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New Genesis Flashback


jblenkle

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Yeah it does seem nitpicky regarding the use of actual cartridges and them perhaps not reading properly on the first try. Hell, I clean my Genesis carts all the time and I still sometimes have to try more than once or slightly lift up on a game or two for them to work on my actual Genesis hardware. The menu navigation does seem odd though. Why didn't they just use the d-pad for all navigation and then you have you use the Start button or A B C buttons to choose the option highlighted? Using the B and C buttons to move up and down the menu just seems all kinds of messed up to me.

 

I'm also disappointed that while mentioning that the emulation was bad with frame skipping apparent, nothing was mentioned regarding the sound, or how the games actually look through the HDMI, or if any of the carts they tried had specific issues...etc. They mention that it does read the carts and dump to RAM before playing, but how long a process is that? And they mention multiple instances of the game appearing to select once dumped. But they didn't state what differences if any there were between them? I'm guessing that since several of the games included both the Japanese original text and English...etc that perhaps the emulator and ROM dumping is able to pick up on that somehow and those are the different versions of the game that appear? If so, they would have discovered that if they had mentioned what the differences were.

 

Overall I understand their complaints, but they didn't even mention anything regarding the other features and experience with them and that too, is disappointing.

 

I agree that the menu system on both the Sega and Atari HD units takes some getting used to. There's a method to the madness, but it's not super intuitive. Part of that is tied to the extra features, like invoking the pop-up menu and what-not.

 

In terms of cartridge dumping, it's just a straight dump. There's no checking or other database like with some consoles. I will be testing it with a few of the cartridges that give Genesis 3, Nomad, and clone systems trouble.

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In terms of cartridge dumping, it's just a straight dump. There's no checking or other database like with some consoles. I will be testing it with a few of the cartridges that give Genesis 3, Nomad, and clone systems trouble.

 

Well of course he usual suspects that wouldn't surprise me as being problematic would be VR Racing, and Sonic & Knuckles. I suspect the flash carts aren't going to work due to the dumping nature of the Genny FB.

 

Also since the cart port allows it, have any import carts been tested? Essentially...is it region free so to speak? That could be a good point for selling as well.

 

And Streets of Rage 2 would be a good one to test in regards to multiple versions since that game has both the english and japanese text versions within the same rom. Curious if the multiple versions is actually the different region selections on the same ROM.

 

Any homebrew carts been tested or demoscene carts, like those that might use a flashcart that contains the game code on them instead of actual roms or eproms?

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I was also going to ask about flash carts, as -^Cro§Bow^- mentioned. The Retron 5 doesn't work with flash carts. I'm really interested in something that will work with my Mega Everdrive X5 if my stash of Genesis Model 2 consoles dies (or to help ensure that they don't) but the audio on some of the clones, like the Retro-Bit Trio, is just unbearably bad.

 

I wonder if the Everdrive, if it already had a game flashed to it, would load (pressing start immediately jumps into a game).

 

Also it's a shame some bad consoles got out. Unfortunately for AtGames a lot of retro gamers are going to say "oh typical AtGames" when they had a chance to really turn it around. Those reviews will never get updated and the console will get maligned.

Edited by derFunkenstein
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Can you be more specific as to what exact problems the "bad production run" caused? Was this the cause of the frame skipping?

 

OK, here's the deal

 

 

What they say is true, unfortunately. A bad production run got out to reviewers (including me). I'm trying to work with AtGames to get ahead of this, but I think the damage is already going to be done. AtGames is already working on the production fix, which may delay the target September release date.

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Can you be more specific as to what exact problems the "bad production run" caused? Was this the cause of the frame skipping?

 

 

There are a few key issues with the review units that are out there now. One, the controllers require two presses on each button and direction to "wake up" that button or direction. Once woken up, it's OK, but you shouldn't have to do that obviously between power cycles. Some games run at half speed or perform poorly. These and other things are all being addressed before this goes to full production (tracking down where the problems were introduced and addressing them), but it obviously doesn't help that the sample run for reviewers has those issues. I'll obviously let everyone know if for some reason a problem is NOT solved.

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Also it's a shame some bad consoles got out. Unfortunately for AtGames a lot of retro gamers are going to say "oh typical AtGames" when they had a chance to really turn it around. Those reviews will never get updated and the console will get maligned.

 

100%. I'm trying to get the PR firm to contact the reviewers and have them put a disclaimer in their reviews. They can obviously only cover what they have, but AtGames IS aware of the problem and working hard to fix the production issue, so certainly those reviews can at least potentially be revisited in the future when the final run is out there.

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I uploaded my video of the Sega Genesis Flashback HD

Thanks John for this! Good to know that my guess on VR Racing not working was correct. But SSF2 not working is a bit worrisome? Is there a limit to how large the Rom image can be that the Genesis FB can dump I wonder? John do you have an opened copy of Pier Solar for the Genesis you can test with it?

 

And I feel like I should send my copy of Escape 2042 for Bill or John to test as that home brew uses a flash cartridge for the stored rom that is on it. So while we know it won't work with an everdrive, it does make me wonder about home brews released on flash type carts.

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Unfortunately, I doubt the menu will be improved. Atgames should have had it so that the D-Pad navigates both the left Game Category menu and the right, Game icon menu, using A to go from left menu to right menu and B to go in reverse.

 

If Pier Solar works, I would be surprised, It is an 8MB cart, SSF2 is only 5MB. Unlike SSF2, the hardware quality of Pier Solar is crap. I assume that Sonic and Knuckles does not work either.

 

IJH's footage looks really choppy and his video is in 60fps.

Edited by Great Hierophant
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I'd like to know why Atgames keeps including those Hong Kong Original games that nobody wants to play (sorry if I insult any Mr. Balls fans out there, but it's honestly not that good). It seems like they're only there to make it look like the number of games the console has is larger than it really is (along with selling a console marketed as the "Genesis Flashback" with Master System and Game Gear games preloaded, but I'm a pretty big Phantasy Star fan so I'm not too bothered).

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QQ @Bill.

 

Given AtGames has been in the business of flashbacks for a while and at that it managed to get legal replica shells for the Atari 2600, CV, IntV and now Genesis does the MK comment that just the mold can set a project back 500K or more holds or not really?

 

I understand that if you want to have top of the class, super hard, super long longevity molds maybe we're in the 100s of K but I cannot fathom AtGames spending millions to get molds for their projects (the year they made the CV and IntV it would have been 1M just for the mold to the shells .... seems a little steep to me).

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My point was not about the particular molds for the Jag, but just that in general one can get reasonable molds for a lot less.

By the same token if I found a used Rolls Royce for say 100K, there's no way I can say I saved my "Uber-based" business 1M$ (as that is the price of a Rolls Royce) .... I can "Uber" around without a RR, it's not a requirement.

 

In the case of the CC the cost of the molds was 10K (or whereabouts) so that was indeed a good deal (I doubt even the AtGames molds can be cheaper than that) ... I only counter the point that the only acceptable solution was 500K molds, hence MK "saved" that much to the team.

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Gizmodo: I Tested Two Retro Consoles―One Good, One Hot Garbage

 

Besides the obligatory AtGames bashing ...

 

Unfortunately, Sega and Atari seem to have no quality control clause in these licenses they sell, and consequently, AT Games has a reputation for making some... not great consoles. So let’s start with the Sega Genesis Flashback, as its really, really bad.

 

there's this

But there’s a problem. See, AT Games elected to go with wireless controllers, while they handle well and have the more popular six-button Genesis layout, they’ve got some big problems that ruin the Flashback. First, the controllers require two AAA batteries to run and accessing the slot for the batteries requires a screwdriver. Second, and far worse, the controllers don’t work consistently. In my testing, it was always a tossup whether pressing a button would actually result in a corresponding action on screen. The Start and the C button were both pretty trustworthy, but every other button required repeated key smashes or brief and excruciating pauses.

 

Maybe they should include a little screwdriver with these things, like how IKEA gives you an Allen wrench in each flat pack. Every toy made for children requires a screwdriver for battery compartments nowadays.

 

They also think there's an SD card slot on the Atari console (there is not), so there's a little WTF from a supposedly hands-on review. That little dig about Pac-Man at the end is particularly annoying since there IS a nice Pac-Man on the handheld, which wasn't mentioned. It would be smart of AtGames to simplify the number of SKUs next time, if for no other reason than to prevent this kind of stupid confusion.

AT Games also provides wireless controllers for the Atari Flashback 8 Gold. This system can’t play old cartridges, but it can connect to a TV with an HDMI port churning out 720p games. As with the Genesis Flashback, the Atari system also has the cool ability to rewind and replay the last 6 seconds (nothing like watching a brutal Pitfall death over and over again), and there are even ports if you have old Atari controllers, as well as a SD card slot in case you want to shove more Atari games on the console. As it already has 120 games available you probably don’t actually need that SD card slot. This thing has all the good games like Frogger, Pitfall, Missile Command, and Yar’s Revenge. Notably absent is Pac-Man, presumably because Namco Bandai had no desire to license it for a $60 nostalgia bomb like the Atari Flashback 8 Gold.
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Quote:

AT Games also provides wireless controllers for the Atari Flashback 8 Gold. This system can’t play old cartridges, but it can connect to a TV with an HDMI port churning out 720p games. As with the Genesis Flashback, the Atari system also has the cool ability to rewind and replay the last 6 seconds (nothing like watching a brutal Pitfall death over and over again), and there are even ports if you have old Atari controllers, as well as a SD card slot in case you want to shove more Atari games on the console. As it already has 120 games available you probably don’t actually need that SD card slot. This thing has all the good games like Frogger, Pitfall, Missile Command, and Yar’s Revenge. Notably absent is Pac-Man, presumably because Namco_Bandai had no desire to license it for a $60 nostalgia bomb like the Atari Flashback 8 Gold.: End-Quote

...

i was stupid enough to, on my 11th or so birthday ask for a original Sega Flashback (the portable wasn't that bad, but the home version is a different story) to replace the portable version i got a year and 1/2 my siblings drowned. I sincerely regretted it, also, unlike they claim, the Sega can't rewind.

...

anyway, the new version is STILL gonna be an emulator based version, so make sure you get it from a place that accepts returns, as that $85 is likely gonna be better spent on a real Sega and most if not all the Phantasy star games or the Mortal combat for Genesis series.

Edited by TheTIGuy
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Are those bad reviews a result of the pre-prod issues Bill mentioned earlier or is it just lousy emulation?

 

At sega-16 they are not exactly enthused by it:

http://www.sega-16.com/forum/showthread.php?32401-New-At-Games-Sega-Genesis-Flashback-720p-HD-console

 

Ace took a jab at Bill too:

http://www.sega-16.com/forum/showthread.php?32401-New-At-Games-Sega-Genesis-Flashback-720p-HD-console&p=786128&viewfull=1#post786128

 

but a few reviewers seems to have gotten units that do work "correctly" (meaning sound is not as bad as the others seems to entail, what gives?)

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Are those bad reviews a result of the pre-prod issues Bill mentioned earlier or is it just lousy emulation?

 

At sega-16 they are not exactly enthused by it:

http://www.sega-16.com/forum/showthread.php?32401-New-At-Games-Sega-Genesis-Flashback-720p-HD-console

 

Ace took a jab at Bill too:

http://www.sega-16.com/forum/showthread.php?32401-New-At-Games-Sega-Genesis-Flashback-720p-HD-console&p=786128&viewfull=1#post786128

 

but a few reviewers seems to have gotten units that do work "correctly" (meaning sound is not as bad as the others seems to entail, what gives?)

 

The review units that went out are bad, i.e., every single unit out in the wild (some people may not be as careful with the review process). A second, corrected run will be made.

 

As for taking a jab at me, so be it. There IS a problem and it is being fixed as we speak. Those are all facts. The proof will be in the second batch of review units.

Edited by Bill Loguidice
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The review units that went out are bad, i.e., every single unit out in the wild (some people may not be as careful with the review process). A second, corrected run will be made.

...

That is unfortunate on oh so many levels.

First the most obvious is bad for AtGames that now is in damage control, at least the fault was found before too late, hopefully the HW is plenty capable of run everything at the right speed, with the right pitch and stutter free (which in HDMI world means though accelerating ever so slightly the master clock of the emulated system).

 

The second and most pernicious for me has to do with the reputation of some YT content creators .... a couple of them actually were positively impressed by the product (which is good) but saw none of the faults .... how is that even possible? Considering they call themselves retro-this-expert retro-that-expert it really recast their so called "expertise" into a whole new light.

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That is unfortunate on oh so many levels.

First the most obvious is bad for AtGames that now is in damage control, at least the fault was found before too late, hopefully the HW is plenty capable of run everything at the right speed, with the right pitch and stutter free (which in HDMI world means though accelerating ever so slightly the master clock pf the emulated system).

 

The second most pernicious has now got to do with the rep of some YT content creators .... a couple of them actually were positively impressed by the product and saw none of the faults .... how is that even possible? Considering they call themselves retro-this-expert retro-that-expert it really recast their so called "expertise" into a whole new light.

 

To be fair to the reviewers, they could have possibly played the games that weren't jacked up on the hardware and not any of the ones that were. There were a small percentage that were fine.

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tumblr_otgi1seybC1rben3uo1_540.jpg

 

Beautiful dog.

 

Edit: I've got a couple of these Sega things in my closet (Christmas gifts), is this one supposed to be different somehow, or?

 

Don't they release one every year or two? I swear the local discount stores are filled with them...

Edited by Good_Times
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