Dastari Creel Posted July 6, 2017 Share Posted July 6, 2017 The schematics for the original Odyssey are available online as are the schematics for the Oydssey2. However, I can't find schematics for the Odyssey 100-5000 systems. I'm not sure if my google fu is failing me or if this information really has been lost. If you have any knowledge on where any of these might be found then please let me know. I'm planning on starting several projects with the Odyssey systems and while the original machine should keep me busy for a while, I figured that I should probably think ahead to see what's available for the dedicated machines. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dastari Creel Posted July 8, 2017 Author Share Posted July 8, 2017 So, in case anyone is curious about this. I've done a little research, and discovered the actual Magnavox model numbers for the Odysseys 100, 200, & 300. This information isn't contained on any of the websites that talk about these system. These model numbers are: 100: YF7010-ORF1 200: YF7015-WHF1 300: BG7500-YE01 That allowed me to do a web search and discover the schematics for the 100 and 200 (had to pay for it). Unfortunately the scans were too wide for a single page, so they were each scanned as two pages. The problem is that whoever scanned them didn't ensure that there was overlap in the middle, so each of them is actually missing a portion of information in the middle. The schematic portion of the 100 is fine, but the troubleshooting data is missing quite a few words in the middle of sentences and some parts information. For the 200, I'm missing a portion of the schematic, which is kind of a problem. For the 300, a nice person on Facebook sent me some photos of a schematic that he's apparently had for years. He doesn't remember where he got them from, but the person who took those pictures at least understood about having overlap. I can provide a link to those below for anyone curious: http://42cast.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/19944203_10154920137493924_4516805364113977292_o.jpg http://42cast.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/19702327_10154920140058924_7604870395142402759_n.jpg Needless to say, I'll continue looking for better images, especially since I'll want to share these on my website, but for now these are adequate. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+pboland Posted July 9, 2017 Share Posted July 9, 2017 So, in case anyone is curious about this. I've done a little research, and discovered the actual Magnavox model numbers for the Odysseys 100, 200, & 300. This information isn't contained on any of the websites that talk about these system. These model numbers are: 100: YF7010-ORF1 200: YF7015-WHF1 300: BG7500-YE01 That allowed me to do a web search and discover the schematics for the 100 and 200 (had to pay for it). Unfortunately the scans were too wide for a single page, so they were each scanned as two pages. The problem is that whoever scanned them didn't ensure that there was overlap in the middle, so each of them is actually missing a portion of information in the middle. The schematic portion of the 100 is fine, but the troubleshooting data is missing quite a few words in the middle of sentences and some parts information. For the 200, I'm missing a portion of the schematic, which is kind of a problem. For the 300, a nice person on Facebook sent me some photos of a schematic that he's apparently had for years. He doesn't remember where he got them from, but the person who took those pictures at least understood about having overlap. I can provide a link to those below for anyone curious: http://42cast.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/19944203_10154920137493924_4516805364113977292_o.jpg http://42cast.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/19702327_10154920140058924_7604870395142402759_n.jpg Needless to say, I'll continue looking for better images, especially since I'll want to share these on my website, but for now these are adequate. You might want to look for a out of print book called: How To Repair Video Game By Robert Goodman Copyright © 1978 by TAB BOOKS I think it contains most of what you are looking for. I think I have the book but it's packed away somewhere. I think it covered many of the Odysseys systems and even had part lists. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dastari Creel Posted July 9, 2017 Author Share Posted July 9, 2017 You might want to look for a out of print book called: How To Repair Video Game By Robert Goodman Copyright © 1978 by TAB BOOKS I think it contains most of what you are looking for. I think I have the book but it's packed away somewhere. I think it covered many of the Odysseys systems and even had part lists. Thanks, I'll definitely give this a look. I'm an electrical engineer by trade, but I haven't done board level electronics since college. I work on large scale industrial control systems, so this is a way for me to get back to my roots. One thing that I will note. I have a website in progress right now where I plan on storing all of the technical information that I dig up. I realize that the later systems are more extensively covered, mostly because interest in the early consoles is low. Still, I feel that someone at some point will be interested in either repairing or doing a mod project on these early systems, so I'd like the process to be easier for them when they're trying to look up info on these systems. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BassGuitari Posted July 9, 2017 Share Posted July 9, 2017 I have a website in progress right now where I plan on storing all of the technical information that I dig up. I realize that the later systems are more extensively covered, mostly because interest in the early consoles is low. Still, I feel that someone at some point will be interested in either repairing or doing a mod project on these early systems, so I'd like the process to be easier for them when they're trying to look up info on these systems. Any preservation is good preservation. Interest in, say, Odyssey dedicated consoles may be low (a shame; I find them really fun. And when I demo my Odyssey 100 or 500 at Midwest Gaming Classic, people get a kick out of the English control and variable settings. "I didn't know Pong could do that!"), but I think there will always be some interest, and at some point, this stuff just isn't going to work anymore. At least with technical information like this, the few and the proud enthusiasts of the Super Systems of The Seventies will be able to resurrect them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dastari Creel Posted July 9, 2017 Author Share Posted July 9, 2017 Any preservation is good preservation. Interest in, say, Odyssey dedicated consoles may be low (a shame; I find them really fun. And when I demo my Odyssey 100 or 500 at Midwest Gaming Classic, people get a kick out of the English control and variable settings. "I didn't know Pong could do that!"), but I think there will always be some interest, and at some point, this stuff just isn't going to work anymore. At least with technical information like this, the few and the proud enthusiasts of the Super Systems of The Seventies will be able to resurrect them. That's pretty much my point of view as well. Btw, what's the Magnavox model number for the 500? It's usually printed on the underside of the console. I can probably get my hands on the schematic with that piece of information. I currently own a 100 and 200 and plan to eventually get all of them, but it will definitely save me time in getting the schematics if a current owner can give me the model number. Besides the technical side, I'm fascinated by the history of video games. I've read Leonard Herman's history of video games as well as books on the history of Atari and Nintendo as well as Ralph Baer's biography about his work with video games. There are so many gaps, though. Even with Magnavox we have a fairly decent amount of information of Baer's work at Sanders and the deal with Magnavox for getting the first Odyssey made, but we have almost no information about the Magnavox side of things. We know that they changed the designs somewhat because Baer mentioned that the idea of using cards to change gameplay was a genius move that he wouldn't have thought of. So who was the engineer who came up with that idea? Who designed the box art and overlay art? Why did Magnavox make the decisions that it did? Baer's story shows increasing frustration with how much he was "shut out" of Magnavox's decision making both technically and marketing wise, so there's very little information that he gives after the Odyssey got really going. I feel like now is the time to strike with trying to research that kind of information because we've probably already lost a lot of people in the past 45 years who could have given a lot of information about all of this, but some should still be around. If we wait much longer there won't be much of anything. With this being my first journalistic project I have no idea if I'll be able to succeed, but I've at least started the slow process of trying to see if I can find anyone from Magnavox who worked on any of the Odyssey systems in any capacity to see if I can capture that part of the story of video game history. The confluence of those two endeavors - technical and historical - would be if I can find any info on the Odyssey 5000. There's a little on pong-story and there's one known picture of the Odyssey 5000 prototype, but beyond that we know nothing. It'd be great if I could learn more about that machine especially if there's a schematic of the prototype floating around somewhere. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BassGuitari Posted July 10, 2017 Share Posted July 10, 2017 That's pretty much my point of view as well. Btw, what's the Magnavox model number for the 500? It's usually printed on the underside of the console. I can actually do you one better. Odyssey 400: BG7516-WHO1 Odyssey 500: BG7520-CHO1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slydc Posted July 10, 2017 Share Posted July 10, 2017 I have all the Magnavox service manuals you're looking for as i have acquired them about 3 months ago. And as pboland mentioned, you can get all the Magnavox service manuals in the book: "How to repair video games", like on Upay: http://www.ebay.ca/itm/How-to-Repair-Video-Games-Goodman-/370276255664?hash=item56362f47b0:g:QOIAAMXQC-tTDVur I will scan all the Magnavox service manuals soon and upload them on www.archive.org so that everyone can get a copy. Both Odyssey 100 & 200 are combined in the same service manual as YF7010 (Ody100) and YF7015 (Ody200), after it is the BG7500 (Ody300), BG7516 (Ody400), BG7520 (Ody500), BH7510 (Ody2000), BH7514 (Ody3000) and finally BH7511 (Ody4000). As for the Odyssey 5000, I know a prototype exist as M.Baer saw it and tested it, which this console had a MM57106 plus a Signetics MUGS-1 which had 2 games inside (Tank & Helicopter). But trying to find a schematic of the Odyssey 5000, i would say: Good Luck! =) I have the pinout of the MM57106 (MM57186 in Europe) somewhere in my personal notes, but for the MUGS-1...that's a mystery to all of us! And if this interest anyone, i have a blog (http://discreteconsoles.blogspot.ca/) which features how to A/V mod a Odyssey 100/200/400/500. And it's very, very easy to do! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dastari Creel Posted July 10, 2017 Author Share Posted July 10, 2017 (edited) I have all the Magnavox service manuals you're looking for as i have acquired them about 3 months ago. And as pboland mentioned, you can get all the Magnavox service manuals in the book: "How to repair video games", like on Upay: http://www.ebay.ca/itm/How-to-Repair-Video-Games-Goodman-/370276255664?hash=item56362f47b0:g:QOIAAMXQC-tTDVur I will scan all the Magnavox service manuals soon and upload them on www.archive.org so that everyone can get a copy. Both Odyssey 100 & 200 are combined in the same service manual as YF7010 (Ody100) and YF7015 (Ody200), after it is the BG7500 (Ody300), BG7516 (Ody400), BG7520 (Ody500), BH7510 (Ody2000), BH7514 (Ody3000) and finally BH7511 (Ody4000). As for the Odyssey 5000, I know a prototype exist as M.Baer saw it and tested it, which this console had a MM57106 plus a Signetics MUGS-1 which had 2 games inside (Tank & Helicopter). But trying to find a schematic of the Odyssey 5000, i would say: Good Luck! =) I have the pinout of the MM57106 (MM57186 in Europe) somewhere in my personal notes, but for the MUGS-1...that's a mystery to all of us! And if this interest anyone, i have a blog (http://discreteconsoles.blogspot.ca/) which features how to A/V mod a Odyssey 100/200/400/500. And it's very, very easy to do! Thank you! That will be a huge help, and thank you for the A/V mod info as well. That was going to be one of the projects that I wanted to undertake. I realize that the details of the Odyssey 5000 have probably been lost to the mists of time, but I might as well see what I can find. Even if no information exists it might be interesting if I can find one of the engineers who worked on it. For anyone interested, I'm also interested in compiling the details of the other Gen 1 consoles, but I thought that I'd start with the Odyssey, since Magnavox was the first company in the business. Once I'm doing there I'll move on to Coleco and so on until I've learned whatever I can about the first gen consoles and move on to the second. I think the third generation onward is fairly well documented, but we'll see what happens if I ever get past that point. Edit: I just checked out the archive.org website. Someone claims to have uploaded the Odyssey 100 service manual, but actually it's just the Ifixit.com "Odyssey 100" teardown document. I looked at some of the Odyssey instruction manuals that they have there, and they're scanned in as jpegs. Will that site take pdfs as well? It'd be nice if they were saved as high resolution pdfs to make them easier to use. Edited July 10, 2017 by Dastari Creel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BassGuitari Posted July 10, 2017 Share Posted July 10, 2017 Speaking of Odyssey and technical matters, I set up my Odyssey 400 last night after I got it out to take a peek at the model number for my earlier post. It had been years since I hooked it up and I remembered having some issues with it, where I couldn't get the ball to serve or something (which is weird since the serve is automatic on the 400), so I figured as long as I had it out, I'd poke around under the hood a little bit.After having to adjust the horizontal hold to unscramble the game picture, I found some odd behavior that only seems to affect Hockey. Occasionally the ball will pass through the front of the left paddle(s) and bounce back out of the goal, unable to score; the back/left side of the left paddles can hit the ball, but not the right side. Paddle, ball, and goal behavior and scoring on the right side appears normal. It seems like it's combining the Hockey playfield with the game characteristics of Handball (ball can only be hit from left side of either paddle and will bounce back against the left edge of the screen if forced through the wall). Also IIRC--it was late and I was a little groggy when I was testing this, so I'll double check later--when this behavior happens, the player/reset switch either doesn't reset the score, or simply doesn't display the "0-0" that indicates the initialization of a new game.Tennis and Handball appear unaffected.It seems to happen more often when I power the Odyssey on while the player switch is set to 4; it seems to like being powered on at 2 better, and then being set to 4 if so desired. Also, when I set the console to 2 players--okay, paddles --and power it on, the game begins immediately with a score of 1-0, rather than "booting" to W-W and awaiting a reset like when it's set to 4 players; the player/reset switch resets the score as expected. Is that normal?Now, all this only happens sometimes, and the Odyssey (specifically Hockey) behaves normally other times. Often enough, though, and it can happen in the middle of a game in progress, which would be really annoying if a companion and I were actually playing a game (one of the few instances I can imagine where the Odyssey 100/200's mechanical sliders would actually be a benefit!). All the components on the board look good--no leaky caps or corrosion or anything like that, apart from the battery compartment, which I just removed and discarded since I always use an AC adapter for Odyssey, and it was shot anyway.I think I've narrowed it down to the game select switch, since something in there seems to be trying to combine Handball and Hockey--might just need a little cleaning? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+pboland Posted July 10, 2017 Share Posted July 10, 2017 As for the Odyssey 5000, I know a prototype exist as M.Baer saw it and tested it, which this console had a MM57106 plus a Signetics MUGS-1 which had 2 games inside (Tank & Helicopter). But trying to find a schematic of the Odyssey 5000, i would say: Good Luck! =) I think some would consider the Odyssey 5000 the holy grail of the dedicated consoles. It looks like your avatar is a screen shot of the OD5000. The closest I've ever gotten to an OD5000 was this picture I found in an old electronics magazine: I think it's obvious to see were the styling of the Odyssey^2 came from. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BassGuitari Posted July 10, 2017 Share Posted July 10, 2017 I think some would consider the Odyssey 5000 the holy grail of the dedicated consoles. It looks like your avatar is a screen shot of the OD5000. The closest I've ever gotten to an OD5000 was this picture I found in an old electronics magazine: I think it's obvious to see were the styling of the Odyssey^2 came from. How many prototypes even were there? And is the one pictured even functional or just a mockup? What would the front panel of the console be used for, if not a keyboard? Can't really tell from the pic. Were the Odyssey 5000 and Odyssey 2 developed concurrently, or did Magnavox see the Fairchild, Atari, and Bally systems and decide they needed a cartridge-programmable system instead and scrap the 5000 and start from scratch? So many questions. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dastari Creel Posted July 10, 2017 Author Share Posted July 10, 2017 I think some would consider the Odyssey 5000 the holy grail of the dedicated consoles. It looks like your avatar is a screen shot of the OD5000. The closest I've ever gotten to an OD5000 was this picture I found in an old electronics magazine: Odyssey-5000.jpg I think it's obvious to see were the styling of the Odyssey^2 came from. I found that picture on an old thread of Atariage from years ago, and it's what inspired me to think that maybe there's some piece of information out there that isn't well known yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dastari Creel Posted July 10, 2017 Author Share Posted July 10, 2017 (edited) How many prototypes even were there? And is the one pictured even functional or just a mockup? What would the front panel of the console be used for, if not a keyboard? Can't really tell from the pic. Were the Odyssey 5000 and Odyssey 2 developed concurrently, or did Magnavox see the Fairchild, Atari, and Bally systems and decide they needed a cartridge-programmable system instead and scrap the 5000 and start from scratch? So many questions. I'm actually really surprised that no one seems to have ever wanted to do a documentary on Magnavox's foray into the gaming industry to ask questions just like this. Still, no time like the present to start asking, right? And all of this is starting to get me really excited about getting the vgarchive up and running, but have to wait for my designer to finish my logo and web banner before I debut it. Edited July 10, 2017 by Dastari Creel 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BassGuitari Posted July 10, 2017 Share Posted July 10, 2017 I think some would consider the Odyssey 5000 the holy grail of the dedicated consoles. I think mine would actually be the Atari Tank II, but the Odyssey 5000 would be up there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+pboland Posted July 10, 2017 Share Posted July 10, 2017 How many prototypes even were there? And is the one pictured even functional or just a mockup? What would the front panel of the console be used for, if not a keyboard? Can't really tell from the pic. Were the Odyssey 5000 and Odyssey 2 developed concurrently, or did Magnavox see the Fairchild, Atari, and Bally systems and decide they needed a cartridge-programmable system instead and scrap the 5000 and start from scratch? So many questions. The front panel is were the controllers are stored when not in use. Kind of like the Colecovision. The four controllers sit in those wells. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+pboland Posted July 10, 2017 Share Posted July 10, 2017 I found that picture on an old thread of Atariage from years ago, and it's what inspired me to think that maybe there's some piece of information out there that isn't well known yet. As far as I know it is the only known picture of it. If you do a google search it still doesn't come up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dastari Creel Posted July 10, 2017 Author Share Posted July 10, 2017 As far as I know it is the only known picture of it. If you do a google search it still doesn't come up. Google isn't perfect, as I've found with these Odyssey schematics, but I wasn't even talking about online. There may be some more information sitting in the attics of ex-employees, vendors, collectors, etc. The question is if I can find the people I need to find to ask the questions. That being said, do you know what issue of what magazine that you found that picture in? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slydc Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 Hi again folks, @Dastari Creel: Thanks! =) I hope that you have 20 years to spare to know everything about Gen 1 consoles because i've been gathering information about the 1st Generation (Pong consoles, Pong systems, dedicated consoles, etc..) and i've still have some unanswered questions. If you check on archive.org, there is a section called "Download Options" and you can download in PDF or even in Torrent (as others formats). @pboland: Flashback 7 years ago to this: http://atariage.com/forums/topic/168304-the-little-brother-of-the-intellivision-unisonic-champion-2711/ If anyone clicks on the link, i've wrote all the information i had about the Magnavox Odyssey 5000 back then and here's some new information i've found in the last 7 years: The Odyssey 5000 was previously called the Odyssey 4000! Really! But it's number model was BH7530 (the actual Odyssey 4000 released model is BH7511) ans was to be sold under $100 in 1977. Check out "Video games" book by Len Buckwalter at page 140 as the games describes are exactly the same games for the Odyssey 5000. In the book "The Personnal Electronics Buyer's Guide" by Charles & Roger J. Sippl on page 84, it also mentions that the Odyssey 5000 had 4-players capability and finally in "Weekly Television digest with consumer electronics Vol.17 part 2 on page 31, it mentions that the Odyssey 5000 was FCC approved! So this proves that at least one prototype exists and i'm betting that the person who tested for FCC approval was an engineer at Sanders Associates since M.Baer did see the game console on September 7-8 1977 (at Sanders of course). For reading (or download) the book by Len Buckwalter, go here: https://archive.org/details/VideoGames_201704 and another great book that i was looking for the past 12 years and finally discovered last night(!) that it was scanned on archive.org by the same guy, the book: Gametronics Proceedings: https://archive.org/details/GamtronicsProceedings This is a must read folks! It has so many historical references and pictures. Same as the book by Len Buckwalter, this one too is a must read if you wanna learn about the 1st Gen (and a bit of the 2nd Gen also). @BassGuiteri: These old game consoles (100, 200, 400 and 500 - not the 300 since it has a dedicated AY-3-8500-1 chip) can jitter, ball serve not functioning, etc...as the components are getting old but usually, a good cleaning corrects 75% of most "bad behaviors". And finally, just for fun, some people were looking for information regarding the Odyssey 5000 almost 10 years ago: http://videopac.nl/forum/index.php?topic=361.0 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dastari Creel Posted July 11, 2017 Author Share Posted July 11, 2017 I think mine would actually be the Atari Tank II, but the Odyssey 5000 would be up there. Excuse my ignorance, but what is Atari Tank II? It looks like it's a dedicated console to play a Tank game similar to Combat. Was there an original Tank console? All that I can find for Atari dedicated consoles is Home Pong, so I'm a little confused. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slydc Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 (edited) Damn my %??&&*? computer!!! (Yes, it's a piece of junk) I had a big text all typed then the computer froze and closed firefox, so all the text i've typed is gone. But they say a picture is worth a thousand word, so here's 2,000 words...LOL! Atari Tank I (was going to be sold by Sears): https://ibb.co/nouw9a And Atari Tank II: https://ibb.co/m5ZA2v And while at it, another 1,00 words: https://ibb.co/iRva2v And please no TANK very much!! Edited July 11, 2017 by slydc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dastari Creel Posted July 12, 2017 Author Share Posted July 12, 2017 Damn my %??&&*? computer!!! (Yes, it's a piece of junk) I had a big text all typed then the computer froze and closed firefox, so all the text i've typed is gone. But they say a picture is worth a thousand word, so here's 2,000 words...LOL! Atari Tank I (was going to be sold by Sears): https://ibb.co/nouw9a And Atari Tank II: https://ibb.co/m5ZA2v And while at it, another 1,00 words: https://ibb.co/iRva2v And please no TANK very much!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dastari Creel Posted July 12, 2017 Author Share Posted July 12, 2017 So I take it that neither one got made. What happened? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BassGuitari Posted July 12, 2017 Share Posted July 12, 2017 So I take it that neither one got made. What happened? Presumably, the Video Computer System. (Honestly, I'm not sure.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dastari Creel Posted July 12, 2017 Author Share Posted July 12, 2017 Presumably, the Video Computer System. (Honestly, I'm not sure.) That makes sense for Tank II, but presumably Tank was earlier, so I wonder why that one was scrapped. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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