My homemade 5200 controller

[atari-dna]

I think the digital range value is 0-224

 

 

That I don't know -- I'm not familiar with 5200 programming or the internal 5200 hardware. If it was a PC joystick, then I'd say you could time it yourself for additional precision.

 

If the POKEY fixes you to 8 bit resolution, then you're right the Microcontroller/DigitalPOT shouldn't impede that resolution.

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[john_q_atari]

 

Ah, I think Scott updated the BOM after I asked about the sockets. BTW, the ATtiny socket appears to be incorrect; it needs to be an 8-bin socket.

 

In that case replace this line:

 

"A120347-ND","4 PIN PDIP IC SOCKET","1"

 

with this one:

 

"A120347-ND","8 PIN PDIP IC SOCKET","1"

 

The part number is correct, just my notes were incorrect

[Swami]

I just bought one today from japan for $15 plus whatever the proxy shipping service charges to mail it to the states... I'd never pay $100 for it. I assume it contains some sort of fuse protected (so you cant dump the code) microcontroller but I'm definitely going to open it up and take a look if/when it ever arrives.

Where did you buy this from?

[john_q_atari]

I searched a large used goods marketplace in Japan:

 

www.suruga-ya.jp

 

and used a proxy mailing service to purchase it and ship it to me:

 

zenmarket.jp

 

I see this one, but it is different than what I purchased and I dont know if it would work:

https://www.suruga-ya.jp/product/detail/145207787001

[Swami]

I searched a large used goods marketplace in Japan:

 

www.suruga-ya.jp

 

and used a proxy mailing service to purchase it and ship it to me:

 

zenmarket.jp

 

I see this one, but it is different than what I purchased and I dont know if it would work:

https://www.suruga-ya.jp/product/detail/145207787001

 

Okay. Must have been in short supply. The Win 95/98 in that one would suggest a PC game port at the unseen end. The other one there is usb rather than game port (smart joy pad 3plusN). However, it mostly mostly Japanese so hard for me to tell.

 

This probably orders from the same place:

https://search.rakuten.co.jp/search/mall/nintendo64+コントローラー/100026/

 

There are these two different ones, but I believe they are ghost stores and best to avoid. The first one is similar to the one ave1 used, but it didn't have the psx and n64 connectors on cords, but had the same label.

http://www.innovation1.com/PSX35.html

 

http://www.hamkumas.net/yokomuki/nichijo/nochina/goods.html(the "Exceed Smart Joy")

[peteym5]

Has anyone taken on the task of mass producing like 20 to 25 units? Sale the boards/controllers themselves or sale through someone that has a business? Albert here may resale hardware through his store. Steve at AtariMax and Lance (Video61) at AtariSales, someone will need to contact them and see what they will offer to will resale the product.

 

Should set up for both immediate sales upon release and long term sales over time. You probably get a hand full of sales right away. Then get a few stranglers who could not afford to get one right away. I cannot say how many will buy a controller if someone made them. I can see the price being around $30 factoring in parts, labor, profit, and shipping.

Edited October 24, 2018 by peteym5

[john_q_atari]

If someone wants to take on such a task I am sure they will publicly announce it on atariage. As for cost, I don't believe you have run the numbers on your idea. Parts cost is $15 plus $10 for the board from the OP. Thats $25. (assuming little to no shipping cost for bulk purchasing). This doesn't include the necessary cable. Then there is assembly time of the bare board, so lets say 30 minutes at $20/hr if you are willing to work for that wage, so $10 in labor. Then there is shipping, maybe $5 plus the time and gas to drop them off for mailing. So we are already up to $40 assuming driving/labor for mailing drop off is free. So if someone gets no profit, and gets compensated $10 total for their labor, then to not lose money they have to charge $40. Most people would probably want some profit and/or more compensation for their time and effort. Normally I can see people not taking on a business venture for less than 50% margin, though some may do it for less.

 

In the end, projects like these are just a hobby because people like the OP enjoy tinkering around with something they love, are happy to share what they have done with others so that if others want to leverage their initial time and knowledge, others can reproduce it for themselves, and if the OP can recover a few dollars spent on the effort by selling off a few extra boards, all the better.

 

OP=original poster (generic term for anyone who starts a build thread covering something they have done)

 

(edited for grammar)

Edited October 24, 2018 by john_q_atari

[+DrVenkman]

Yeah that’s right. And 30 minutes is a low estimate for most folks if they want to do it right. I’ve built two of these - and there are a lot of solder points. I counted one of mine and it’s like 120 individual joints to solder, plus the actual parts placement, and then a few minutes to program the microcontrollers.

 

Even assuming better prices in quantity for the boards (maybe $5 - $7 each) and better prices for the parts in quantity ($10 for parts instead of close to $15 when you add in shipping), it would be hard to hit a $30 price point if you add in a reasonable rate for the time it takes to build, test, package and prep to ship.

[smbaker]

Is anyone still waiting for a PCB? I have a handful of them in stock and available to ship. As usual, this is pcboard-only. You still need to source all the components and build them yourself.

 

Scott

[amiman99]

So, it looks like Digi-Key charges $50+ to program your chip, and it looks like I have to do it myself.

 

I have some questions programming the chip.

Can I use this programmer? https://www.amazon.com/HiLetgo-ATMEGA8-Programmer-USBasp-Cable/dp/B00AX4WQ00/ref=pd_lpo_vtph_23_bs_lp_t_1?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=K9R750SP9EYW4QCF0BRQ

Do I program the chip directly on the board using the header?

The cable has 10 positions, but the header has 6, how do I connect it to the programmer?, pictures would be nice.

 

Thanks

[smbaker]

So, it looks like Digi-Key charges $50+ to program your chip, and it looks like I have to do it myself.

 

I have some questions programming the chip.

Can I use this programmer? https://www.amazon.com/HiLetgo-ATMEGA8-Programmer-USBasp-Cable/dp/B00AX4WQ00/ref=pd_lpo_vtph_23_bs_lp_t_1?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=K9R750SP9EYW4QCF0BRQ

Do I program the chip directly on the board using the header?

The cable has 10 positions, but the header has 6, how do I connect it to the programmer?, pictures would be nice.

 

Thanks

 

You want one of the ones with the 10-pin to 6-pin adapter, like this one: https://www.amazon.com/HonsCreat-Programming-Programmer-Quadcopter-ATMEGA128/dp/B071P2LCC9/. This isn't necessarily the same as the one that I used, but looks similar.

 

The one I linked does say "software controlled SCK option to support targets with low clock speed" which is a good sign that it probably has recent firmware. In my case, my programmer was older, and I purchased two programmers and used one programmer to update the firmware on the other programmer.

 

Searching amazon or ebay, you'll find a zillion of these things from different people, often with slight differences in the boards. One of our builders here, DrVenkman, did a fairly long writeup on programming that might be useful. It's in this thread, around message 88 or so.

 

Scott

Edited October 30, 2018 by smbaker

[+DrVenkman]

So, it looks like Digi-Key charges $50+ to program your chip, and it looks like I have to do it myself.

 

I have some questions programming the chip.

Can I use this programmer? https://www.amazon.com/HiLetgo-ATMEGA8-Programmer-USBasp-Cable/dp/B00AX4WQ00/ref=pd_lpo_vtph_23_bs_lp_t_1?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=K9R750SP9EYW4QCF0BRQ

Do I program the chip directly on the board using the header?

The cable has 10 positions, but the header has 6, how do I connect it to the programmer?, pictures would be nice.

 

Thanks

 

Please see this post and the post which follows immediately thereafter.

[amiman99]

Thanks for all the help.

Waiting for my parts to arrive...and I need to get that programmer.

[john_q_atari]

I found this adapter on ebay for 99 cents after shipping. Probably will come on a slow boat though.

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/173332592823

 

or pay 7 bucks and get it in 2 days if you have amazon prime

 

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00CW80MP6

Edited October 31, 2018 by john_q_atari

[+DrVenkman]

I found this adapter on ebay for 99 cents after shipping. Probably will come on a slow boat though.

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/173332592823

 

or pay 7 bucks and get it in 2 days if you have amazon prime

 

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00CW80MP6

Yeah I found (and bought!) the same thing for a couple bucks cheaper (I think the USBasp I bought was about $5 and the adapter (because I was too lazy to wire up one myself) was $6. Arrived in 2 days thanks to Prime.

[amiman99]

Ok, so I got my parts and it's a work in progress, but the capacitor location is not marked, so I don't know where they go.

Maybe in the next PCB revision C1-C4 could be marked. I'm thinking that the CAPs below START button are 0.22uF, is that correct?

 

 

Also, I see a problem designing a 3D case for the joystick. The problem I see is the multiple location and size of the buttons, and left/right configuration.

I soldered mine same way as @DrVenkman, so the case will be designed as such. (for now...)

 

I'm still waiting on my programmer.

[john_q_atari]

Ok, so I got my parts and it's a work in progress, but the capacitor location is not marked, so I don't know where they go.

Maybe in the next PCB revision C1-C4 could be marked. I'm thinking that the CAPs below START button are 0.22uF, is that correct?

 

Yes the capacitors below the start button are 0.22uF.

[amiman99]

 

Yes the capacitors below the start button are 0.22uF.

thanks

[amiman99]

Here is a preview of the 3d Case:

 

I need to figure it out how to do the keypad properly, and choose proper size for the buttons.

So far the alignment on the bottom shell is done and it fits nice.

 

 

[+DrVenkman]

I need to figure it out how to do the keypad properly, and choose proper size for the buttons.

 

 

The way I see it, there are a couple choices:

 

1. Build the existing board, but find and use different "tall" keypad buttons. I know such taller buttons exist but I don't know how tall/high they are in comparison to the standard button switches, and I don't know if the footprint is identical.

2. Use exising-design button switches, but find or print "keycap" parts to fit into the case and actuate the button mechanisms when depressed. Something like that would probably give the best aesthetics but also be more expensive to print. If existing-stock button caps could be found and used, that would probably be the cheaper approach.

[David Alexander]

Here is a preview of the 3d Case:

 

I need to figure it out how to do the keypad properly, and choose proper size for the buttons.

So far the alignment on the bottom shell is done and it fits nice.

 

 

 

Wow, these definitely need a case. Just to be clear would the case fit the boards as in my attached picture or require an exchange of components.

[john_q_atari]

Depends on the final solution.

 

No matter what, you would need to remove the controller in your picture from its mount by removing the 4 nuts on the corner.

Then if the case was designed to use the existing "keycaps" you would do nothing but put the controller in the new case

If it was design to use different "keycaps" you would just pop the existing ones off, press on the new ones, and put it all in the new case.

If the design was to use different switches then the existing switches would need to be desoldered and then the new chosen switches would need to be soldered in before placing the controller in its new case.

[smbaker]

There's also a matter of left stick vs right stick. Maybe two variations of the case could be designed.

 

As far as the keypad is concerned, there are taller tactile buttons, such as https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/te-connectivity-alcoswitch-switches/2-1825910-7/450-1642-ND or https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/e-switch/TL1105BF160Q/EG1833-ND. For the fire buttons, maybe a taller keycap could be 3D printed.

 

Scott

Edited November 4, 2018 by smbaker

[David Alexander]

There's also a matter of left stick vs right stick. Maybe two variations of the case could be designed.

 

As far as the keypad is concerned, there are taller tactile buttons, such as https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/te-connectivity-alcoswitch-switches/2-1825910-7/450-1642-ND or https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/e-switch/TL1105BF160Q/EG1833-ND. For the fire buttons, maybe a taller keycap could be 3D printed.

 

Scott

Great Idea Scott

[amiman99]

I think I will 3D print the buttons, because I can have them at required length.

The problem with buttons is that they have to be at a certain height, and the height is determined by the analog joystick.

The hole for the analog joystick needs to be a little bit wider then the top of the joystick which determines the height of the to shell, and the buttons.

 

So, the height of the buttons needs to be around 12mm, so this button might be perfect https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/te-connectivity-alcoswitch-switches/2-1825910-7/450-1642-ND, it's too bad I soldered mine already.

 

As far as the left/right configuration. I made a drawing in FreeCAD of the button layout that can be flipped and then subtract the holes in the shell.