Uav rev d and atari 2600jr issues

[Jfcatari]

I installed a rev d uav into a rev f atari 2600jr ntsc

I get a picture on composite out from the uav board but the colors are all washed out. See pics.

 

The color pickup into the uav is coming from the topside of the picked up r54 resistor.

The uav is configured for the 2600 and the co4050 is still in place.

 

Any thoughts on how to fix this?

Edited March 11, 2022 by Jfcatari
Added ntsc

[+-^CrossBow^-]

Pretty sure the Jr models have the 820Ω resistor in them to improve the saturation through RF. I've not installed a UAV into a Jr model but my guess is that if you check for resistance between pins 6 and 9 of the TIA it will likely show that resistor is on the board somewhere and you very likely need to remove it or at least desolder one leg of the resistor off the board to disable it.

 

The other option would be to install it similar to the non 4050 version and just remove the jumpers off the UAV completely and solder the wires directly from the UAV locations to the pins on the TIA or nearest component that directly leads to those pins on the TIA. 

[Jfcatari]

I checked on this Atari 2600Jr Rev D.  It does not have this resistor in place.

I tried the same UAV in another 2600Jr (REV C) and I see the exact same issues, washed out colors.

 

I am picking up the color out of the TIA on pin 9 on a via above the TIA.

 

Any suggestions are welcome!

[alex_79]

Colors are correct in those pictures.

 

The brightness is off. And not uniformly, but by a different amount for different objects on screen.
Which meas that the TIA LUMA signals are wired incorrectly to the UAV board, similarly to what happened with the PAL Jr consoles in this thread.

 

[Jfcatari]

Thanks for the information!

 

I will trace the CSYNC, L0, L1, and L2, pins from the NTSC TIA over to the 4050.

 

Assuming the CSYNC, L0, L1, and L2 target locations on the UAV PINS block is correct, I will add jumpers from the 4050 to UAV pins locations.

 

Edited March 13, 2022 by Jfcatari

[Jfcatari]

I traced the pins off of the TIA to the 4050. Here is what I see on the 2600jr

 

Tia 2 csync goes to 4050 pin 11

Tia 5 Lum1 goes to 4050 pin 9

Tia 7 Lum2 goes to 4050 pin 3

Tia 8 Lum0 goes to 4050 pin 7

 

I am not sure how to config the pin header on the UAV Rev d based on the details above.

 

 

Edited March 14, 2022 by Jfcatari

[Jfcatari]

I wired up the 4050 pins above to PIN location here, ignore the source pins from the 4050 in the image below.

I used the pins I traced from the NTSC TIA to the 4050

 

 

 

 

Here is the RF image:

 

 

 

Here is the AV output (similar, but darker than RF):

 

 

 

Any further suggestions?

 

[alex_79]

9 hours ago, Jfcatari said:

I traced the pins off of the TIA to the 4050. Here is what I see on the 2600jr

 

Tia 2 csync goes to 4050 pin 11

Tia 5 Lum1 goes to 4050 pin 9

Tia 7 Lum2 goes to 4050 pin 3

Tia 8 Lum0 goes to 4050 pin 7

 

I am not sure how to config the pin header on the UAV Rev d based on the details above.

 

 

That confirms that the CD4050 is wired differently in the NTSC jr (or at least in the board revision you have) compared to the NTSC 6 switch, and so that the UAV "2600" jumper configuration cannot be used here.

 

8 hours ago, Jfcatari said:

I wired up the 4050 pins above to PIN location here, ignore the source pins from the 4050 in the image below.

I used the pins I traced from the NTSC TIA to the 4050

Pictures of your board would help a lot, as it's not entirely clear what you did from the above text.

 

You should wire the signals to the 4 pads circled in red in that UAV board picture:

LUM0 to "1"
LUM1 to "2"
LUM2 to "3"
SYNC to "S"

Do not use any jumper on the UAV board.

 

Also, I'm not sure how you installed the UAV (again, pictures would be helpful):

 

• On top of the existing 4050?
• In place of it, with the 4050 relocated on the bottom of the 2600 board?
• Just connected with wires to the 4050 pins?
• Other?

 

 

 

Quote

Here is the RF image:

 

 

 

Here is the AV output (similar, but darker than RF):

 

 

The image looks closer to what it should be, but still incorrect.

Here are the color values used in "Frogger" game code:

From your last screenshots, seems like LUM0 is missing.

Do you have "Air Sea Battle", or a way to load roms on your console (Supercharger, Harmony cart, Pluscart, Unocart, etc), so you can test that game like explained in the thread linked in my previous post?

 

Anyway, the fact that it also happens on RF is concerning, as in that case you're bypassing the UAV mod.

This suggests a short, or a broken connection somewhere. Or a bad TIA chip.

Edited March 15, 2022 by alex_79

[Jfcatari]

I socketed the 4050, so I can test RF (4050 plugged in) and the UAV (plugged into 4050 socket) separately.

 

I mapped the 4050 pins on the UAV to the pin rows on the UAV.  With the mapping , I added jumpers to the UAV pin rows to satisfy the following:

 

LUM0 to "1"
LUM1 to "2"
LUM2 to "3"
SYNC to "S"

 

I hope what I am describing make sense...basically I am carrying the TIA lines to the 4050 to the correct pins on the UAV listed above.

 

 

Here is the UAV AV image:

 

Here is the RF imge

 

 

 

 

[Jfcatari]

Edit the previous message:

 

I removed the original 4050 and installed a socket. I created a PCB board that plugs into the 4050 on the jr and duplicates the 4050 sockets.  One socket for the 4050 and one for the UAV.  The jr needs to keep the 4050 in order to work correctly.

 

The board looks like this.

 

 

 

The most recent frogger pictures do need a slight tweak on the color pot. 

The green is too green.  It needs to be more on the olive color side.

 

I have the PCB gerber file if anyone it interested in it for the jr.

 

 

Edited March 16, 2022 by Jfcatari
forgot something

[alex_79]

7 hours ago, Jfcatari said:

I socketed the 4050, so I can test RF (4050 plugged in) and the UAV (plugged into 4050 socket) separately.

 

I mapped the 4050 pins on the UAV to the pin rows on the UAV.  With the mapping , I added jumpers to the UAV pin rows to satisfy the following:

 

LUM0 to "1"
LUM1 to "2"
LUM2 to "3"
SYNC to "S"

 

I hope what I am describing make sense...basically I am carrying the TIA lines to the 4050 to the correct pins on the UAV listed above.

Thanks, that clarifies things for me.

 

7 hours ago, Jfcatari said:

 

Here is the UAV AV image:

 

Here is the RF imge

 

Those looks better. The logs and red "turtles" looks a bit brighter than before, so it looks like LUM0 is there after all. Did you change something to the connections between these and the previous pictures, or the difference was just due to the camera?

 

Anyway, "Frogger" has a B&W mode which will easily show any missing "LUM" signal (sorry I didn't notice that before).

So try again with the TV TYPE switch set to B&W.

I marked three areas with LUM0, LUM1 and LUM2. If any of those signals is missing, the corresponding area will be completely  black.

 

[Jfcatari]

The first shots were from a vga monitor hooked to an AV to VGA converter.

 

Here are two av screen shots on my large screen TV taken with my phone.

Color and bw with Frogger.

The green is not as green as the photo, more olive  colored.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[alex_79]

Everything looks fine to me in those last pics.

[Jfcatari]

Thanks to all for the help and guidance!

 

I will post pictures of the pin configs for the UAV for the NTSC Atari  2600 Jr.

 

I will also send this information to Brewing Academy so that the docs get updated.  As it stands now the 2600 pin configs are wrong for the NTSC Atari 2600 Jr.

 

[+-^CrossBow^-]

41 minutes ago, Jfcatari said:

Thanks to all for the help and guidance!

 

I will post pictures of the pin configs for the UAV for the NTSC Atari  2600 Jr.

 

I will also send this information to Brewing Academy so that the docs get updated.  As it stands now the 2600 pin configs are wrong for the NTSC Atari 2600 Jr.

 

I believe they were also found to be incorrect for the 4switch units as well. I just stick to using the basic board and wiring up to the TIA pins manually so that the 4050 can remain in place etc. and I have more freedom to place the UAV where I want.

 

[Jfcatari]

Here is a diagram and picture of the setup for the NTSC 2600jr.

 

Diagram (red showing connections):

 

 

Board Picture (jumpers and a jumper wire):