Gaming franchises you feel should be major, but aren't.

[electricmastro]

Franchises that you figure would be big by now, but ultimately feel like they aren't for one reason or another. One example I think of is Bomberman. After lasting for so long and releasing as many games, it boggles me why the series doesn't get much more fanfare beyond the occasional passing mention.

 

[Lord Mushroom]

Chrono Trigger should have spawned a major franchise, but they blew it with the sequel. The same with Toejam & Earl and Unreal Tournament.

 

There are many Bomberman games, but they are designed to be played in local multiplayer, which is largely a thing of the past. They are also too simple to justify a high price, and thus their earnings potential is limited. One problem with the Bomberman games is that they are all so similar. If you have played one, you have played them all.

[Pixelboy]

Yeah, Bomberman is the kind of game where even if you add some extra bells and whistles, it's still always the same game.

 

One "franchise" that was never really a franchise, but I feel should have been, is H.E.R.O. from the Atari 2600 days. If there's one title that could be expanded into a sprawling Metroidvania formula, it's that game. It should have made a comeback by now.

 

[Cynicaster]

I'm a bit surprised at how many "one and done" classic 80s arcade IPs there were.  Pac-Man and Jumpman/Mario ended up having several notable games, ports, updates, etc. through the years but many contemporaries largely fizzled out.  

 

Q*Bert

Dig Dug

Frogger

Centipede

Defender

Mr. Do!

Robotron

etc.

 

I know most (if not all) of these IPs had sequels and/or later "re-imaginings" on consoles but to my knowledge they never really made much of a splash after their original outings.  I guess they're mostly shooting stars - burning bright and quick, then gone.  

 

 

 

 

[Ninjabba]

I never understood why Unreal Tournament didn't get more mainstream. I had so much fun with UT3 but couldn't get my friends interested to join.. they were all stuck at CoD MW at the time and didn't care for the sci-fi setting.. now Epic pretty much gave up on UT in favor of Fortnite.. eternal shame.

 

I really enjoy Bomberman but to be honest the latest entry on the Switch feels a little bit of a let down. The graphics are nothing to be excited about, I'd argue they're pretty bad for some maps as they mix brown/green tiles which are hard to distinguish. The worst part is that you need to grind for coins to unlock multiplayer maps to play locally together, why??? This is by far the worst decision in the game.

The fun is there, but too little variety in the music and maps make it feel like a lazy implementation.

 

I'd argue that Duke Nukem is a lost case.. the first 2 games were really fun platformers (here's an idea if someone ever reads this.. NukemVania) and of course everybody loves the 3D games that came afterwards. And then the IP got royally screwed over and became the joke of the industry and still is to this day afaik.

 

 

[Tanooki]

@Ninjabba Not to mention until many months later a patch dropped to even make Super Bomberman R even playable as it had input lag on a level of like those Cotton games.  You couldn't keep up with the AI boss fights because they'd already had move on from where you were seeing on screen so forget strategic bomb traps.  And don't forget Duke had a quality 3rd 2D release on GBC only carts but went under the radar. A real shame as that GBC game is right there graphics, audio, control Duke Nukem 3 as it picks up in the DN2 style completely.

 

Personally going to stick with Nintendo and their dumb ass behavior around 3 very particular franchises that have millions of fans yet gets dumped on hard for more releases.

- Kid Icarus (3DS game and Smash inclusion aside...ugh)
- F-Zero

- Pilotwings

 

Those games are big gaping holes in their lineup of quality IP and genres they control and don't care to seemingly do crap with other than pity party stuff in smash bros anymore if that.  Each of them have a very nice style, niche, world of their own that really need to be further explored and they seemingly don't care.

[electricmastro]

8 hours ago, Lord Mushroom said:

Chrono Trigger should have spawned a major franchise, but they blew it with the sequel. The same with Toejam & Earl and Unreal Tournament.

 

There are many Bomberman games, but they are designed to be played in local multiplayer, which is largely a thing of the past. They are also too simple to justify a high price, and thus their earnings potential is limited. One problem with the Bomberman games is that they are all so similar. If you have played one, you have played them all.

Bomberman did start branching out more into platformers, adventure games, racing games, etc. in the late 90s, but I suppose Hudson going defunct in 2012 and Konami largely sticking with the maze formula really halted this momentum.

Edited March 24, 2023 by electricmastro

[zzip]

4 hours ago, Cynicaster said:

Mr. Do!

Robotron

etc.

 

I know most (if not all) of these IPs had sequels and/or later "re-imaginings" on consoles but to my knowledge they never really made much of a splash after their original outings.  I guess they're mostly shooting stars - burning bright and quick, then gone. 

Mr. Do! got several sequels-  Mr. Do's Castle, Mr. Do's Wild Ride, Do Run Run.      It just never survived the crash I guess?

[Cynicaster]

1 hour ago, zzip said:

Mr. Do! got several sequels-  Mr. Do's Castle, Mr. Do's Wild Ride, Do Run Run.      It just never survived the crash I guess?

Don't forget Neo Mr. Do! from the mid-90s:

 

 

Thing is, I don't think any of these follow-ups were as "big" as the original.  I don't have the data on that, but I know I never even heard of any of these other Mr. Do games until I got into MAME about 12 years ago. 

 

 

 

 

[zzip]

1 minute ago, Cynicaster said:

Thing is, I don't think any of these follow-ups were as "big" as the original.  I don't have the data on that, but I know I never even heard of any of these other Mr. Do games until I got into MAME about 12 years ago. 

Seems like each was a little less popular than the one before.   Do Castle was fairly common and got home ports by Parker Bros,  Wild Ride was kind of rare and I don't think it got home ports.   And I'm not sure I've ever seen Do Run Run at an arcade, maybe once?

 

Each game is almost a different genre, maybe that was part of the problem?

[electricmastro]

6 hours ago, Cynicaster said:

Frogger

It’s strange, because Frogger has had games somewhat regularly since 1997, yet it still hasn’t retained a considerable amount of attention to this day.

 

[roots.genoa]

6 hours ago, Tanooki said:

Personally going to stick with Nintendo and their dumb ass behavior around 3 very particular franchises that have millions of fans yet gets dumped on hard for more releases.

- Kid Icarus (3DS game and Smash inclusion aside...ugh)
- F-Zero

- Pilotwings

I really doubt they have millions of fans. F-Zero games never sold well after the first two games (and the first one was a launch title, which helps a lot).

And actually, relaunching Kid Icarus on the 3DS was already unexpected imho. But since Sakurai retired I'm not sure there could be another one unfortunately.

[pablum]

IMO Sega's Shinobi should be getting a new entry at least once a console generation, yet here we are...

 

Same for Golden Axe.

 

Old school shooters should still be popular (they used to be a dominant genre until the 32-bit era) and Gradius and Thunderforce should still be getting sequels. 

 

Castlevania was rocking along quite peacefully on handhelds too. Then Konami upended everything for Lords of Shadow and pachinko machines.

Edited March 24, 2023 by pablum

[electricmastro]

2 hours ago, pablum said:

IMO Sega's Shinobi should be getting a new entry at least once a console generation, yet here we are...

Especially surprising considering how games like Ninja Gaiden Sigma thrive these days and whatnot. I think modern game system owners would really get a kick out of a triple AAA Shinobi game similar to the PS2 games.

[Madwindoman]

I don’t know about major but I always hoped for a sequel to kameo on the 360. When I brought my 360 home way back when kameo was the only game I had. I played the shit out of it and I thought the graphics really showcased the system well. One of those games where if it hasn’t happened by now…

[electricmastro]

7 hours ago, Cynicaster said:

Don't forget Neo Mr. Do! from the mid-90s:

 

 

Thing is, I don't think any of these follow-ups were as "big" as the original.  I don't have the data on that, but I know I never even heard of any of these other Mr. Do games until I got into MAME about 12 years ago. 

 

 

 

 

Neo Mr. Do looked like it was going in a promising direction, but I wonder how a hyper neon take like Tempest 2000 would fare. I could see it gaining fanfare quite a bit.

Edited March 25, 2023 by electricmastro

[roots.genoa]

9 hours ago, pablum said:

IMO Sega's Shinobi should be getting a new entry at least once a console generation, yet here we are...

 

Same for Golden Axe.

I agree (you can also add Altered Beast and many more) but it's a little too late unfortunately, imho. To stay relevant these licenses should have indeed gotten a new entry at least once a console generation, in order to evolve properly from 2D to 3D for instance. If you made a game based on them right now, people wouldn't understand if it wasn't (almost) exactly like it was back then... 😔

[electricmastro]

Are Space Invaders and Pac-Man considered major franchises? They release new games every so often, but I get the feeling they've never really escape the fame of their first games and thus lead to later entries being ignored more. I suppose that could be said for many franchises actually.

[Mikebloke]

I think a lot of the issue is many 80s and 90s styled games don't convert well, or are not converted well. Bomberman from OP is a classic example, great multiplayer format, somehow completely destroyed in the age of high speed Internet. So while you can play shooters with 128 or even 256 players in a server, a 4 player tiled game where all the graphics can be handled locally without issue is apparently asking far too much. 

 

I know my nostalgic games like galaxian and bubble bobble don't translate modern well, games that should also translate well regardless such as final fantasy fail due to their insistence on trying to make it more "active" for a higher player base. 

[electricmastro]

2 hours ago, Mikebloke said:

I think a lot of the issue is many 80s and 90s styled games don't convert well, or are not converted well.

 

Which prob makes it all the more impressive how games like Mario, The Legend of Zelda, Dragon Quest, Metal Gear, and Street Fighter made it into the 21st century.

 

Edited March 25, 2023 by electricmastro

[Video]

Hero? Yeah, extra huge worlds with stations (checkpoints) to reload and continue, a variety of more powerful weapons, just watch your energy gauge. Of course updating graphics an physics, like blow a wall to let lava burn through a floor or something, maybe be able to swap the helicopter for dive gear to get to new areas?

 

Homebrew crowd activate!!!

 

Newer games, I loved spyro the dragon, which looked like it was going to be a series, but disappeared after the PlayStation and ps2 games. The gba ones were excellent imo.

[Mikebloke]

6 hours ago, electricmastro said:

 

Which prob makes it all the more impressive how games like Mario, The Legend of Zelda, Dragon Quest, Metal Gear, and Street Fighter made it into the 21st century.

 

There has been a theory for awhile now that nintendo franchises have been dumbing down for mass appeal ever since the gamecube / wii, certainly things like paper mario, which was a full fledged jrpg with levelling, item customisation etc turned into a 2 concept gimmick by the switch. Zeldas "go anywhere at anytime" and "all weapons are temporary and are virtually the same" new phase is a complete opposite of its puzzled near linear item progression of its early games, and probably started as early as the N64. 

 

It's an issue for me because I see how basic it is, I can practically see the simplification of game design and code complexity as each generation passes. It probably doesn't help that all the publishers and by extention the developers have drank the game engine cool aid which probably limits a lot of unique experiences we used to get in order to streamline when the next financial payday is. I think pokemon is a good example of this, arceus legends which was made by a 3rd party had unique concepts and a bit of variation, while the mainline games have turned into an unimpressive laggy mess and little inspiration in its storyline but the goal now seems to be 'just make the next game because we know it would sell'. 

 

Metal Gear is known for Hideo essentially being forced to make a sequel and taking more of the Michael each time . MGS was supposed to be the end, 2 was a polished rehash of 1 with a new backdrop and graphical processing ability, 3 was a artistic James bond parody of ridiculousness (which absolutely worked) , 4 was supposed to be a final f u to Konami about how stupid he could go with it, and then after all that they still made him make 5 which speaks for itself. The funny thing is mechanically, even up until 4 each game progressed a little bit, but 5 became a complete mess. Being able to run around in the tank doing stupid things without causing an alert, the infinite pistol glitch as any soldier could just whip a new one out his arse, the metal gear side quest that literally isn't used or seen in the game once done other than a fancy text prompt for idle missions.

 

I understand why series like mega man, pac man, Bomberman and others went the way of 3D action adventures and weird spinoffs (I just can't play any weird pac man games at all!) but it is interesting how all of them largely go back to their routes. Mega man is now back in 2D, pac man now has more traditional grid based 2D titles and the only redeemable Bomberman modern games is the ones that go back to 2D tiled line explosion type battle modes.

 

There just isn't as much going for a lot of the other franchises though, bubble bobble 1 (more arcade) and 2 (more platformer) are quite different games, a 'true sequel' could be different too but if the art and music style is wildly different then I'm not going to get on with it at all. Things like wonder boy get some stylised modern adaptations with a reasonable approach to the idea they won't be knocking out new games like assasins creed every year or two. I guess in my 'old age and experience' the sort of games I would buy are not financially viable long term, while fifa, AC, and shooter of the day will always have it's place. I don't get why so many people play League of Legends for example. It's great that so many people want to play the same mechanic over and over again in virtually similar scenarios and fighting over micro transactional mini battles, I just don't get it personally. 

 

I think as well, a lot of "acquired" companies go dead after a short while. Tomb Raider, Command and Conquer, Wipeout, even Sim city, a lot of these things sell to the big companies and then die back soon after. 

[electricmastro]

27 minutes ago, Mikebloke said:

I understand why series like mega man, pac man, Bomberman and others went the way of 3D action adventures and weird spinoffs (I just can't play any weird pac man games at all!) but it is interesting how all of them largely go back to their routes. Mega man is now back in 2D, pac man now has more traditional grid based 2D titles and the only redeemable Bomberman modern games is the ones that go back to 2D tiled line explosion type battle modes.

 

And that makes it all the more interesting how Mario can get into games like racing games, party games, sports games, RPGs, etc. and all receive acceptance, even though he started off in a platformer.

[roots.genoa]

2 hours ago, Mikebloke said:

There has been a theory for awhile now that nintendo franchises have been dumbing down for mass appeal ever since the gamecube / wii, certainly things like paper mario, which was a full fledged jrpg with levelling, item customisation etc turned into a 2 concept gimmick by the switch. Zeldas "go anywhere at anytime" and "all weapons are temporary and are virtually the same" new phase is a complete opposite of its puzzled near linear item progression of its early games, and probably started as early as the N64.

Nintendo haters love to create dumb theories and these examples are puzzling to me. I don't like RPGs to be honest, but I don't think having a proper leveling system or whatever is that relevant when you have only one character to begin with. The latest Paper Mario is great; it's more of an action/adventure game than an RPG, sure, but there's nothing wrong with that imho. It would be like claiming Zelda games are bad because they're not RPGs.

And considering Breath of the Wild is dumbed down compared to previous Zeldas is just WRONG. The fact that the weapons break and that there's a stamina system makes it actually less accessible than the previous games imho. Many gamers were turned off by it, sure, but not because they found it more casual. That's just wrong, sorry.

[dudeguy]

OutRun