What games showcased the best 3D graphics on Micro Home Computer platforms? (Non-PC)

[Keatah]

Whenever I use a MAC I feel like I'm breathing through a straw - no excess capacity to do anything wild. A restrictive OS. But with the PC I can let my fat hang out. Complete with body odour! Additionally the MAC was the wrong color and looked like a toy, the diminutive size. The lack of expansion - which kept it out of industrial applications.

 

In the early years it were text modes that made the PC. Crisp. Sharp. Fast. No lag, maybe even negative lag in a sort of way. This responsiveness appealed to people that had influence and real purchasing power.

[Leeroy ST]

28 minutes ago, Keatah said:

Whenever I use a MAC I feel like I'm breathing through a straw - no excess capacity to do anything wild. A restrictive OS. But with the PC I can let my fat hang out. Complete with body odour! Additionally the MAC was the wrong color and looked like a toy, the diminutive size. The lack of expansion - which kept it out of industrial applications.

 

In the early years it were text modes that made the PC. Crisp. Sharp. Fast. No lag, maybe even negative lag in a sort of way. This responsiveness appealed to people that had influence and real purchasing power.

Apple 3 was a bit of a mistake as well. Didn't really solve anyone's issues.

[Keatah]

I don't know what the fuck the filosafee was behind the Apple ///. As a child I found it interesting and futuristic and alluring - on paper - in the catalog. But that's about it. They never made any games for it that I know of. And if they did, they were insignificant non-starters.

 

Even after seeing it in TRON I didn't develop enough interest to acquire one. No. The /// was firmly a paper-release to us.

 

Eventually during the purge of the beige-box PCs (and rise of e-waste) post-dotcom I did pick up a couple of /// consoles. I think it was 6 standard issue models, and a ///+. A few years back I got rid of some of them. Kept the ///+ and 2 ///s. Not sure what to do with them as I know I'll never find the interest or time to power them up and stuff. So they sit.

[Leeroy ST]

16 minutes ago, Keatah said:

I don't know what the fuck the filosafee was behind the Apple ///. As a child I found it interesting and futuristic and alluring - on paper - in the catalog. But that's about it. They never made any games for it that I know of. And if they did, they were insignificant non-starters.

 

Even after seeing it in TRON I didn't develop enough interest to acquire one. No. The /// was firmly a paper-release to us.

 

Eventually during the purge of the beige-box PCs (and rise of e-waste) post-dotcom I did pick up a couple of /// consoles. I think it was 6 standard issue models, and a ///+. A few years back I got rid of some of them. Kept the ///+ and 2 ///s. Not sure what to do with them as I know I'll never find the interest or time to power them up and stuff. So they sit.

It's clear they thought they could grab professionals with it but there wasn't anything they really wanted from it.

 

Apple seemed like they weren't sure what direction to go in, the Lisa proves that too. I knew one guy with one and he was an enthusiast who ran the one store that sold them.

 

 

[Hwlngmad]

Battle Command, Starglider, Starglider 2, Epic, Hunter, Crammond's F1, Simulcra, and Thunderhawk were good 3D titles for the Atari ST.

[Leeroy ST]

6 hours ago, Hwlngmad said:

Battle Command, Starglider, Starglider 2, Epic, Hunter, Crammond's F1, Simulcra, and Thunderhawk were good 3D titles for the Atari ST.

I believe some of those are on Amiga too, right Murdock?  I wonder how different the versions are.

 

Thunderhawk looks interesting but is it 3D? It looks like 2D scaling, very nice 2D scaling. Looks like a game to check out otherwise 

 

[Hwlngmad]

1 hour ago, Leeroy ST said:

I believe some of those are on Amiga too, right Murdock?  I wonder how different the versions are.

 

Thunderhawk looks interesting but is it 3D? It looks like 2D scaling, very nice 2D scaling. Looks like a game to check out otherwise 

 

No doubt there are titles I listed that are on the Amiga.  However, the ST could (usually) do 3D better than the Amiga due to its slightly faster processor.  Also, regarding Thunderhawk, Moby Games states, "Thunderhawk AH-73M a 3D action/simulation helicopter game".  But, I do see where one could see it being very similar with 2D scaling.

[Leeroy ST]

2 hours ago, Hwlngmad said:

No doubt there are titles I listed that are on the Amiga.  However, the ST could (usually) do 3D better than the Amiga due to its slightly faster processor.  Also, regarding Thunderhawk, Moby Games states, "Thunderhawk AH-73M a 3D action/simulation helicopter game".  But, I do see where one could see it being very similar with 2D scaling.

Well to be fair, a lot of isometric games were called 3D back then, so something like Thunderhawk probably qualified back at release, even more so..

[JamesD]

On 7/27/2021 at 12:48 AM, Keatah said:

Elite on Apple II

StarGlider on Amiga

Flight Simulator I and II on various platforms

Jet on Apple II and Amiga

Stellar 7 on Apple II

BallBlazer on various platforms

Carrier Command on Amiga

Rescue on Fractalus on Atari 8-bit

Star Raiders on Atari 8-bit

Marble Madness on various platforms

Zaxxon on various platforms

 

A variety of interactive graphic novels had nicely drawn scenes. But that's not animated 3D done on the microprocessor.

 

There's more for sure.

 

That's a pretty good list.
Then there's:
Falcon
F-18
A bunch of Battlezone, Star Wars, etc... clones

Marble Madness and Zaxxon are isometric, so not sure they are what the author meant.  ISO does some calculation to see what is drawn first, but that's it.  They are just advanced tile engines.
There were a boatload of iso games on the Spectrum.
Star Raiders uses scaled sprites rather than wireframe, but it's 3D ish and uses some real math rather than just scrolling like some isometric games (Zaxxon).
 

 

Edited August 30, 2021 by JamesD

[+Muddyfunster]

Thunderhawk by Core (1991) is not 2d scaling. Play it and see  

[Leeroy ST]

3 hours ago, Muddyfunster said:

Thunderhawk by Core (1991) is not 2d scaling. Play it and see  

Yeah, I was thrown off by the part of the game that looks like it was:

 

 

But yeah it's 3D.

[+davidcalgary29]

3D was usually nothing more than a gimmick, and not an essential part of the gameplay mechanics, so it wasn't something that drew my interest at the time. The exception for me was A8 MIDI Maze, which blew me away when I played it for the first time on my 130XE in 1989. It still does, really. It's just tragic that it never received a commercial release.

[Leeroy ST]

3 hours ago, davidcalgary29 said:

3D was usually nothing more than a gimmick, and not an essential part of the gameplay mechanics, so it wasn't something that drew my interest at the time. The exception for me was A8 MIDI Maze, which blew me away when I played it for the first time on my 130XE in 1989. It still does, really. It's just tragic that it never received a commercial release.

I think 1989's midwinter is when 3D started to become a big deal in gameplay experience.

[Keatah]

That seems a little early. Having said that, I wasn't much into PC gaming in earnest till the quintessential Doom, Raptor, and Tubular Worlds arrived.

 

Early on there were a number of Apple II games I thoroughly enjoyed. Most weren't heavy hitters in the popular culture scheme of things.

 

Way Out

Horizon V

Epoch

Hadron

Bill Budge's Space Album

Bill Budge's Trilogy of Games

Space Vikings

A2-FS1

Flight Simulator II

International Grand Prix

Star Dance

Space Raiders

..and likely others I don't recall at this instant.

 

[NoBloodyXLOrE]

Star Wars: The Arcade Game (1983) was a very impressive 3D title graphically, and while there were some pretty good 8-bit ports (the ColecoVision, Atari 8-bit, and 5200 ports are generally considered fairly favorably), the 16-bit Atari ST and Amiga versions were almost arcade-perfect, having only a little bit of pixelation.

Star Raiders is probably the quintessential 3D game on the Atari 8-bit home computers, with a 5200 version too.

[KG7PFS]

You should see Koronis Rift and Rescue on Fractalus on the Tandy Color Computer 3. The Commodore and Atari versions are good, but the CC3 version is much better. I also suggest that you not look at the Apple II versions of those games.

[Leeroy ST]

12 hours ago, KG7PFS said:

You should see Koronis Rift and Rescue on Fractalus on the Tandy Color Computer 3. The Commodore and Atari versions are good, but the CC3 version is much better. I also suggest that you not look at the Apple II versions of those games.

Curious, what ways is the TCC3 version better? 

[KG7PFS]

5 hours ago, Leeroy ST said:

Curious, what ways is the TCC3 version better?

Better detail in almost every part of the picture. The CC3 displayed 320X192 in 16 colors, 64 colors available, with no character cells or other limits. The later Apples have even higher resolution (560X192-16), but the Apple screenshots I've seen for these games appear to use the early Apple II/II+ 280X192 in 6 colors, with an attempt at artifact colors.

 

 

[IntelliMission]

Carrier Command is an interesting case. An amazing 3D open world game that worked perfectly on the PC, Amiga and Atari ST, it also was ported to the ZX Spectrum, Amstrad CPC and Commodore 64.

 

Apparently, not too many people even saw or played the 8 bit versions (at least the Amstrad one) back in the day, and Amstrad/Spectrum magazines did not pay too much attention to it either.

 

So the thing is, they turned the C64 version into a top down shooter (considering this and the deformed looking Hard Drivin' port, I wonder if the C64 had any problem with 3D graphics?), but somehow they made really good Amstrad and Spectrum ports:

 

 

[Parker77]

On 10/4/2021 at 10:23 AM, IntelliMission said:

Carrier Command is an interesting case. An amazing 3D open world game that worked perfectly on the PC, Amiga and Atari ST, it also was ported to the ZX Spectrum, Amstrad CPC and Commodore 64.

 

Apparently, not too many people even saw or played the 8 bit versions (at least the Amstrad one) back in the day, and Amstrad/Spectrum magazines did not pay too much attention to it either.

 

So the thing is, they turned the C64 version into a top down shooter (considering this and the deformed looking Hard Drivin' port, I wonder if the C64 had any problem with 3D graphics?), but somehow they made really good Amstrad and Spectrum ports:

 

 

 

Yeah the C64 had a slower processor than the other two that didn't lend itself well to 3D.

My votes would go to Stunt Car Racer and Hunter both on the Amiga.

 

Hunter was basically a proto GTA - an open map and full freedom to roam it and tackle missions in any order.

The Freescape games deserve a mention as well - Driller, Dark Side, Castle Master, culminating in a full construction kit.

[mr_me]

On 8/30/2021 at 12:24 AM, JamesD said:

That's a pretty good list.
Then there's:
Falcon
F-18
A bunch of Battlezone, Star Wars, etc... clones

Marble Madness and Zaxxon are isometric, so not sure they are what the author meant.  ISO does some calculation to see what is drawn first, but that's it.  They are just advanced tile engines.
There were a boatload of iso games on the Spectrum.
Star Raiders uses scaled sprites rather than wireframe, but it's 3D ish and uses some real math rather than just scrolling like some isometric games (Zaxxon).
 

 

Even if it uses 2D graphics or pseudo isometric graphics, the game should be based on a 3D model in memory to be considered a 3D game.  The Marble Madness developer does a post mortem presentation explaining how it's based on simple 2D tricks.

 

The question here is specifically about 3D graphics so scaled 2D sprites isn't 3D graphics even if it's positioned in a 3D model in memory.

Edited October 7, 2021 by mr_me

[zzip]

On 10/3/2021 at 5:15 PM, KG7PFS said:

Better detail in almost every part of the picture. The CC3 displayed 320X192 in 16 colors, 64 colors available, with no character cells or other limits. The later Apples have even higher resolution (560X192-16), but the Apple screenshots I've seen for these games appear to use the early Apple II/II+ 280X192 in 6 colors, with an attempt at artifact colors.

 

The Coco 3 may have been capable of 320x192x16 but this image is clearly using something like 160x192.  You can tell from how fat the pixels are.

[Keatah]

3 hours ago, mr_me said:

I'll add the game Jefighter (1988) by Velocity for PC.  I was impressed by how fast and smooth the 3D animation was even though the 3D world was sparse.

Loved that. They also had a Jet Fighter II. IIRC wasn't there some commonality or something between those and F/A-18 Interceptor for the Amiga?

[Pokeypy]

Seems, there were different approaches to 3D. Most impressed I was with:

Vector Graphics: Elite (ZX Spectrum), "Mercenary I (Escape from Targ)" (A8)

Filled Vector Graphics: Starglider II, F/A 18-Interceptor, Virus, Falcon (all Amiga)

Raycasting: Wayout (A8), Alien Breed 3D (Amiga 1200)

 

Don't have a clue, how "Rescue on Fractalus" (A8) does it.

 

"Alien Breed 3D" was like "The 486 of that guy down the street can run Doom alright. Oh look, the A1200 can run something, that's not totally different, too. And it even has an 'Aliens' theme".

 

When you take the flight simulations and something like "Carrier Command" or even "Test Drive" into account or you add even isometric games, actually quite a lot of games used 3D.

Psion Flight Simulation on the ZX Spectrum was probably the first thing I saw:

 

 

Mercenary I and Starglider II were probably the ones, that were most impressive to me.

And, yeah, alright, Doom and what came after it, too.

On the other hand, "Frontier - Elite II" wasn't.

Edited October 7, 2021 by Pokeypy

[JamesD]

6 hours ago, zzip said:

The Coco 3 may have been capable of 320x192x16 but this image is clearly using something like 160x192.  You can tell from how fat the pixels are.

I just asked the guy that patched it to take advantage of the 6309.  It's 160x192x16.