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The 100 MHz 6502!


RobertB

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And the 65F02 works with a Commodore PET 8032!  Think about the other machines it may support!  See

http://www.e-basteln.de/computing/65f02/65f02/#supported-host-systems

Truly,
Robert Bernardo
Fresno Commodore User Group - http://www.dickestel.com/fcug.htm
Southern California Commodore & Amiga Network - http://www.portcommodore.com/sccan
Nov. 6-7 Commodore Los Angeles Super Show 2021 - http://www.portcommodore.com/class

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(Juergen has given me permission to post his responses to me.)

Fri., Oct. 15

Many thanks for reaching out! Yes, I have been thinking about supporting the
VIC-20, which should be a more realistic proposition than the C64 (with its
6510 and memory banking trickery...)

But I will probably look into an upgraded version of the 65F02 first, most
likely based on the Spartan-7: As I add more host computers, I am running
into timing bottlenecks in the FPGA. The address decoder (which has to
decide when to route a bus access to the fast internal RAM or to the
external bus) sits on a timing-critical path, and starts to get in the way
of 100 MHz internal operation. I could also do with the larger RAM available
in the Spartan-7, to properly support bank-switched host designs.

Since the Spartan-7 pinout is quite different from the Spartan-6, and it
also needs different supply voltages (and one more), this means a complete
redesign of the PCB. So it will take a while, unfortunately. But looks like
a good winter project, so I hope to get it done eventually!

Sat. Oct. 16

To avoid creating false expectations, it is probably worth adding that the
chances of making the 65F02 available to a broader audience are
unfortunately pretty slim. I have explored options last year to have it
produced in quantities of 100 or so, and found that

(a) The numbers don't work out; the 65F02 would need to be more expensive
than people expect.
(b) Since I am based in Europe, the compliance hurdles are a pain in the
neck. (EMC measurements, anyone?)
(c) Managing the production and distribution would not be fun at all --
certainly not my idea of a hobby, and a job I already have...

Hence, while I very much appreciate the interest and the feedback, I don't
want to create expectations that this will be available on Tindie or
elsewhere any time soon. And on the other hand, the required BGA soldering
will unfortunately mean that only very few hobbyists could build their own
65F02.

Best regards,
Juergen

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On 10/15/2021 at 8:46 AM, carlsson said:

Aren't there already 3rd party adapters that lets you use a 6502 in a C64? If so, I would have thought the 65F02 can be adapted to work with that too, but the on-board RAM might be an issue unless it can be completely disabled.

The I/O port at $00/$01 would need be replicated in hardware, writes to $00/$01 go to RAM, as well, and those locations are available to the VIC-II.  If such an adapter exists, that would be pretty cool but the 65F02 would need to be made aware of the extra functionality.

 

32 minutes ago, RobertB said:

Many thanks for reaching out! Yes, I have been thinking about supporting the
VIC-20, which should be a more realistic proposition than the C64 (with its
6510 and memory banking trickery...)

This is what I suspected.  The C64 has a total of 80k of RAM (64k) and ROM (16k,) plus the 1k nibble-RAM for the color table.

 

As for the rest of the hurdles, maybe someone in another country can help out?  I figure if people are willing to spend extortion-level amounts of money on a 20MHz SuperCPU, the cost of a 100MHz pin-compatible replacement would be worth it, relatively.  I am not familiar with the circuitry of the SuperCPU, but I know the CPU is different (65C816, IIRC,) so the hypothetical 65F10 would not be SuperCPU software compatible.

 

But then, a 65C816 SuperCPU-compatible, 6510 pin-compatible replacement might be a fun project.  Yeah, not for me, though.  I got other things to do ;)

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