Pixelboy Posted March 16, 2023 Share Posted March 16, 2023 49 minutes ago, NIAD said: I'm far from a programmer or hardware designer, but the bank-switching method has to be part of the CV Core in the Phoenix, otherwise the Phoenix would not be able to run any of the MegaCart rom image files. It would be akin to how all the CV emulators like BlueMSX, EmulTwo, ColEm and even ADAMem SDL could not run MegaCart rom image files originally until the emulator programmer added specific support for the MegaCart's bank-switching method. Sure, but then what are we talking about? From what doubledown originally said above, I was under the impression that the original cartridge does not run on the Phoenix. I wasn't talking about cartridge ROM dumps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NIAD Posted March 16, 2023 Share Posted March 16, 2023 2 hours ago, Pixelboy said: Sure, but then what are we talking about? From what doubledown originally said above, I was under the impression that the original cartridge does not run on the Phoenix. I wasn't talking about cartridge ROM dumps. Yes, because the Phoenix’s CV Core does not know how to handle the contents of this cartridge just like if the MegaCart code was removed for the Phoenix’ CV Core, the Phoenix wouldn’t know how to handle MegaCart rom images and possibly even actual MegaCart cartridges. One would think that this SG-1000 MultiCart would just work in the Phoenix like it does in an actual ColecoVision, but it doesn’t. So the Phoenix is not a 100% compatible replacement of the ColecoVision unless the CV Core is continually updated to handle new developments like this SG-1000 cart. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pixelboy Posted March 16, 2023 Share Posted March 16, 2023 4 hours ago, NIAD said: Yes, because the Phoenix’s CV Core does not know how to handle the contents of this cartridge just like if the MegaCart code was removed for the Phoenix’ CV Core, the Phoenix wouldn’t know how to handle MegaCart rom images and possibly even actual MegaCart cartridges. Sorry, but no, that part is simply not true. As a cartridge, Wizard of Wor (512K) works properly in the Phoenix and always has from day one. That's because the circuitry of the MegaCart is inside the cart. So all the Phoenix has to do is behave like a regular ColecoVision in the way it interacts with the cart through the cartridge port, and everything works. So again, the fact that the Sega SG-1000 Collection cartridge doesn't work on the Phoenix probably has little to do with the custom bankswitching system of that particular cartridge, but because there is a small bug in the FPGA core implementation that prevents it from working. The FPGA core that handles ROM files needs to have the MegaCart support built in, that much is true. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digress Posted March 16, 2023 Share Posted March 16, 2023 did anyone try that sg-1000 multicart in a regular colecovision with : nothing extra installed a sgm installed f18a installed both a sgm & f18a installed and see if it works in all 4 configurations. It was designed for only a standard colecovision. The phoenix is upgraded. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NIAD Posted March 16, 2023 Share Posted March 16, 2023 2 hours ago, Pixelboy said: Sorry, but no, that part is simply not true. As a cartridge, Wizard of Wor (512K) works properly in the Phoenix and always has from day one….. I hear what you are saying, but the only people that could give a clear and proper response are Bmack and Tursi. Unless they chime in, it’s all presumption on our part, even your Wizard of Wor example… removing the MegaCart support from the Phoenix core would suggest that the rom image would not work and the actual cartridge should work because the bank switching code is built into the cartridge PCB / Proms, but it’s still very possible that it may not. Tursi??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+5-11under Posted March 16, 2023 Share Posted March 16, 2023 It all depends on how the Phoenix works. I haven't investigated this at all for the Phoenix... If it reads the whole cartridge ROM into its memory at the start, then the multicart won't work (and Megacart and Team Pixelboy EEPROM and Eduardo's save-game carts would need firmware to work properly). If it just reads one byte at a time from the cartridge ROM, as required, like a regular ColecoVision does, then there's a chance it could work at some point (maybe they haven't tested it, maybe there's a timing issue, who knows?) (same with the Megacart and the others listed above, and whatever bankswitching, etc. someone comes up with in the future). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bomberman93 Posted March 16, 2023 Share Posted March 16, 2023 On 3/14/2023 at 11:44 PM, evg2000 said: What happens if you put it in a phoenix. The cartridge won't be detected. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodge2001 Posted March 16, 2023 Share Posted March 16, 2023 On 3/13/2023 at 6:11 PM, rietveld said: my UNO cart plays starpath games on my 2600 I guess then what I have is more basic: the Harmony Atari Multi Cart. Thank you for mentioning; I'll definitely look into upgrading to a UNO Atari Multi Cart or some other that can play Starpath games. I'm not using a 2600 but rather a Gemini but that shouldn't matter if they're both exactly the same. The SG-1000 Multi Cart website says "temporarily" not taking any new requests so that's good and implies they will hopefully again in the future. Until then I will dream about this thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rietveld Posted March 17, 2023 Share Posted March 17, 2023 16 hours ago, rodge2001 said: I guess then what I have is more basic: the Harmony Atari Multi Cart. Thank you for mentioning; I'll definitely look into upgrading to a UNO Atari Multi Cart or some other that can play Starpath games. I'm not using a 2600 but rather a Gemini but that shouldn't matter if they're both exactly the same. The SG-1000 Multi Cart website says "temporarily" not taking any new requests so that's good and implies they will hopefully again in the future. Until then I will dream about this thing. The your Harmony cart is better than the uNO in almost every way. Its just that the UNO does play starpath games Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marauder666 Posted March 17, 2023 Share Posted March 17, 2023 Harmony cart can play Starpath games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alex_79 Posted March 17, 2023 Share Posted March 17, 2023 (edited) 17 hours ago, rodge2001 said: I guess then what I have is more basic: the Harmony Atari Multi Cart. Thank you for mentioning; I'll definitely look into upgrading to a UNO Atari Multi Cart or some other that can play Starpath games. Keep in mind that for Supercharger multi-load games ("Dragonstomper", "Escape from the Mindmaster" and "Survival Island"), you need to use a single file with all the loads concatenated. If you're using split files - e.g. those in Atarimania collection with names ending in "(1 of 4)", "(2 of 4)", etc. - that's the reason why you're experiencing crashes. This is true for Harmony, Unocart, Pluscart, and every emulator I know of. AFAIK, the split files were only used by the old "Cuttle Cart II". Edited March 17, 2023 by alex_79 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tursi Posted March 19, 2023 Share Posted March 19, 2023 On 3/16/2023 at 6:45 AM, NIAD said: I hear what you are saying, but the only people that could give a clear and proper response are Bmack and Tursi. Unless they chime in, it’s all presumption on our part, even your Wizard of Wor example… removing the MegaCart support from the Phoenix core would suggest that the rom image would not work and the actual cartridge should work because the bank switching code is built into the cartridge PCB / Proms, but it’s still very possible that it may not. Tursi??? I haven't read the whole thread, but yeah, the Phoenix runs the cartridge port, it doesn't download the ROM. This is why the OpCode games work even though their bank switching is not implemented in the FPGA. It's strange that the cart you are testing doesn't work. The menu program goes through the following steps: - init the hardware - Check if a cartridge is plugged in that starts with 0x55, 0xAA (the no-logo test boot mode). If so, it reads the keypad once (to give you a chance to hold down * for the options menu), then jumps to 'start cartridge'. - does the Phoenix boot animation - Check if a cartridge is plugged in that starts with 0xAA, 0x55 (the normal full boot). If so, it reads and reformats the header text, displays it for 4 seconds, then jumps to 'start cartridge' 'start cartridge' makes sure the FPGA is in cartridge mode (it should normally be already), sets the scanline option, locks the F18A, clears (or not) the RAM, loads the various artifacts that OS7 expects (if not test boot mode), copies a short trampoline to the start of RAM, and jumps to it. The trampoline turns off the Phoenix BIOS, sets the stack pointer, loads the cartridge boot address and jumps to it. So in short, you only see that insert sd or cartridge menu if the first two bytes of the plugged in cartridge are not AA55 or 55AA. That's the only thing that is checked - just like the real ColecoVision. I can only imagine that either you're getting bad connection with the Phoenix cartridge port, or perhaps there's a power issue? 3 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SegaSnatcher Posted March 25, 2023 Share Posted March 25, 2023 SG-1000 is pretty underrated. While it doesn't have the overall quality library of Colecovision, it still has a worthwhile library of games worth checking out. I love Girl's Garden and Ping Pong. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SegaSnatcher Posted March 25, 2023 Share Posted March 25, 2023 On 3/14/2023 at 3:44 PM, evg2000 said: I'm curious why it doesn't work on the phoenix. Does the phoenix download the cart into 'memory' and run it? What happens if you put it in a phoenix. Honestly, I'm surprised SG-1000 compatibility wasn't added for side rom loading. SG-1000 uses the same CPU, Sound and Video chip as the Colecovision, just a different memory mapping system. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tursi Posted March 25, 2023 Share Posted March 25, 2023 8 hours ago, SegaSnatcher said: Honestly, I'm surprised SG-1000 compatibility wasn't added for side rom loading. SG-1000 uses the same CPU, Sound and Video chip as the Colecovision, just a different memory mapping system. That means a different FPGA load - it's not emulation. To move the addresses means moving the wires. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SegaSnatcher Posted March 26, 2023 Share Posted March 26, 2023 2 hours ago, Tursi said: That means a different FPGA load - it's not emulation. To move the addresses means moving the wires. Of course, but they already have support of cores with totally different archtecture like the Atari 2600 core on the Phoenix. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tursi Posted March 26, 2023 Share Posted March 26, 2023 2 hours ago, SegaSnatcher said: Of course, but they already have support of cores with totally different archtecture like the Atari 2600 core on the Phoenix. Really? Huh. 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SegaSnatcher Posted March 26, 2023 Share Posted March 26, 2023 (edited) 32 minutes ago, Tursi said: Really? Huh. Indeed, here's the github repo. https://github.com/CollectorVision/Phoenix2600 Edited March 26, 2023 by SegaSnatcher Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tursi Posted March 26, 2023 Share Posted March 26, 2023 Sorry, I'm teasing you. I wrote the menu system for the ColecoVision side of the Phoenix and helped debug some of the sound issues. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SegaSnatcher Posted March 26, 2023 Share Posted March 26, 2023 7 hours ago, Tursi said: Sorry, I'm teasing you. I wrote the menu system for the ColecoVision side of the Phoenix and helped debug some of the sound issues. Oh lol. Hey nice job! Working on any other gaming projects? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tursi Posted March 27, 2023 Share Posted March 27, 2023 16 hours ago, SegaSnatcher said: Oh lol. Hey nice job! Working on any other gaming projects? Thanks. Porting Cool Herders to the GBA right now. Once that's done I can finally get back to finishing Super Space Acer for Coleco 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loafer Posted April 12, 2023 Share Posted April 12, 2023 FYI apparently they have resolved the “Phoenix” issue and are about to open up orders again and will allow existing owners to send in their carts for the updated version (this is according to their Facebook post) 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+evg2000 Posted April 12, 2023 Share Posted April 12, 2023 21 minutes ago, Loafer said: FYI apparently they have resolved the “Phoenix” issue and are about to open up orders again and will allow existing owners to send in their carts for the updated version (this is according to their Facebook post) can you share the link to FB? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loafer Posted April 13, 2023 Share Posted April 13, 2023 It’s on one of the Colecovision groups so you may need to be a member to view; check out the comments section. https://www.facebook.com/596195503873576/posts/pfbid0cHjLCQuE7vsoJdRawonYXp7a5N5HNxTpRMq4WsQmKUvAcqcgaDFZcFfvJt9qzPYDl/?app=fbl 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+evg2000 Posted April 13, 2023 Share Posted April 13, 2023 cool, thanks found it and sent them an email Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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