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SDrive-MAX ATX support


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2 hours ago, _The Doctor__ said:

I would still look at everything, I would verify voltages under load, whatever power supply used to power the machines at the time of the mishap may have over current damage because power was put to them in reverse by-bassing their in built protections

I think I would have experienced serious problems if something really went wrong. I still think I was lucky. I loaded a few games from tapes and that worked. Also games from the sdrive max load ok now. So I don't think there is a problem with the sio connection. Only thing is that the sdrive doesn't work with external power anymore. The problem isn't in the power supply. That is why I asked if it is safe to connect another sdrive to my Atari. If that works there is only a problem with the sdrive.

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58 minutes ago, _The Doctor__ said:

If using another SDrive do not use the same power supplies you used with the possibly bad SDrive.

Ok, I have another one. But with that one there is no difference. The power supply of the Atari is ok you think?

 

A friend of mine doesn't want to connect his sdrive to my Atari. To br honest I think that he is over reacting. There was a risk when the wires were on the wrong place. Since computer and sdrive work fine without external power now I dare to take the risk..

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6 hours ago, madness77 said:

- so you connected an external power supply as the switch (or jumper) was set to supply via SIO? Well...  I may not have good news...
- have you tried powering the Arduino from USB? E.g. from a normal phone charger or from a computer/laptop? Only with the switch set to "external", of course.

You mean the usb connection on the sdrive? I can try that.

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You aren't paying attention, You use a new power supply with a new sdrive max. The hope you are holding out is for the Atari to be fine and a new SDrive max to work properly with it. If you keep using a suspected damaged SDrive Max it may very well damage other things you attached to it at some point. Playing with fire for no reason, You can easily replace the ardy for cheap and program it up.

Edited by _The Doctor__
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4 hours ago, _The Doctor__ said:

You aren't paying attention, You use a new power supply with a new sdrive max. The hope you are holding out is for the Atari to be fine and a new SDrive max to work properly with it. If you keep using a suspected damaged SDrive Max it may very well damage other things you attached to it at some point. Playing with fire for no reason, You can easily replace the ardy for cheap and program it up.

So if I understand correctly there is no harm to connect another sdrive with power supply to my Atari but it is better not to use my current sdrive anymore? I think myself that my current sdrive is only dangerous with the sio switch on external power and use it with external power. In that situation it is acting weird. If I use power from the Atari with switch on other side it works fine. But if it is better to not use this SDrive anymore I will wait for my new one. But in that case I want to know if it is safe to test another sdrive now with other power supply to see if that works fine. If that works I'm a bit more sure that my Atari survived my stupidness. But my friend doesn't want to take the risk to connect his Sdrive to my Atari..

Edited by tajvdz
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9 hours ago, tajvdz said:

You mean the usb connection on the sdrive? I can try that.

The Arduino can be powered in three ways:

- direct 5V to the VIN input (e.g. from the SIO port) (you wrote that this works fine, so it is unlikely there should be a short anywhere on the 5V rail)

- from an external power supply, in which case 5V and 3.3V are created by voltage regulators

- 5V from the USB port

 

You can try this way, without the Atari connected of course.

 

If everything will be OK and the screen will work correctly, this may indicate a fault in the voltage regulators circuitry, admittedly there is a diode there to protect against reversed voltage polarity.

 

Repair of this is certainly beyond your technical skills and the cost of repair in some electronics service will exceed the cost of a new Arduino (~$5), but for any electronics technician such a repair (e.g. replacement of capacitors or burnt regulator) is relatively simple, fast and cheap.

 

If you feel confident enough with a multimeter, you can check with an external power supply what the voltages are on the 5V and 3.3V pins (multimeter set to V, black probe to GND, red to voltage holes).
 

 

image.thumb.png.54a029c7d3cb4c11e176133e851cff12.pngways_to_power_Arduino_480x480.webp.fd8b6358cd97f02ea3f999a5f513695c.webp

 

 

Edited by madness77
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1 hour ago, madness77 said:

The Arduino can be powered in three ways:

- direct 5V to the VIN input (e.g. from the SIO port) (you wrote that this works fine, so it is unlikely there should be a short anywhere on the 5V rail)

- from an external power supply, in which case 5V and 3.3V are created by voltage regulators

- 5V from the USB port

 

You can try this way, without the Atari connected of course.

 

If everything will be OK and the screen will work correctly, this may indicate a fault in the voltage regulators circuitry, admittedly there is a diode there to protect against reversed voltage polarity.

 

Repair of this is certainly beyond your technical skills and the cost of repair in some electronics service will exceed the cost of a new Arduino (~$5), but for any electronics technician such a repair (e.g. replacement of capacitors or burnt regulator) is relatively simple, fast and cheap.

 

If you feel confident enough with a multimeter, you can check with an external power supply what the voltages are on the 5V and 3.3V pins (multimeter set to V, black probe to GND, red to voltage holes).
 

 

image.thumb.png.54a029c7d3cb4c11e176133e851cff12.pngways_to_power_Arduino_480x480.webp.fd8b6358cd97f02ea3f999a5f513695c.webp

 

 

Ok, I can try this but I have a new sdrive max on the way. I can also wait. It works with the sio power now. And now I used it for a day I even think that I will keep using it. I found out a few tricks that make it easier. 

 

But since I don't notice any strange things on my Atari I can say that it was a lucky escape? The new sdrive was on the way anyway..

 

About the screen. With external power it shows the sdrive menu. In the beginning the touch screen works but if power is on longer the touch screen isn't responding anymore. With sio power this problem doesn't exist.

 

And where can I find the technical manual of the 800 XL? I can lr my friend take a look at it..

Edited by tajvdz
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20 hours ago, madness77 said:

Ok thank you. But what do you think are the chances that I damaged my Atari if it is working fine now? And in what area do I have to look to rule things out?

Edited by tajvdz
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On 4/30/2024 at 11:56 AM, tajvdz said:

Ok thank you. But what do you think are the chances that I damaged my Atari if it is working fine now? And in what area do I have to look to rule things out?

image.png.c5ce1e9cde9f6d28b19a06cdda0b168a.png

 

"NEAR..."

 

But, seriously, it's hard to say, I had a "fully working" Atari XE, and that it has some problem, it turned out when I wanted to add a memory expansion to it. Sometimes you add some modification, and it turns out, for example, that the voltage or clock waveform is "ugly" on the oscilloscope and something there does not want to work....

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 5/6/2024 at 12:15 PM, madness77 said:

image.png.c5ce1e9cde9f6d28b19a06cdda0b168a.png

 

"NEAR..."

 

But, seriously, it's hard to say, I had a "fully working" Atari XE, and that it has some problem, it turned out when I wanted to add a memory expansion to it. Sometimes you add some modification, and it turns out, for example, that the voltage or clock waveform is "ugly" on the oscilloscope and something there does not want to work....

Ok, but I didn't make a modification on my 800 xl. I made a bad connection in the sdrive max that i connected to the sio port. The sdrive max gave problems with the external power supply at first but not with sio power. I didn't use my Atari for a few weeks and last week without sdrive max. I didn't notice any problems. When I used my sdrive max with sio power there were no problems at first but later it started to act weird. It didn't boot to the sdrive menu and when it did games didn't boot. When I took the sio connector of and put it back on it started working again. Is it likely that the problem is in the sdrive max or in the computer? Is it better to not use the sdrive max anymore? Or better to not use my Atari at all before I have let it checked out? Is it a risk to connect another device (tape or other sdrive max) to the sio port to see what happens?

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  • 3 months later...

Hi,

 

I would like to present to you an SDriveMax front LED panel that I designed:

 

sdrivemax-with-led-panel.thumb.jpg.720116d60162e1ab8bf3779e3050c3ca.jpg    led-panel-pcb.thumb.png.d49a9317a0f4d9a14ee1ac703fd92f25.png

 

The potentiometers allow you to adjust the brightness of the LEDs to an even and desired level:

 

 

It should be connected to the RX, 5V, and GND pins on the Arduino UNO module. The panel does not require any additional modules to function. Its small size makes it suitable for a 3D-printed case, such as https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:5037759 and others. The photos show how to assemble it:

 

20240826_153856.thumb.jpg.c7c2172740bc8f8a0d51647342df5f77.jpg20240826_153943.thumb.jpg.40c7984f315dfd01a33b4f89f459bcc1.jpg      20240826_155811.thumb.jpg.21caeea03fb6cb1ce91e8f2068b96a95.jpg

 

 

 

The connector should be soldered as close to the PCB as possible, removing the plastic stoppers.

 

20240826_124408.thumb.jpg.ff988185a401841eee8d8c40186f924e.jpgBOM:

  • 2x 330 Ohm THT resistors
  • 2x LED 3mm (RED and GREEN)
  • 3-pin 2.54mm male connector
  • 2x 1 kOhm potentiometer (3362W-1-102LF) https://aliexpress.com/item/1005006652482075.html
  • Approximately 10-15 cm of 3-core cable with 2.54mm female connectors on one end.

 

 

Required soldering skill level: beginner ;-)

 

The potentiometers can be omitted; however, in that case, you need to select the appropriate resistor values for the LEDs to achieve the desired brightness level, typically within the range of 330 ohms to 1.5 kOhms, and solder bypasses in place of the potentiometers.

 

Final result: 
You can order the PCBs here:

 

https://www.pcbway.com/project/shareproject/SDriveMAX_LED_panel_0454e41f.html

 

or download the Gerber file. The license is CC BY-ND. I allow commercial use, but I caution against "businessmen." The cost of a single module should not exceed $3.

 
By ordering the PCBs through the above link, I receive a contribution.

 

 

Edited by madness77
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  • 4 weeks later...

I a question about going to the ready prompt with the Sdrive-Max connected.

With Q you can quit the sdrive menu. But you come in the self test then. With reset you can go to the ready prompt. (Is that called basic?) Is there another way to go to the ready prompt from the sdrive menu or while booting with sdrive connected? By the way my Sdrive-Max is sio powered. With external power you only have to put power on the sdrive after the Atari booted to the prompt.

Edited by tajvdz
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sdrive max is a disk drive and tape device, when you turn on your Atari it boots a config program from the drive, you use that program to set up the disks and tapes it serves. It is not deciding if you want BASIC or not, you are making that decision.

Boot a DOS disk and select B from the DOS menu for most AtariDOS variants or type BASIC ON, CAR, or BASIC from the command prompt for most SpartaDos variants.

Maybe read a manual for said DOS flavors, or an Atari computer owners manual of some kind that outlines your methods, like holding OPTION key down during boot to turn BASIC off or just turning it on so BASIC is present.

Maybe check out the new and returning users thread sticking at the top of the pages! You know from the first post not last...

On 2/2/2011 at 1:25 PM, Philsan said:

Which Atari 8-bit computer to buy? What do I need to run software? Where to find software? What emulators are available?
I try to answer to those questions objectively and in a manner suitable for newbies or veterans returning to Atari after many years.

Many other answers are in Atari 8-bit computers FAQs.

 

Index

1. Which computer to buy?

2. What do I need to run software?

3. Where to find software?

4. Best homebrews?

5. Emulators?

6. Basic programming?

7. Graphics capabilities

 

1. Which computer to buy?

Historically speaking, Atari 800 is the best one (a milestone, compare it with contemporary 1979 computers!), but if you want a computer compatible with all software, you should take an Atari 800XL or a 130XE (65XE and XEGS are OK too). Their only limitation compared to Atari 800 is that they have two joystick ports instead of four.

Cart port: if you use cartridges, 800XL cart's port position is more comfortable.
Keyboard: important only if you plan to enter a lot of text; many people prefer 800XL keyboards but 5 variants exists (avoid the last variant, Mitsumi).
Memory: 800XL has 64KB, 130XE has 128KB, usuful for few games. Memory can be upgraded with internal or external expansions.
Video ouput: 800XL has RF and composite, 130XE has s-video too. If you have a socketed Atari, with solderless Sophia 2 board you get RGB and DVI output.
Quality: 800XL has a better building quality. Some XL's have all ICs socketed, therefore they are easier to repair and upgrade.
Basic: Important only if you want to program with Atari Basic. Most 800XL have Basic rev. B, 130XE have bug free Basic rev. C. You can replace 800XL Basic rev. B chip with a rev. C. Anyway, if you like Basic programming, nowadays people don't use Atari Basic but Turbo-Basic XL (fast, compatible and compilable), Altirra Basic or the brand-new FastBasic so built-in Atari Basic's revision isn't important.

 

Atari 8-bit machines comparison table by @MrFish


2. What do I need to run software?

 

CARTRIDGES: you don't need anything apart an Atari 800XL/130XE.
5¼ FLOPPY DISKS: you need a disk drive (Atari 1050 or XF551). To load machine language programs, remember to turn on computer with option key pressed.
TAPES: you need a program recorder (Atari 410, 1010, XC11 or XC12). To load machine language programs, remember to turn on computer with start and option keys pressed, then press play on program recorder and finally press return key.

 

Nowadays all above software has been dumped and these are file format extensions:

ATR: files that are reproductions of floppy disks.

ATX: files that are reproductions of protected floppy discs.

XEX/COM: files that are reproductions of single executables.

CAR/ROM/BIN: files that are reproductions of cartridges.

CAS: files that are reproductions of tapes.

 

The frequent asked question is: "Which is the best multicart to run my games?".

 

Atari computers are not consoles, so games were (and are) released not only in cartridge format but in disk format too. Moreover, some games need more than 64KB RAM to run.

 

I made a comparison table (last updated June 4, 2024) covering loading devices:

A8 loading devices.pdf 37.14 kB · 135 downloads

There are three other comparison tables:

https://avgcart.tmp.sk/

https://www.wudsn.com/index.php/productions-atari800/hardware/thecart

https://atari8.co.uk/firmware/side3/

 

Those comparison tables are not easy to understand for newbies, so I'll try to explain.

 

SIO LOADING DEVICES are slower devices that emulate disk drives; they connect to SIO port and load programs like real disk drives.

Considered the fact that all software is available in XEX and ATR formats, these devices load almost all software.

Some games and many demos require a memory expansion though.

 

MULTICARTS are faster devices that emulate cartridges; they are plugged into the cartridge port and load CAR and XEX.

There are some games and many applications available in ATR format only (for example Alternate Reality, Seven Cities of Gold, The Dark Crystal) which multicarts can't run.

But there are two multicarts with ATR compatibility (one of them with CAS compatibility too).

Multicarts have the advantage of loading some games in CAR format that otherwise need memory expansion to run.

 

Conclusions

 

With a cheap SIO2PC-USB (with $6 you can make a SIO2PC-USB or you can link PC and Atari with a breakout board for the FTDI FT232RL USB to serial IC) you can run most of the software from a nearby PC, where you can keep all your files, for Atari and emulators.

 

With FujiNet you can run most of the software from a microSD card or wirelessly from your PC or Internet.

 

With two multicarts you can quickly select and load all the software: AVGCart (if connected to SIO port with the optional cable) and Side3 (if U1MB internal memory expansion is installed).

 

At the moment AVGCART with SIO cable is the only all-in-one solderless solutions.

Compared to other multicarts, as-is it's the only multicart with full ATR compatibility.

Compared to SIO devices it lets you load CAR and files search/selection is faster.

This cart expand RAM too if connected to Atari with PBI or ECI cable. The new SUBCART emulates Double Pokey and COVOX.

 

3. Where to find software?

You can buy/find software on the Internet or in the real word, the price depends on conditions (loose, boxed, sealed) and rarity, and/or you can download it here:
Atarimania (many screenshots and manuals)
Atari 8-bit Forever
Fandal (unparalleled for demos)
Atarionline (Gry/Games on the left column)
Homesoft (games in XEX and ATR format when XEX isn't available, continually updated and cleaned - no intros, no unpacking delays, no glitches - click on download button on the right, extract zip file and you'll get all games inside A-Z folders)

Pigwa Atari FP Archive 

Mr. Bacardi

Vjetnam 8-bit Atari games archive

Archive

 

4. Best homebrews?

 

Dozens of games are released each year.

@ZeroPage Homebrew since 2019 keeps track of all Atari 8-Bit/5200 games that have either been completed, updated or released.

 

I would try Albert, Assembloids XE, Atari Blast!, Bosconian, Crownland, Dimo's Dungeon, Dimo's Quest New Year Edition, Final Assault, FloB, Gacek, His Dark Majesty, International Karate Enhanced Edition, Last Squadron, Laura, Manic Miner 2016, onEscape, Pac-Man 2012, Pad, Pang, Prince of Persia, RGB, The Rescue Expedition, Ridiculous Reality, Scramble, Space Harrier, Space Taxi, Stunt Car Racer, Time Pilot, Total Eclipse, Yoomp!, to name just a few.

 

Almost all games are released for free (sometimes beautiful collectors editions are available).

You can download them in the "3. Where to find software?" websites.

 

Thanks to MrFish, you can download an homebrew compilation here.

 

5. Emulators?

PC
Altirra (the best emulator for PC)
Atari800
Atari++
Atari800WinPLus
Mac
Atari800MacX
Android
Colleen (official Atari800 port)

XEmu65
Droid800
Atari800
Nintendo DS
PokeyDS

Nintendo DSi

A8DS

Nintendo Wii
WiiXL
Sony PSP
Atari800PSP
PSP Atari

 

6. Basic programming?

 

If you want to start programming Atari computers, built-in Atari Basic apart, the easier and most known language is Turbo-Basic XL. Released by Frank Ostrowski in 1985, it's compatible with Atari Basic but faster, compilable and with additional commands. Here you can find original language, updated 2023 version, and two manuals: Turbo-BasicXL.zip If you would like to develop on PC with that language, I recommend Turban.

In 2017 a new Basic has been released, FastBasic. Almost compatible with Turbo-Basic XL, but faster.

Mad Studio is a good integrated development environment (scroll to find latest version).

If you want to make bitmap images using various peculiar Atari graphics modes, you can use Atari Graphics Studio.

To design player-missile graphics (sprites), you can use SprEd (very easy to use, it supports overlap feature to create a third color when overlapping sprites).

To create music you can use Raster Music Tracker, made by Radek Sterba (we miss you).

To change character set you can use Atari FontMaker or Atari Font Creator.

 

Folks in the 8-bit programming subforum gladly answer questions.

 

7. Graphic capabilities

 

If you want to see A8 machines graphics capabilities, check out Images generated by Rastaconverter topic.

pssst click the arrow or some of the links

https://forums.atariage.com/topic/176545-topic-for-newbies-or-veterans-returning-to-atari/

 

Edited by _The Doctor__
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1 hour ago, _The Doctor__ said:

sdrive max is a disk drive and tape device, when you turn on your Atari it boots a config program from the drive, you use that program to set up the disks and tapes it serves. It is not deciding if you want BASIC or not, you are making that decision.

Boot a DOS disk and select B from the DOS menu for most AtariDOS variants or type BASIC ON, CAR, or BASIC from the command prompt for most SpartaDos variants.

Maybe read a manual for said DOS flavors, or an Atari computer owners manual of some kind that outlines your methods, like holding OPTION key down during boot to turn BASIC off or just turning it on so BASIC is present.

Maybe check out the new and returning users thread sticking at the top of the pages! You know from the first post not last...

pssst click the arrow or some of the links

https://forums.atariage.com/topic/176545-topic-for-newbies-or-veterans-returning-to-atari/

 

Is this a reply to my question?

 

I only want to know if it is possible to boot the Atari to the ready prompt you get without an sdrive max connected.

 

My Sdrive-Max is sio powered so every time i turn on the atari the Sdrive-Max menu boots. 

 

Or if it is possible to quit without going to the self test.

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If you boot to BASIC without a DOS from disk, or a cas image ready, You can not save your work.

 

Booting to BASIC with devices disconnected? Well just disconnect it and turn the Atari on, if it's an XL/XE you will be at the ready prompt. If it's a 400/800 you simply have to have a BASIC cartridge in and nothing attached.

 

Don't quite get the circles we are running in when you can just try it and you would be there.

 

Read the SDrive helpers from Mr Robots site ore the manual, you might be able set it to have no image and no config then save it. It may become the doorstop your looking for.

 

Try reading he manuals, helpful tips and sites, maybe even read the posts in these threads. Too long didn't read (TLDR) when it's already shortened to the bare minimum is not such a good thing be doing.

 

https://atari8bit.net/tutorials/de-re-sdrive-max/

Edited by _The Doctor__
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4 hours ago, _The Doctor__ said:

If you boot to BASIC without a DOS from disk, or a cas image ready, You can not save your work.

 

Booting to BASIC with devices disconnected? Well just disconnect it and turn the Atari on, if it's an XL/XE you will be at the ready prompt. If it's a 400/800 you simply have to have a BASIC cartridge in and nothing attached.

 

Don't quite get the circles we are running in when you can just try it and you would be there.

 

Read the SDrive helpers from Mr Robots site ore the manual, you might be able set it to have no image and no config then save it. It may become the doorstop your looking for.

 

Try reading he manuals, helpful tips and sites, maybe even read the posts in these threads. Too long didn't read (TLDR) when it's already shortened to the bare minimum is not such a good thing be doing.

 

https://atari8bit.net/tutorials/de-re-sdrive-max/

Well i ask it because I'm trying to figure out what the most successful way is to load a .cas file on the Sdrive-Max when it is sio powered. With external power it works better because you can can power up the Atari after you selected the game. With sio power you need to reset and that causes the problem. When you are in the sdrive menu and press start or start and option the menu starts to scroll. So after leaving the menu with Q you come in the self test. So my question is what is the best way to reset. With basic you only need reset and you can type cload. I hope I made my question more clear now.

 

I also don't know what they mean with how you have to Disable a disk. I just press tape on the sdrive.

Edited by tajvdz
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You leave the drive slots empty as well as the config/alternate image slots. That means in both menus on the display. D0: at the bottom and D1: on up. That also means boot D1: in the config menu is off. Put your CAS file in The tape slot and and do the Save IM and save config. Then when you Turn on the computer on the sdrive comes up with the tape as the default.

Hold the start key when turning on the atari and when ready press a key. the tape loads.

The other method is to Turn the Atari on and choose one of the loading methods like cload etc.

My Sdrives have touch screen allowing swapping of cas images etc. at any time.

Please start reading the manuals.

You are aware that starting pausing and turbo mode can be controlled from the touch screen, yes?

Edited by _The Doctor__
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Ok I will try this with save im. But you have to change the settings later for disk images to the normal settings? 

 

Yes I know that you can control these options from the touchscreen. 

 

I did read the manuals but not everything worked like it was described. With doing it my own way I had more succes. 

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On 9/24/2024 at 11:09 PM, _The Doctor__ said:

You leave the drive slots empty as well as the config/alternate image slots. That means in both menus on the display. D0: at the bottom and D1: on up. That also means boot D1: in the config menu is off. Put your CAS file in The tape slot and and do the Save IM and save config. Then when you Turn on the computer on the sdrive comes up with the tape as the default.

Hold the start key when turning on the atari and when ready press a key. the tape loads.

The other method is to Turn the Atari on and choose one of the loading methods like cload etc.

My Sdrives have touch screen allowing swapping of cas images etc. at any time.

Please start reading the manuals.

You are aware that starting pausing and turbo mode can be controlled from the touch screen, yes?

I tried this but it doesn't work. How can I go to the cfg screen when I'm about to start a game? (First picture) And which color in the cfg means on and which means off? The blue or grey? The cfg screen shows the settings I normally use. SaveIm does nothing. When I click on it it turns blue. After I click Save and go back to cfg it is grey again.

20240926_222031.jpg

20240926_222119.jpg

Edited by tajvdz
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Your computer is on and at the ready prompt

You have the CAS loaded and can press start when needed

you have the cload typed in and press return right after you press start on max

follow the same method you always do in basic cassette software loading and it should be good to go.

If you need to do the START load method, type bye hold start on computer tap start on max tap reset while holding start bbbrrrrmt tap return on computer

If you you need to load a binary and not basic image

You can go to self test and hold option and start, tap start on max, tap reset on computer while holding option and start

The BASIC and Binary loading methods are the same as a real datasette and you are pressing play so to speak on the max etc

Edited by _The Doctor__
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13 hours ago, _The Doctor__ said:

Your computer is on and at the ready prompt

You have the CAS loaded and can press start when needed

you have the cload typed in and press return right after you press start on max

follow the same method you always do in basic cassette software loading and it should be good to go.

If you need to do the START load method, type bye hold start on computer tap start on max tap reset while holding start bbbrrrrmt tap return on computer

If you you need to load a binary and not basic image

You can go to self test and hold option and start, tap start on max, tap reset on computer while holding option and start

The BASIC and Binary loading methods are the same as a real datasette and you are pressing play so to speak on the max etc

Yes this method works for me. But what about my questions with cfg and SaveIm? I can't figure out how that should work with loading tapes. And it seems like that SaveIm doesn't work at all.

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