunately, considering how extremely vexed the creators were about certain issues I would not hold my breath waiting for it if I were you.

 

I'm under no illusion, I won't be, but it would be nice. I'd even pay to download the ROM, but it is incredibly vexing to see such a great game kept away behind a price wall, especially when so many people cry out for a re-release or ROM Release.

[Flojomojo]

How many people?

[+orpheuswaking]

Eleventy seven

[doctorclu]

It would be nice if the ROM had an official release, but like most ROMs for any system you can name, Google can find it.

 

Not sure why this is even an issue for anyone.

 

Huh, one site has it supposedly uploaded by "thund3rb1rd" but no copy of Bubsy. I mean really!?!

 

Anyway, chiming in, got Battlesphere when it first came out and LOVED it. Played many hours, and lots of fun networking Jags against friends. Have always dreamed of attending a Jag Fest and having that famed 16 Jaguar network going.

 

If any JagFest wants to try it, that to me would be worth the cost of going where ever. (And I could bring four copies for the mix).

Edited April 12, 2017 by doctorclu

[+Stephen Moss]

It would be nice if the ROM had an official release, but like most ROMs for any system you can name, Google can find it.

 

Not sure why this is even an issue for anyone.

 

Depending on an individuals point of view there could be one of several reasons why a person may want to obtain an official release of the ROM from the developers website/AA over an unofficial dump, just of the top of my head possible reasons could be…

Respect for the developers copyright and IP (particularly if the person looking from the ROM image produces something they would not like someone to be copying & distributing for free).

Fear of prosecution for having an illegal copy, unlikely to happen but the potential can still deeply trouble some people.

The risk of potentially infecting your PC with malware while trying to obtain a ROM dump that may be corrupted and not even work from an iffy website.

[Zerosquare]

Guys... Battlesphere isn't going to be rereleased, ever. Not as as Jag cart, not as a ROM, not as a port on another machine. If the devs wanted to do it, they would have done so a long time ago.

 

They claimed they were outraged by the prices on eBay, but:

- they made limited runs and refused to disclose how many copies exist

- they've used nonsense justifications ("against software piracy" auction, seriously?)

- they kept milking the diabetes thing over and over again (don't get me wrong, donating to charity is great, but you're supposed to do it out of kindness, not as a way to brag and claim the moral high ground)

- they've been caught auctioning copies of BS on eBay with another account (so much for blaming scalpers, heh?)

- they spent years overhyping their game with outrageous claims, trademarking ThunderThis™ and ThunderThat™, and being agressive to others

 

The picture is pretty clear: all the reasons they gave for not rereleasing are just excuses. They actually don't want to rerelase Battlesphere, because the rarity and attention it gets as is strokes their (massive) ego. Apparently they didn't notice that outside of the hardcore fans, claiming you've made the most sought-after video game on the Atari Jaguar gets you about as much street cred as owning the largest collection of matchboxes in Austin, Texas.

 

If you want to play Battesphere, either save up a lot of money, or try it out in a gaming convention (but be ready for the "wow, this is actually what all that fuss was about?" effect).

Edited April 17, 2017 by Zerosquare

[+Saturn]

Apparently they didn't notice that outside of the hardcore fans, claiming you've made the most sought-after video game on the Atari Jaguar gets you about as much street cred as owning the largest collection of matchboxes in Austin, Texas.

I know that guy. He's a freaking LEGEND

[MAYAman]

 

Geeze... we call those kinds of people "snowflakes" here in the United States.

 

No we don't. Only Trumpanzees use Snowflake and Buttercup and or Cupcake as insults. Please don't group the rest of us in with that bullshit.

[82-T/A]

 

No we don't. Only Trumpanzees use Snowflake and Buttercup and or Cupcake as insults. Please don't group the rest of us in with that bullshit.

 

Sorry, not going to let you steal that word for political purposes.

 

Way back in the late 1990s... we would call computer programmers (of which I was one) that made unreasonable demands, "Snowflakes."

 

The pretense comes from the idea that every snowflake in a snowstorm is different, no two snowflakes are the same. It's a joke because typically when people pretend to be different, they're actually just doing the exact same thing every other person who's trying to be different does.

 

Just because two political parties want to take the word and use it for something else doesn't mean I'm going to change my ways.

 

 

I'm feeling very Gay today... so don't try to bring me down! haha...

[skip]

Playing devil's advocate...this could be long...

- they made limited runs and refused to disclose how many copies exist

This is / was their prerogative. I don't see any other post-Atari Corp. developers giving out updates on their game sales stats.

- they've used nonsense justifications ("against software piracy" auction, seriously?)

I'm uninformed / unaware about what this actually means.

 

- they kept milking the diabetes thing over and over again (don't get me wrong, donating to charity is great, but you're supposed to do it out of kindness, not as a way to brag and claim

Based on facts alone: it was their / T-bird's approaches to Hasbro that allowed the Jaguar to be released from any possible legal / copyright issues (re: software releases, encryption keys, use of logos etc.), which is where they offered up the diabetes / charity thing as a carrot. From what I could see this carrot wasn't necessary as Hasbro were quite happy to be done with anything Jag related (and Jag fanboy related I'm sure hahaha). However, due to the ongoing health issues and ultimate transplant that 1/3 of the Scatologic team faced, it was a noble act IMHO. At the risk of sounding obvious (because I've seen misconceptions arise) this only relates to the original BS release. Part of the reason I held back on not getting BS gold was simply because they could / should have been able to have this release out there on an ongoing basis. When they packed up shop I was rather annoyed that I missed out, but I was AWOL from here and JSII at the time so I was unaware of 'issues' that may (or may not) have made them rethink putting the time and effort into continuing production of BSG, the Scatbox etc.

Personally I think keeping these two things trickling out would be an easy way to make (small) amounts of money, but I understand the margins and profit for effort expended (especially with the somewhat volatile community) may simply not have been worth it at the time. That said, with the re-sourcing of moulds, the different ways carts can be produced, the renewed interest in the system, and the increase in perceived prices, now would be a great time to produce a lot of 500-1000 of these, sell at them a higher price than a 'standard' cart / peripheral, put a percentage of the profits toward diabetes research, and still walk away with a $30+ US profit per piece. Boom, there's $15-30K profit right there (yeah, it's all ideal if it works out perfectly, not so much if it doesn't).

- they've been caught auctioning copies of BS on eBay with another account (so much for blaming scalpers, heh?)

This sucks, especially for those who legit want multiple copies to play. I've heard that this happened numerous times, but I never bothered looking to see if it was a regular thing, the names of the ebay accounts etc. Have they ever responded to these instances?

Then again, it's their game to do with what they want, just as it's fine for us to criticise their practices.

- they spent years overhyping their game with outrageous claims, trademarking ThunderThis™ and ThunderThat™, and being agressive to others

We probably wouldn't be talking about it if they didn't, nor would the prices be beyond the $150 mark. It's their prerogative to do so or not.

As far as 'being aggressive', I can call it as I remember it. The team were blunt, called out factual errors, spoke their mind, and yes perhaps overhyped things, but hey - it was 'news' when the Jag's commercial tailspin accelerated. Plus, they engaged with fans online via newsgroups and forums - few other developers bothered or cared. This raised the profile amongst the fans. As far as aggressiveness goes, most of this perception was in their answers toward people who were bereft of facts or had poor logic and reasoning skills. I used to enjoy watching them rip into people who lacked the basic tenets of logical argument. About the time I got bored of the whole online Jag forum / newsgroup stuff (early / mid 2000s until about 5 years ago) I found that they were a bit more abrupt and sometimes rude. However, having to deal with the same stupidity, demands, entitledness (and sometimes hostile nature) of the Jag fan base for years and years, I don't necessarily blame them (although I always found one member of the team rarely if ever could concede they were even slightly wrong even if I could see he was from afar, which didn't help the whole 'them vs us' mentality that plagued the Jag scene forever).

 

The picture is pretty clear: all the reasons they gave for not rereleasing are just excuses. They actually don't want to rerelase Battlesphere, because the rarity and attention it gets as is strokes their (massive) ego. Apparently they didn't notice that outside of the hardcore fans, claiming you've made the most sought-after video game on the Atari Jaguar gets you about as much street cred as owning the largest collection of matchboxes in Austin, Texas.

This is simply conjecture. Sure, it's based on what has occurred over the years, but I very seriously doubt they sit at home revelling in their Jaguar infamy. It's a footnote, an interesting one for sure, but I doubt they really give it much of a thought these days. Except when they happen across threads like this and probably laugh.

Why don't they make more? My assertions are (a) they're done with it, (b) the margins vs the effort are so small, and © the Jag community is (somewhat, maybe not overall a true reflection) perceived as dismissive, entitled, and they some people don't like 4Play / Scatologic so why would they bother? Ego plays an inconsequential (albeit possibly present) impact on the situation. Where it possibly comes into play is the refusal to let others reproduce it under license (ostensibly due to quality control, or supply chain control, or whatever)...which I kind of agreed with ten years ago, but not now.

Why do I think this? Hypothetical - License it to *someone*, get them to produce the cart (or Scatbox), approve the product at their high standards, let it sell for $130 a piece, collect their $30-50 per piece for doing nothing, reseller donates a percentage to charity, sell hundreds of the products, profit, go on a holiday and sip cocktails with little umbrellas by the pool, be happy that a good thing has been done and the handful of Jag fans are happy and get to appreciate your product for what it is rather than a semi-mythical tchotchke that it currently is.

I could dream, but I'm in agreement that it's done, just for different reasons than some others who bring the online personas into it more than I do.

[LianneJaguar64]

It would be nice if the ROM had an official release, but like most ROMs for any system you can name, Google can find it.

 

Not sure why this is even an issue for anyone.

Would it work if you burnt the file to CD?

[Flojomojo]

Would it work if you burnt the file to CD?

On a Jaguar CD? No, not without being reworked.

[VladR]

...why hasn't it been ported/converted/remade for another platform, like PC or mobile? Something with a larger user base and a working network infrastructure?

Looks like you haven't ever browsed Steam's massive section on Space Simulators...

 

The sheer amount of quality games in this genre is mindblowing. While I haven't played BattleSphere, judging from YT videos, I would not have touched it on PC, even 25 yrs ago, let alone now...

 

 

I still, very much, applaud the dev team's technical achievement on jag!

[Flojomojo]

Oh, of course I have. But none are Battlesphere, and I admire its arcade-style simplicity and purity ....sort of. It would be very interesting to do a straight port with nothing but higher resolution and analog control, and see what the Steam reviewer peanut gallery would do to it.

[VladR]

Oh, of course I have. But none are Battlesphere, and I admire its arcade-style simplicity and purity ....sort of. It would be very interesting to do a straight port with nothing but higher resolution and analog control, and see what the Steam reviewer peanut gallery would do to it.

I think I finally get what you mean. Sort-of like all those oldschool pixelated retro games, but this would be old-school retro flatshaded/gourard arcade space shooter.

 

Run it at 4k resolution, play on 65" TV, it would look nice, smooth and sharp.

 

If it was multiplayer-only, you would not need any AI, literally just implement input, model few ships, and just host dogfights.

 

Probably could not charge more than $5 on Steam, though... Too much competition, too many sales, too much market saturation...