Game design help please

[Ecernosoft]

Hi guys.

I’ve had to be in the shadow of you’re arguably better games for my entire time on AA and I am sad about it.

 

I feel that my games don’t address my audience that well, and I’m asking for help on how to make better games.

 

What sort of games would you like from me? And do you guys enjoy my stuff? ( my 2600 stuff too )

 

What criticisms do you have on my stuff? And how can I improve?

 

(And no, ICT7800 won’t be finished, it’s better as a 2600 game)

 

Thanks!

 

E.C.

Edited October 15, 2022 by Ecernosoft
Spelling error lol

[+Atarius Maximus]

On 10/15/2022 at 11:01 AM, Ecernosoft said:

Hi guys.

I’ve had to be in the shadow of you’re arguably better games for my entire time on AA and I am sad about it.

I can only speak from my own experience and why I've been a part of this hobby.   For me, it's not about comparing what I've done to what others have done, I simply work on a project or idea that is meaningful to me and then hope maybe someone else might like it too.  But it's really about me, I just work on whatever is fun for me to do, be it nostalgia for for a particular game or genre, the technical challenge of an idea, or just the personal sense of accomplishment.  If someone else likes it, that's a bonus.  Without that personal motivation or passion for a project I'd never finish anything, and is why most hobbyist programmers here dislike it when people try to peddle ideas.

 

On 10/15/2022 at 11:01 AM, Ecernosoft said:

I feel that my games don’t address my audience that well, and I’m asking for help on how to make better games.

How to make a better game is extremely open-ended and very subjective.  I've never considered a "target audience" here at AA, really.  There's a lot of information out there on the elements of game design and how to make them better.  For me much of it boils down to paying attention to the details and presenting something that feels polished and complete.  The best games seem to be from folks that take the time to do all of the little things at the end that most people find boring, once the fun of designing graphics and a basic game engine is complete. For example, spending months working on a perfect jumping mechanic can seem tedious and boring (or even just having a graphic ever so slightly off-centered when it's supposed to be centered) but that's what is noticed even if it isn't said.  It's pretty obvious which games fall into that category.

 

On 10/15/2022 at 11:01 AM, Ecernosoft said:

What sort of games would you like from me? And do you guys enjoy my stuff? ( my 2600 stuff too )

I would want a game that you were passionate about making in the first place.  It will show in the final product.  Make a game that makes it hard for you to sleep at night because you keep thinking of what you work on the next day. 

 

On 10/15/2022 at 11:01 AM, Ecernosoft said:

What criticisms do you have on my stuff? And how can I improve?

It's hard to criticize what is essentially just someone's pastime.  We all do things differently.  Focus on making it fun and don't worry so much about making it a showcase of technical challenges that were overcome.  For the forums, I'd suggest having a single thread for a single project, and if you're looking for feedback on your code post detailed info about your changes/updates, keep a good naming/versioning syntax of your choosing, update the first post in the thread with the latest attachments (and edit accordingly), comment your code well so it's easy for others to read and provide feedback, and be as specific as you can about problems you're having.  For me personally I like to post updates less frequently and look for feedback on games when they are closer to a completed state, or at least playable.  That's just me though.

 

On 10/15/2022 at 11:01 AM, Ecernosoft said:

 

(And no, ICT7800 won’t be finished, it’s better as a 2600 game)

 

Thanks!

 

E.C.

If you love working on ICT and really want a 7800 version, finish it!  That's the beauty of this, it's all for fun.  Do it for you because you want to, if you don't, that's fine.

 

Steve

[Silver Back]

I've seen you posting a lot for help and guidance on things and it's apparent that your young and ready to move mountains.  You have a fair bit of knowledge but your stuck in a cycle of comparing yourself with life long programmers and professionals who program Atari as a hobby. One day you'll be able to do things that people here couldn't even fathom but to do that you need knowledge. Absorb everything you can like a sponge, apply and reapply it and try to see a simple project through to the end. 

 

But I wouldn't have the end goal of having your next program sell, or be better than anybody else's, or to even impress anybody. Just see it through to the end, ask questions and take in all you can.  Put it out to the world if you want and take the creative criticism to heart and use the negative to harden your skin against inevitable hate.

 

But hey when I was young I wouldn't listen to me lol.  I'm no programmer either but I've worked in the same field for 14 years and the things I can do now I couldn't of imaged when I was starting out. Like everything worthwhile in life it takes time to come into your own. 

[Ecernosoft]

On 10/17/2022 at 8:13 AM, Silver Back said:

I've seen you posting a lot for help and guidance on things and it's apparent that your young and ready to move mountains.  You have a fair bit of knowledge but your stuck in a cycle of comparing yourself with life long programmers and professionals who program Atari as a hobby. One day you'll be able to do things that people here couldn't even fathom but to do that you need knowledge. Absorb everything you can like a sponge, apply and reapply it and try to see a simple project through to the end. 

 

But I wouldn't have the end goal of having your next program sell, or be better than anybody else's, or to even impress anybody. Just see it through to the end, ask questions and take in all you can.  Put it out to the world if you want and take the creative criticism to heart and use the negative to harden your skin against inevitable hate.

 

But hey when I was young I wouldn't listen to me lol.  I'm no programmer either but I've worked in the same field for 14 years and the things I can do now I couldn't of imaged when I was starting out. Like everything worthwhile in life it takes time to come into your own. 

I see. ICT is basically my passion, even if every game I make has something to do with it. It's Conner time! As a series is always based on something else. 

ICT1 scratch: Super mario land

ICTS scratch: Super mario bros. Special

ICT1 2600: Smurfs (Atari 2600, colecovision)

ICT2 2600: Metroid (It's freaking awesome!)

ICT1 7800: Take a guess. (SMB)

On 10/16/2022 at 9:07 PM, Atarius Maximus said:

I can only speak from my own experience and why I've been a part of this hobby.   For me, it's not about comparing what I've done to what others have done, I simply work on a project or idea that is meaningful to me and then hope maybe someone else might like it too.  But it's really about me, I just work on whatever is fun for me to do, be it nostalgia for for a particular game or genre, the technical challenge of an idea, or just the personal sense of accomplishment.  If someone else likes it, that's a bonus.  Without that personal motivation or passion for a project I'd never finish anything, and is why most hobbyist programmers here dislike it when people try to peddle ideas.

 

How to make a better game is extremely open-ended and very subjective.  I've never considered a "target audience" here at AA, really.  There's a lot of information out there on the elements of game design and how to make them better.  For me much of it boils down to paying attention to the details and presenting something that feels polished and complete.  The best games seem to be from folks that take the time to do all of the little things at the end that most people find boring, once the fun of designing graphics and a basic game engine is complete. For example, spending months working on a perfect jumping mechanic can seem tedious and boring (or even just having a graphic ever so slightly off-centered when it's supposed to be centered) but that's what is noticed even if it isn't said.  It's pretty obvious which games fall into that category.

 

I would want a game that you were passionate about making in the first place.  It will show in the final product.  Make a game that makes it hard for you to sleep at night because you keep thinking of what you work on the next day. 

 

It's hard to criticize what is essentially just someone's pastime.  We all do things differently.  Focus on making it fun and don't worry so much about making it a showcase of technical challenges that were overcome.  For the forums, I'd suggest having a single thread for a single project, and if you're looking for feedback on your code post detailed info about your changes/updates, keep a good naming/versioning syntax of your choosing, update the first post in the thread with the latest attachments (and edit accordingly), comment your code well so it's easy for others to read and provide feedback, and be as specific as you can about problems you're having.  For me personally I like to post updates less frequently and look for feedback on games when they are closer to a completed state, or at least playable.  That's just me though.

 

If you love working on ICT and really want a 7800 version, finish it!  That's the beauty of this, it's all for fun.  Do it for you because you want to, if you don't, that's fine.

 

Steve

I wanted a 7800 version because I own a 7800.But 7800 dev is tough because you must consider what you are going against. 

On 2600, you can get away with much less and it's still a good game. ICT1 vs ICT1 7800.... well, ICT1 7800.

I was also deving on 2600 since more people own and play their 2600 than 7800 and most don't even know the 7800. And the 7800 is so powerful yet so restricted in some key areas. 

Also, thanks. ICT is a passion project of mine. I wanted to make a "Conner game" since kindergarten, and 9 years later I get to do that!

[Jinks]

On 10/18/2022 at 4:54 PM, Ecernosoft said:

I see. ICT is basically my passion, even if every game I make has something to do with it. It's Conner time! As a series is always based on something else. 

ICT1 scratch: Super mario land

ICTS scratch: Super mario bros. Special

ICT1 2600: Smurfs (Atari 2600, colecovision)

ICT2 2600: Metroid (It's freaking awesome!)

ICT1 7800: Take a guess. (SMB)

I wanted a 7800 version because I own a 7800.But 7800 dev is tough because you must consider what you are going against. 

On 2600, you can get away with much less and it's still a good game. ICT1 vs ICT1 7800.... well, ICT1 7800.

I was also deving on 2600 since more people own and play their 2600 than 7800 and most don't even know the 7800. And the 7800 is so powerful yet so restricted in some key areas. 

Also, thanks. ICT is a passion project of mine. I wanted to make a "Conner game" since kindergarten, and 9 years later I get to do that!

Conner is better than Fred I guess. 

 

Who is Conner again? Yourself? 

 

[Ecernosoft]

Just now, Jinks said:

Conner is better than Fred I guess. 

 

Who is Conner again? Yourself? 

 

"Conner" is a character I made quite a while ago.

 

Why "Conner"? Because a name like "Mario" is too video-game character like. 

"Conner" is supposed to be a regular person, nothing special.

Edited October 27, 2022 by Ecernosoft

[Ecernosoft]

I appreciate all of your suggestions.

 

Thanks!

 

E.C.