+MrFish Posted April 22, 2018 Author Share Posted April 22, 2018 (edited) Looking at the original sprites that I ripped, the hanging object that falls downward at you in the game is in the same category. It's multi-color here, but a single color as a playfield and a P/M object in the Atari version. So I can edit this too and give a similar effect. [Note: far right, next to the last rocket.] Edited April 22, 2018 by MrFish 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zap! Posted April 22, 2018 Share Posted April 22, 2018 (edited) If I had to choose between those two, I like 3b, but if the color has to change I'd stick with the original. Edited April 22, 2018 by Zap! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+MrFish Posted April 22, 2018 Author Share Posted April 22, 2018 If I had to choose between those two, I like 3b, but if the color has to change I'd stick with the original. In that case, revert to version 2. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+MrFish Posted April 22, 2018 Author Share Posted April 22, 2018 Here's a version with the dropping mines colored up. It's pretty far into the game, so here's screenshot of how they look. Super Cobra 4a.xex 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+MrFish Posted April 22, 2018 Author Share Posted April 22, 2018 IMO another worthwhile enhancement would be to tweak the colours. I remember arcade Scramble and Super Cobra being more towards drab than the cartoonish look of the Atari version. I've had a few closer looks at it and the arcade version uses similar types of color schemes. I don't know how accurate the Atari version is in replicating the exact colors per level, etc., though. But it looks pretty close overall to me. I might revisit it later and do a per-level comparison. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+MrFish Posted April 22, 2018 Author Share Posted April 22, 2018 Just as a side note... I like games that allow continuing from the last level played, but I can't stand the fact that they (almost all?) include the notion of continuing when your "continue" will start from the beginning! As if it's some benefit to "continue" in that case. They should just go back to the regular start/option screen, or whatever. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fingolfin Posted April 22, 2018 Share Posted April 22, 2018 Gotta get caught up, MrFish's been busy! FWIW I like version 2 and 3b too (of all the three series; 3c was just a little too bright! ) but now I have to try 4a! I know I already asked about changing rockets fired from the copter in a previous post but would it be possible/effective/relatively easy to use the attached sprite of rocket with flame(s) (from the group of Super Cobra sprites image above) for the rockets coming out of the copter? Or would that just look ridiculous? b/c of size/scale differences or just the visual of that particular sprite being launched from the copter... Just continuing to wonder about moving Super Cobra in a more arcade like direction (i.e. visually/arcade looking). Thanks again for all you have already done to make Super Cobra more enjoyable to play! Very cool to see this project evolve! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunstar Posted April 22, 2018 Share Posted April 22, 2018 (edited) Yes, that's what I meant when I said above about them changing color when taking off, and that it happens in the arcade version too. I misunderstood and thought you were referring only to the Arcade version, and that your changes would cause the same effect in the 8-bit version. The reality is I don't know if I ever played the 8-bit version before, I played it on the 2600 back in the day, but there are so many better (graphically) clones of Scramble on the 8-bit...I've loaded it up before and played for 10 seconds and decided I'd play a better clone but never played far enough to see the green rockets take off and turn blue. Of course you've finally got me playing it with the spruced-up graphics and better chopper size. Now it stands up better to some of the other clones graphically, like Caverns of Mars 2, my favorite clone: http://www.atarimania.com/game-atari-400-800-xl-xe-caverns-of-mars-ii_7089.html Plus, it's now better in some ways because Super Cobra is higher resolution. Edited April 22, 2018 by Gunstar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+MrFish Posted April 22, 2018 Author Share Posted April 22, 2018 I know I already asked about changing rockets fired from the copter in a previous post but would it be possible/effective/relatively easy to use the attached sprite of rocket with flame(s) (from the group of Super Cobra sprites image above) for the rockets coming out of the copter? Or would that just look ridiculous? b/c of size/scale differences or just the visual of that particular sprite being launched from the copter... The bombs are composed of exactly 1 "missile" (of player/missile graphics fame). 1 missile is exactly 2 pixels wide, and in this case 3 pixels tall. If you can come up with something of those dimensions that improves what I've already done, be my guest and post your suggestion. Obviously what you're currently suggesting is out of the question. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+MrFish Posted April 22, 2018 Author Share Posted April 22, 2018 Now it stands up better to some of the other clones graphically, like Caverns of Mars 2, my favorite clone: http://www.atarimania.com/game-atari-400-800-xl-xe-caverns-of-mars-ii_7089.html Plus, it's now better in some ways because Super Cobra is higher resolution. Caverns of Mars II looks nice, but without bombs it's not as interesting, and gameplay ends up being quite a bit different. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunstar Posted April 22, 2018 Share Posted April 22, 2018 (edited) This is true, but it just happens to be one of several clones or similar games that happens to be my favorite and one of the reasons why I've never really played Super Cobra on the Atari 8-bit.The tail of beta lyrae is another one that I rather spend my time playing and there are a couple others too that I don't remember off the top of my head. In the past, because I didn't care for the drab single color sprites of Super Cobra. That is why you are bothering, correct? And I applaud it, this is how it should have been all along. Of course gameplay is still most important, but these games have very good gameplay too, if a bit different or expanded. Now you have given me reason to spread my game time to include it. IIRC, another fantastic one I just recalled at want to play again, is called Laser Hawk(?) Edited April 22, 2018 by Gunstar 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fingolfin Posted April 22, 2018 Share Posted April 22, 2018 The bombs are composed of exactly 1 "missile" (of player/missile graphics fame). 1 missile is exactly 2 pixels wide, and in this case 3 pixels tall. If you can come up with something of those dimensions that improves what I've already done, be my guest and post your suggestion. Obviously what you're currently suggesting is out of the question. Thank you for considering my question/suggestion MrFish. I wasn't sure about the size/scale of that sprite being workable for use as I was suggesting. Apologies for that. I very much appreciate all your work on Super Cobra: it's much improved and more enjoyable to play. I get excited about stuff that seems interesting and cool, and I like to try to help when and where I can if it seems appropriate. I do not want to be pushy, rude or disrespectful. Sorry if I've come across that way at all. Thanks again MrFish! Happy Earth Day! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+MrFish Posted April 22, 2018 Author Share Posted April 22, 2018 (edited) This is true, but it just happens to be one of several clones or similar games that happens to be my favorite and one of the reasons why I've never really played Super Cobra on the Atari 8-bit.The tail of beta lyrae is another one that I rather spend my time playing and there are a couple others too that I don't remember off the top of my head. In the past, because I didn't care for the drab single color sprites of Super Cobra. That is why you are bothering, correct? And I applaud it, this is how it should have been all along. Of course gameplay is still most important, but these games have very good gameplay too, if a bit different or expanded. Now you have given me reason to spread my game time to include it. IIRC, another fantastic one I just recalled at want to play again, is called Laser Hawk(?) I guess part of the problem is that the the standard A8 controllers only have one button. So, how do you allow for firing 2 weapons... keyboard isn't so great -- unless it's a weapon with very limited ammo; a combination move of the joystick with the button can work sometimes. Here they just compromise and let the button fire both. It's a different gameplay dynamic too; but seems to work well enough for Super Cobra. Tail of the Beta Lyrae is a cool clone. I think it's another one that doesn't use bombs though. But it has some interesting obstacles and enemies. I actually have a hack of that too, which I haven't shared yet. I was only interested in hacking the fonts for that one. It came out pretty nice though. Laser Hawk is cool; nicely done, but you hardly hear about it. Edited April 22, 2018 by MrFish 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+MrFish Posted April 22, 2018 Author Share Posted April 22, 2018 (edited) Thank you for considering my question/suggestion MrFish. I wasn't sure about the size/scale of that sprite being workable for use as I was suggesting. Apologies for that. I very much appreciate all your work on Super Cobra: it's much improved and more enjoyable to play. I get excited about stuff that seems interesting and cool, and I like to try to help when and where I can if it seems appropriate. I do not want to be pushy, rude or disrespectful. Sorry if I've come across that way at all. No problem. I just wanted to get to the point of why it couldn't be done. Suggestions are fine, but you had already suggested it once before and I thought I had answered it, albeit in a different fashion. It's not that some of the things you're suggesting couldn't be done, but rather the restrictions of how this particular port was done. What you're suggesting would require recoding how different graphics are rendered, which could add complications to get them functioning with the existing "engine" used here. Often times it's a better idea to start over from scratch if you want to change the engine of a game very much. I think this is a fairly good port though. It's simple on the graphics, but considering it was originally and 8K cart, I'd say they've done a good job. The only real problem I had with it to start was the chopper proportions. Edited April 22, 2018 by MrFish 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+MrFish Posted April 22, 2018 Author Share Posted April 22, 2018 Here's the Beta Lyrae font hack (fonts, actually, as there are several). Tail of Beta Lyrae.xex 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Philsan Posted April 22, 2018 Share Posted April 22, 2018 The Tale of Beta Lyrae, 1983 shoot-'em-up by Philip Price (Alternate Reality), has an interesting feature: the landscape is randomly generated. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+MrFish Posted April 22, 2018 Author Share Posted April 22, 2018 Big plus for replay value. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunstar Posted April 22, 2018 Share Posted April 22, 2018 (edited) I guess part of the problem is that the the standard A8 controllers only have one button. So, how do you allow for firing 2 weapons... keyboard isn't so great -- unless it's a weapon with very limited ammo; a combination move of the joystick with the button can work sometimes. Here they just compromise and let the button fire both. It's a different gameplay dynamic too; but seems to work well enough for Super Cobra. Tail of the Beta Lyrae is a cool clone. I think it's another one that doesn't use bombs though. But it has some interesting obstacles and enemies. I actually have a hack of that too, which I haven't shared yet. I was only interested in hacking the fonts for that one. It came out pretty nice though. Laser Hawk is cool; nicely done, but you hardly hear about it. One button isn't so bad if you have an analog adjustable rapid fire adapter like me, works with any Atari compatible joystick. With this puppy, set right, I get a regular rythm of four shots and two bombs per second on Super Cobra. This is 2600/400/800 era tech I found NOS on ebay. Edited April 22, 2018 by Gunstar 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+MrFish Posted April 22, 2018 Author Share Posted April 22, 2018 One button isn't so bad if you have an analog adjustable rapid fire adapter like me, works with any Atari compatible joystick. Yeah, I probably need one of those. I get lazy to button-slam for more than a few minutes at a time. Honestly, though, I find dual buttons for multiple weapons needing a little too much thought, when you're facing a constant onslaught of enemies needing to be dealt with using one or the other (as in the arcade version of Super Cobra). So, the trade-offs for not having the extra button kind of equalize the whole thing in this particular scenario. Now, for other games, where the action isn't quite so frantic or the second weapon isn't needed as much (or the second weapon has some limitations on ammo), 2 buttons can be more advantageous. 2 buttons also become more essential in games where combining a feature with one button would have no use, such as in a Tetris-type game or similar. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zzalg_Repus Posted April 22, 2018 Share Posted April 22, 2018 (edited) First of all, thanks a lot for tackling Super Cobra! It's one of the first games I've ever played on the A8 BITD, so it still holds a lot of nostalgia value for me. Having said this - the new version (only tried V1 so far) won't let me pick up the treasure ($) at the very end (PAL). Does this have anything to do with the new heli Player/Missile? Anyway, please keep up improving Super Cobra, your input is greatly appreciated! Edited April 22, 2018 by Zzalg_Repus 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+MrFish Posted April 22, 2018 Author Share Posted April 22, 2018 Having said this - the new version (only tried V1 so far) won't let me pick up the treasure ($) at the very end (PAL). Does this have anything to do with the new heli Player/Missile? I couldn't tell you; I never knew there was a treasure at the end; although, I was wondering about "$" sprite from the original game and the scene that's shown for it before starting a game. Hopefully I'm not working from a bum copy of the game. Maybe the original copy I'm working from can be fully-tested, so we can have some info about that first. If there's a problem with the version I'm hacking, I'll just apply the hacks to a working version later; no problem. Thanks for the heads-up. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+MrFish Posted April 22, 2018 Author Share Posted April 22, 2018 Here's the original version that I started working from. Super Cobra.xex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiwilove Posted April 22, 2018 Share Posted April 22, 2018 I like to say thanks for mentioning of Laser Hawk. This was Andrew's first proper game. For those who are interested in his previous efforts - he wrote a few simple game routines - which I put onto video - that can be seen here. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2pNfEEaIbXs&t=4s&list=UUuS_WWw8gMxmjZSvzbNCElQ&index=22 They're not anything special at all - but it's there to encourage those who are starting assembler - to keep working at it. That if you put enough time and effort into it - you can progress to your first proper game project. Harvey 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zzalg_Repus Posted April 22, 2018 Share Posted April 22, 2018 I was wondering about "$" sprite I'm pretty sure the "Booty" is meant to be picked up, not shot at. (I have great memories playing this one with my father BITD - he still remembers the "xxxx miles cleared" melody, I just asked him today! ) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+MrFish Posted April 22, 2018 Author Share Posted April 22, 2018 I'm pretty sure the "Booty" is meant to be picked up, not shot at. Yes, that's what it shows on the arcade version. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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