2 Un-listed Atari 2600 games???

[Tempest]

It's not worth it, trust me. To sum it up he was (is) a sad little trouble maker that caused alot of turmoil around here. He has a particular dislike for me and a few other regulars on this board. Someone finally made him suffer the consequences of his childish acts and he left to go bug other people. He's not a contributing member to the classic gaming community no matter what he says.

 

And that's all I have to say about that...

 

BTW, did you ever play mini-golf on the 5200? You can get a rom of this never released prototype from the 5200 section (I think). It's pretty much like the 2600 version but alot more fun (although the graphics still suck).

 

Tempest

 

[ 07-18-2001: Message edited by: Tempest ]

[jstefans]

Ok, I won't go there anymore!

 

But on the mini golf front, I'll definitely have to try out the rom! Thanks!

[rolenta]

Sunrise showed off Glacier Patrol at the Winter CES 1984. The game was completed, and therefore may exist, although I haven't seen one.

 

Leonard Herman

[Alex]

quote:

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Originally posted by rolenta:

Sunrise showed off Glacier Patrol at the Winter CES 1984. The game was completed, and therefore may exist, although I haven't seen one.

 

Leonard Herman

---

 

True, what I mean to say is that there is no 2600 Glacier Patrol as released by Sunrise, something that has been in every rarity guide I've seen. Obviously the code exists as Telegames is selling it, but I wonder how exactly they got hold of that. Do you remember seeing any other 2600 Sunrise games that never came to light? I suppose it's possible that Telegames bought some inventory and maybe they have something else they don't know about.

[rolenta]

Yes, a game called Snowplow. here's a description of it from my ABC To The VCS:

 

In Snowplow (Sunrise) you operate a snowplow which must clear the eight horizontal rows of snow. Snow is cleared by merely moving your plow through it. Somewhere in each row you'll uncover a car which will then move across the row that it is in and must be avoided at the risk of losing a turn. When all the snow has been cleared, one of the six cars will flash on and off and you must get to it before time runs out while still avoiding the other cars. When the car has been reached, another car will begin to flash. After all six cars have been retrieved, you'll move on to a harder screen where you must again clear the snow.

[mos6507]

As far as label variations and fonts go, there is one label variation that I think is quite distinct although both are still in the same family, which is the lowercase unconnected text (like Space invaders) vs. the earlier font.

 

Did all the games lapse into this font or just Space Invaders and other games released in 1980?

[jahfish]

i hate this pal/ntsc discussion .... there is no "complete" listing as most of you guys do not accept pal carts in their listings ... still they collect some PAL item because they were never released as ntsc versions ...

 

the good thing about collecting both systems, is that there is no more limit .... there's just too many bootlegs out there. and i heard that carts are still produced in brazil. seems it ain't over yet ... so there can't be a winner in this competition ... even marco_k started to reduce his brazil collection to one of each company/label.

 

also for games like Glacier Patrol, you can by the 10$ telegames version instead of waiting that a ntsc protype may appear one day

 

 

i have been working on lists and started to collect all infos i could get. i planning to make a book with tons of pictures ... hopefully i'll have a first dummy at the eurocon 2001 .... anybody having PAL listings (specially brazil & taiwan titles) could send me his infos to doublecheck, that would be very nice

[digitalpress]

quote:

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Originally posted by jahfish:

i hate this pal/ntsc discussion .... there is no "complete" listing as most of you guys do not accept pal carts in their listings ... still they collect some PAL item because they were never released as ntsc versions ...

---

 

I guess we're not the same "most of you guys" as the ones leaving non-US games off of their lists. The DP Guide contains everything, including PAL games. We have a group of researchers in various countries who assist in populating and editing this list. And we pride ourselves on getting our information first-hand (though there are plenty of programmers and project managers from "the day" that aren't as happy about that).

 

The plan for the 7th edition of the Guide is to get it online, and continue to be the most complete and accurate rarity listing on the planet. Not just for Atari systems but for all of our beloved classics.

 

PS Sunrise Glacier Patrol: Leonard isn't the only person who claims to have seen this game first-hand. The sources have been very reliable. Still hunting for it (and Snowplow).

 

Digital Press

Conquering this tiny planet for ten years!

 

[ 08-28-2001: Message edited by: Digital Press ]

[Alex]

I don't believe Leonard claims to have seen a released copy. A version at a gaming show, yes, but not a production copy. I have yet to hear of anyone claiming to see a production copy, much less show proof of one. Obviously the game existed at some point in prototype form, since Telegames has the code.

 

Is this what you are referring to? Or do mean someone claims to have seen a retail version of Glacier Patrol?

[Albert]

quote:

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Originally posted by rich_vcs:

I would humbly submit that what you just said was quite pompous and arrogant considering that a good amount of your site seems to be borrowed from various sources including Digital Press and others.

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Quite the contrary, Alex and I have spent a considerable amount of time creating content for AtariAge. From the website itself, which certainly wasn't borrowed from anything, to the complex database that ties together games, manuals, label styles, screenshots, catalogs, systems, manufacturers, programmers, and more, to the thousands of scans and pictures Alex and I have taken ourselves, to the original features we've authored, the majority of this site most certainly is not "borrowed" from various sources. Even images that we haven't personally taken have been graciously sent to us by other collectors for inclusion on our site.

 

As for the actual rarity lists themselves, Alex had developed the 2600 list long ago on the original Atari 2600 Nexus site and it has evolved ever since. The 5200 and 7800 lists are fairly small and it's not very difficult to put together complete lists of those games--it's all common knowledge at this point.

 

We spend a lot of time working on this site and we certainly aren't "full of ourselves". We're just glad we're able to give something back to the classic gaming community and it's something we enjoy doing.

 

..Al

[rich_vcs]

quote:

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Originally posted by Alex:

I would humbly submit that our list is the most complete by far, except for the label variation list that Tempest maintains. If you see something in another list that we don't have, it's either just been discovered, it's a minor label variation, or it's probably wrong.

---

 

WOW!

 

I would humbly submit that what you just said was quite pompous and arrogant considering that a good amount of your site seems to be borrowed from various sources including Digital Press and others.

 

I think the Atari Age guys are starting to get a little too full of themselves.

 

Rich

[Alex]

quote:

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Originally posted by rich_vcs:

WOW!

 

I would humbly submit that what you just said was quite pompous and arrogant considering that a good amount of your site seems to be borrowed from various sources including Digital Press and others.

 

I think the Atari Age guys are starting to get a little too full of themselves.

 

Rich

---

 

Fair enough, I can see how that would appear pompous. And I should amend that to say "North American releases" since we don't include PAL games. That said, I think our list is pretty complete, including numerous box and label variations. Aside from Tempest's list, it probably has the most entries.

 

The rest of your comments just seem hostile, and I don't know where that's coming from. I'm sorry you feel that way.

[Sol]

I with Rich this time I find alot of things here that I find on another sites. Even your name AtariAGe was taken from old magazine did you buy to use there name??!

[Alex]

quote:

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Originally posted by Sol:

I with Rich this time I find alot of things here that I find on another sites. Even your name AtariAGe was taken from old magazine did you buy to use there name??!

---

 

If there is anything that we have used from another site without permission, please tell us what it is and we will remove it. Most of the content on the site we created ourselves. The rest was either submitted willfully to the site, or borrowed with permission from another site. It is possible that somone submitted material that was not their own, even though we have requested that people not do this on our contribution page, in which case we would remove it upon notification. Maybe the content you see on other sites was taken from us?

 

"AtariAge" is not copyrighted in any form. I do not believe that "Atari Age" is copyrighted either, based on a nonprofessional search I conducted. We do not use the Atari Fuji logo. Finally, I believe the use of Atari in our name would fall under fair use laws, if Infogrames were to care. There are plenty of examples of company's names being used within other names - look at all the gaming magazines for example.

[Tempest]

I think AtariAge and the Digital Press make nice companion sites, both have things the other doesn't. I frequent both sites and know the owners of both and I wouldn't say that AtariAge is pompus in any way.

 

And to your claim that they just "borrow" stuff form other sites, how can you not? If I put a list of all known 2600 games, can I then claim that all other sites like AtariAge are really borrowing that information from me? There's only a finite amount of Atari information out there, jsut because one site has some of that information doesn't mean another site that has that information too is stealing it.

 

Sounds like your just trying to pick a fight to me.

 

Tempest

[Scott Stilphen]

I need to get my .02 in here, if I may. As you know, I've done a lot of work this year in putting up a comprehensive Easter egg list. A large percentage of the 2600 section comes directly from the 2600 Connection newsletter (which has always given credit for these, since the 1st issue). One of my main goals with this site was to see that people were credited with their discoveries, as many sites neglect this or (worse yet) copy this information from the n/l, word-for-word. I’m also trying to credit those who were the first to actually discover something, and not someone who simply repeated what they had read elsewhere. When I first noticed that you were going to add an Easter egg section, I thought it was a great idea. You had previously included a link to my page on your site, and even promoted my contest, so to have another outlet for this information was great to hear. Which is why I was surprised to see that you’re doing exactly what these other sites are doing – copying the information over (some of them verbatim from my list), sans credit.

 

I have no problem with anyone who wants to use this information for their site, but at least have the courtesy to either mention the source, or ask me first.

[liquid_sky]

I use both guides, its the best of both worlds in a way, and to say someones hard work is "pompous" is a slap in the face, not only to the atariage crew, but the DP crew who has also done extensive research, to all of the contributiors and maintaiers of the lists.... its a slap in the face to anybody who cares about classic gaming

[Albert]

Hi Scott,

 

I think you've done a great job on the Easter Egg list you've created on the DP site. I'd like you to know that I did not copy easter eggs directly from your site, but I did visit a lot of other sites and grabbed many of the eggs I could find that were duplicated on several sites. There are very few sites that actually listed credit for any of the eggs. I saw quite a few eggs, hints, tricks, cheat codes, etc. that were copied word for word across sites.

 

I'm sure some of these sites grabbed your easter eggs and then I ended up copying them onto our site. The reason I didn't pillage your site is I respect the amount of work you've put into it and certainly wouldn't copy everything you've done without talking to you first. You'll surely notice that there are a good number of eggs on your site that are not in our database. The ones that we do have are here because other people also have them on their sites. I was just trying to get a "baseline" of the more commonly known eggs, to which we could add to in the future.

 

Alex and I have been extremely good about giving people credit for submissions, usually right on the front page of the site. If we don't give someone credit when we post a news item it's almost always because the person asks us not to credit them. We don't post news on the front page about every submission, which is why we created the Change Log page, where we can go into glorious detail about what items people have sent us.

 

From the get go we have considered having the ability to credit individual scans (carts, manuals, etc) on the site, which could also be applied to things like the Easter Eggs. But people have been happy to receive credit when we post the items and not everyone is looking for credit anyway, so it's not something we've spent time implementing (yet). Many people are just happy to be able to share their knowledge with others in the community and we're glad to provide a forum for them.

 

..Al

[Scott Stilphen]

>>. There are very few sites that actually listed credit for any of the eggs. I saw quite a few eggs, hints, tricks, cheat codes, etc. that were copied word for word across sites.

>>

 

I agree, Albert – this is exactly my point.

 

I’ve replied to Alex in length about this, so I don’t want to repeat my long-winded email here. The jist of it is, I noticed some of your entries were ones that others or I had written (exactly). I’m all for the exchange of information, but I think there’s a difference between say, using someone’s scan of a Pac-Man box, and plagiarism. The problem with most of these Easter eggs sites have either plagiarized or outright copied information w/o crediting who wrote it (doing a quick search for “2600 Easter eggs” will provide plenty of examples). Even though my page has only been up 6 months, I have seen other sites already starting to glean parts of it, and I don’t doubt that some of it has made its way here. I just felt I should bring it to your attention. My page is by no means the definitive source for such info, but I’m quite confident that no one else has spent as much time tracking down who was the first to discover a given egg, or sifting through the occasional bogus tricks circulating.

 

I’d be lying if I didn’t say that I frequently visit your site, and the amount of information contained within it is staggering, but I’ve probably explored only a 10th of everything that’s offered. In regards to the Easter egg section, that’s a particular area of interest for me, and that’s the only example I’m addressing. As I said, you’re free to use anything on my site (as I state on it, the list is merely a compilation of all the presently-known facts) – all I ask is that if you use something verbatim to give credit to whoever discovered it. Just realize that if you take EE information from other sites, chances are those sites spent little time verifying it or acknowledging the source of it. I’ve already done most of that “grunt” work, so feel free to use my page as a reference point.