Lucas Lac124 Posted June 19, 2022 Share Posted June 19, 2022 I've spent the better part of a year and a half developing a replacement controller for the Atari 5200 in my (infrequent) spare time, and I hope that this will be a reasonable place to discuss both my personal progress, future prospects, and what I should be thinking about in further development of the controller. Now for some preliminaries: Does it work (what state is the controller in)? As of now, although exact wiring types, routes, and shielding, etc. are not finalized, I have made several prototype revisions whose buttons work. This has been proven using various games and both 2-port and 4-port consoles (not that the particular console revision should have any affect on performance). Original overlays have also been tested and work with the cavity provided for them. My controller has a few more curves than the original, which makes holding it a better experience in my opinion, but only a larger test sample will determine ultimately how reasonable it is to use. As the highest resistance commercially available joysticks of an approximately correct form factor are 10kΩ, I've had to take the route of previous joystick attempts and use a digital potentiometer, a microcontroller, and some capacitors to simulate the correct resistance. I am currently waiting on some perfboards and such in order to internally test this method, results should be in within several weeks on whether what I have will work for the given purpose. In short, the buttons work, the joystick does not (yet). Future (pre?-'production') goals? - Wireless connectivity --> using an Arduino: will require a battery and a secondary microcontroller: costs will go up - Some supply for made-to-order purchase (probably using eBay) - wire routing improvement and trigger button stiffening - Simplification and cost-reduction: due to long manufacture time and limited material availability, if I were to sell a controller, it would cost upwards of $100 to a buyer before shipping would be factored in. With a little help from economies of scale and an easier production process, this could be lessened. Are you willing to go 'open source' (make 3D files, code, and production documents entirely available)? Although I've considered it several times now, the time investment that has been poured into this single project is too great to be immediately given away. I can make no promises, but if I never get to a point where I can sell the controllers, I may make enough of the project available so that it can at least positively impact the community in that way. In the mean time, look out in several months for a method of purchase. Opening the Floor - What do people that have been waiting on a controller replacement want out of a controller? I've tried to make all of the buttons more tactile, the joystick self-centers, the triggers use microswitches, the controller was made specifically so that most major components can be replaced with screws alone: what other things should I consider including or altering? - Is this even something that anyone wants? Thank You, ~ Lucas Lac124. 24 7 Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/337073-making-a-new-atari-5200-controller-in-the-original-form-factor/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spzero15 Posted June 20, 2022 Share Posted June 20, 2022 This is great, let me know when it’s available. I’m in for at least 1.Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/337073-making-a-new-atari-5200-controller-in-the-original-form-factor/#findComment-5076122 Share on other sites More sharing options...
thegamezmaster Posted June 20, 2022 Share Posted June 20, 2022 Nice work! Does the controller have 2 buttons on each side like the original one? Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/337073-making-a-new-atari-5200-controller-in-the-original-form-factor/#findComment-5076148 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucas Lac124 Posted June 20, 2022 Author Share Posted June 20, 2022 1 hour ago, thegamezmaster said: Nice work! Does the controller have 2 buttons on each side like the original one? Sadly, it was not practical to add 2 sets of trigger buttons to the controller. Thankfully, this does not affect the function of the controller. 1 Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/337073-making-a-new-atari-5200-controller-in-the-original-form-factor/#findComment-5076185 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atari Nut Posted June 20, 2022 Share Posted June 20, 2022 Depending on the final cost, I would go for at least 1. Are the buttons hard plastic (excuse me if I missed this)? I like the wireless idea. Any way to make it work on an 8-bit computer... I realize the connector would need to be different as well as the wiring. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/337073-making-a-new-atari-5200-controller-in-the-original-form-factor/#findComment-5076362 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atari Nut Posted June 20, 2022 Share Posted June 20, 2022 4 hours ago, Lucas Lac124 said: Sadly, it was not practical to add 2 sets of trigger buttons to the controller. Thankfully, this does not affect the function of the controller. Aren't there some games where the top button has a different function than the bottom button? Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/337073-making-a-new-atari-5200-controller-in-the-original-form-factor/#findComment-5076364 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucas Lac124 Posted June 20, 2022 Author Share Posted June 20, 2022 10 minutes ago, Atari Nut said: Aren't there some games where the top button has a different function than the bottom button? This is a very interesting question. As far as the readily available schematics show, both the bottom and top buttons on each side of the controller are connected to the same pins in the same way, and various other remake controllers concur with this. However, what you are saying may very well be true, and if that is so, I may need to work around that limitation. In short, I don't think so, but I am not entirely sure either. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/337073-making-a-new-atari-5200-controller-in-the-original-form-factor/#findComment-5076369 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucas Lac124 Posted June 20, 2022 Author Share Posted June 20, 2022 19 minutes ago, Atari Nut said: Depending on the final cost, I would go for at least 1. Are the buttons hard plastic (excuse me if I missed this)? I like the wireless idea. Any way to make it work on an 8-bit computer... I realize the connector would need to be different as well as the wiring. The buttons are indeed hard plastic, not rubber. This may be inauthentic, but it feels better in normal use in my opinion. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/337073-making-a-new-atari-5200-controller-in-the-original-form-factor/#findComment-5076370 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGHMW Posted June 20, 2022 Share Posted June 20, 2022 7 hours ago, Lucas Lac124 said: Sadly, it was not practical to add 2 sets of trigger buttons to the controller. Thankfully, this does not affect the function of the controller. I hope that the fire button system is a similar design as that of the CX24 controller that comes with the 7800 ProSystem, that is that each fire button has a different function, and, that it works with the same bubble-contact setup as it does too, so far it looks great, put me down for at least one if not 2. 1 Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/337073-making-a-new-atari-5200-controller-in-the-original-form-factor/#findComment-5076439 Share on other sites More sharing options...
+cjherr Posted June 20, 2022 Share Posted June 20, 2022 Is the joystick analog? I’d probably pick up 2. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/337073-making-a-new-atari-5200-controller-in-the-original-form-factor/#findComment-5076454 Share on other sites More sharing options...
8bitAndy Posted June 20, 2022 Share Posted June 20, 2022 3 hours ago, Lucas Lac124 said: This is a very interesting question. As far as the readily available schematics show, both the bottom and top buttons on each side of the controller are connected to the same pins in the same way, and various other remake controllers concur with this. However, what you are saying may very well be true, and if that is so, I may need to work around that limitation. In short, I don't think so, but I am not entirely sure either. The top left and top right buttons share a pin (#14), and the bottom left and bottom right buttons share a pin (#13). Many games use the two buttons for different functions. This looks like a cool project. Atari 5200 FAQ -- 5200 Controller Pinout (atarihq.com) Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/337073-making-a-new-atari-5200-controller-in-the-original-form-factor/#findComment-5076474 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucas Lac124 Posted June 20, 2022 Author Share Posted June 20, 2022 1 hour ago, 8bitAndy said: The top left and top right buttons share a pin (#14), and the bottom left and bottom right buttons share a pin (#13). Many games use the two buttons for different functions. This looks like a cool project. Atari 5200 FAQ -- 5200 Controller Pinout (atarihq.com) Correct! In my permutation, because there are only two buttons, one is connected to pin #14, and the other is connected to pin #13. There should be no loss of functionality, but it will be interesting to see if this has any measurable effects on games, as which side trigger is pressed will affect functionality. Alternatively, I could just wire both triggers up to both pins, making it as if you are pressing both sets of triggers at once. This is a minor issue, however, and I am sure that I can iron it out by the time I get to making any measurable quantity of the controller. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/337073-making-a-new-atari-5200-controller-in-the-original-form-factor/#findComment-5076520 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucas Lac124 Posted June 20, 2022 Author Share Posted June 20, 2022 2 hours ago, cjherr said: Is the joystick analog? I’d probably pick up 2. The joystick is indeed analog and self-centering. 4 Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/337073-making-a-new-atari-5200-controller-in-the-original-form-factor/#findComment-5076521 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGHMW Posted June 20, 2022 Share Posted June 20, 2022 7 minutes ago, Lucas Lac124 said: Correct! In my permutation, because there are only two buttons, one is connected to pin #14, and the other is connected to pin #13. There should be no loss of functionality, but it will be interesting to see if this has any measurable effects on games, as which side trigger is pressed will affect functionality. Alternatively, I could just wire both triggers up to both pins, making it as if you are pressing both sets of triggers at once. This is a minor issue, however, and I am sure that I can iron it out by the time I get to making any measurable quantity of the controller. No, leave them separate, the CX24 for the 7800 has them each for a separate purpose, anyone who either owns a 7800 or who uses a CX24 with the 7800 Edition of the old AtariAge/Pixels Past Redemption 5200 interface (I do) knows that. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/337073-making-a-new-atari-5200-controller-in-the-original-form-factor/#findComment-5076527 Share on other sites More sharing options...
+cjherr Posted June 20, 2022 Share Posted June 20, 2022 9 minutes ago, Lucas Lac124 said: The joystick is indeed analog and self-centering. 2 for me! 1 Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/337073-making-a-new-atari-5200-controller-in-the-original-form-factor/#findComment-5076528 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGHMW Posted June 20, 2022 Share Posted June 20, 2022 Just now, cjherr said: 2 for me! Same! Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/337073-making-a-new-atari-5200-controller-in-the-original-form-factor/#findComment-5076530 Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwoShedsWilson Posted June 21, 2022 Share Posted June 21, 2022 I'd be curious about the cost. I've never used a 3D printed controller before so I'm a little hesitant about how durable it would be. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/337073-making-a-new-atari-5200-controller-in-the-original-form-factor/#findComment-5076740 Share on other sites More sharing options...
stringfellow Posted June 21, 2022 Share Posted June 21, 2022 looks awesome so far. I would be down for one most likely Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/337073-making-a-new-atari-5200-controller-in-the-original-form-factor/#findComment-5076758 Share on other sites More sharing options...
+-^CrossBow^- Posted June 21, 2022 Share Posted June 21, 2022 I'm more than a little curious and likely to buy one or two once released. Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/337073-making-a-new-atari-5200-controller-in-the-original-form-factor/#findComment-5076807 Share on other sites More sharing options...
+sramirez2008 Posted June 21, 2022 Share Posted June 21, 2022 On 6/19/2022 at 5:10 PM, Lucas Lac124 said: - Is this even something that anyone wants? You had me at self-centering and new side buttons. Very interested and would purchase one, possibly a pair. Thanks for sharing. 4 Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/337073-making-a-new-atari-5200-controller-in-the-original-form-factor/#findComment-5076812 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucas Lac124 Posted June 21, 2022 Author Share Posted June 21, 2022 (edited) 2 hours ago, TwoShedsWilson said: I'd be curious about the cost. I've never used a 3D printed controller before so I'm a little hesitant about how durable it would be. That is a reasonable concern. I will do some stress testing, but I am making the controller's shell and inner components fairly thick, which should alleviate the issue for the most part. That said, repairability is a focus of mine as well. Edited June 21, 2022 by Lucas Lac124 Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/337073-making-a-new-atari-5200-controller-in-the-original-form-factor/#findComment-5076818 Share on other sites More sharing options...
phuzaxeman Posted June 21, 2022 Share Posted June 21, 2022 Really great idea. The joystick looks really nice. I'm a 5200 purist and use only the original sticks but this project might change my mind. I hope the buttons have different functions because there are games where you need both the top and bottom buttons. Do you have any plans to add pause, reset, and start buttons? Any future plans so you can adjust analog settings? Thanks Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/337073-making-a-new-atari-5200-controller-in-the-original-form-factor/#findComment-5076825 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucas Lac124 Posted June 21, 2022 Author Share Posted June 21, 2022 --- UPDATE --- Thank you so much everyone for your support and questions! I do not currently have the capital at hand to make a large batch of these controllers, but things are getting finalized quickly enough that I am estimating a midsummer 8 controller batch, followed by a mid-September batch of 2-3 times that, followed by batches made as supply is required. In all cases, I will only be offering the controller through eBay, because shipping costs are reduced quite a bit through its usage. The price before shipping and tax will be equal to or below $75.00. One major point that I couldn't quite get around was the issue of cable length. The only one available at a reasonable price was 1.8m, so optional extensions of 1.8m and 3.0m lengths will also be offered as accessories, bringing the cost up to at or below $85.00 and at or below $90.00 respectively. Links will come when the time is right! Before any of that though, I am planning on making a more in-depth explanation of the strengths and weaknesses of the controller available, whether that be in video or written form. Thank you, Lucas Lacerda. 3 Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/337073-making-a-new-atari-5200-controller-in-the-original-form-factor/#findComment-5076842 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucas Lac124 Posted June 21, 2022 Author Share Posted June 21, 2022 14 minutes ago, phuzaxeman said: Really great idea. The joystick looks really nice. I'm a 5200 purist and use only the original sticks but this project might change my mind. I hope the buttons have different functions because there are games where you need both the top and bottom buttons. Do you have any plans to add pause, reset, and start buttons? Any future plans so you can adjust analog settings? Thanks The start, select, and pause buttons are the 3 at the part of the controller farthest from the joystick. They are too small to be easily labelled, but I will make sure to make some sort of diagram or some such identification for them in the future so there is no confusion. 2 Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/337073-making-a-new-atari-5200-controller-in-the-original-form-factor/#findComment-5076847 Share on other sites More sharing options...
+-^CrossBow^- Posted June 21, 2022 Share Posted June 21, 2022 13 minutes ago, Lucas Lac124 said: The start, select, and pause buttons are the 3 at the part of the controller farthest from the joystick. They are too small to be easily labelled, but I will make sure to make some sort of diagram or some such identification for them in the future so there is no confusion. Might it be possible to at least put an S, P, & R on them? 2 Quote Link to comment https://forums.atariage.com/topic/337073-making-a-new-atari-5200-controller-in-the-original-form-factor/#findComment-5076850 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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