+Andrew Davie Posted September 5, 2021 Share Posted September 5, 2021 (edited) I'm now up-and-running with the TouchDesigner and moviecart software on my MacBook Pro (2013) It's an interesting environment. Strange, and slightly odd in places... will be fun to play with. Anyway, I've contributed zero to this, but thought I'd show a rendering from the software. It is pretty cool... toy.mp4 Edited September 5, 2021 by Andrew Davie 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Andrew Davie Posted September 5, 2021 Share Posted September 5, 2021 I'm learning what all the code does, and how that affects the output. Here I've turned off the error diffusion/stippling. Interesting! toyx3.mp4 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+rbairos Posted September 5, 2021 Author Share Posted September 5, 2021 Hey that's really cool. Looking forward to seeing what you find. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Andrew Davie Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 Continuing with the experiments, I noticed that the algorithm prefers to select greys/whites instead of colours very similar to these. That is, would choose a grey instead of a pale green. So, I knocked out all the whites/greys from the palette to see how it would do. Also, I super-saturated the colours of the source before converting this one. I wanted to really enhance the variety of colours chosen. Finally, I chose this particular clip mostly because it has dinosaurs fighting, but also because it's incredibly messy/busy and should be very difficult to render well. The results are pretty good, considering. The super-saturation is a bit of overkill, and perhaps the brightness should be down a bit. But the removal of the white/grey colours seem to be working well. I'll do another version with the original palette and without colour super-saturation just to show the difference. That will take a few hours to finish, though. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+rbairos Posted September 6, 2021 Author Share Posted September 6, 2021 Really enjoying all the exploration you're doing. What are you using to play with the saturation? There are endless ways to manipulate the color in the existing software. Its interesting that it picks the greys instead of light greens. This suggests that my color-distance function isn't optimal in that case. Right now it just takes minimum euclidean distance, weighted by .6/.3/.1 for R/G/B I have a color weighting method parameter to select the 8-bit cell color, but notice I didn't use it in findClosestInPalette / colorDist. Maybe that will provide different selections that take hue into account better. I know there are also other published methods for finding 'best' color in a set, that I never fully explored. Happy exploring! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+rbairos Posted September 6, 2021 Author Share Posted September 6, 2021 (edited) Also, I think I'm going to change the flicker/fill pattern from two alternating checkerboards to two alternating columns, to free up more cycles. I had this originally and to be honest, the alternating checkerboards look like alternating columns in practice anyways. I'll need the extra cycles to setup the playfield bits more readily for background, as the blank spots still need to be black, not background-color. The only remaining advantage of checkerboard was that you still saw a pretty full frame, even if the youtube playback was 30hz instead of the intended 60hz. With columns, you definitely see only half the columns until you change that setting. After that may re-explore the shiften chevron pattern Thomas Jentzsch proposes earlier. Edited September 6, 2021 by rbairos Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Jentzsch Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 6 minutes ago, rbairos said: Also, I think I'm going to change the flicker/fill pattern from two alternating checkerboards to two alternating columns You should be careful here, because this will increase flicker quite a lot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Andrew Davie Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 12 minutes ago, rbairos said: Really enjoying all the exploration you're doing. What are you using to play with the saturation? There are endless ways to manipulate the color in the existing software. I ran the original through iMovie first. I don't know enough about the tool/existing software to use it competently. 12 minutes ago, rbairos said: Its interesting that it picks the greys instead of light greens. This suggests that my color-distance function isn't optimal in that case. Right now it just takes minimum euclidean distance, weighted by .6/.3/.1 for R/G/B I've just added a HSL conversion (which isn't functioning 100% yet - tomorow, though...) so that I can do a nearest-colour based on weightings on hue, saturation, lightness... rather than RGB. Results tomorrow, hopefully. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Andrew Davie Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 9 minutes ago, rbairos said: Also, I think I'm going to change the flicker/fill pattern from two alternating checkerboards to two alternating columns, to free up more cycles. Yeah, I think this is a terrible idea!! It's going to be so totally noticeable it will hurt my eyes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+rbairos Posted September 6, 2021 Author Share Posted September 6, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, Andrew Davie said: Yeah, I think this is a terrible idea!! It's going to be so totally noticeable it will hurt my eyes It still 30hz in both cases though. I'll make some test cases in emulation to compare. The checkerboards ended up looking like columns anyways. *Maybe* the chevrons though, but those end up creating swimming artifacts If I do go with checkerboards, may have to just update the background color every second line. Reason is I need to avoid the blank areas. Fastest I can do this is by setting up playfield as ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- Then setting playfield color one line, while setting background to black. Then swapping the colors for the second line. The background color will extend through the left and right sides of the screen, but maybe this will look better, and help hide the weird central rectangle viewing area I have now. Okay I'll start with that. background every two lines on the original checkerboard. Edited September 6, 2021 by rbairos Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+rbairos Posted September 6, 2021 Author Share Posted September 6, 2021 (edited) Quote I've just added a HSL conversion (which isn't functioning 100% yet - tomorow, though...) so that I can do a nearest-colour based on weightings on hue, saturation, lightness... rather than RGB. Results tomorrow, hopefully. That's cool. Look through the original colorizer.cpp I have an RGBtoLum and RGBtoHue in there, but not really explored. Edited September 6, 2021 by rbairos Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Jentzsch Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 17 minutes ago, rbairos said: It still 30hz in both cases though. Yes, but the checkerboard hides most of the flicker. There is a good reason why all flickering text kernels to this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+rbairos Posted September 6, 2021 Author Share Posted September 6, 2021 Just now, Thomas Jentzsch said: Yes, but the checkerboard hides most of the flicker. There is a good reason why all flickering text kernels to this. Okay fair enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Jentzsch Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 1 minute ago, rbairos said: Okay fair enough. That's why I was afraid that my idea from above would create too much flicker. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shawn Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 flicker = bad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Andrew Davie Posted September 7, 2021 Share Posted September 7, 2021 Here's the original clip showing the tendency towards grey. I know the colour is subtle here, but I think the colour choice might be able to be improved slightly with a better matching algorithm. In any case, you can clearly see the differences when saturation is increased! kingkong.mp4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Andrew Davie Posted September 7, 2021 Share Posted September 7, 2021 Here's a version with colour saturation increased (50% of the first version from yesterday). kingkong.mp4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+rbairos Posted September 7, 2021 Author Share Posted September 7, 2021 9 hours ago, Andrew Davie said: Here's a version with colour saturation increased (50% of the first version from yesterday). kingkong.mp4 2.53 MB · 1 download That's cool. If you want to play with the saturation in realtime during the encoding, add a 'HSV Adjust' node in the chain. The 'Saturation Multiplier' will do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+rbairos Posted September 7, 2021 Author Share Posted September 7, 2021 Thing are moving along steadily on the kernel/emulator side. I was able to find enough cycles by sacrificing the STA WSYNCs, for exact kernel entry times. So maybe full background color change per line. Fingers crossed. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Andrew Davie Posted September 7, 2021 Share Posted September 7, 2021 1 hour ago, rbairos said: That's cool. If you want to play with the saturation in realtime during the encoding, add a 'HSV Adjust' node in the chain. The 'Saturation Multiplier' will do it. That worked well, TY. Why does the tool open two identical windows when I start it? See image... I close the top one, the one underneath keeps going. Seems redundant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Jentzsch Posted September 7, 2021 Share Posted September 7, 2021 37 minutes ago, rbairos said: Thing are moving along steadily on the kernel/emulator side. I was able to find enough cycles by sacrificing the STA WSYNCs, for exact kernel entry times. So maybe full background color change per line. Fingers crossed. The code I posted should provide enough free time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+rbairos Posted September 7, 2021 Author Share Posted September 7, 2021 22 minutes ago, Thomas Jentzsch said: The code I posted should provide enough free time. Yah absolutely, your earlier changes were key. I was able to carve out a colubk, and colupf for the right kernel, and left kernel. I need to change both colors, to keep the background color a checkerboard instead of solid. Still need a few more changesto prove to myself this weeks simulations are actually TIA compliant, but hopeful. My backup was to drop one half of the audio updates from 15k to 7.5K, but luckily didn't have to touch that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+rbairos Posted September 7, 2021 Author Share Posted September 7, 2021 29 minutes ago, Andrew Davie said: That worked well, TY. Why does the tool open two identical windows when I start it? See image... I close the top one, the one underneath keeps going. Seems redundant. I'll have to see how your specific file is now set up. I had set it up to open only one performance window. PM me for details. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Andrew Davie Posted September 7, 2021 Share Posted September 7, 2021 1 minute ago, rbairos said: I'll have to see how your specific file is now set up. I had set it up to open only one performance window. PM me for details. Will PM, but it's *always* done this for me. I use the little white "STOP" square on the main window to launch it. Perhaps that's the issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Andrew Davie Posted September 7, 2021 Share Posted September 7, 2021 (edited) Here's the latest. I've played with saturation and tweaked a few other things. Perhaps too bright. But I have to say I never thought I'd see this sort of quality on the '2600 for video. It's astounding. As an aside: YouTube detected a copyright claim/breach on the Thin Lizzy song "Boys are Back in Town" so I guess that says a bit about the audio quality - at least recognisable to an algorithm Edited September 7, 2021 by Andrew Davie 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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