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Will the NES console play Famicom titles, same powerpad


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1. Will the NES play Famicom power pad titles with cart adapter?

2. If you buy one power pad activity mat can you use it on the NES to play both NES and Famicom power pad games? i.e., there are 11 power pad titles combined, can you play all of them on the NES with the same power pad?

3. If no to #2, if you buy the Famicom and both US and Japanese power pad, can you play all 11 games?

4. If this is all nonsense, is there a simpler way than buying both consoles, both pads and all 11 carts ...or two different sd multicarts?

 

Thanks

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I have a powerpad but no jp titles to test with. What are the 11?

Easier to just link to the info. See "Compatible Games" section.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power_Pad

 

You can use a cart adapter on the NES for Famicom games, you may even be able to play Famicom games on an NES using a programmable ROM megacart of some sort, but it sounds like on the Famicom the pad is different and uses an expansion port with more pins, so I don't think the Famicom ROM on the NES would understand the NES powerpad input, unless there is some kind of pad adapter. Now the Famicom has both the controller port and the expansion port, so it seems like with a cart adapter or the programmable ROM megacart, there is a possibility if you have both pad to play all 11 games on one system. However, info on this is lacking so this is all speculation. I am wanting to know if there is a way to get everything with one console and possibly one pad. BTW, I have read from several sources thatthere are no NES/FC controller adapters for emulators that work with power pads, although I have found nothing on if there is one for the FC expansion port that would work on an emulator with the game ROM, but I doubt they would make an adapter specifically for the FC expansion port.

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PowerPad and Zapper both use Player 2 D3 and D4 inputs.

 

NES Vaus uses Player 2 D3 and D4 inputs. Famicom Vaus uses Player 1 and Player 2 D1 inputs.

 

Famicom games use Player 1 and Player 2 D1 inputs as auxillary controllers as well as Player 3 and Player 4 for four player titles.

 

NES four player games multiplex Player 1 and Player 2 D0 inputs to provide data for players 3 and 4.

 

 

 

The takeaway: Zapper and Powerpad function identically on NES and Famicom. It is possible to access Player 2 controller inputs simultaneously with a Famicom revolver (Zapper) on a Famicom but I know of no game that utilizes this. Some homebrews or unlicensed NES games support dual Zappers and will not function correctly on any Famicom as Player 1 D3 and D4 inputs do not exist anywhere on the Famicom accessory port. Famicom Arkanoid I and II will not work with an NES Vaus controller. NES Arkanoid will not work with the Famicom Vaus. Some NES games and homebrews (and rarely some Famicom games), especially by western developers, may or may not support the Famicom accessory controllers. Four player Famicom games don't work with Four Score and Four Player NES games don't work with Famicom accessory controllers.

 

Famicom systems cannot access Start and Select on player 2 (except the AV Famicom). NES and AV Famicom cannot access the Famicom microphone (Player 1 D2). AV Famicom cannot use an NES Zapper or PowerPad because Player 2 D3 and D4 pins on the controller port are disconnected. The AV Famicom can however be modified to accept NES accessorie controllers in port 2 by running jumpers from the accessory port.

 

Also Family Basic, which requires the Famicom keyboard and utilizes nearly every I/O pin on the accessory port, cannot be used on an NES. Lastly I have no clue how the Power Glove or U-Force controllers operate (beyond basic controller functionality) or if they are supported on the Famicom.

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PowerPad and Zapper both use Player 2 D3 and D4 inputs.

 

NES Vaus uses Player 2 D3 and D4 inputs. Famicom Vaus uses Player 1 and Player 2 D1 inputs.

 

Famicom games use Player 1 and Player 2 D1 inputs as auxillary controllers as well as Player 3 and Player 4 for four player titles.

 

NES four player games multiplex Player 1 and Player 2 D0 inputs to provide data for players 3 and 4.

 

 

 

The takeaway: Zapper and Powerpad function identically on NES and Famicom. It is possible to access Player 2 controller inputs simultaneously with a Famicom revolver (Zapper) on a Famicom but I know of no game that utilizes this. Some homebrews or unlicensed NES games support dual Zappers and will not function correctly on any Famicom as Player 1 D3 and D4 inputs do not exist anywhere on the Famicom accessory port. Famicom Arkanoid I and II will not work with an NES Vaus controller. NES Arkanoid will not work with the Famicom Vaus. Some NES games and homebrews (and rarely some Famicom games), especially by western developers, may or may not support the Famicom accessory controllers. Four player Famicom games don't work with Four Score and Four Player NES games don't work with Famicom accessory controllers.

 

Famicom systems cannot access Start and Select on player 2 (except the AV Famicom). NES and AV Famicom cannot access the Famicom microphone (Player 1 D2). AV Famicom cannot use an NES Zapper or PowerPad because Player 2 D3 and D4 pins on the controller port are disconnected. The AV Famicom can however be modified to accept NES accessorie controllers in port 2 by running jumpers from the accessory port.

 

Also Family Basic, which requires the Famicom keyboard and utilizes nearly every I/O pin on the accessory port, cannot be used on an NES. Lastly I have no clue how the Power Glove or U-Force controllers operate (beyond basic controller functionality) or if they are supported on the Famicom.

Thanks for the info. I have some question regarding confusion from my current limited understanding of NES-FC compatibility. Thanks

 

"Famicom Vaus uses Player 1 and Player 2 D1 inputs."

"Some homebrews or unlicensed NES games support dual Zappers and will not function correctly on any Famicom as Player 1 D3 and D4 inputs do not exist anywhere on the Famicom accessory port"

 

I have to admit I find this pinout for the FC aux port confusing.

https://wiki.nesdev.com/w/index.php/Famicom_expansion_port_pinout

There's one Joypad 1 pin and five joypad 2 pins, but aren't the controller ports hardwired elsewhere, are these auxillary pins also internally hardwired to have continuity with the main controller 1 & 2 port pins? I'm not sure how you would plug two zappers into a Famicom with only one port available.

 

"Zapper and Powerpad function identically on NES and Famicom."

Not sure how this works when the power pad plugs into a 7-pin controller port on the NES but the FC 7-pins are hardwired to joypads. I don't think you can plug the NES power pad or zapper into the Famicom unless there is some kind of adapter. There are Famicom analogs of zapper and power pad that plug into the 15-pin aux port, but I have read the FC "Family TRainer Pad" is wired differently to take advantage of the extra aux port pins. Ultimately, it sounds like the NES power pad games may (possibly) work with the "Family Trainer Pad", but the FC family trainer pad games probably won't work right with the NES as they expect more pin input than you can get from a single NES 7-pin port. I saw this infor at this link:

 

https://wiki.nesdev.com/w/index.php/Power_Pad "The Famicom's version of the Power Pad looked similar, but had an entirely different protocol that took advantage of the greater number of digital outputs on the Famicom expansion port:"

 

"AV Famicom cannot use an NES Zapper or PowerPad because Player 2 D3 and D4 pins on the controller port are disconnected."

This blows, mods are expensive if you are not confident in your own soldering ability. I recently realized that although the NES had mono composite, the original Famicom only had RF. Also, the NES has cart port springs that wear out.

 

I am curious, it sounds like the AVS RetroUSB system can do everything the original NES and Famicom could do with HDMI support. I imagine you could use an HDMI to composite adapter to use the zapper on a CRT. Only complaint I have heard about this device is the cart port, as it is a pain to seat a cart and remove it, at least in the NES cart port. Worth $185? Its sounds like the next best option is to get an original Famicom and AV mod or AV Famicom and pin jumper mod. Although, the AV FC pin jumper sounds more compatible as long as the AV Famicom itself is as fully compatible with NES and FC games as the original FC.

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PowerPad and Zapper both use Player 2 D3 and D4 inputs.

 

NES Vaus uses Player 2 D3 and D4 inputs. Famicom Vaus uses Player 1 and Player 2 D1 inputs.

 

Famicom games use Player 1 and Player 2 D1 inputs as auxillary controllers as well as Player 3 and Player 4 for four player titles.

 

NES four player games multiplex Player 1 and Player 2 D0 inputs to provide data for players 3 and 4.

 

 

 

The takeaway: Zapper and Powerpad function identically on NES and Famicom. It is possible to access Player 2 controller inputs simultaneously with a Famicom revolver (Zapper) on a Famicom but I know of no game that utilizes this. Some homebrews or unlicensed NES games support dual Zappers and will not function correctly on any Famicom as Player 1 D3 and D4 inputs do not exist anywhere on the Famicom accessory port. Famicom Arkanoid I and II will not work with an NES Vaus controller. NES Arkanoid will not work with the Famicom Vaus. Some NES games and homebrews (and rarely some Famicom games), especially by western developers, may or may not support the Famicom accessory controllers. Four player Famicom games don't work with Four Score and Four Player NES games don't work with Famicom accessory controllers.

 

Famicom systems cannot access Start and Select on player 2 (except the AV Famicom). NES and AV Famicom cannot access the Famicom microphone (Player 1 D2). AV Famicom cannot use an NES Zapper or PowerPad because Player 2 D3 and D4 pins on the controller port are disconnected. The AV Famicom can however be modified to accept NES accessorie controllers in port 2 by running jumpers from the accessory port.

 

Also Family Basic, which requires the Famicom keyboard and utilizes nearly every I/O pin on the accessory port, cannot be used on an NES. Lastly I have no clue how the Power Glove or U-Force controllers operate (beyond basic controller functionality) or if they are supported on the Famicom.

There's also this controversy about plugging your Famicom with its own cord into a USA plug 100V vs 115V AC. Some people say its okay if you unplug it when your not using it. Other say, don't worry about it, its just a cheap Famicom, LOL! I think they say that less as it gets more antique.

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The risk of running a Famicom system using a US wall outlet is minimal. Better to just ditch the vintage power bricks and get a 9V switching power supply (negative tip) since I have found most vintage unregulated bricks put out more than what's printed on the nameplate. A 9V adapter with 20% over rated (100 vs 120V) is like 10.8V, still well within the safe zone. I'd get weary of any brick that measures over 12V with a multimeter though. I've seen some "9V" bricks register as high as 14V on the multimeter unloaded, 13V when running consoles. That's a bit high IMO.

 

= = = = = = = =

 

As for the inputs, the 15-pin accessory port on the Famicom has a variety of inputs. The CPU can read from Player 1 or "P0" at address $4016 D0, D1, D2, D3, and D4, as well as Player 2 or "P1" at address $4017 D0, D1, D2, D3, and D4. Not all of these inputs are utilized on either NES or Famicom.

 

On an original Famicom, $2016 D0 is the hard wired Player 1 controller, $2017 D0 is the Player 2 controller, and $2016 D2 is the Player 2 Microphone. $2016 D1 is available on the accessory port and is generally used for third party or external Player 1/3 controller. $2017 D1, D2, D3, D3, and D4 are also available from the expansion port. $2017 D1 is used for auxiliary Player 2/4 controllers. Rare third party controllers had a spare DB-15 male port on them for piggybacking an additional auxiliary controller on them for Player 2/4. Either a piggyback controller or a DB-15 with two controllers is necessary to play 4-player Famicom games. It isn't uncommon to build a Famicom controller adapter with two NES plugs out of extension cables. Often Player 2 is wired with D3 and D4 for NES Zapper support or other peripherals.

 

Due to the frequent use of auxiliary controllers on the Famicom, almost all Famicom games (with a handful of exceptions like Super Mario USA) and many NES games read controller inputs from the D0 and D1 inputs simultaneously.

 

NES controller ports have D0, D3, and D4 connected. D3 and D4 were added to controller ports to support the Zapper and other peripherals. $2016 D3 and D4 are unused on the Famicom but can be accessed on the Player 1 controller port on the NES. However no licensed games that I know of used auxiliary controllers in the Player 1 port but the inputs are accessible. The NES also has an expansion port on the bottom which can allow easy access to all of the pins on the Famicom expansion port as well as the Mic input, auxiliary audio, and unused expansion pins on the cart bus. So it is be possible to mod an NES toaster with a DB-15 Famicom connector, expansion sound, or even a "mic button," however some Famicom games that support the microphone expect sporadic inputs on the Mic connection and won't behave well with a simple pushbutton input. When Legend of Zelda was re-issued in Japan on cartridge, this made killing Pol's Voice more difficult due to the lack of a Famicom Mic on the newer AV hardware.

 

There may be internal connections on the IC chips for the unused inputs on an original Famicom, but the AV Famicom and NES2 used cost reduced custom chips so many of the CPU inputs such as $2016 D2 microphone input, cannot be accessed at all on AV Famicom or NES2.

 

So while the NES controller port 2 and the Famicom expansion connector may share some common inputs, the auxiliary controllers have different pinouts. The main hurdle is that Arkanoid II for the Famicom doesn't work with the NES Vaus controller, though this issue can be fixed in the configuration menu when playing on AVS.

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The risk of running a Famicom system using a US wall outlet is minimal. Better to just ditch the vintage power bricks and get a 9V switching power supply (negative tip) since I have found most vintage unregulated bricks put out more than what's printed on the nameplate. A 9V adapter with 20% over rated (100 vs 120V) is like 10.8V, still well within the safe zone. I'd get weary of any brick that measures over 12V with a multimeter though. I've seen some "9V" bricks register as high as 14V on the multimeter unloaded, 13V when running consoles. That's a bit high IMO.

 

= = = = = = = =

 

As for the inputs, the 15-pin accessory port on the Famicom has a variety of inputs. The CPU can read from Player 1 or "P0" at address $4016 D0, D1, D2, D3, and D4, as well as Player 2 or "P1" at address $4017 D0, D1, D2, D3, and D4. Not all of these inputs are utilized on either NES or Famicom.

 

On an original Famicom, $2016 D0 is the hard wired Player 1 controller, $2017 D0 is the Player 2 controller, and $2016 D2 is the Player 2 Microphone. $2016 D1 is available on the accessory port and is generally used for third party or external Player 1/3 controller. $2017 D1, D2, D3, D3, and D4 are also available from the expansion port. $2017 D1 is used for auxiliary Player 2/4 controllers. Rare third party controllers had a spare DB-15 male port on them for piggybacking an additional auxiliary controller on them for Player 2/4. Either a piggyback controller or a DB-15 with two controllers is necessary to play 4-player Famicom games. It isn't uncommon to build a Famicom controller adapter with two NES plugs out of extension cables. Often Player 2 is wired with D3 and D4 for NES Zapper support or other peripherals.

 

Due to the frequent use of auxiliary controllers on the Famicom, almost all Famicom games (with a handful of exceptions like Super Mario USA) and many NES games read controller inputs from the D0 and D1 inputs simultaneously.

 

NES controller ports have D0, D3, and D4 connected. D3 and D4 were added to controller ports to support the Zapper and other peripherals. $2016 D3 and D4 are unused on the Famicom but can be accessed on the Player 1 controller port on the NES. However no licensed games that I know of used auxiliary controllers in the Player 1 port but the inputs are accessible. The NES also has an expansion port on the bottom which can allow easy access to all of the pins on the Famicom expansion port as well as the Mic input, auxiliary audio, and unused expansion pins on the cart bus. So it is be possible to mod an NES toaster with a DB-15 Famicom connector, expansion sound, or even a "mic button," however some Famicom games that support the microphone expect sporadic inputs on the Mic connection and won't behave well with a simple pushbutton input. When Legend of Zelda was re-issued in Japan on cartridge, this made killing Pol's Voice more difficult due to the lack of a Famicom Mic on the newer AV hardware.

 

There may be internal connections on the IC chips for the unused inputs on an original Famicom, but the AV Famicom and NES2 used cost reduced custom chips so many of the CPU inputs such as $2016 D2 microphone input, cannot be accessed at all on AV Famicom or NES2.

 

So while the NES controller port 2 and the Famicom expansion connector may share some common inputs, the auxiliary controllers have different pinouts. The main hurdle is that Arkanoid II for the Famicom doesn't work with the NES Vaus controller, though this issue can be fixed in the configuration menu when playing on AVS.

Okay. Thanks. Its making a lot more sense as far as the differences between the two. I think the AVS is out since the HDMI output leaves zapper games out unless you have a very rare HDMI CRT. Will most likely get an AV Famicom and do the jumper mod or sacrifice large wad of cash for an Analogue NT mini, although $450+ feels like way too much to spend.

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1. Will the NES play Famicom power pad titles with cart adapter?

2. If you buy one power pad activity mat can you use it on the NES to play both NES and Famicom power pad games? i.e., there are 11 power pad titles combined, can you play all of them on the NES with the same power pad?

3. If no to #2, if you buy the Famicom and both US and Japanese power pad, can you play all 11 games?

4. If this is all nonsense, is there a simpler way than buying both consoles, both pads and all 11 carts ...or two different sd multicarts?

 

Thanks

The TL:DR answers :

 

1. No

2. No

3. Yes, but only with a simple NES controller port to Famicom expansion port adapter that you make yourself

4. Get an EverDrive, a Famicom (any with an expansion port) and both Power Pads. Make an adapter along as described by Kosmic Stardust and enjoy hours of exercise fun.

Note that you will need a real copy of Family Trainer 3: Aerobics Studio if you want to hear the voice samples.

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So the Famicom Power Pad does not use the D3 / D4 inputs? I stand corrected. I remember reading on Famicom World forum somewhere the Famicom Powerpad worked. Some of these Famicom accessories still don't have proper pinout diagrams online whereas all of the NES accessories are highly documented, except for stuff like the Power Glove.

 

I have a Power Glove that's missing the sensor bar apparatus, but it has a 9-pin connector on it. I would like a pinout on the 9-pin connector port so I could adapt it to the NES controller port so at least the built in gamepad will function.

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The TL:DR answers :

 

1. No

2. No

3. Yes, but only with a simple NES controller port to Famicom expansion port adapter that you make yourself

4. Get an EverDrive, a Famicom (any with an expansion port) and both Power Pads. Make an adapter along as described by Kosmic Stardust and enjoy hours of exercise fun.

Note that you will need a real copy of Family Trainer 3: Aerobics Studio if you want to hear the voice samples.

This seems unlikely, but does Family Trainer 3: Aerobics Studio have English as an option or do I hear the voice samples in Japanese only? I have my doubts I would buy a cart adapter for one NES aerobics game, although I suppose I will eventually find enough games like this to buy one.

 

P.S. I've read several reports of the analogue nt mini crashing or freezing, so, considering the lower cost as well, AV FC is probably best.

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So the Famicom Power Pad does not use the D3 / D4 inputs? I stand corrected. I remember reading on Famicom World forum somewhere the Famicom Powerpad worked. Some of these Famicom accessories still don't have proper pinout diagrams online whereas all of the NES accessories are highly documented, except for stuff like the Power Glove.

 

I have a Power Glove that's missing the sensor bar apparatus, but it has a 9-pin connector on it. I would like a pinout on the 9-pin connector port so I could adapt it to the NES controller port so at least the built in gamepad will function.

I read by people who tried it on a couple boards that it works, sort of, but not really. This of course is after days of famicom vs nes investigation with mostly vague blog and forum entries. There does appear to be a common belief around that they are electronically the same. The zappers are the same according to those who have used them interchangeably.

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So the Famicom Power Pad does not use the D3 / D4 inputs? I stand corrected. I remember reading on Famicom World forum somewhere the Famicom Powerpad worked. Some of these Famicom accessories still don't have proper pinout diagrams online whereas all of the NES accessories are highly documented, except for stuff like the Power Glove.

 

I have a Power Glove that's missing the sensor bar apparatus, but it has a 9-pin connector on it. I would like a pinout on the 9-pin connector port so I could adapt it to the NES controller port so at least the built in gamepad will function.

Even after all these years, there is really a small amount of info on Famicoms in English. Probably, related to my finding that almost all used Famicoms are being sold from Japan.

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For the Power Pad, to be compatible with Famicom games, the original Power Pad would need to: A) use the D3 and D4 inputs on the Famicom, and B) use the same logical order on the CD4021 chips. So it needs to send out 8 bits on one input and 4 on the other input, in the same arrangement that the US Power Pad uses.

 

Since I have never seen a pinout diagram for a Japanese Power Pad, I have no idea if it would work or not. Just that someone in a forum posted somewhere online said it did.

 

Zappers are cross compatible, four scores and Vaus controllers are not. However it is possible to fabricate an adapter to the Famicom expansion ports to allow most NES peripheral controllers to operate on their Famicom counterparts. The most common custom mod is the two player adapter, with D3 and D4 connected to Player 2 controller port so that NES peripherals can be used on the Famicom. Vaus use in Arkanoid II would require a different wiring.

 

Since the Vaus uses both D1 connections, one of them is a push button and the other one is the 8-bit position data, but I forget which. The Vaus needs the Clock and Reset pins from one of the controller ports (I forget which) to provide the 8-bit data from the paddle position. The pushbutton doesn't need these pins to operate. Why did I forget which clock input was needed? Incomplete documentation online regarding the Famicom EXP connector.

 

FYI, the controller port Reset pin is shared for Player 1 (P0) and Player 2 (P1), but each register ($4016 for P0 and $4017 for P1) uses individual clock signals with unique timings. Using the wrong clock signal will cause the controller to malfunction.

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The Famicom's Arkanoid Vaus controller reads $4017 D1 for the potentiometer, so I would suggest that it requires the clock signal for $4017. It reads the button at $4016 D1, but I doubt it needs a clock signal for a single button. The Zapper does not.

 

Family Trainer 3's samples are in English, you can listen to them here : http://forums.nesdev.com/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=16129&start=15#p199048

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For the Power Pad, to be compatible with Famicom games, the original Power Pad would need to: A) use the D3 and D4 inputs on the Famicom, and B) use the same logical order on the CD4021 chips. So it needs to send out 8 bits on one input and 4 on the other input, in the same arrangement that the US Power Pad uses.

 

Since I have never seen a pinout diagram for a Japanese Power Pad, I have no idea if it would work or not. Just that someone in a forum posted somewhere online said it did.

 

Zappers are cross compatible, four scores and Vaus controllers are not. However it is possible to fabricate an adapter to the Famicom expansion ports to allow most NES peripheral controllers to operate on their Famicom counterparts. The most common custom mod is the two player adapter, with D3 and D4 connected to Player 2 controller port so that NES peripherals can be used on the Famicom. Vaus use in Arkanoid II would require a different wiring.

 

Since the Vaus uses both D1 connections, one of them is a push button and the other one is the 8-bit position data, but I forget which. The Vaus needs the Clock and Reset pins from one of the controller ports (I forget which) to provide the 8-bit data from the paddle position. The pushbutton doesn't need these pins to operate. Why did I forget which clock input was needed? Incomplete documentation online regarding the Famicom EXP connector.

 

FYI, the controller port Reset pin is shared for Player 1 (P0) and Player 2 (P1), but each register ($4016 for P0 and $4017 for P1) uses individual clock signals with unique timings. Using the wrong clock signal will cause the controller to malfunction.

They also sell an expansion port adapter, $30 total, but reviews seem uncertain about whether it will allow one or two players and seems to not work for all games. One reviewer said both inputs were pigtailed together. All kinda strange.

 

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00NHATUTW/ref=olp_product_details?_encoding=UTF8&me=

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They also sell an expansion port adapter, $30 total, but reviews seem uncertain about whether it will allow one or two players and seems to not work for all games. One reviewer said both inputs were pigtailed together. All kinda strange.

 

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00NHATUTW/ref=olp_product_details?_encoding=UTF8&me=

 

The Amazon reviewers tell almost all even if they don't understand the hardware behind the device. If it works with a NES Zapper, then it must work with an NES Vaus and Power Pad. It will allow a Famicom "Player 3", which many non-3/4 player games will interpret as "Player 1". But as I read the reviews it will not allow a Famicom "Player 4" to masquerade as "Player 2" for most games. Instead, both controllers will look like Player 3/1, which makes the adapter less than ideal.

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For the Power Pad, to be compatible with Famicom games, the original Power Pad would need to: A) use the D3 and D4 inputs on the Famicom, and B) use the same logical order on the CD4021 chips. So it needs to send out 8 bits on one input and 4 on the other input, in the same arrangement that the US Power Pad uses.

 

Since I have never seen a pinout diagram for a Japanese Power Pad, I have no idea if it would work or not. Just that someone in a forum posted somewhere online said it did.

 

Zappers are cross compatible, four scores and Vaus controllers are not. However it is possible to fabricate an adapter to the Famicom expansion ports to allow most NES peripheral controllers to operate on their Famicom counterparts. The most common custom mod is the two player adapter, with D3 and D4 connected to Player 2 controller port so that NES peripherals can be used on the Famicom. Vaus use in Arkanoid II would require a different wiring.

 

Since the Vaus uses both D1 connections, one of them is a push button and the other one is the 8-bit position data, but I forget which. The Vaus needs the Clock and Reset pins from one of the controller ports (I forget which) to provide the 8-bit data from the paddle position. The pushbutton doesn't need these pins to operate. Why did I forget which clock input was needed? Incomplete documentation online regarding the Famicom EXP connector.

 

FYI, the controller port Reset pin is shared for Player 1 (P0) and Player 2 (P1), but each register ($4016 for P0 and $4017 for P1) uses individual clock signals with unique timings. Using the wrong clock signal will cause the controller to malfunction.

 

 

 

The Amazon reviewers tell almost all even if they don't understand the hardware behind the device. If it works with a NES Zapper, then it must work with an NES Vaus and Power Pad. It will allow a Famicom "Player 3", which many non-3/4 player games will interpret as "Player 1". But as I read the reviews it will not allow a Famicom "Player 4" to masquerade as "Player 2" for most games. Instead, both controllers will look like Player 3/1, which makes the adapter less than ideal.

Thank you both for all of your help. Do you know if the homemade FC Expansion port adapters allow both player 3 and 4 support? The amazon one seems odd to allow two inputs and connect them both to player 1 leads unless they figured some games would allow 2 players in this configuration, or maybe just to make it look better, or possibly it works better on the Twin FC it appears to be targeting.

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Thank you both for all of your help. Do you know if the homemade FC Expansion port adapters allow both player 3 and 4 support? The amazon one seems odd to allow two inputs and connect them both to player 1 leads unless they figured some games would allow 2 players in this configuration, or maybe just to make it look better, or possibly it works better on the Twin FC it appears to be targeting.

 

I already said the Famicom Expansion port and this homebrew adapter allowed player 3 support. The port cannot offer player 1 support, so you have to hope your 1-2 player game will read player 3 as player 1. The majority of Japanese games do.

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I already said the Famicom Expansion port and this homebrew adapter allowed player 3 support. The port cannot offer player 1 support, so you have to hope your 1-2 player game will read player 3 as player 1. The majority of Japanese games do.

Sorry, I meant would the adapter Kosmic Stardust described be able to have both player 3 and player 4, versus only player 3 on the amazon adapter.

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They also sell an expansion port adapter, $30 total, but reviews seem uncertain about whether it will allow one or two players and seems to not work for all games. One reviewer said both inputs were pigtailed together. All kinda strange.

 

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00NHATUTW/ref=olp_product_details?_encoding=UTF8&me=

 

 

The Amazon reviewers tell almost all even if they don't understand the hardware behind the device. If it works with a NES Zapper, then it must work with an NES Vaus and Power Pad. It will allow a Famicom "Player 3", which many non-3/4 player games will interpret as "Player 1". But as I read the reviews it will not allow a Famicom "Player 4" to masquerade as "Player 2" for most games. Instead, both controllers will look like Player 3/1, which makes the adapter less than ideal.

Someone apparently didn't wire port 2 correctly then. It sounds like they put the clock signal and data pin for player 1 into the player 2 port. This would also prevent Powerpad, Vaus (for US games), and other Player 2 peripherals that rely upon the NES clock/reset signals from operating properly. And since everything is molded together, there is no way to make it work.

 

About the product
  • Connect your NES accesories on your Japanese Famicom
  • Compatibles with one NES Controller and NES Zapper at once.

I could probably throw together an adapter to allow two NES controllers + Zapper (player 2 port), and an NES Vaus (port 3) to all behave together simultaneously. I would still need to know whether the Famicom Vaus reads from the Player One or Player Two clock and data pins for the 8-bit position data. If it can read from the player 1 clock signal, then that would be great as it could plug into the Player 1 socket, otherwise I would need a third socket if it used the Player 2 clock/data in addition to the D1 inputs. This would also result in bus conflicts if an NES controller was plugged into either socket simultaneously with the Vaus.

 

On second thought, since the Vaus shares Famicom EXP inputs with both auxiliary controllers, it would be better to create a separate adapter specifically for the Vaus controller. Only reason I never made one was because I got the AVS which can configure the four ports as Japan or USA four score compatibility, as well as a special "Famicom Expansion Emulation" option that lets me plug in a US Vaus controller into port 2 and behave appropriately on Arkanoid II Famicom.

 

Sorry, I meant would the adapter Kosmic Stardust described be able to have both player 3 and player 4, versus only player 3 on the amazon adapter.

Player 3/4 function as duplicate Player 1/2 inputs in the vast majority of Famicom games, and many NES games as well. Basically the signal input from D0 and D1 is ANDed together in game logic such that a low input from either 1/3 or 2/4 controller counts as a button hit. Support for auxiliary controllers in NES games produced by licensed 3rd party western developer studios, unlicensed developers, and hombrew games will be spotty at best.

 

One notable example of a first party developed game that does not work with auxiliary controllers is Super Mario Bros 2 (USA) or Super Mario Bros USA (Japan). Since Super Mario Bros 2 was developed as an entirely unique game for western audiences, it was designed specifically with NES in mind. Then due to it's popularity, it was later ported over to Famicom with only the title screen updated, with no support for D1 inputs built in. There may be other Famicom carts that do not read auxiliary controllers, but I don't know of a definitive list of games available in English.

 

Famicom collecting is still the Wild Wild West in many ways, and Japanese collectors generally don't document and catalog stuff the way US collectors do. Famicom World database is still largely incomplete for example.

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The TL:DR answers :

 

1. No

2. No

3. Yes, but only with a simple NES controller port to Famicom expansion port adapter that you make yourself

4. Get an EverDrive, a Famicom (any with an expansion port) and both Power Pads. Make an adapter along as described by Kosmic Stardust and enjoy hours of exercise fun.

Note that you will need a real copy of Family Trainer 3: Aerobics Studio if you want to hear the voice samples.

 

 

The risk of running a Famicom system using a US wall outlet is minimal. Better to just ditch the vintage power bricks and get a 9V switching power supply (negative tip) since I have found most vintage unregulated bricks put out more than what's printed on the nameplate. A 9V adapter with 20% over rated (100 vs 120V) is like 10.8V, still well within the safe zone. I'd get weary of any brick that measures over 12V with a multimeter though. I've seen some "9V" bricks register as high as 14V on the multimeter unloaded, 13V when running consoles. That's a bit high IMO.

 

= = = = = = = =

 

As for the inputs, the 15-pin accessory port on the Famicom has a variety of inputs. The CPU can read from Player 1 or "P0" at address $4016 D0, D1, D2, D3, and D4, as well as Player 2 or "P1" at address $4017 D0, D1, D2, D3, and D4. Not all of these inputs are utilized on either NES or Famicom.

 

On an original Famicom, $2016 D0 is the hard wired Player 1 controller, $2017 D0 is the Player 2 controller, and $2016 D2 is the Player 2 Microphone. $2016 D1 is available on the accessory port and is generally used for third party or external Player 1/3 controller. $2017 D1, D2, D3, D3, and D4 are also available from the expansion port. $2017 D1 is used for auxiliary Player 2/4 controllers. Rare third party controllers had a spare DB-15 male port on them for piggybacking an additional auxiliary controller on them for Player 2/4. Either a piggyback controller or a DB-15 with two controllers is necessary to play 4-player Famicom games. It isn't uncommon to build a Famicom controller adapter with two NES plugs out of extension cables. Often Player 2 is wired with D3 and D4 for NES Zapper support or other peripherals.

 

Due to the frequent use of auxiliary controllers on the Famicom, almost all Famicom games (with a handful of exceptions like Super Mario USA) and many NES games read controller inputs from the D0 and D1 inputs simultaneously.

 

NES controller ports have D0, D3, and D4 connected. D3 and D4 were added to controller ports to support the Zapper and other peripherals. $2016 D3 and D4 are unused on the Famicom but can be accessed on the Player 1 controller port on the NES. However no licensed games that I know of used auxiliary controllers in the Player 1 port but the inputs are accessible. The NES also has an expansion port on the bottom which can allow easy access to all of the pins on the Famicom expansion port as well as the Mic input, auxiliary audio, and unused expansion pins on the cart bus. So it is be possible to mod an NES toaster with a DB-15 Famicom connector, expansion sound, or even a "mic button," however some Famicom games that support the microphone expect sporadic inputs on the Mic connection and won't behave well with a simple pushbutton input. When Legend of Zelda was re-issued in Japan on cartridge, this made killing Pol's Voice more difficult due to the lack of a Famicom Mic on the newer AV hardware.

 

There may be internal connections on the IC chips for the unused inputs on an original Famicom, but the AV Famicom and NES2 used cost reduced custom chips so many of the CPU inputs such as $2016 D2 microphone input, cannot be accessed at all on AV Famicom or NES2.

 

So while the NES controller port 2 and the Famicom expansion connector may share some common inputs, the auxiliary controllers have different pinouts. The main hurdle is that Arkanoid II for the Famicom doesn't work with the NES Vaus controller, though this issue can be fixed in the configuration menu when playing on AVS.

So ordered an AV Famicon that comes with a new US compatible adapter (100 - 240V AC, 10V DC, high enough amps), new AV cable, and the controllers and a couple games to test. Also have two each of the power pads and family trainers on the way and a couple cheap Famicom games to test out the FC powerpad and an NES zapper I have. It will take a while to get here from Japan, so I can have some time to work on a control adapter. Budget-wise, I think I'll post-pone the Everdrive for a short while. I think that Everdrive FC N8 is the most expensive sd cart I've seen, including the protos I've bought,

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So ordered an AV Famicon that comes with a new US compatible adapter (100 - 240V AC, 10V DC, high enough amps), new AV cable, and the controllers and a couple games to test. Also have two each of the power pads and family trainers on the way and a couple cheap Famicom games to test out the FC powerpad and an NES zapper I have. It will take a while to get here from Japan, so I can have some time to work on a control adapter. Budget-wise, I think I'll post-pone the Everdrive for a short while. I think that Everdrive FC N8 is the most expensive sd cart I've seen, including the protos I've bought,

Glad to see you've got the AV Famicom; I love it. If you're handy with a soldering iron, I recommend this simple mod to allow NES accessories such as the Zapper to work on it:

http://famicomworld.com/workshop/tech/nes-zapper-on-av-famicom/

 

NES accessories that plug into player 2 port will only work on Famicom games if the Famicom equivalent is wired to the same logical inputs, and visa-versa for Famicom accessories working with NES games.

 

I also highly recommend you save up for that Everdrive. It is worth it. If you buy one, I recommend ordering straight from Krikzz or Stone Age Gamer. :)

http://krikzz.com/store/home/32-everdrive-n8-famicom.html

http://www.stoneagegamer.com/everdrive-n8-basic-fc.html

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Glad to see you've got the AV Famicom; I love it. If you're handy with a soldering iron, I recommend this simple mod to allow NES accessories such as the Zapper to work on it:

http://famicomworld.com/workshop/tech/nes-zapper-on-av-famicom/

 

NES accessories that plug into player 2 port will only work on Famicom games if the Famicom equivalent is wired to the same logical inputs, and visa-versa for Famicom accessories working with NES games.

 

I also highly recommend you save up for that Everdrive. It is worth it. If you buy one, I recommend ordering straight from Krikzz or Stone Age Gamer. :)

http://krikzz.com/store/home/32-everdrive-n8-famicom.html

http://www.stoneagegamer.com/everdrive-n8-basic-fc.html

Won't be too long, but if I don't budget myself, I'll find myself buying things like that $2000 Starpath Supercharger.collection on ebay just for its hallowed glow. :-D

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