Do you prefer the recharged games or the original version's ?

[Wildstar]

On 9/22/2023 at 7:42 PM, ledzep said:

 

That sounds just like the soulless crap you posted previously.  How do even know which specific cloned tracks you're listening to?  It's not even a good rip-off of the original type of music.  What these no-talents are reaching for is some kind of William Orbit result but instead of being creative they just let computers do the "hard work" (not hard at all considering how many tutorial videos there are explaining how easy it is to flood the Internet with this monotonous, repetitive shit).  Wouldn't dare soil their hands playing real instruments, that's not Future!

 

Are you zoomers religiously against the green side of the color palette?  i can't tell what's more repetitive, the synth elevator music or the endless pink/lavender stripclub beach/cityscapes.

 

A couple co-workers of mine back in the '90s liked to play this guy's stuff inbetween Rock or other CDs (our room had a little shelf stereo).  Not bad as background music -

 

 

Probably too much variety for you and your zoomer friends, though.  Not one of those co-workers who listened to it connected this style of music to Atari, either, and that's back when Atari was still fresh in people's minds.  Why can't zoomers get anything right?  Why do they prefer remixes and cheap copies of the originals?  They prefer computer-generated approximations of talent, not actual talent.

 

 

Ok, prove that.  Right now.  Show how this game has impacted real world culture.  Links to something reputable.  I'm betting you can't because it's just your feeling and after avoiding substantiating this claim you will once again pretend to realize we've all gone "massively off topic in regards to the original subject" and play dumb.

 

You just saying it's true doesn't make it true.  You and your zoomer friends being impacted doesn't equate to "real world culture" being impacted.  Recognize that probably over 90% of the people you could ask (not just your insulated friends) would have no fucking idea what Cyberpunk is (nor what it has to do with Atari) but I bet you a follow-up question asking the same people about Dungeons & Dragons would get way more of them being able to identify that game and its impact on real world culture.

 

 

You mean CD Projekt Red?  Come on, man, a true fan would never misspell their name.  Maybe you like Ateri or Siga more?  Even the Wikipedia page says that CD Projekt Red is best known for The Witcher series, not Cyberpunk.  So much for real world culture being impacted.

 

That is the first non-completely ridiculous idea you've put forward.  Don't know how well it could work but I would hope that the punishment for any player wasting time playing one of those recharged clownshows instead of moving forward within the real game is that some NPC would shoot the distracted player in the face or beat him senseless.  Second offense would mean complete reset to the start of the game, really drive the point home not to waste time in this arcade, there's an actual game you're ignoring!!

 

On the other hand, if I were programming the game I would include one of the arcade original versions in maybe a different location (convenience store?) and, if the player had the correct controller connected to his PC/console and played the game decent (get to an extra life at least), secret power-ups or unlocked weapons or something would become available.  Oh, imagine the struggles of the zoomers playing being completely incapable of handling original Missile Command or Centipede without loads of power-ups or a gamepad, hahaaha.

First, stop being a dick. Second, cyberpunk isn't about any particular video game and tabletop game. They are byproducts of subgenre science fiction in a dystopia future setting. This began with literature like 1984 and emergence of computers into the Public conscience. This along with the then relationship to real world punk subculture. Think... what punk culture be if you have a futuristic 1984 type setting... example bladerunner, even robocop, Terminator, etc. The punks of a dystopia future, say 100 years from now with cyber-human augmentation. We are cyberpunks... today. We are accessorized with technology with just the smartphones. When we go a step further with what we saw in Johnny Mneumonic where cybernetic implants and computer integration. Cyberpunk is today and we are incrementally entering that reality. Even today's politics is more dystopia than it was in the 1990s. MAGA, insurrection, dysfunctional government, we are becoming 1984 but maybe it 2084. 1984 was perhaps a 100 years early. Then 1984 prediction was predicted in 1949 but Orwell might have been 50-100 years early. Cyberpunk merges punk subculture, hacker culture, Orwellian "1984" dystopia. We are just entering the "Cyberpunk Era". 1949, computers were vacuum tubes. 1960s, New Wave science fiction. Then in 1982, we saw the film Bladerunner. In 1984, Neuromancer along with influences of Bladerunner... the basis for TV show Max Headroom, the film, Johnny Mneumonic and tabletop rpg game Cyberpunk... eventually inspiring cyberpunk 2077. These literature along with futuristic sci-fi shows including star trek and star wars, inspired the technology we have today, and culture imprints in our values, our increasing acceptance of computer-human augmentation. We are already augmenting and integrating computer technology, telecommunication, into our lives. More so than we ever been. Yes, we are the cyberpunks. At least the proto-cyberpunks of the next generations of cyberpunks. 

[Wildstar]

On 9/14/2023 at 8:57 AM, donjn said:

These recharged games are objectively better "games" however the nostalgia of the older versions are unbeatable.

Why do people always have to compare and there has to be a "winner"? Enjoy both.

On technical merits but the originals were constrained by technology at the time. The art and technical merits to do what they could do with merely kilobytes or just even under 1 kilobyte. There we must say, the merits are awesome and phenomenal because frankly programmers learning to program today will absolutely have no idea or skill to work with such constraints but they have no need or incentive too. Game developers then, can remained their games and execute their ideas in ways technology allows now that they could never been able to with the technology then. 

[JPF997]

1 hour ago, ledzep said:

 

How would you know until you actually answer them?  Don't speak for me.  None of the questions were "so broad", they were directly related to the statements you made.  My questions are mostly asking you to either provide some evidence to support your statements about Atari and society or asking you what you meant by certain statements.  So if my questions are "so broad" then so were your claims.

 

 

If you don't know what the terms you're using mean, don't use them or look them up to be sure you're saying what you think you're saying.  You made big claims about, for example, an Atari sign showing up in "Blade Runner" changed the way that people viewed Atari forever (if I remember correctly) and synthwave being loved by modern Atari fans, to name just 2.  I'm not going to go through it again, I went to the trouble to lay out each of the questions in the previous post that you consistently ignore.  You can read, yes?

 

 

You and your 5 friends aren't any yardstick for culture, you are again saying that something within a video game impacts culture over time like it's a given and not just your wishful fanboy opinion.  Prove it or stop making that goofy claim because I don't see any cultural impact from that Cyberpunk game in everyday society.  Just because you think it happens based on your limited personal experience doesn't mean dick.  You've just made another claim, that because your 5 friends agree that including Atari recharged games inside another video game would be a great idea, that means doing that will impact culture over time.  Dare I ask, you have anything to back that up?  Again, I bet on 'No'.

 

 

I want you to stop changing the subject and support your ridiculous theory that '80s Atari arcade games dreamed about the endless possibilities of space.  Do you understand that "dreamed about the endless possibilities of space" is not anywhere near the same as associating Atari with space themes or Atari's classics revolving around space?  As I've said before, and you stubbornly ignore, just because a game is set in space doesn't mean it dreams about the endless possibilities of space, get it?  There are maybe a dozen games that would fit that dreamed about the endless possibilities of space standard, the rest don't.  That's not a "great percentage", not even close.  Honestly, do you even know what "dreamed about the endless possibilities of space" means?  That's science fiction book shit, not single-screen shooter games.

 

Back up what you have previously claimed, don't reword it into something else and then say you already answered the question that nobody asked about something you didn't originally say.

 

 

Yes it is the simplest explanation ("for me" being the key phrase), and it's far away from the ridiculous claims you were making earlier about there's nothing more Atari than synthwave blah blah blah.

 

 

Not by a long shot.  You barely answered a couple questions and moved the goalposts on others to make it sound like you said something else originally.

 

Go through the previous post that summarized the questions that were asked of you (9/23/2023 at 1:35 AM) in earlier posts sprayed all over this thread and, simply, fucking answer them.  How hard can that be when they're based off of your own goofy claims?  Answer them.  Or don't, just finally admit that those claims made no sense and you can't answer them because there's nothing to back them up.  Just please don't start a new victim thread somewhere else about you don't understand why you answer everyone's questions so thoroughly and accurately but nobody will accept your answers only because you're new.  You haven't answered most of them yet, still.

When will you get it through your head that "dreaming of the endless possibilities of space" is a romantic interpretation not a statement of fact,  old Atari games are so simple and the visuals are so abstract that a thousand people can look at them and each come away with a different interpretation of what they just saw. Same thing with the blade runner and cyberpunk reference's, to you they mean nothing to other people they're inspiring and provide a vision of what Atari could have been.

 Cultural impact is a very difficult thing to measure, to you more people becoming aware of Atari means nothing to me it means the brand will survive and thrive into the future, yesterday it was me a 5 other guys, tomorrow it's a thousand more people now interested in the brand. That's why I said that the burden of proof was to high because you never even bothered explaining what cultural impact means to you, would you only be satisfied if say for example the next president of the US wins the zoomer vote because he said he loves Atari, I have no idea what level of cultural impact you would consider satisfying so this discussion is not gonna go anywhere productive.

Why not instead of making me search for your question's (which easily blend in with the random stuff you've said so I have no idea which is which) you just outline them all in quick succession so that we can finally get this over with, like this for example:

1)

2)

3)

etc

[Wildstar]

On 9/17/2023 at 2:23 PM, ledzep said:

 

How can it not be remotely close to the truth when I've seen actual "recharged" games with all those stupid additions?  Not all the games because, obviously, I'm not in the mood to play them so maybe a few don't all have all the extra unnecessary bullshit additions, maybe just one or two, but that's too much already.

 

Fuck synthwave, that's elevator music.  I want people to actually play instruments in my music.  And yes, many of them still do, even many current bands!

 

I have nothing against a modernized '80s game if that game was boring/flawed to start out with.  Imagine for example if the 2600 version of Pac-Man was the arcade version, then Ms. Pac-Man would be a welcomed and needed improvement.  I would consider Space Duel a modernization of Asteroids and I love it.  But additions that don't add to gameplay are a waste of code and a distraction.  Tilting the camera around to make things seems "faster" or more dramatic doesn't help, it's annoying.  When you play a game where the playing field isn't slipping around do you suck at the game and wish that the view would keep changing?  I don't.  If there's no shitty music blaring does that actually change how the game plays?  No, you can add your own favorite shitty music from your stereo, the controls are unaffected.  If you're not good enough to clear a level without 3 power-ups wasting everything that moves and a 4th that shields you, stop playing video games.

 

I feel like I benefitted from growing up with those old/original '80s games because they were limited by graphics and CPU so they had to squeeze as much gameplay out of those clunky machines as possible.  Once chips got faster and more powerful gameplay was less important compared to graphics/shading/colors, you got better looking games but many added nothing to gameplay and many of them actually lost gameplay.  Modern games veer towards 1st person, whether shooters or exploring or driving or whatever, beautiful environments with real-time shading and lighting, oooooooh, almost like a movie.  Yay.  But the simple games don't need that shit, photoreal Space Invaders or photoreal Asteroids adds absolutely dick to how the game actually plays, whether that gameplay is good or not.  Loud, monotonous, soulless music adds nothing, improves nothing.  Power-ups make things easier, now I'm invincible for 10 seconds!!  Who asked for that?

 

If a simple straightforward '80s game bores you I can understand that, some of them bore me, too.  But changing them to ADHD experiments isn't the solution.  It's like going to a modern football or basketball game, whenever there's a pause in play the announcers won't fucking shut up, they're constantly telling the crowd to get loud or here's 20 seconds of crap music or look at all these highlights on the screens, distract distract distract!  Knock that shit off, I want to enjoy the game.

BTW: NONE of the original games music from the 70s and early 80s were ever played by any player. They were coded. No human instruments. Additionally, it generally cost a significant sum or chunk of royalties to have a contracted music band create music for it for a game. Of course, your attitude and position basically is "don't bother with remaking games".  That's the tone that is projected and I don't have the desire to sift through everything you wrote and others... over the past 8 or so pages.

[Matt_B]

54 minutes ago, Wildstar said:

Most is done by third party which are likely putting out most of the investments in the recharge projects except those directly developed by Atari.

There aren't any Recharged games directly developed by Atari. They're all made by Adamvision and SneakyBox. Atari, as publishers, will be bankrolling their development.

 

There may be other sources of funding for some projects - I believe Atari 50 was partly financed by Digital Eclipse via funds raised on the Republic crowdfunding site - but it'll mostly be coming from Atari's R&D budget.

 

Until Atari's recent acquisition of Nightdive studios, they haven't had any in house development since the bankruptcy; that's when their last remaining studios were shut down. Now that they've got one again, it'll be interesting to see how it goes but I'd suspect that they'll be inclined to play it relatively safe. They're not really in a position where they could afford a big budget flop right now.

[Wildstar]

Also tracker music is probably closer to the art form. Of course original sound were using sound chips that were programmable sound generators.... or closer to that. 

 

[Wildstar]

3 minutes ago, Matt_B said:

There aren't any Recharged games directly developed by Atari. They're all made by Adamvision and SneakyBox. Atari, as publishers, will be bankrolling their development.

 

There may be other sources of funding for some projects - I believe Atari 50 was partly financed by Digital Eclipse via funds raised on the Republic crowdfunding site - but it'll mostly be coming from Atari's R&D budget.

 

Until Atari's recent acquisition of Nightdive studios, they haven't had any in house development since the bankruptcy; that's when their last remaining studios were shut down. Now that they've got one again, it'll be interesting to see how it goes but I'd suspect that they'll be inclined to play it relatively safe. They're not really in a position where they could afford a big budget flop right now.

I am not sure that bankroll all the cost but may contribute to varying levels. If they were bankrolling 100%, I'll be happy to get even some for a project that would be something more or less new... even if there are classics as source of inspiration.

Edited September 25, 2023 by Wildstar

[Wildstar]

One way to finance such projects is basically crowdfunding/pre-order. Basically, that is how many crowdfunded projects really are. I know what they say and the risks. Pre-orders are generally refundable by canceling the pre-order but it may sometimes be non- refundable after a period of time elapsed. 

[ledzep]

1 hour ago, Wildstar said:

First, stop being a dick.

 

You first.  Read through this thread from the beginning, I (and others) have shown a huge amount of patience and restraint trying to claw through what JPF997 has been claiming and haphazardly declaring about wide-ranging topics that have little to do with what he seems to be trying to convey.  Some of us have reached our limit.  Nice of you to join in late and pretend you understand what everyone else has been going through so far.  Even he has figured out that he got off on the wrong foot and then made it much worse based on a separate thread he started about how not to be a punching bag something something.  Catch up.

 

To put it another way, I propose that you try to sift through his goofy claims about society, games, space, synthwave, etc., and explain what he was actually talking about since he won't and, better yet, provide anything that would approach evidence to back up those same declarations.

 

1 hour ago, Wildstar said:

Second, cyberpunk isn't about any particular video game and tabletop game. They are byproducts of subgenre science fiction in a dystopia future setting.

 

Hahaaha, you think he was talking about cyberpunk the genre?!?  He has repeatedly talked about Cyberpunk the RPG and now the game(s) and their amazing impact on society based on how much he and his zoomer friends love it.  That's all.  Nothing he's talked about has actually delved into the wider cyberpunk genre.  You would know that if you actually read the many times he's mentioned the fantasticalness of that game like because it mentions a fictional merged Atari/Sega company in it that somehow that means society is really into Atari again.  Go ahead, read it through and prove me wrong, show me where he's talked about cyberpunk as a science-fiction concept and how whatever the fuck society something.  I've read through most of his shit twice, you won't find it.

 

1 hour ago, Wildstar said:

This began with literature like 1984 and emergence of computers into the Public conscience. This along with the then relationship to real world punk subculture. Think... what punk culture be if you have a futuristic 1984 type setting... example bladerunner, even robocop, Terminator, etc. The punks of a dystopia future, say 100 years from now with cyber-human augmentation. We are cyberpunks... today. We are accessorized with technology with just the smartphones. When we go a step further with what we saw in Johnny Mneumonic where cybernetic implants and computer integration. Cyberpunk is today and we are incrementally entering that reality. Even today's politics is more dystopia than it was in the 1990s. MAGA, insurrection, dysfunctional government, we are becoming 1984 but maybe it 2084. 1984 was perhaps a 100 years early. Then 1984 prediction was predicted in 1949 but Orwell might have been 50-100 years early. Cyberpunk merges punk subculture, hacker culture, Orwellian "1984" dystopia. We are just entering the "Cyberpunk Era". 1949, computers were vacuum tubes. 1960s, New Wave science fiction. Then in 1982, we saw the film Bladerunner. In 1984, Neuromancer along with influences of Bladerunner... the basis for TV show Max Headroom, the film, Johnny Mneumonic and tabletop rpg game Cyberpunk... eventually inspiring cyberpunk 2077. These literature along with futuristic sci-fi shows including star trek and star wars, inspired the technology we have today, and culture imprints in our values, our increasing acceptance of computer-human augmentation. We are already augmenting and integrating computer technology, telecommunication, into our lives. More so than we ever been. Yes, we are the cyberpunks. At least the proto-cyberpunks of the next generations of cyberpunks.

 

Oh, thank Odin you're here to explain cyberpunk to me because you assume I don't know what it is or don't understand it.  You forgot Ghost In The Shell and Westworld, I give your essay a C+.  So, after that rambling Wikipedia-ish synopsis, explain what does that have to do with JPF997's claims that including Atari in that Cyberpunk game affects society in general or changes the way people see Atari?  Can't wait.

[ledzep]

1 hour ago, JPF997 said:

When will you get it through your head that "dreaming of the endless possibilities of space" is a romantic interpretation not a statement of fact,  old Atari games are so simple and the visuals are so abstract that a thousand people can look at them and each come away with a different interpretation of what they just saw.

 

Then don't present it as a statement of fact such that you confuse whoever is reading what you claim.  Aw, a romantic interpretation, you have to warn people that you're veering off into poetry.  So you are saying we can throw out everything you said connected to "dreamed of the endless possibilities of space" and instead agree that you simply think old Atari games with black backgrounds are cool like space.  Flowery language with no explanation will lead to lots of tangents and confusion.

 

By the way, this -

 

"How can you not understand how this type of music appeal's to Atari fans, remember how most old Atari games dreamed about the endless possibilities of space, maybe after hearing this you'll finally get it "

 

that you stated before isn't a romantic interpretation, it's a statement of fact.  If you want people to get that you were going for "romantic interpretation" then you should word it correctly, something like "it's as though most of those old Atari games dreamed about the endless possibilities of space!"  What you said was "remember how", that's not interpretation, that's you saying they in fact did dream about the endless possibilities of space, whatever the fuck that means, and then refused to elaborate on that.

 

1 hour ago, JPF997 said:

Same thing with the blade runner and cyberpunk reference's, to you they mean nothing to other people they're inspiring and provide a vision of what Atari could have been.

 

That's not what you were saying earlier, you were claiming that because an Atari sign was briefly seen in "Blade Runner" that that changed the way that people viewed Atari forever after.  Let me guess, now you're going to backpedal and pretend that was romantic interpretation, too?

 

To what other people are they inspiring and provide a vision of what Atari could have been?  Why do you keep extrapolating your feelings onto everyone else on this subject?

 

"Blade Runner" and cyberpunk (the genre) mean a great deal to me, they just have dick to do with Atari then or now.  It was a cool "Hey, look!  Atari!" moment while watching that movie, that's it.

 

1 hour ago, JPF997 said:

Cultural impact is a very difficult thing to measure, to you more people becoming aware of Atari means nothing to me it means the brand will survive and thrive into the future, yesterday it was me a 5 other guys, tomorrow it's a thousand more people now interested in the brand. That's why I said that the burden of proof was to high because you never even bothered explaining what cultural impact means to you, would you only be satisfied if say for example the next president of the US wins the zoomer vote because he said he loves Atari, I have no idea what level of cultural impact you would consider satisfying so this discussion is not gonna go anywhere productive.

 

I already know that more people are becoming aware of Atari.  It's got nothing to do with a neon Atari sign showing up in "Blade Runner" decades ago or a fake future version of Atari appearing in Cyberpunk.  If anything it's driven by these Arcade1Up fake arcade cabs that seem to be pretty popular (I think they're sold in Walmarts and Costcos now?) and online games, the Flashbacks and now this 2600+.  I don't have to explain what cultural impact means to me, I wasn't the one who made that ridiculous claim, you did.  It's on you to explain what you mean by that and up to now you still refuse to, you just make the excuse that it's hard to define "cultural impact".  Ok, if it's difficult to measure then how can you state that having recharged Atari games inside Cyberpunk would make an impact on society at large?  It's your theory, explain how that would work.

 

1 hour ago, JPF997 said:

Why not instead of making me search for your question's (which easily blend in with the random stuff you've said so I have no idea which is which) you just outline them all in quick succession so that we can finally get this over with, like this for example:

1)

2)

3)

etc

 

I don't know, why don't you follow the very simple instruction from my previous post?  I already outlined them, ok?  I just didn't number them.  I'm not doing it again so that you can ignore them again.  By the way, I got the timestamp wrong, go to my post from 9/23/2023 at 4:24 AM (on Page 7), read through it and answer the questions I included if you can.  Most of them are even indented so you can find them easier but read through it and you'll find all the key questions about your many claims.  Again, just what I asked, don't change the subject or answer a question I didn't even ask.

[ledzep]

1 hour ago, Wildstar said:

BTW: NONE of the original games music from the 70s and early 80s were ever played by any player. They were coded. No human instruments. Additionally, it generally cost a significant sum or chunk of royalties to have a contracted music band create music for it for a game.

 

Oh shit, more revelations!  They were coded?!?!?  This changes everything that was known about arcade games, thank you for the knowledge.  Wow, like with programming.  I can't wait to tell my friends who grew up playing arcade games, they won't believe it.

 

Who said the old 8-bit games had music played by people?  Most of those games didn't have any music beyond the attract mode because who could even hear it in a crowded arcade?  It's unnecessary.

 

1 hour ago, Wildstar said:

Of course, your attitude and position basically is "don't bother with remaking games". 

 

Of course you don't have a clue what my attitude and position about any of this is.  Basically it's don't bother with making shitty remakes of older games.  Giles N slapped together a still image that's a more interesting and attractive potential Centipede Recharged than the plodding mess of the actual recharged version.  That game (if it ever got made) I'd like to see (hopefully with a trak-ball controller).  But taking Centipede, blunting all the colors, changing the centipedes into multi-legged slugs, swamping it with power-ups and big/bright explosions and shitty music adds nothing good to the original.  It just adds "more", like those KFC Bowls that pile everything on the menu into one sloppy meal.  Huh, they got rid of the individual insect sound effects.  Everything is so slow, especially the spider, that used to be one of the most lethal elements.

 

As I asked before you swanned in, who was playing original Centipede and saying "It's a good game, but if only it had camera shake/monochromatic colors/big explosions with fireworks animations/relentless power-ups/shitty music, then it would be great!"  On the other hand, if you take those elements out of the recharged version, would you still play it with it's zombie gameplay?

 

1 hour ago, Wildstar said:

That's the tone that is projected and I don't have the desire to sift through everything you wrote and others... over the past 8 or so pages.

 

No, that's what you inferred after not even bothering to read enough to find out what I actually said, just be judgy and lazy about it.  Of course you don't have the desire to sift through everything I wrote and others... over, gasp, 8 or so pages, that would require thought and consideration, of which you've shown none.  Better to just swoop in, get the wrong idea and then declare your superior attitude about it.

[JPF997]

20 hours ago, GoldLeader said:

 

Except I Love Daft Punk! 

 STARDUST is just Daft Punk with  a different (older) name, this song "music sounds better with you" is arguably the first truly timeless song Daft Punk ever produced.

[jerseystyle]

1 hour ago, JPF997 said:

 STARDUST is just Daft Punk with  a different (older) name, this song "music sounds better with you" is arguably the first truly timeless song Daft Punk ever produced.

[Giles N]

16 hours ago, roots.genoa said:

Are there different genres depending on if the "singer" vomits, barfs, or throws up his lyrics? 🙂

That would line up as:

 

- VomitCore/DeathVomit

- True Barbaric Barf Metal

- Puke Rock

[Mockduck]

In a practical sense I guess in 2023 at least I prefer the Recharged games. We'll see over time, and not to take away from the legit classic nature of the originals, but I now have basically all of both available to me and play way more Recharged versions instead of the originals over the past three years. 

[digdugnate]

in between all the off-topic stuff, i don't think i actually gave my preference.

 

Some days I'm a 'play the original arcade game' kind of guy, some days I'm a 'play Recharged' kind of guy; it just depends really on what kind of mood I'm in. 

 

Since absolutely no one ever asked, here's my personal ranking of the Recharged games:

 

1.  Asteroids Recharged

2.  Centipede Recharged

3.  Black Widow Recharged

4.  Yars Recharged

5.  Quantum Recharged

6.  Missile Command Recharged

7.  Caverns of Mars Recharged

8.  Gravitar Recharged

9.  Breakout Recharged (blech)

 

Here's my ranking of the 'originals':

 

1. Centipede (arcade)

2. Black Widow (arcade)

3a.  Asteroids (arcade)

3b.  Asteroids (7800)

4. Caverns of Mars (Atari 8-bit computer)

5. Yars Revenge (2600)

6. Missile Command (arcade)

7. Quantum (arcade)

8. Gravitar (2600)

9. Breakout (arcade) (blech)

[Wildstar]

8 hours ago, ledzep said:

 

You first.  Read through this thread from the beginning, I (and others) have shown a huge amount of patience and restraint trying to claw through what JPF997 has been claiming and haphazardly declaring about wide-ranging topics that have little to do with what he seems to be trying to convey.  Some of us have reached our limit.  Nice of you to join in late and pretend you understand what everyone else has been going through so far.  Even he has figured out that he got off on the wrong foot and then made it much worse based on a separate thread he started about how not to be a punching bag something something.  Catch up.

 

To put it another way, I propose that you try to sift through his goofy claims about society, games, space, synthwave, etc., and explain what he was actually talking about since he won't and, better yet, provide anything that would approach evidence to back up those same declarations.

 

 

Hahaaha, you think he was talking about cyberpunk the genre?!?  He has repeatedly talked about Cyberpunk the RPG and now the game(s) and their amazing impact on society based on how much he and his zoomer friends love it.  That's all.  Nothing he's talked about has actually delved into the wider cyberpunk genre.  You would know that if you actually read the many times he's mentioned the fantasticalness of that game like because it mentions a fictional merged Atari/Sega company in it that somehow that means society is really into Atari again.  Go ahead, read it through and prove me wrong, show me where he's talked about cyberpunk as a science-fiction concept and how whatever the fuck society something.  I've read through most of his shit twice, you won't find it.

 

 

Oh, thank Odin you're here to explain cyberpunk to me because you assume I don't know what it is or don't understand it.  You forgot Ghost In The Shell and Westworld, I give your essay a C+.  So, after that rambling Wikipedia-ish synopsis, explain what does that have to do with JPF997's claims that including Atari in that Cyberpunk game affects society in general or changes the way people see Atari?  Can't wait.

First, "stop being a dick" wasn't exclusive to you. Second, there is a thing called netiquettes. Stop bleeping arguing. Short part, agree to disagree where there is disagreements on and shut up already. 8 pages of quasi-opinionated bantering. Some of which you contributed. Technically, there is a bit of being all over the place.  Cut down on some of the long-winded responses. There are reasons for not covering everything in a single post. I didn't write my response to you AND jpf997 for an opinion on grade of writing nor was it ever meant to be a complete exhaustive treatise of 10,000+ pages on everything cyberpunk, either. Yes, Ghost in the Shell is another example of the various take on this genre.

 

Cyberpunk 2077 is a video game that did not invent the cyberpunk influence. It's the sci-fi genre that already influenced the people. The game is already targeted to customers already interested and influenced by the genre. The game is itself just one medium out of the many cyberpunk themed stuff out there that influenced society as a whole. The game, less so. Jpf997, don't take it as dissing the game. I have that game as well. 

 

Reminder, this thread is well publicly viewed. My response wasn't just responding to or just for you, ledzep. It was partly for educating jpf997 on elements. We are already living 'cyberpunk' in an early state of it before Cyberpunk 2077. Although we are not yet with so much with cyberimplants as depicted but we are on the road to there. I am not going to say Cyberpunk 2077 won't have any influence. It is just one of many influences on societal development. It will be more influencing to a Gen Z or later generation who hasn't experienced the prior cyberpunk themed genre that has been out there. 

 

I suspect the games, tv shows, movies that comes out during your life will directly influence you more than anything before on the basic human nature of not or general lack of caring about what happened before your birth. However, we are a world of people spanning a century. 

 

PS: I am still not going to spending 2 weeks of reading through every post over the past 9 pages of this thread.

 

While you been holding considerable restraint compared to some I have seen. That's fine but posting responses is voluntary and I'm saying let's knock off the bantering. Slow down on the pace of responses because some of what you wrote and how you wrote it got you a little ass chewing by others. Jpf997, before talking on a subject that subject matter that predates you, it is worth learning and researching on the subject matter. Spend about 10-20 weeks of about 2-4 hours a day, average... looking at, reading, watching, and playing the stuff.... you should gain an appreciation or understanding of the genre.

 

[Wildstar]

7 hours ago, ledzep said:

Of course you don't have a clue what my attitude and position about any of this is.  Basically it's don't bother with making shitty remakes of older games.  Giles N slapped together a still image that's a more interesting and attractive potential Centipede Recharged than the plodding mess of the actual recharged version. 

I will skip a lot of banter. It's noise. The noise ratio is too high. My patience for responding to long response, which in turn results in requiring lengthy replies, runs thin quickly when replying by a phone. 

 

I agree with you on there should be better quality remakes. Of course, 'better' is subjective. I am suspecting some aspect of poor remakes is for a lot of reasons but money being one of them. Rehashing a remake for conventional displays is probably not going to energize creativity as well. Maybe if they took a take on a game for say... Tilt Five. It would challenge them to do more. In essence you are making a new game on the same cast of characters. Nintendo has done a fairly successful job because they aren't exactly remaking the games so much as making new games in a franchise manner... making sequels.

 

If I want to play the original game, I would either play it in the emulator or with the real hardware.  There would be little incentive to pay money for another copy of what I already have in cartridges and ROM files to run in an emulator.

 

What are you providing in a new game or sequel that is going to be worth it to someone who has the prior to buy. Careful thought about what you add and how it is added as well as how the cast of characters are used and employed in a game. 

 

If you make it out as a mere remake, it will be evaluated differently than as a sequel or something along that line. 

Edited September 25, 2023 by Wildstar

[Wildstar]

I do agree with ledzep that Atari had very little to do with the cyberpunk genre. Only a limited role in cyberpunk reality we live in but so did all of the other technology companies with introduction of computers. One might say Commodore and Nintendo had more impact in the human-computer augmentation than Atari directly, because Commodore and Nintendo outsold number of computers. Atari had influence in starting the video game industry in homes and in the arcades. Third party games made for a lot of platforms at the time, May have weaved in cyberpunk-genre themed games over the years. Then Atari with JPL developing VR headsets way back and how we saw that VR represented in movies like Johnny Mneumonic, Lawnmower man, and others. However, Atari isn't looked at as a "cyberpunk" company. Bushnell's Era Atari are closer to be described as techno-hippies and they were not as closely associated with the "punk" subculture and the cyberpunk literature and branching of the genre to other media.

 

The Atari sound were used in various movies. 

 

In a sense, Atari logo on a building in the Bladerunner sequel was kind of gimmicky. An inclusion perhaps because of a product placement deal. They did it for classic corporate marketing gimmick. They happen to have a little marketing gimmick to promote themselves in 1982 Bladerunner. Remember, Atari was part of Warner Communication and Warner was a film distributor of Blade runner. However, the videogame Blade Runner came out 3 years later by some other video game outfit. Atari wasn't producing that kind of game and theme of games.

[roots.genoa]

9 hours ago, JPF997 said:

 STARDUST is just Daft Punk with  a different (older) name, this song "music sounds better with you" is arguably the first truly timeless song Daft Punk ever produced.

Not exactly, one of Daft Punk's members was one of the three guys in Stardust. But the other guy was the one with actual talent (no I'm joking).

[PowerDubs]

The question to all of you who play the Recharged in couch co-op mode- would you pay something to allow online multiplayer?

 

I know I would...  I love Centipede / Yars / Blackwidow couch co-op with friends.  Online just opens the opportunities.

 

Heck- on Yars- a NON-co-op mode would be fun.  Players not only fight the normal way- but against each other- start from opposing L/R sides- have the bad guy in the middle- avoid each other's shots...and yea be able to hit each other with a cannon from each side as well. 

[Giles N]

14 hours ago, ledzep said:

Just no multibarrel minigun power-ups, please. 

No can do, Sir.

Here will be quad-barrel miniguns, the BFG 26Million, Anti-Bug Nuclear Missile Sites and the Interstellar BugKiller DeathBase Planet-sized Space-station, Anti-Alien Tanks, SpaceBug-infestable Cargoships with super-advanced self-destruct ‘Mother’-AI-systems, become-Chuck Norris-changeling mushrooms, and Hyper-Entropy Universe-Heat-Death-quantum-relativity-Reactors… as the most common of weapon upgrades.

 

Your starting gun, will always fire an automated round of 10000 bullets per button-push.

 

It’s like it or leave it.

 

Time has come to end the Bug-reign once and for all. 
On the front-cover, it’ll say:
«This time its really even more serious than last time».

 

14 hours ago, ledzep said:

the little fairie or whatever that shooter at the bottom is supposed to be.

… he’s not a fairy…

 

 … he’s a sprite…

 

(drum-roll)

[JPF997]

1 hour ago, Wildstar said:

I do agree with ledzep that Atari had very little to do with the cyberpunk genre. Only a limited role in cyberpunk reality we live in but so did all of the other technology companies with introduction of computers. One might say Commodore and Nintendo had more impact in the human-computer augmentation than Atari directly, because Commodore and Nintendo outsold number of computers. Atari had influence in starting the video game industry in homes and in the arcades. Third party games made for a lot of platforms at the time, May have weaved in cyberpunk-genre themed games over the years. Then Atari with JPL developing VR headsets way back and how we saw that VR represented in movies like Johnny Mneumonic, Lawnmower man, and others. However, Atari isn't looked at as a "cyberpunk" company. Bushnell's Era Atari are closer to be described as techno-hippies and they were not as closely associated with the "punk" subculture and the cyberpunk literature and branching of the genre to other media.

 

The Atari sound were used in various movies. 

 

In a sense, Atari logo on a building in the Bladerunner sequel was kind of gimmicky. An inclusion perhaps because of a product placement deal. They did it for classic corporate marketing gimmick. They happen to have a little marketing gimmick to promote themselves in 1982 Bladerunner. Remember, Atari was part of Warner Communication and Warner was a film distributor of Blade runner. However, the videogame Blade Runner came out 3 years later by some other video game outfit. Atari wasn't producing that kind of game and theme of games.

I think I'm starting to understand why ledzep was having such an issue with my opinions, he  thought that I thought that everything I was saying was a literal statement of fact and not an interpretation ( perhaps a bit to idealized/romantic of an interpretation ) maybe I could have worked things a little better to avoid confusion.

Ledpez also had a problem with me associating Atari with things he thought had nothing to do with it, but he has to understand that the little details and distinctions he cares so much about are not that easy for young people of another generation to understand. The way I see it old Atari was relevant in the 80s, blade runner and the cyberpunk genre were born in the 80s, Atari was referenced in blade runner and so the two became connected in my mind , cyberpunk the tabletop game also referenced Atari and so the connection in my mind grew even stronger. Same thing with Atari and synthwave,you go on YouTube and type Atari and Synthwave in the same sentence and what do you get, Atari themed synthwave music, you go to Google images and type Atari cyberpunk and you'll see a mountain of cyberpunk themed artworks with the Atari logo proudly displayed, you start making connections through the media you consume, is this factual evidence, probably not, does any of this have real cultural impact in the real world,  who knows, maybe I'm the only one that ever made these connections, but given the amount of content I have seen on the internet  over the years made by other people who also make these loose connections I sincerely doubt it.

[+GoldLeader]

I just realized one band I always liked, Perturbator,  which I've been listening  to since 2017 or so,  is sometimes described as Synthwave...Hmmmm...

 

OK Back on track, sort of

 

A 2 player Yars especially non Co-op,  Would be pretty cool, but make it so a player can absorb 5 hits or so or 2 from the cannon before exploding, so it's not over too soon. and allowing 3 players would be pretty cool...

 

Shoutout to P-Dubs on that brilliant idea!

[JPF997]

3 minutes ago, GoldLeader said:

I just realized one band I always liked, Perturbator,  which I've been listening  to since 2017 or so,  is sometimes described as Synthwave...Hmmmm...

 

OK Back on track, sort of

 

A 2 player Yars especially non Co-op,  Would be pretty cool, but make it so a player can absorb 5 hits or so or 2 from the cannon before exploding, so it's not over too soon. and allowing 3 players would be pretty cool...

 

Shoutout to P-Dubs on that brilliant idea!

Pertubator are really talented, I especially love they're song "Death Squad" , really fits

that old japanese classic anime movie     Jin-Roh.