ijor Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 I'm used to see all sort of hidden (or not so hidden) dedication messages to crackers, pirates, etc. But this one I didn't note before: ATARI HLS COPY PROTECTION (TK 0 AND 39) ... WE BEAT HAPPY TO DEATH! This is found, among others, on the Mindscape release of Gauntlet. Note that this doesn't come from the publisher or the developer, it's a signature from the company that implemented the copy protection. Btw, this protection defeated the Happy, but only temporarily until they released an update. 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mclaneinc Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 Never bait a hacker / cracker, you will lose almost always A hacker or in this case a hardware writing device maker with a challenge is a person possessed.. I remember the guy on the Xbox360 scene (C64eva I think was his name) who rewrote a Liteon DVD Burner bios so it could write ever so slightly longer allowing copy images to be written to real disks. These guys are like Terminators, they never give up 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DjayBee Posted June 18, 2017 Share Posted June 18, 2017 (edited) Where/how did you find this message? I searched for it on the ATR, the ATX and in RAM while it was running. I want to search if other titles contain the same or a similar message because this copy protection is used by several games and publishers (i.e. Broderbund, Epyx and Accolade). Edited June 18, 2017 by DjayBee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ijor Posted June 19, 2017 Author Share Posted June 19, 2017 You won't find it on ATR or (standard) ATX images. This is part of a duplicator marking signature. It is some kind of metadata, usually recorded on track 40 (the 41th track). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Nezgar Posted June 19, 2017 Share Posted June 19, 2017 Now we have to re-do all the software preservation initiative to capture track -1 and 40 of all commercial disks! Do you know what the specific protection scheme was that was used that temporarily foiled happy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rybags Posted June 19, 2017 Share Posted June 19, 2017 Alternate Reality has scrolly message (in the backup utility?) that describes some of the protection and encryption employed. Even The Dungeon has a message to pirates. I tried to crack it (from a non-complete copy), got to about the second or third round of decryption and that was about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ijor Posted June 19, 2017 Author Share Posted June 19, 2017 Now we have to re-do all the software preservation initiative to capture track -1 and 40 of all commercial disks! Do you know what the specific protection scheme was that was used that temporarily foiled happy? Many raw images at the initiative already include the track 40. It depends on the user and the default configuration of the software. Kryoflux software images a couple of extra tracks by default. SCP software usually doesn't and the user has to include them specifically. I already commented more than once that people should do it. Note that only a small fraction of the Atari 8-bit disks have those duplicator records. The mentioned protection has 20 sectors on track 39. The "standard" happy software can produce a maximum of 19 sectors per track, because normally you can't fit more. But these aren't really full 20 sectors, there is one short/overlapped sector. So the layout can be produced with the 1050 hardware once the software/firmware has the right smartness. Other enhancements, including some 810 happy versions, could reduce the rotation speed to include 20 (or even more) full sectors. But this is not very reliably, and in almost every case it won't reproduce the original track layout anyway. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sack-c0s Posted June 19, 2017 Share Posted June 19, 2017 Never bait a hacker / cracker, you will lose almost always A hacker or in this case a hardware writing device maker with a challenge is a person possessed.. I remember the guy on the Xbox360 scene (C64eva I think was his name) who rewrote a Liteon DVD Burner bios so it could write ever so slightly longer allowing copy images to be written to real disks. These guys are like Terminators, they never give up That and inevitably the comment is embedded very close to the actual copy protection so you are effectively doing half the job for the cracker That said, I did once find a game whose protection was in a binary file called 'copyProtection'.... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mclaneinc Posted June 19, 2017 Share Posted June 19, 2017 Lol.........All you need was another file called 'nothingtoseehere' Some programmers who don't have the hacker mentality often have the grey matter but bugger all common sense Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DjayBee Posted June 19, 2017 Share Posted June 19, 2017 You won't find it on ATR or (standard) ATX images. This is part of a duplicator marking signature. It is some kind of metadata, usually recorded on track 40 (the 41th track). If you want to search yourself for more of these messages: These titles share the same protection: Bop'n Wrestle (1986)(Mindscape)(US)(Side A) Boulder Dash Construction Kit (1986)(Epyx)(US) Gauntlet (1988)(Mindscape)(US)(Side A)[!][req 64K] Gauntlet - The Deeper Dungeons (198x)(Mindscape)(US)[bASIC][req 64K] Infiltrator (1986)(Mindscape)(US)(Side A)[req 64K] Lode Runner (1983)(Broderbund Software)(US)[a] Trailblazer (1986)(Mindscape)(US) These titles are similar: Ace of Aces (1987)(Accolade)(US)[a1][!][req 64K] Ace of Aces (1987)(Accolade)(US)[req 64K] World Karate Championship (1986)(Epyx)(US) And these titles use the same disk format but do not use the protection on track 1: Eidolon, The (1985)(Epyx)(US)[!][req 64K] Eidolon, The v1.1 (1985)(Epyx)(US)[p][req 64K] Koronis Rift v1.1 (1985)(Epyx)(US)[a][p] Koronis Rift v3.0 (1985)(Epyx)(US)[p] Lode Runner's Rescue (1985)(Synapse Software)(US)(Side A)[!] Temple of Apshai Trilogy (1985)(Epyx)(US) 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ijor Posted June 22, 2017 Author Share Posted June 22, 2017 If you want to search yourself for more of these messages: ... I don't have raw dumps for all of those, but so far found only Lode Runner's Rescue having the same dedication message. These duplication signatures seem to depend more on the publisher and the date, than the actual protection. Trailblazer has almost the same marking but without the dedication message. And Boulder Dash Construction Kit, with the same protection, doesn't seem to have any duplication signature at all. At least in the copies I've seen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ijor Posted June 22, 2017 Author Share Posted June 22, 2017 Some programmers who don't have the hacker mentality often have the grey matter but bugger all common sense But several publishers were smart enough and eventually hired (ex) hackers to do the work. This was more common on the 16-bit and later platforms. And sometimes they embedded greetings to his ex fellows. Sometimes they included some kind of questionnaire: "if you crack this program, write me and please tell me how much time, how difficult, etc ..." But this case is quite different. It doesn't address the hacker or the cracker, but the manufacturer of a copier. Hackers probably didn't even where aware of this message as they have no way to see it. Not completely sure that even Mr Adams (Happy owner and developer) received the message. LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryan Posted June 22, 2017 Share Posted June 22, 2017 Copy protection is certainly interesting on the A8, but on the C64 it was absolutely nuts because you had software access to every aspect of the drive. You could write any kind of crazy stuff all over the disk, not just in the normal track space. Of course, this meant you could outwit your disk duplication/mastering hardware too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tschak909 Posted June 22, 2017 Share Posted June 22, 2017 Well, that was one of the many reasons that 99.99999% of all Commodore 64 owners had ONE 1541 drive, at least....The copy protections wouldn't run on anything else... self modifying decryption code running on the drive, overlapping data on tracks, overlapping sectors, unbelievably weak sectors. I believe some protections would attempt to brick the drive mechanics if things weren't exactly right.... brutal. -Thom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GlowingGhoul Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 Well, that was one of the many reasons that 99.99999% of all Commodore 64 owners had ONE 1541 drive, at least....The copy protections wouldn't run on anything else... self modifying decryption code running on the drive, overlapping data on tracks, overlapping sectors, unbelievably weak sectors. I believe some protections would attempt to brick the drive mechanics if things weren't exactly right.... brutal. -Thom And yet, there always seemed to be more C64 pirated disks floating around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryan Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 And yet, there always seemed to be more C64 pirated disks floating around. Well, they could copy most stuff with software tools that reprogrammed the drive. We usually had to wait for someone to crack stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mclaneinc Posted June 24, 2017 Share Posted June 24, 2017 But several publishers were smart enough and eventually hired (ex) hackers to do the work. This was more common on the 16-bit and later platforms. And sometimes they embedded greetings to his ex fellows. Sometimes they included some kind of questionnaire: "if you crack this program, write me and please tell me how much time, how difficult, etc ..." But this case is quite different. It doesn't address the hacker or the cracker, but the manufacturer of a copier. Hackers probably didn't even where aware of this message as they have no way to see it. Not completely sure that even Mr Adams (Happy owner and developer) received the message. LOL I doubt Scots brother did see it as he was too busy rolling in the cash..Well that was until after the Discovery cart, then it all seemed to just vanish.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mclaneinc Posted June 24, 2017 Share Posted June 24, 2017 And yet, there always seemed to be more C64 pirated disks floating around. The C64 scene was and is more open as it still survives till today with daily recracks, the Atari, not so much, different people, different style. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tschak909 Posted June 24, 2017 Share Posted June 24, 2017 Boy, isn't that the truth, every community is different. (I'm currently being roasted in the ColecoVision community here, because...shocker of all shocker... I asked if I could get ROM dumps with physical cartridges I wanted to buy, and from that point on was treated terrible in the most passive aggressive sense, and it's still going on.) -Thom 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mclaneinc Posted June 24, 2017 Share Posted June 24, 2017 Amazing isn't it....And filled with hypocrites too... Also they tend to very clique based, little keyboard Rambo's... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MEtalGuy66 Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 Boy, isn't that the truth, every community is different. (I'm currently being roasted in the ColecoVision community here, because...shocker of all shocker... I asked if I could get ROM dumps with physical cartridges I wanted to buy, and from that point on was treated terrible in the most passive aggressive sense, and it's still going on.) -Thom I hate that.. What thread is it in? I will come join the flame war on your side.. I want a shirt that says "You made me a PIRATE when you tried to CHARGE MONEY for INFORMATION!" fuck all IPR.. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mclaneinc Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 (edited) Just have a look in the coleco / adam forum. its near the top probably with me as last post...just showing my support for one of our own.. For what Thom wants to do I'd feel almost privileged someone wanted to so something so interesting with my software..AND offer money.... Edited June 25, 2017 by Mclaneinc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tschak909 Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 http://atariage.com/forums/topic/266505-where-do-i-purchase-team-pixelboy-games/?p=3790065 -Thom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Like us on Facebook
Follow us on Twitter
AtariAge on Instagram
Watch us on YouTube
Chat on Discord
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.