+swlovinist Posted May 13, 2022 Share Posted May 13, 2022 I wanted to post these and get input as well as in the prototypes section. I recently purchased these prototypes and would like to get some help finding all the differences between these and the final releases. I could not play the I-war file on my Game Drive, but Kasumi Ninja plays fine. Attached is the footage of the I-War running on hardware. Please let me know if you are able to play I-war a different way or if the file appears to be dumped correctly. I hope you enjoy and thanks for looking! KN940524.ROM IWAR9510_2MB.ROM 20 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tempest Posted May 13, 2022 Share Posted May 13, 2022 Wow, you don't see Jaguar protos that often. Neat! 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+swlovinist Posted May 13, 2022 Author Share Posted May 13, 2022 3 minutes ago, Tempest said: Wow, you don't see Jaguar protos that often. Neat! Thank you very much Tempest. I will continue to do what I can to post if I find any prototypes the best I can. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sirlynxalot Posted May 13, 2022 Share Posted May 13, 2022 Cool. Will be interesting to see any kasumi ninja differences. Wasnt that basically a launch game? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+swlovinist Posted May 13, 2022 Author Share Posted May 13, 2022 10 minutes ago, sirlynxalot said: Cool. Will be interesting to see any kasumi ninja differences. Wasnt that basically a launch game? Nope, came out in November of 1994 about a year after launch. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctorclu Posted May 13, 2022 Share Posted May 13, 2022 Tried the games under IrataJaguar and was not able to get iWar to work there either. Maybe we can try a Flash card or Skunkboard? But was able to get Kasumi Ninja Working, so here are the pics from that: Opening Screen Hit C you the text disappears! Habaki verses No voice bits in this. In the hall you select a fighter... And then another hallway is seen behind that. Gyaku is not in the first hallway, but as someone you can fight in the second hallway. KN Pics.zip 4 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+swlovinist Posted May 13, 2022 Author Share Posted May 13, 2022 39 minutes ago, doctorclu said: Thank you for the info! Anyone have a skunkboard to try this game in? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctorclu Posted May 13, 2022 Share Posted May 13, 2022 1 hour ago, swlovinist said: Thank you for the info! Anyone have a skunkboard to try this game in? Tried on Skunkboard, but no dice for Iwar. Also checked to see if it had a header in JIFFI but looks like it does. Maybe a bad image? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+swlovinist Posted May 14, 2022 Author Share Posted May 14, 2022 9 minutes ago, doctorclu said: Tried on Skunkboard, but no dice for Iwar. Also checked to see if it had a header in JIFFI but looks like it does. Maybe a bad image? Any idea on how I can redump this game for the community? What options do I have? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctorclu Posted May 14, 2022 Share Posted May 14, 2022 9 minutes ago, swlovinist said: Any idea on how I can redump this game for the community? What options do I have? There is a cart dumping program and a set up that was described pretty well in this message: There are probably other ways. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Mitch Posted May 14, 2022 Share Posted May 14, 2022 17 minutes ago, swlovinist said: Any idea on how I can redump this game for the community? What options do I have? I can do it for you if you don't mind mailing it. Mitch 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
orange808 Posted May 14, 2022 Share Posted May 14, 2022 Had to click on this one. Got my hopes up for a second. There were rumors Atari slashed the cart size and the devs abandoned some assets during development. If true, I hope some of that turns up someday. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KidGameR186496 Posted May 14, 2022 Share Posted May 14, 2022 3 hours ago, doctorclu said: Tried the games under IrataJaguar and was not able to get iWar to work there either. Maybe we can try a Flash card or Skunkboard? But was able to get Kasumi Ninja Working, so here are the pics from that: Opening Screen Hit C you the text disappears! Habaki verses No voice bits in this. In the hall you select a fighter... And then another hallway is seen behind that. Gyaku is not in the first hallway, but as someone you can fight in the second hallway. KN Pics.zip 12.91 MB · 3 downloads Damn cool to see the canyon stage everyone saw from the teacher commercial. Is this similar to the one ViMasterJag has posted on YouTube? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctorclu Posted May 14, 2022 Share Posted May 14, 2022 20 minutes ago, KidGameR186496 said: Damn cool to see the canyon stage everyone saw from the teacher commercial. Is this similar to the one ViMasterJag has posted on YouTube? Oh yeh, that is cool. As for iWar, it is interesting, a 4 mb file when IWar was a 2mb game. When tinkering with the VirtualVCS they had 4K slots for 2600 games. Sometimes when they wanted to pad up a 4K spot they would paste the 2K image in twice. The second 2K would be ignored and the first 2K would be loaded. I wonder if that is what is going on here? I split the load at the 2 mb point, I've attached what I created so people can play with it. The second half of the rom only has 516 differences from the commercial rom. May sound like a lot, but considering that is 516 entries out of 2 mb worth of material, I thought it was fascinating. The above is from "iWar2" which currently loads to a red screen. Maybe give is a fresh header with JIFFI and see what happens? IWar1b.romiWar2.rom Of course the question I have for swlovinist when you plug in the prototype Iwar is... what shows up? Does it display a game, or does it display a black screen? I'm wondering was this a 4mb cart that had a different version in each 2 mb eprom, and somehow they could switch eproms somehow? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+CyranoJ Posted May 14, 2022 Share Posted May 14, 2022 JAGGD.EXE -rd -stub -ux "d:\downloads\IWAR951020.rom",a:$800000,x:$802000 Gets you a blank screen and an audio click. It does have a boot header which sets up the h/w, and then copies a binary to $7000 and jumps to it - the start of this file is valid code. Haven't looked further, but at this stage, if the actual physical cart boots I would say this is a bad dump. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+swlovinist Posted May 14, 2022 Author Share Posted May 14, 2022 6 minutes ago, CyranoJ said: JAGGD.EXE -rd -stub -ux "d:\downloads\IWAR951020.rom",a:$800000,x:$802000 Gets you a blank screen and an audio click. It does have a boot header which sets up the h/w, and then copies a binary to $7000 and jumps to it - the start of this file is valid code. Haven't looked further, but at this stage, if the actual physical cart boots I would say this is a bad dump. Here is the dump of the actual prototype running on actual hardware. I don't see many differences initially but know that there might be things later on in the game that are different. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jag64 Posted May 14, 2022 Share Posted May 14, 2022 19 hours ago, swlovinist said: I wanted to post these and get input as well as in the prototypes section. I recently purchased these prototypes and would like to get some help finding all the differences between these and the final releases. I could not play the I-war file on my Game Drive, but Kasumi Ninja plays fine. Attached is the footage of the I-War running on hardware. Please let me know if you are able to play I-war a different way or if the file appears to be dumped correctly. I hope you enjoy and thanks for looking! The Jaguar community is so lucky to have folks like you guys ... 12 hours ago, doctorclu said: Tried the games under IrataJaguar and was not able to get iWar to work there either. Maybe we can try a Flash card or Skunkboard? tracking down, debugging, and sharing Atari history. Awesome. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PFG 9000 Posted May 14, 2022 Share Posted May 14, 2022 22 hours ago, swlovinist said: I wanted to post these and get input as well as in the prototypes section. I recently purchased these prototypes and would like to get some help finding all the differences between these and the final releases. Did you pick those up at the Midwest Gaming Classic last month? I bought the Tempest 2000 prototype there. But I can't get mine to boot on actual hardware, and I don't have the knowledge or equipment to dump it. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctorclu Posted May 14, 2022 Share Posted May 14, 2022 38 minutes ago, PFG 9000 said: Did you pick those up at the Midwest Gaming Classic last month? I bought the Tempest 2000 prototype there. But I can't get mine to boot on actual hardware, and I don't have the knowledge or equipment to dump it. Possibly a header-less rom? Would be fun to see a Tempest 2000 proto. Mitch above said he can do it if you want to ship it to him. I know of others that have also proven reliable. I know that shipping can be a a bit of a gamble. And there is a cartridge dumping program, and details on how that would work here.. Now someone bring on the Bubsy prototype! 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lostdragon Posted May 14, 2022 Share Posted May 14, 2022 13 hours ago, orange808 said: Had to click on this one. Got my hopes up for a second. There were rumors Atari slashed the cart size and the devs abandoned some assets during development. If true, I hope some of that turns up someday. From what scraps i have pieced together over the years, this had a very troubled development cycle. The story mode was droppedr, Producer Ted Tahquechi pushed for a larger cartridge than the Tramiel's would allow, Jim Gregory claiming they actually halved the size they initally promised, wiping out months of work, characters a Goth, a Yeti etc?) and environments etc Atari flew a certain individual over to sunmyvale, where he spent a few months crunch coding, hating time there, once coding done, he got hammered, smashed up the toilets there. Atari promised HMS an amazing music system from Atari for KN on the Jaguar so they wrote loads of music, only to discover the system couldn’t handle it and Atari’s code was dreadful.. An awful lot of unconfirmed stories doing the rounds. 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunther Posted May 14, 2022 Share Posted May 14, 2022 (edited) Edited May 14, 2022 by Gunther 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clint Thompson Posted May 14, 2022 Share Posted May 14, 2022 6 hours ago, Lostdragon said: From what scraps i have pieced together over the years, this had a very troubled development cycle. The story mode was droppedr, Producer Ted Tahquechi pushed for a larger cartridge than the Tramiel's would allow, Jim Gregory claiming they actually halved the size they initally promised, wiping out months of work, characters a Goth, a Yeti etc?) and environments etc Atari flew a certain individual over to sunmyvale, where he spent a few months crunch coding, hating time there, once coding done, he got hammered, smashed up the toilets there. Atari promised HMS an amazing music system from Atari for KN on the Jaguar so they wrote loads of music, only to discover the system couldn’t handle it and Atari’s code was dreadful.. An awful lot of unconfirmed stories doing the rounds. Sounds about right, though I'm not sure how much better of a game Kasumi Ninja would have turned out regardless sadly. Always felt it looked good but gameplay was bad. The Lynx games that were stripped down to bare bones due to Atari being cheap on the other hand, well... that's a tragic loss for sure. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tempest Posted May 14, 2022 Share Posted May 14, 2022 It was sort of a vicious circle wasn't it? Atari was hard up for cash so they cheaped out on game development which lead to crappy games that not enough people bought which lead to Atari being hard up for cash. Rinse and repeat. 11 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clint Thompson Posted May 14, 2022 Share Posted May 14, 2022 (edited) 11 minutes ago, Tempest said: It was sort of a vicious circle wasn't it? Atari was hard up for cash so they cheaped out on game development which lead to crappy games that not enough people bought which lead to Atari being hard up for cash. Rinse and repeat. But then when they did get a short infusion of hard cash they dropped the ball. Definitely stretched themselves too thin with dozens of projects going on at the same time. It's like, they killed off the computer line to focus on the Jaguar then decided it was a good idea to do 20 peripherals and accessories. Games seemed to be a fraction of their pie instead of the majority of it. You can tell they really loved being in the hardware stuff though and I think that's why its always been fascinating. Edited May 14, 2022 by Clint Thompson 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctorclu Posted May 15, 2022 Share Posted May 15, 2022 1 hour ago, Clint Thompson said: You can tell they really loved being in the hardware stuff though and I think that's why its always been fascinating. Seems like whoever has owned Atari (not so much with the recent VCS) were about the gadgets. "Hey here is a color handheld game system" "Hey here is the first 64 bit system." "Hey, here is VR" "Hey, get a load of this... a game you can control with your mind (or frowning just right)." And so on. 3 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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