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Crazy idea or not ?


Lastic

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I only have two and I converted one of them to PAL/Ultimate/Stereo routing the stereo out through the RF hole (like I assume yours does), leaving the case intact otherwise. and the other will get a Sophia DVI as 60Hz is apparently more compatible with TVs and I can use it for original speed gaming.

Yes, that is exactly what I did, with a stereo head-phone jack and a small amplifier board where the RF modulator used to be. My original intention was to keep the case 100% intact and I wasn't going to do a PBI mod. I use the old RF channel selector as a switch to turn off the composite signal when using S-video, for a cleaner picture since the composite interference is removed, but still wanted composite for games that use artifacting.

 

My other two 1200XL's started out as replacement back-up boards I bought from Best Electronics, and I only had the one 1200XL. But the same gentleman that recently sold the +50 1200XL's was generous enough to give me cases and keyboards that had dead, and apparently beyond repair, mobo's in them, for my other two mobo's. He also gave me an 800 & 810! I am paying it forward by gifting one of the 1200XL's to someone else, with some upgrades installed.

Edited by Gunstar
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Yes, that is exactly what I did, with a stereo head-phone jack and a small amplifier board where the RF modulator used to be. My original intention was to keep the case 100% intact and I wasn't going to do a PBI mod. I use the old RF channel selector as a switch to turn off the composite signal when using S-video, for a cleaner picture since the composite interference is removed, but still wanted composite for games that use artifacting.

 

My other two 1200XL's started out as replacement back-up boards I bought from Best Electronics, and I only had the one 1200XL. But the same gentleman that recently sold the +50 1200XL's was generous enough to give me cases and keyboards that had dead, and apparently beyond repair, mobo's in them, for my other two mobo's. He also gave me an 800 & 810! I am paying it forward by gifting one of the 1200XL's to someone else, with some upgrades installed.

 

 

Interesting, that never occurred to me. Did you simply route the composite signal through that switch? Or did you use some kind of indirect switching.

 

And what's the amplifier for? I thought that the stereo board would output the correct level? I 3D-printed a small round plug to fit into the RF hole with a hole just wide enough for the 3.5mm stereo connector and hot-glued that to the inside of the case, so I figure it should be possible to remove it again if required.

 

The PBI mod is intriguing though given my limited mechanical abilities I'd never be able to get it done as nicely as yours which looks like it came from the factory. And given today's peripherals, there's not that much that I'd need a PBI port for (maybe the Turbo Freezer?).

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Yes, just routed the signal through the switch.

 

What stereo board are you referring too? Several have been made or are made? But actually mine is a complete DIY POKEY piggy-back with additional needed 74LS14 or whatever it is piggy-backed elsewhere. Did I have audio before I installed the "amplifier?" Yes, but I wanted better. It's not much, just a couple small capacitors and trim pots.

 

I have an older MetalGuy66 stereo board, but it wouldn't fit with the Atarimax APE Warp+ OS board (32-in-1) installed too, so I chose just to do the original Gumby piggy-back mod. The stereo board I'm installing in an 800xl I'm rebuilding and upgrading and giving to another friend. That one is a payback gift though, not pay-it-forward gift. But as I recall it (MetalGuy66 board) is only the two POKEY's and a 74LS14(?) IC and maybe a resister. The installation instructions from the stereo board suggested adding a small pre-amp like the one I have, as well as the original DIY Gumby instructions. I didn't do it with the stereo board when I had it installed, and it was OK output, but when I did the DIY Gumby piggy-back I did do the pre-amp and it gives a richer output sound to any PC speakers or TV/monitor than without, and less volume required.

Edited by Gunstar
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Still unclear on how to connect both the Midi-Mate PCB and Diskdrive PCB to the SIO port internally whilst retaining the SIO port to connect additional periphals.

 

Other thing I might be looking for is a replacement top case badge that says ATARI 130XEfm or 130XE fm Ultimate.

 

Will see how it goes, after I received all parts.

 

Get a USb Brother Ptouch Label printer. Something like the Ptouch 970 and then get the silver tape. Something like this:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B076H827N1/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

(Make sure the tape you get is compatible with the printer you buy, then print it out saying whatever you want it to say, cut the ends diagonal. I did something similar for my SDrive Max.

post-50483-0-03165600-1560114026_thumb.jpeg

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Are seven standards a drawback? Surely this just means the protocol has seen significant iterative improvements. And they are all backwards compatible with legacy USB devices.

 

The profusion of different connector sizes can be problematic, but contrast this with the completely ad-hoc connectivity methods employed before USB existed. And almost everything is now being homogenised into USB type C.

was more an attempt at humour - in how "un-universal" it's becoming - not to mention the utter rat's-nest of cables I have in clear plastic boxes - some nearly 20 years old....just in case they're ever needed again.

 

someone, somewhere is probably able to list (off the top of their head) what each standard can/can't do.

 

and the USB Implementers Forum (yes it's a thing - probably the USB equivalent of DVD Forum's Steering Committee) loves to confuse things:

Of the complete list of connectors; typeA, typeB, typeA(superspeed), typeB(superspeed), miniA, miniB, miniAB, microA, microB, microAB, microB (superspeed) and typeC - Type-A, MicroUSB, and USB-C can be badged USB 3.2, but technically, only USB-C cables will achieve/support fastest USB 3.2 (2x2)speed.

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One of the issues whilst planning to install all of this inside a 130XE is the thickness and space needed of the ribbon cables for both the Sophia DVI and Ultimate board.

 

I've been looking into thinner , more flexible ribbon cable but unsure which spacing or stranding I should pick.

 

https://www.mouser.be/Wire-Cable/Flat-Cables/_/N-5ggm?P=1z0jnhrZ1z0vl9dZ1z0x86hZ1z0zp68Z1z0zlewZ1yx5jly

 

Anybody got a clue ?

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  • 2 weeks later...

So for the past 2 hours I've been trying to desolder the MMU and OS ROM to install sockets for the Ultimate 1MB with :

 

cheap desoldering pump

heated desoldering pump

vacuum desoldering pump

solder wick + flux

resoldering followed by desoldering

 

and nothing broken still but I can't seem to get the last bit of solder in the holes removed so the legs will be free.

 

One thing that aided my crappy nearby eyesight a lot compared to my Sophia install , were these https://www.mecshop.be/VTMG13 

 

Anybody got anymore hints on how I get the legs freed ?

Edited by Lastic
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I have sometimes used canned air/or compressor air to blast out a nice hot molten spot that would not clear...

I use lead based solder to change the melting point of rohs solder or old stubborn solders and then use the desoldering equipment to clear it.

A wiggle of each leg before pulling and we're done.

 

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I give up, desoldering is not my cup of tea.

 

@flashjazzcat or @Level42 could you contact me how much it would cost me to have the MMU and OS ROM socketed.

Or anybody else in Europe, I live in Antwerp (Belgium).

 

It's a matter of millimeters but I'm afraid if I continue I will do permanent damage.

At the moment everything still works so this is the point where I have to throw in the towel and accept defeat.

 

Current state of the MMU :

 

IMG_4333.thumb.JPG.7bb72a699f77cfdbc22e77f9491bea0a.JPG

 

IMG_4334.thumb.JPG.9527fdf51a948e3e597c4d0743c3f5e9.JPG

 

In the meanwhile I'll continue with what I'm capable off , soldering the MidiMate board.

 

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Since I'm born in the winter, global warming isn't my thing so I decided to go outside and do some 2 hour filing on my terrace.

 

I gradually progressed, remeasuring probably 50 times but in the end I'm happy with the result.

Will still need to do some sanding .

 

599710195_DiskdrivesideviewnoShield.thumb.JPG.e8adc27773ce2fba6b70d59fdcb2b0a0.JPG

 

619027873_Sideviewwithoutdiskdrive.thumb.JPG.3c7ba3b9951bbee009ca23ab5475fdd7.JPG

 

1535923656_ECIcutouttopview.thumb.JPG.fb6ecc39dba936b3c2d393bf9b0cbfbe.JPG

 

355951693_ECIUnoCart.thumb.JPG.2a0a229363297b430969a01a4093f87c.JPG

 

The hardest part was getting the corner of the diskdrive to fit under the corner of the keyboard. Currently it fits, keyboard hardly lifts without the shield.

 

I decided to go with this cutout on the Cartridge support so the topcase would still fit since it extends over the keyboard.

 

222596663_DiskdrivesideviewShieldon.thumb.JPG.3da4b8d51ec8f14eb6a5b242ead03d27.JPG

 

With the shield the keyboard top corner rises 1mm , will have to see how to progress once I start with the cutouts in the top case.

 

The final install should look something like this :

 

1478361632_Totaldiskdriveinstallmockup.thumb.JPG.9331f502c8bf938ac946e28143e9a522.JPG

 

Things to do :

 

Use the pylon hole to create an extra support on which the diskdrive rests 

 

Have been thinking about create an 3D printed ST like bezel to fit in front of the diskdrive. ( but lack the skills, if only my imagination could be 3D printed directly )

Currently the drive bezel is leveled with the joystick ports support, might sink it further down.

 

The black diskdrive that I received with the board was in perfect condition but the bezels are really fragile, and came loose at one end.

 

To keep the theme going I bought the white (yellowed) version of it which I will install

 

635368001_WhiteDiskdrive.thumb.JPG.c9a995dccce7ebe269146b846b5b4a0c.JPG

 

To be continued next weekend with Midi Mate on the lefthand side.

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On 6/26/2019 at 2:00 PM, Lastic said:

I give up, desoldering is not my cup of tea.

 

@flashjazzcat or @Level42 could you contact me how much it would cost me to have the MMU and OS ROM socketed.

Or anybody else in Europe, I live in Antwerp (Belgium).

 

It's a matter of millimeters but I'm afraid if I continue I will do permanent damage.

At the moment everything still works so this is the point where I have to throw in the towel and accept defeat.

 

Current state of the MMU :

 

IMG_4333.thumb.JPG.7bb72a699f77cfdbc22e77f9491bea0a.JPG

 

IMG_4334.thumb.JPG.9527fdf51a948e3e597c4d0743c3f5e9.JPG

 

In the meanwhile I'll continue with what I'm capable off , soldering the MidiMate board.

 

Dunno what kind of desoldering pump you’re using, but a good one like a Hakko FR300 or 301 would clean out those holes easy-peasy.

 

The first image is from a cruddy 130XE is disassembled for parts last summer. The second is a dead-shorted 4164 DRAM is removed from a C64 Breadbin yeasterday to socket and replace. 

 

XD5A158C9-202C-477D-9A63-C363EEE79B9E.jpeg

 

 

9E57BA82-7D7B-424A-9703-A3EC598BD871.jpeg

 

Anyway, once the solder is mostly removed, if you still have stuck legs, you can heat them with an iron until the residual stick solder melts, wiggle the leg to free it from the side of the hole and the leg should then be free to move. Once you’ve similarly freed all the legs you can easily lift the part out.

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It's been my experience that solder pumps work better when the pump is held with the tip facing the sky and the board is held above the tip. Gravity helps draw the solder into the pump. Also, keep replace the filter in the solder pump often for maximum suction.

 

 

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After mocking up the 3 MIDI ports MidiMate XEL, I Will have to refrain to the 1040STFM design of 2 MIDI ports, since 3 ports and it’s PCB just don’t fit with the top case.

 

New SIO2MIDI ordered.

 

In the meanwhile continuing with the drive cutout and maybe a “ST style” 3D printed bezel

Edited by Lastic
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  • 3 weeks later...

In the meanwhile my 130XE returned from Jon whose qualified hands installed the sockets I was unable to do after 2 days of frustration.

 

I still need to order the 30C (there is no 28C version) ribbon cable from Mouser but why do they charge 20 EUR for a 8 EUR cable ,  I know custom duties ...
I went with this cable since it allows a lot more bending than the original ribbon cable.

 

As such I started with the 20C cable swap but I need to double-check my pin layout , I think the IDE connector is now reversed.

Also thinking of cutting part of the shield so the cable has a bit more room and maybe run the 28C cable along the same path.

 

1907702788_Ultimatewithoutshield.thumb.JPG.2e3c2fc95229cbea8f115681d816dd77.JPG1319267804_Ultimatewithshieldmockup.thumb.JPG.b421607f941e37d4f7640481cef53c0e.JPG

 

After this I decided to continue my afternoon-evening with a 2 hour filing session to create the cutout for the diskdrive, almost there and yes still with the shield in place.

I did have to remove the 3 screws from the keyboard bottom-side , maybe I'll install flush ones.

 

 526722471_130XESideviewcutoutdiskout.thumb.JPG.6d8d17070c086339a12579969918032a.JPG

 

1921860951_130XESideviewcutoutdiskin.thumb.JPG.7d3100de395f84eec85707f1d3f25b9d.JPG

 

77071105_130XEdiskdrivenotopcase.thumb.JPG.516bad4b5ffc5b33b1d5292c758d47a2.JPG

 

I did have to cut more from the cartridge stand to lower the diskdrive further

 

1613986424_130XEdiskdrivecartridgecutout.thumb.JPG.5f9f062400f897a8081382fb74a3028d.JPG

 

312190172_130XEtopcaseclosedUltimateDiskdrive.thumb.JPG.48f35e29806f8d1c090e5022f4d4e843.JPG

 

This is the actual diskdrive that might be used unless I create a 3D printed bezel for the other black one.
Still needs some further filing with the added dimension of the bezel.

 

1354918181_130XESideviewTOBEdiskdrivebezel.thumb.JPG.1a8788989e1af8c3b8f073fdf6303e98.JPG

223148387_130XESideviewTOBEdiskdrivecloseup.thumb.JPG.2695bf26b3f08b8d788aef8f7b1296bf.JPG

1288076478_130XERearviewTOBEdiskdrivegap.thumb.JPG.cd261946e4b21e4c062c137ff853dac7.JPG

 

Still waiting on the delivery of the SIO2MIDI boards from OSH Park to install and start on the lefthand side of the case with the MIDI port cutouts.

A mockup of the progress so far ...

 

2063102624_130XEnotopcaseUltimatediskdrive.thumb.JPG.c119bb44c84b72286ef827cf342fde6e.JPG

 

1501216787_130XESideviewnotopcaseUltimateDiskdrive.thumb.JPG.5efaabe2bab9dda147634b8eb2955276.JPG

 

I must say that this has become quite a fun and challenging project , to be continued ...

Edited by Lastic
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A question to those more knowledgeable than me, obviously the drive with its exposed bottom part cannot rest like that on the shield.

 

What kind of tape could I use between the shield and the drive's electronics bottom side , also there is the motor hole which rotates during disk access ?

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And another idea, I was thinking of cutting off the midi port section of an ST case to add to the SIO2MIDI , make a cutout in the topcase of the 130XE so it fits over it ?

 

Anybody has a really bad ST bottomcase I can salvage ?

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22 hours ago, Lastic said:

And another idea, I was thinking of cutting off the midi port section of an ST case to add to the SIO2MIDI , make a cutout in the topcase of the 130XE so it fits over it ?

 

Anybody has a really bad ST bottomcase I can salvage ?

 

Found another possible solution , these guys are making a 3D printed ST case

https://www.exxoshost.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=62&t=224&sid=a961f96ee8963566ef0bbb27ef03b05b&start=180

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Today my SIO2MIDI PCB's arrived, I only need one so if anybody in Europe needs one, let me know.

 

I decided to further file down the cutout for the diskdrive, it now sits flush and the topcase fits over it.

 

Thus I soldered my internal diskdrive's pcb power wires and had a try to see if the diskdrives work (didn't had a chance to test them) which they did.

I might need a bigger flex cable from the drive to the PCB since it's a bit short .

 

573363978_DiskdrivePCBMockup.thumb.JPG.771311aed02ace2e772bb7a935dfd60e.JPG

 

But then solder the SIO wires , like in the picture zaxon (the seller of this PCB) provided me

 

843038729_DDPCBSIOpinout.thumb.jpg.6f37f2bea581412457f44b6418349afa.jpg

 

The pins on the SIO connector seems to be allergic to solder since it won't stick, should I scratch them or what am I doing wrong ?

Another idea was to solder them at the bottom side of the PCB but I must find a way to get them back inside , one possiblity is enlarge the standoff hole since I don't have any use for it anymore ?

 

30C Flex-cable from Mouser is incoming so continue with the Ultimate install and tomorrow I'll start soldering the SIO2MIDI PCB .

Already took some measurements on where the holes can be created in the topcase , still unsure wether I'll 

  1. Have my friend create a 3D printed Midi standoff including the Midi in - out and little notes like on the ST , make a rectangular cutout in the XE topcase that fits over it
  2. Salvage a broken ST case and cutout that part , same procedure as number 1
  3. Just create the holes in the top case (lazy option)

 

Edited by Lastic
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Didn't feel like soldering my SIO2MIDI PCB so did the wiring for the diskdrive PCB instead.

 

I figured out that scratching the pins on the SIO connector made them like solder.

 

419092816_DiskdrivewiredupwithFFC.thumb.JPG.cf923796942a98313f0a830941e4959c.JPG

 

And first format of a taped-off 1,44Mb 3,5" disk.

 

590272533_FormattingFloppy.thumb.JPG.079e19f6a5afc3bdbbc5f2cc83303a0b.JPG

 

Man, I forgot how much noise floppydrives make :)

 

303250752_Diskdrivereading.thumb.JPG.c809e9a59cf732a90fb067f8788ab377.JPG

 

Not sure if this is correct amount of free sectors after copying the DOS files , what was the calculation again ? :)

 

DOS_Floppy.thumb.JPG.72f52eb2742067e14226417f62e48366.JPG

 

Tomorrow the ribbon cable to complete my Ultimate install arrives and depending the energy I can find with these tropical exhausting temperatures , install that and solder the SIO2MIDI.

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1 minute ago, Lastic said:

I figured out that scratching the pins on the SIO connector made them like solder.

There's also another method. Just put some Hydrocholirc Acid on it with a q-tip and once you heat it up with your soldering iron, suddenly it "sticks". That's "zoutzuur" and a "wattenstaafke" in Dutch :D

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