Multi Boot Loader for USB/eMMC

[moonchilddave]

On 6/12/2021 at 4:33 PM, 0_obeWAN said:

I usually do it the other way around.
- I install Windows on USB and I duplicate on the internal M.2 card, which erases it completely.
- I reduce the Windows partition and create my other partitions to the desired size.
- In each of the partitions I restore a system that I have previously backed up with DiskGenius in .pmf format that restore filesystem to

So if I were you, I would backup the Batocera and Ubuntu partitions. And I would transfer Windows to M.2 internal + restore the backups

 

Ok, I now have Windows and Batocera installed on the M.2 and working great.  For the life of me though, I can't figure out how to get Ubuntu to install entirely on the M.2 card.  When installing, I created a 512MB EFI system partition on /dev/sda6 and told the installer to place the boot loader (grub) on that partition - but for some reason it installs the boot loader on the system partition.  Any idea on how to get around this?  Sorry for the poor picture quality, my phone hates taking pictures of the TV.

If I re-flash the Atari - the bootloader for Ubuntu goes away... which is not exactly desirable.

 

Edited June 17, 2021 by moonchilddave

[0_obeWAN]

23 hours ago, moonchilddave said:

Ok, I now have Windows and Batocera installed on the M.2 and working great. 

Hello,

At this point my method

In Windows disk manageur I reduce Windows primary partition with size you want for Ubuntu

I create a new partition, don' t have to format

In Ubuntu find your partiton, create, format EXT4 with "\" for partition

For Grub, sorry I forget  the name of partition in Linux but this is the first EFI partition on eMMC (This partition serves no other purpose than Grub, not for Apertis)

 

With rEFInd VCS or Grub VCS Multi boot loader you can delete Grub for Ubuntu BUT You don't see Atari logo during start, only texte

To keep logo indicate to rEFInd VCS or Grub VCS to point bootx64.efi

[0_obeWAN]

23 hours ago, moonchilddave said:

 

If I re-flash the Atari - the bootloader for Ubuntu goes away... which is not exactly desirable.

No  Because your Grub is on first partition on eMMC is efi(0) on picture

Restauration disk don't format this first partition I believe, verify but I think it doesn't format it

[moonchilddave]

5 hours ago, 0_obeWAN said:

No  Because your Grub is on first partition on eMMC is efi(0) on picture

Restauration disk don't format this first partition I believe, verify but I think it doesn't format it

I can confirm that if you use the flasher provided by Atari here: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17TeJMIZcLIsGMJEHlQAxOb_YdIuX4GoL4bvBExAudWU/ it does indeed erase the Ubuntu/grub boot loader installed on efi(0).  I'm thinking that what I want to do is back that partition up and restore it to the M.2 drive.  Just wanted others who may be reading to be aware of this catch, as it might save them some time and frustration. 

So I copied the contents of efi(0) to the EFI partition I created on M.2 drive and it now works as expected... without losing the Atari logo on boot.

Edited June 18, 2021 by moonchilddave

[moonchilddave]

So now I'm running into an issue with using Disk Genius to copy the rEFInd files to the efi(1) & efi(2) partitions.

 

Do you need the paid version to copy?  I tried dragging the EFI folder to both partitions but nothing happens.  The partitions look like they are locked or something.

[0_obeWAN]

12 minutes ago, moonchilddave said:

So now I'm running into an issue with using Disk Genius to copy the rEFInd files to the efi(1) & efi(2) partitions.

 

Do you need the paid version to copy?  I tried dragging the EFI folder to both partitions but nothing happens.  The partitions look like they are locked or something.

Does you eMMC isn't read only or offline ? It works with free version I just try

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[moonchilddave]

13 minutes ago, 0_obeWAN said:

Does you eMMC isn't read only or offline ? It works with free version I just try

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It looks locked to me...

[moonchilddave]

Says the drive is read only, offline.

 

 

Edited June 19, 2021 by moonchilddave

[moonchilddave]

Ok, I'm an idiot, missed the part about taking the drive online.  Got it up now, but why so many multiple choices?

[0_obeWAN]

1 hour ago, moonchilddave said:

Ok, I'm an idiot, missed the part about taking the drive online.  Got it up now, but why so many multiple choices?

You have to try one by one choose good ones and mask those you don't need (Supp and confirm only mask)

Eatch one icons point to an .efi file or bootable Linux image 

[moonchilddave]

1 hour ago, 0_obeWAN said:

You have to try one by one choose good ones and mask those you don't need (Supp and confirm only mask)

Eatch one icons point to an .efi file or bootable Linux image 

I found hitting DEL (not Delete) over an icon pops up a dialog to hide it.  Confirm, and all is great!  Thanks for all your help!!!

Edited June 19, 2021 by moonchilddave

[zzip]

I want my VCS to boot into my ubuntu installation on my m.2. SSD by default.   I thought I could do this in BIOS, but I don't see a way to permanently change the boot order in BIOS.  

 

I put reFind on a USB flashdrive,  and that does the trick, but I'd like to do it without a USB drive.

 

to summarize this thread, is the best practice to install refind on both of the VCS eMMC partitions?   Or is there something else I should try?

[0_obeWAN]

24 minutes ago, zzip said:

to summarize this thread, is the best practice to install refind on both of the VCS eMMC partitions?   Or is there something else I should try?

If the UEFi starts on the eMMC, there is no choice but to copy rEFInd to both partitions of the eMMC.

[zzip]

22 hours ago, 0_obeWAN said:

If the UEFi starts on the eMMC, there is no choice but to copy rEFInd to both partitions of the eMMC.

What about secure boot?  One of my fears is that Atari releases an update that updates the bios, reenables Secure Boot and changes the password again?   Looks like according to this thread reFind won't work with Secure Boot?   But the refind docs do have some instructions on how to work with secure boot

[0_obeWAN]

21 hours ago, zzip said:

What about secure boot?  One of my fears is that Atari releases an update that updates the bios, reenables Secure Boot and changes the password again?   Looks like according to this thread reFind won't work with Secure Boot?   But the refind docs do have some instructions on how to work with secure boot

I hope Atari will not make the mistake of blocking the bios with a new password. I think it would create a lot of disappointment in their community.

If they do this, they won't be able to counter Grub2 which is native to Ubuntu and therefore supported by Atari.

However, this would mean not being able to run Batocera anymore, which would be a tragedy for me, which is why I don't update my consoles anymore, I don't want to run that risk.

For my part I don't use the Atari OS anymore, I'm waiting for an alternative (which may never come) because as it is and to remain polite the VCS Dashboard is really "minimalist" and sticks to the announced specifications, not more

The more time passes and the more my disappointment grows 

 

Edited August 11, 2021 by 0_obeWAN
Modify for reply (I forget to reply)

[zzip]

2 hours ago, 0_obeWAN said:

I hope Atari will not make the mistake of blocking the bios with a new password. I think it would create a lot of disappointment in their community.

If they do this, they won't be able to counter Grub2 which is native to Ubuntu and therefore supported by Atari.

However, this would mean not being able to run Batocera anymore, which would be a tragedy for me, which is why I don't update my consoles anymore, I don't want to run that risk.

For my part I don't use the Atari OS anymore, I'm waiting for an alternative (which may never come) because as it is and to remain polite the VCS Dashboard is really "minimalist" and sticks to the announced specifications, not more

The more time passes and the more my disappointment grows 

 

If they change the password, then I'm sure it's only a matter of time until somebody finds the new one.   It's happened a few times already.

 

But I have a secure-boot compatible ubuntu, and I don't want the boot loader to break if they reenabled secure boot,  so sounds like Grub2 would be a better choice than refind?

 

I don't really plan to use Atari OS much either

[zzip]

On 3/17/2021 at 5:28 PM, 0_obeWAN said:

 

[ATARI VCS 800] USB Multi boot Grub2 VCS 

 

I installed this to a USB device.   Looks great!  Only problem is it is defaulting to the Atari OS, and I want it to default to my Ubuntu installation.   I looked at the config file, but I'm not quite sure how to force this?

[zzip]

23 hours ago, zzip said:

I installed this to a USB device.   Looks great!  Only problem is it is defaulting to the Atari OS, and I want it to default to my Ubuntu installation.   I looked at the config file, but I'm not quite sure how to force this?

Actually I figured this out, I was looking at the wrong part of the config file.

[ConstititutionalCommando]

Ok, so I tried the eMMC (permanent) Multi boot Grub2 VCS and the Atari OS forced an update and it cleared this method from working.  Next, I tried the USB Multi boot Grub2 VCS method and it work.  I had to update the config file on the usb drive to move Windows up one spot to the default #1 boot priority position.  This works for me because the system will boot into the #1 selected OS after roughly 10 seconds of inactivity.  Can we use a gamepad to select the OS, or are we stuck with a keyboard only input at the boot screen?  

[zzip]

9 hours ago, ConstititutionalCommando said:

Ok, so I tried the eMMC (permanent) Multi boot Grub2 VCS and the Atari OS forced an update and it cleared this method from working.  Next, I tried the USB Multi boot Grub2 VCS method and it work.  I had to update the config file on the usb drive to move Windows up one spot to the default #1 boot priority position.  This works for me because the system will boot into the #1 selected OS after roughly 10 seconds of inactivity.  Can we use a gamepad to select the OS, or are we stuck with a keyboard only input at the boot screen?  

That would be nice, but you'd need to find a bootloader that supports it, or convince the existing ones to add the feature.

 

By the time you pair the controller, the bootloader is likely to timeout and select the default, so you'd need to set a longer timeout

 

What I did was buy a small wireless keyboard like this.   It's the size of a game controller, but has built in keys and mouse to get you out of the situations where a program is looking for KBM input

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07QNPX8C2?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2_dt_b_product_details

[ConstititutionalCommando]

Ok, now I don't know what happened as the USB Multi boot Grub2 no longer shows my Windows installation as a selectable OS in the boot menu.  The only change to the internal M.2 drive was when I partitioned the M.2 drive to add 1.75 GB of roms.  I formatted the unused space as NTFS.  I can still boot into Windows if I enter into the BIOS and select Windows, so I'm not sure why it's missing as an option through the usb boot menu.  I wiped the usb drive and reinstalled the Grub2 and still no luck.  On a positive note, somehow I am now able to access the BIOS with the celebrate password and I disabled the password.  Strange but true.

[TSOLfan]

Not sure if this is the right topic, but seemed to be the closest.

 

I followed the following tutorial using my own Windows ISO to get a multi loader using GRUB on a M.2 drive I had in a USB enclosure since I had read reports that installing Windows directly to the M.2 installed internally proved troublesome, and everything worked perfectly.

 

 

Then I removed the M.2 from the USB enclosure, installed it internally to free up the USB port and updated my BIOS to change the boot order to boot from the M.2 first instead of the eMMC.

 

Though, now the GRUB multi boot loader no longer displays, the VCS just boots straight into Windows.

 

Using DiskGenius, I checked and the M.2 drive still has both WinToUSB partitions.

 

Is there something else I need to change given that the M.2 drive is now internal and not in a USB enclosure in order to get GRUB to once again display?

 

[zzip]

7 minutes ago, TSOLfan said:

 

Then I removed the M.2 from the USB enclosure, installed it internally to free up the USB port and updated my BIOS to change the boot order to boot from the M.2 first instead of the eMMC.

 

Though, now the GRUB multi boot loader no longer displays, the VCS just boots straight into Windows.

 

Using DiskGenius, I checked and the M.2 drive still has both WinToUSB partitions.

 

Is there something else I need to change given that the M.2 drive is now internal and not in a USB enclosure in order to get GRUB to once again display?

 

As far as I know, USB takes priority over internal and eMMC takes priority over m.2

 

I don't know if this can be permanently changed in BIOS.   I've tried but somehow eMMC always boots before m.2. except when you set the "next boot" flag (I assume that's what PC Mode does).  However after "next boot" the boot order reverts to usual USB->eMMC->m.2

 

What I ended up doing was putting reFINd or Grub onto a USB flash drive and use that to decide which OS to boot into.

 

But my preference would be to put grub on m.2 and have m.2. be the boot device, but so far no luck.   If I was to do it again, I'd install my OS onto external SSD and use m.2. for extra storage.

 

Maybe there is a magic BIOS setting to get the boot order the way you and I would like, but it feels like Atari is doing so magic behind the scenes to force a certain order (possibly to prevent these from getting bricked?)

[joeatari1]

30 minutes ago, TSOLfan said:

Not sure if this is the right topic, but seemed to be the closest.

 

I followed the following tutorial using my own Windows ISO to get a multi loader using GRUB on a M.2 drive I had in a USB enclosure since I had read reports that installing Windows directly to the M.2 installed internally proved troublesome, and everything worked perfectly.

 

 

Then I removed the M.2 from the USB enclosure, installed it internally to free up the USB port and updated my BIOS to change the boot order to boot from the M.2 first instead of the eMMC.

 

Though, now the GRUB multi boot loader no longer displays, the VCS just boots straight into Windows.

 

Using DiskGenius, I checked and the M.2 drive still has both WinToUSB partitions.

 

Is there something else I need to change given that the M.2 drive is now internal and not in a USB enclosure in order to get GRUB to once again display?

 

 

16 minutes ago, zzip said:

As far as I know, USB takes priority over internal and eMMC takes priority over m.2

 

I don't know if this can be permanently changed in BIOS.   I've tried but somehow eMMC always boots before m.2. except when you set the "next boot" flag (I assume that's what PC Mode does).  However after "next boot" the boot order reverts to usual USB->eMMC->m.2

 

What I ended up doing was putting reFINd or Grub onto a USB flash drive and use that to decide which OS to boot into.

 

But my preference would be to put grub on m.2 and have m.2. be the boot device, but so far no luck.   If I was to do it again, I'd install my OS onto external SSD and use m.2. for extra storage.

 

Maybe there is a magic BIOS setting to get the boot order the way you and I would like, but it feels like Atari is doing so magic behind the scenes to force a certain order (possibly to prevent these from getting bricked?)

The latest BIOS update allows you to change the boot order.  Be sure to update your BIOS to the latest version and you will be able to boot from anything without the need for GRUB.

[TSOLfan]

1 hour ago, zzip said:

As far as I know, USB takes priority over internal and eMMC takes priority over m.2

 

I don't know if this can be permanently changed in BIOS.   I've tried but somehow eMMC always boots before m.2. except when you set the "next boot" flag (I assume that's what PC Mode does).  However after "next boot" the boot order reverts to usual USB->eMMC->m.2

 

What I ended up doing was putting reFINd or Grub onto a USB flash drive and use that to decide which OS to boot into.

 

But my preference would be to put grub on m.2 and have m.2. be the boot device, but so far no luck.   If I was to do it again, I'd install my OS onto external SSD and use m.2. for extra storage.

 

Maybe there is a magic BIOS setting to get the boot order the way you and I would like, but it feels like Atari is doing so magic behind the scenes to force a certain order (possibly to prevent these from getting bricked?)

Huge thanks for the reply.

 

For me, the boot order works perfectly, the VCS definitely boots from the M.2, just no boot loader that I was getting when I had the M.2 in the USB enclosure instead.

 

And not sure if it will help you, but my process was using the Atari recovery image that's floating around, I used that to downgrade my BIOS to get a known password and confirmed that I could get in using the Atar!C3l3br8te$50Ye4r$ which I could.  Then I let the VCS do all the updates and then confirmed I could still get into the BIOS.

 

Then I used this M.2 drive (was only $50 when I ordered it last week, currently out of stock):

 

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07864V6CK/

 

in this USB enclosure:

 

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08RVC6F9Y/

 

And using that YouTube video I linked above, used WinToUSB to image the M.2 with a Windows ISO, and then plugged the USB enclosure into the VCS with no BIOS changes and it booted off of it and setup Windows without any issues.  Then I used DiskGenius from Windows on the VCS and the Grub2VCS linked in that YouTube video to copy over what was on the first partition on the M.2 drive and rebooting, the boot loader came right up and everything worked, selecting Windows, selecting Atari Apertis, with no BIOS changes.

 

Though, then I decided to disconnect the USB enclosure, take out the M.2 drive, install it internally in the VCS and the only BIOS setting I changed was this one:

 

 

And I expected to see the Grub menu once I rebooted, though, was surprised when it booted straight into Windows off of the M.2.

 

And even more surprised when holding Escape to get into the BIOS no longer worked   It showed text on screen that Escape was pressed, though, still booted Windows 10 anyways

 

Fortunately, in Windows, was able to go to Advanced Startup options and restart which loaded Windows 10 recovery options and from there I was able to launch the UEFI preferences which got me back to the BIOS and I turned off Quick Boot and Quiet Boot and then Escape worked again.

 

So that's where I'm currently at, Windows 10 booting off of the M.2 drive just fine, but the boot loader not coming up over M.2 that worked just fine when the same drive was connected via USB enclosure.

 

 

Edited April 28, 2022 by TSOLfan