320 mode colours question

[PacManPlus]

That's why I usually keep a text 320A area vertically separated from the play area

 

[Synthpopalooza]

11 hours ago, PacManPlus said:

I actually ended up using 320B for Scramble, both with and without Kangaroo mode depending on the area of the screen.

 

(I *still* don't see the usefulness of 320C or 320D mode...  Do any homebrew games use them?  I don't think any retail games do...)

Not that I've seen, though you can use 320C to get extra colors, without worrying about the kangaroo 00/01 glitch.  But I think the color pixel limitations are a tradeoff.  I had planned to try some interlace experiments with it though.

Edited April 5, 2023 by Synthpopalooza

[Eagle]

Today I did converter for 320C mode. @Defender_2600 you may like it results  

 

[Ecernosoft]

That's exciting, can't wait for it to be real!

[+Muddyfunster]

looks real enough to me...

[Ecernosoft]

Download, please?

 

 

(if only they would also include the ability to speak in the download.)

[Defender_2600]

10 hours ago, Eagle said:

Today I did converter for 320C mode. @Defender_2600 you may like it results  

 

 

Great work, thanks. And you can convince more people if you show all 8 colors on the same scanline with two sprites, and each sprites with 4 colors ( you can use my 320C Mario sprites as an example ).

 

Your editor can be helpful in getting people to practice 320C graphics and understand the advantage of having 8 colors from two palettes over 320B which has 6 colors from two palettes. 320C and 320B have different restrictions regarding pixel placement but in many cases you can get better results with 320C and you can still use 320C + 320A (for example you can use 320A - 1 bpp for a starry background, consuming less cycles).

 

For example, 320C would be perfect for Galaga sprites, we have more colors than 320B and the same number of cycles are required (2 bpp).

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited June 13, 2023 by Defender_2600

[Defender_2600]

On 4/5/2023 at 1:15 PM, PacManPlus said:

Do any homebrew games use them?  I don't think any retail games do...)

 

One-on-One Basketball is made completely in 320C mode, it has bad graphics but it's just bad pixel art.

 

And there is another game in the works, it will be a big surprise so I won't say more.

Edited June 12, 2023 by Defender_2600

[Eagle]

@Defender_2600 one more, 4 colours left for gfx

 

[Eagle]

Editor it's not finished. No point, to many problems with changing sprites, colours, saving etc. 

Like I said this is just converter for 320c mode only.

I'm looking for different solution. Editor is just viewer for now.

Bin attached (PAL no signature)

 

 

320cViewer.a78

Edited June 12, 2023 by Eagle

[Defender_2600]

2 hours ago, Eagle said:

@Defender_2600 one more, 4 colours left for gfx

 

 

In this case though, it's better to use 160B - 8 colors

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited June 12, 2023 by Defender_2600

[KrunchyTC]

1 hour ago, Defender_2600 said:

 

In this case though, it's better to use 160B - 8 colors

 

 

 

Neither looks bad at all. but the 320 version looks dangerously close to colecovision lol

[Defender_2600]

21 hours ago, Defender_2600 said:

 

Great work, thanks. And you can convince more people if you show all 8 colors on the same scanline with two sprites, and each sprites with 4 colors ( you can use my 320C Mario sprites as an example ).

 

Your editor can be helpful in getting people to practice 320C graphics and understand the advantage of having 8 colors from two palettes over 320B which has 6 colors from two palettes. 320C and 320B have different restrictions regarding pixel placement but in many cases you can get better results with 320C and you can still use 320C + 320A (for example you can use 320A for a starry background, consuming less cycles).

 

For example, 320C would be perfect for Galaga sprites, we have more colors than 320B and the same number of cycles are required.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

For people who want to try drawing graphics in 320C mode, I just want to add that each pair of pixels must include the same color or one color + the background color. It requires patience because you need to manually check each pair of pixels but (in some circumstances) it can be more versatile and colorful than the 320B mode. Of course, a sprite editor would be very useful, so that when you draw sprites it is not possible (as error) to place two different colors within the same pair of pixels.

 

Here are my previous Galaga sprites with a grid dividing the pairs of pixels, to better understand how to get around the limitations of pixel placement in 320C mode.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited June 13, 2023 by Defender_2600

[Eagle]

I'm using Grafx2 by setting grid for 2x1

Shift+G - grid menu

G - grid on/off (must be off)

Shift+Alt+G - grid view

 

Also now I have LUA script for checking bad cells

To run script right click on red marked FX button and open CellColorCheck.lua

Script will mark bad cells, press undo to unmark them

 

 

CellColorCheck.lua

Edited June 13, 2023 by Eagle

[Eagle]

@Defender_2600 another one for you. Picture by Piesiu from Spectrum in 320c mode

 

XenoformByPiesiu320c.a78

Edited June 13, 2023 by Eagle

[Eagle]

The Red Bandana by Piesiu - 320C mode

 

TheRedBandanaByPiesiu320c.a78

[Defender_2600]

Great work!

 

[Eagle]

Last one...

When The World Explodes by Slayer

9 colours 320C

 

 

WhenTheWorldExplodesbySlayer_320C_9colours.a78

[Defender_2600]

9 colours 320C mode, awesome... 👏👏

[+bsteux]

19 hours ago, Defender_2600 said:

 

For people who want to try drawing graphics in 320C mode, I just want to add that each pair of pixels must include the same color or one color + the background color. It requires patience because you need to manually check each pair of pixels but (in some circumstances) it can be more versatile and colorful than the 320B mode. Of course, a sprite editor would be very useful, so that when you draw sprites it is not possible (as error) to place two different colors within the same pair of pixels.

 

Waouh, thank you for the explanation. I had been reading and rereading the 7800 software guide and the Maria chip reference, and now it suddenly seems clear to me. Very clever color coding indeed. I had never figured out why this mode actually existed...

[+Karl G]

That helps me as well. It's kind of like 2600 sprite design with one color per line, but more flexible because it's on a pixel pair basis. 

[Eagle]

Some graphics test from NES on 7800 

This is just 2 bitmaps 320C mode, that's why Maria dma fail on the end of screen.

 

320C mode it's like Lowres mode but you can turn off the left or right half of the pixel.

 

 

Stanley_TheSearchforDrLivingston.a78

[Eagle]

Also from MisTer with composite blending Pal an Ntsc

 

Pal

 

Ntsc

 

[Eagle]

Another very quick conversion

Spoiler

Sorry for colours, I was guessing them  

 

randomgfxfromNes.a78

[+Karl G]

On 6/12/2023 at 3:58 PM, Defender_2600 said:

Great work, thanks. And you can convince more people if you show all 8 colors on the same scanline with two sprites, and each sprites with 4 colors ( you can use my 320C Mario sprites as an example ).

Cool - but I don't understand how you can get 4-color sprites? Pixel values are either 00, 01, 10, or 11 with 00 being background color or transparent, right?