No more Vectrex Multicarts :(

[MegaManFan]

For a little perspective here, I bought two of his multi-carts (Vectrex, which I still have, and one other) over the years. I wouldn't say he's the most responsive e-mailer, but I did receive both of the items I paid for in a fair amount of time, and have to say each met with my full satisfaction. The only bad thing I can say about him (and this is pretty mild) is that when I met him in person, I noticed he never smiles - not even when I asked if I could take his picture (to which he did say yes).

 

I really don't think this thread is productive. Maybe it's the in thing to do today to bash people who are from or associated with DP, and maybe in some way I've contributed to the problem, or at least not decried it. As someone far wiser than me said, "It's only video games people!" Geez. If Sean Kelly decided that it's too much time and effort to make multi-carts, and not worth the legal hassles (and there are quite a few) then who are we to bitch? If you don't like it make your own or find somebody else to make one. His are good but it's not like he's the only one out there - he was just the BEST KNOWN with the only website that blatantly advertised them.

 

Bottom line, unless Sean took your money and never sent you shit, what business do you have bitching?

[tantone56]

I started this thread not complaining about his buisness capability but his rude manner. The other people who have done buisness with him filled in the blanks. If he doesnt want to sell vectrex multicarts anymore than fine I could care less but dont act like an ass about people asking you for them when you still advertise them on your site

[MegaManFan]

But dude, you called him at his house. Quite frankly, I've met you at PC5, I think you're an okay kid, but if I didn't know you from Adam and you called my house asking me to sell you shit, I'd probably be rude too. I don't dig random unsolicited calls. I'm with Sean on that one.

[NE146]

I thought he said he didn't call him at his house.. he called him at the Store.

[MegaManFan]

Maybe I missed something. Sean owns an electronics or video game store? I always thought he assembled and mailed carts right out of his home. I could swear I remember sending my checks to a personal address.

[NE146]

Maybe I missed something.  Sean owns an electronics or video game store?

 

As of last year.. yeah.

 

http://www.digitpress.com/archives/arc00097.pdf

 

Videogames etc

4351 N. Harlem Ave.

Norridge,Illinois

[jsoper]

As of last year.. yeah.  

Man, if I spent 70 hours a week running a store and had four daughters at home people wouldn't complain about my manners. They'd be complaining about me chasing them with a chainsaw.

[tantone56]

It wasnt his house cause i got the number off his store site and if it was his house than he shouldnt have posted it on is site. Ive said what ive had to say and im finished now.

[MegaManFan]

Still, all things considered, if he runs a video games store now he probably doesn't WANT to deal with multi-carts any more, because that would be a quick way to get his store closed down in an overzealous legal action over copyright enforcement. But I've said all I have to say on the subject too.

[sku_u]

I really don't think this thread is productive.  Maybe it's the in thing to do today to bash people who are from or associated with DP, and maybe in some way I've contributed to the problem, or at least not decried it. As someone far wiser than me said, "It's only video games people!"  Geez.  If Sean Kelly decided that it's too much time and effort to make multi-carts, and not worth the legal hassles (and there are quite a few) then who are we to bitch?  If you don't like it make your own or find somebody else to make one.  His are good but it's not like he's the only one out there - he was just the BEST KNOWN with the only website that blatantly advertised them.

 

Bottom line, unless Sean took your money and never sent you shit, what business do you have bitching?

 

Exactly. It seems that these "SK sucks" threads pop up every other month. The guy doesn't want to make multicarts anymore and has pulled away from that aspect of classic gaming.

 

To those complaining, put yourselves in his shoes. If you were getting constant inquiries about something you weren't interested in doing, how would you start responding after a while? It's not like he was making a killing on these.

[Atariboy]

But doesn't he still advertise them on his website for sale?

[Zaxxon]

I don't know what thread you're reading but no one here is faulting him for not wanting to produce multicarts any longer. No one said he just suddenly developed his reputation as rude, crabby, etc. just since he stopped making multicarts. And as has been said multiple times now, if he doesn't want anyone to contact him about the carts, why does he still advertise them as being for sale. All he has to do is change his page to read, "I no longer sell any multicarts". That's really tough to do.

 

You SK worshipers will defend him to the death. I can't wait till I release my own classic system cart/thingy so I too can have my own personal internet posse to shout down anyone who says anything less than glowingly positive about me. And don't you dare call my video game store or home or I'll fucking kill you, as it's well within my Classic Gaming Community Super Hero rights to do so.

[Richard H.]

Mark will make any original CGE game except for Animaction

 

I gave Mark my AnimAction PCB design - so he'll have them available soon.

[sku_u]

I don't know what thread you're reading but no one here is faulting him for not wanting to produce multicarts any longer. No one said he just suddenly developed his reputation as rude, crabby, etc. just since he stopped making multicarts.  

 

Hmmmm, let me think about this...maybe I got that impression because several people said that he was grumpy and rude, in several threads complaining about the fact that he doesn't sell multicarts anymore? Is there another way I should interpret that?

 

BTW, I'm not an "SK" worshipper as you call it. I was never a big fan of his multicarts and the guy probably doesn't know who I am.

[MattG/Snyper2099]

Let's see what Sean has to say about all this...

(Taken from digital press #48 )

 

ROMpage: To Show or Not to Show

by Sean Kelly

OK, so what's the deal with all these shows? It seems everyone and their dog is putting on some sort of classic gaming event these days so I thought I'd give a quick run-down of what the hell has been and is going on.

Being one of the organizers of Classic Gaming Expo, obviously I'll be quite a bit more well-versed about our show, but I've attended several others and will be able to offer a different persepctive on those shows. Before I go any further, however, I'd like to make it clear up-front that it is not my intention to belittle any show other than CGE. I'd simply like to pose a few questions and explore the possibility that having too many shows MIGHT be detrimental to the hobby as a whole.

Electronicon

As I recall, the very first show held with a classic videogame theme was held in Philadelphia in 1996 and was called Electronicon. Roughly 30-40 people were in attendance, the show didn't do very well, and was never hosted again.

World of Atari

In 1998, World of Atari was put on in Las Vegas and was run by the same gentleman who ran the World of Atari shows back in the early 80's - Rich Tsukiji. John Hardie and Keita Iida helped organize the event but, according to Mr. Tsikiji, the show lost tens of thousands of dollars and he was not very eager to run it again in 1999.

As the time drew near to make the decision to have a show or not, Rich was nowhere to be found. Emails to him went ignored and rumor had it, he was not in the best of health. The decision was made by John and Keita to form CGE Services and put on what would be a more well-rounded Classic Gaming show called Classic Gaming Expo. Yours truly was brought on-board to help organize things and the first Classic Gaming Expo was born in 1999.

Classic Gaming Expo

CGE '99 was mildly successful at least in the sense that it didn't lose the "tens of thousands" that Rich Tsukiji claimed to have lost at World of Atari '98. There was certainly a loss incurred, but not even half of what was supposedly lost in 1998. The response to CGE '99 was great and despite the loss, and objections from our wives, CGE 2000 was announced.

As plans were being made for the 2000 show, Ketia Iida decided to step- down but John and I forged ahead. As the show's date drew near, two things happened. We took-on Joe Santulli of this very rag to help out with public relations and the media and just before the show opened it's doors, PhillyClassic was announced.

CGE 2000 was bigger and better than the 1999 show and we saw roughly 750 people make their way out to Las Vegas to attend. The guest list was more impressive and despite the fact that our initial plan was to skip 2001 and come back in 2002, popular opinion forced us to make the announcement that CGE 2001 would, in fact, be held.

Classic Gaming Expo 2001 was held in Las Vegas in August and was the biggest of them all. Over 1000 people attended and nearly 100 former industry people were on-hand. Nearly a dozen new games were released at CGE 2001 and even a modern game was debuted in Dragon's Lair 3D with the entire crew who developed the original Dragon's Lair 20 years prior there signing autographs and mingling with the crowd.

CGE 2002 will take place on August 10 & 11 again, in Las Vegas. Our expectations are to see nearly 1300 people in attendance this year!

PhillyClassic

In the Spring of 2000, PhillyClassic took place in Philadelphia. Accounts put about 50-60 people in attendance with about twelve vendors albeit smaller more flea market-type vendors. According to the reports I read after the show, most people had a good time.

PhillyClassic 2001 was held, again, in Philadelphia and the the show saw explosive growth over the previous year. Nearly 200 people attended including myself, John Hardie, and Joe Santulli. Digital Press lauched our tenth anniversay festivities at PhillyClassic 2001. Due to the unexpected growth rate, the show floor was JAM PACKED. You literally could not move inside the main show room. The only refuge was outside in the bar or in the second show room that held the arcade machines. Even the second room was a bit too crowded for my liking at times. The show was a huge success and plans for PhillyClassic 2002 were announced immediately.

There are a number of localized shows held throughout the country as well as overseas. The first CinciClassic, I believe, was held in June of 2000. The setting was a vacant store in a mall (ironically, it looked like a former Radio Shack) and according to reports, roughly 60-70 people were in attendance. It had very much a flea market look to it, but the trading action was reportedly hot and heavy.

The Europeans, naturally, have a difficult time attending the shows here in the US, so in October of 2000, they held their own show in England. Around 30 people were in attendance coming from all over Europe to attend.

In addition to the shows I've mentioned here, there are also numerous smaller gatherings or meetings or parties or whatever you want to call them. There has been talk of a several other shows under consideration including one in Texas someplace and another in New York possibly being held in a school. My question is...at what point do all these shows become detrimental to the hobby or perhaps the idea of attending ANY of the shows being hosted? I'm not sitting here attempting to mandate who should or shouldn't put on a show, but what I would like the people who run them or are thinking about running one to take a few points into consideration before you do.

First of all, are you looking to attract a local audience or a national audience? I have hosted a party or meeting at my house for the past five Summers. As a general rule, I don't invite people more than an hour or so driving distance from my place. I consider my "gathering" to be a party. I don't advertise it publicly and would never even think about trying to attract a larger, national audience. There is plenty of "room" for as many of these types of gatherings or parties as folks can stand. The problem arises when folks start inviting the whole country and pass their party off as something it's not.

For the most part, if someone is going to travel to a "show", they will likely only attend one per year if that. Let's say this year they have a few bucks set aside and start looking around the net for a show they believe they would enjoy the most. The find info on CGE, Philly, and a couple admittedly smaller shows, but then they come across one being held in Los Angeles being advertised as hundreds of people in attendance. They choose the LA show, make their way out there, and find 25 people in some guy's backyard. Maybe if this LA moron had told people what his show was intended to be up-front, this poor sap wouldn't have wasted his hard-earned dough to fly out to LA!

Now this was a hypothetical situation, there isn't a show anywhere in LA that I'm aware of, but the point I was trying to make is that most people will only travel to one show per year. Are there enough collector's to divy-up between four or five shows attempting to be "major" shows? In my opinion, absolutely not! Is there room for two or maybe three shows that cooperate between themselves in an effort to ensure nobody is competing with each other as much as possible? That's a distinct possibility.

Here are a couple more examples of folks attempting to be something they're not and potentially hurting the whole show concept.

In 2002, the first Amiga Expo will be held. Initially, the person running this show advertised it as an Amiga computer show which sounded interesting. He had a few vendors lined-up and even a sponsor or two. A few weeks after announcing the show, another announcement came that they were now incorporating classic videogames into their festivities. Now what possible good is that going to serve?! Now we have some guy who probably has very little knowledge of classic games running around soliciting classic game vendors, sponsors, and attendees to come to his Amiga computer show. Maybe he'll get a classic game vendor or two to show up and maybe a dozen or two classic gaming enthusiasts, but essentially he has deceived classic gamers into supporting a show they probably otherwise wouldn't have. Even if he has considerable knowledge of classic games, his show is directly competing with both PhillyClassic and CGE, and he is seemingly thinking of nothing but himself and his show.

Another show that has been around for a while, JagFest, which is held in support of the Atari Jaguar has said they will incorporate ALL classic games into their show. Jagfest is a traveling show and is held in changing locations each year. In years past, roughly 20-25 people have attended Jagfest. OK, the Jaguar was made by Atari and was very short- lived so I guess some people might make the argument that it's a classic system. Fine....it's classic - I'll even give you that. But here again, we have yet another show trying to sway classic gamers across the country into attending their show.

The question I have to ask myself when I read about these shows suddenly incorporating classic gaming into the mix is why? Is it because they think they can fill a gap in what people are looking for in a videogame show? Do the Amiga Expo people think they have something to offer that folks won't find at CGE or Philly or some of the other established shows? It seems to me they are just trying to better their show. We've run the Jag show for a few years now, it doesn't seem to be growing at the same rate some of the classic game shows are, so let's bring in some classic gamers. What about the Amiga guy? He sets up show as an Amiga show, things are going along decently with a few vendors and sponsors signing-on early but it doesn't look like he's going to see anywhere near the number of people that CGE or even PhillyClassic does. So, here again, let's add classic games to the mix and try and swipe some of their patrons and make the Amiga show a little better.

I don't know about you, but I just can't find the best interests of the people who attend these shows as being considered anywhere here. Sure, I'm one of the people who runs CGE so call me biased all you want. Keep in mind, however, I am also one of the people who attends these shows and one who would attend whether or not I had anything to do with putting the show together.

Have your shows, parties, get-togethers, or whatever, but don't try and be something you're not. If you're running a localized show, invite just that - locals. If your area of expertise is one thing and it's not happening the way you thought it would, maybe it's just not meant to be. Is it really neccessary to try and damage other shows because you couldn't possibly have had a bad idea? If you think there's room for another national show, why not have the best interests of the folks who would attend in mind and try and get some input before making your plans? Perhaps contact the organizers of the other larger shows and try to cooperate with everyone in such a way so as to keep from thinning things out so much that no show can survive. Like I said, I'm a classic gamer and I have a great time attending the shows I am able to sneak away to. I don't want ANYONE to screw that up for me as a COLLECTOR!

(End article)

 

Now wait just a second, too many shows bad? WTF? Every show has it's problems. (Like CGE having to raise the prices to the point where the event isn't even fun b/c it's costing you a fortune to be there! I understand it's in Las Vegas but I still don't completely understand why.)

 

Now c'mon, the only reason I am in this hobby is for the events an the people that organize them and go to them for the same reasons I do. Man I hope Sean doesn't ruin this for me with all his negative carma.

 

[Guest cvo]

"Have your shows, parties, get-togethers, or whatever, but don't try and be something you're not. If you're running a localized show, invite just that - locals. If your area of expertise is one thing and it's not happening the way you thought it would, maybe it's just not meant to be. Is it really neccessary to try and damage other shows because you couldn't possibly have had a bad idea? If you think there's room for another national show, why not have the best interests of the folks who would attend in mind and try and get some input before making your plans?"

 

The arrogance of Sean Kelly makes me want to hurl the lunch I just finished. Who the HELL does he think he is to say who should do what??? Oh heavens forbid anyone take any attendance numbers away from CGE. The bottom line here is that the CGE folks are very afraid of competition and try to mask it as something in the best interests of the hobby. Please, how stupid do we look? Oh hold on a second...

 

*checks wallet to make sure I wasn't born yesterday*

 

Sorry if shows like Philly Classic and AGE and California Extreme are taking away attendance from CGE, but last time I checked, this is a free country and people can do as they please. It's simple as this: you throw a good fun show and people will come. No one is going to give a rat's ass if it's local, national, international, whatever the hell. If it's a fun-looking event and if it's in a fun city, then people are going to go. The only people making ANY noise about shows being local or not or whether or not the number of shows is hurting the hobby are the CGE people. You can read the DP boards for evidence of this. Over and over they iterate how CGE IS THE SHOW OF SHOWS and everything else is just a big flea market! :lolblue: Give me a freaking break. What a nice tactic---passive aggressively slam other shows and belittle them. I think it's safe to say that Philly Classic with numbers over 2400 and AGE with numbers over 2200 are not "flea markets".

 

For those of you who STILL think that Sean is God's gift to the hobby, please take your heads out of your asses, wake up, and smell the coffee.

[Tempest]

"Have your shows, parties, get-togethers, or whatever, but don't try and be something you're not. If you're running a localized show, invite just that - locals. If your area of expertise is one thing and it's not happening the way you thought it would, maybe it's just not meant to be. Is it really neccessary to try and damage other shows because you couldn't possibly have had a bad idea? If you think there's room for another national show, why not have the best interests of the folks who would attend in mind and try and get some input before making your plans?"

 

Wow. That has to be the most arrogant comment I've ever read. Amazing...

 

As far as I'm concerned there's always room for another show (national or local), as long as there are people willing to attend. Back in the late 90's the 'Only one big show a year' theory may have been justified, but times have changed. It appears that some people are having a hard time accepting that.

 

Tempest

[desiv]

For those of you who STILL think that Sean is God's gift to the hobby, please take your heads out of your asses, wake up, and smell the coffee.

 

So, this thread is basically an agrument against those people who think SK is God's gift to the hobby...

 

Yet, nowhere in this thread does anyone ever say that..

 

Point proven!!!

 

Well, done!!

 

Next, let's argue that those people who think water isn't wet are the biggest idiots ever!!!

 

:-)

 

desiv

[Scooterb23]

Gotta go with desiv here...I read through the whole thread...didn't see anyone who said Sean was God.

 

I did see a few people who said that he followed through on his deals, although slowly...and that he was a grumpy person. No God-like properties though.

 

Can I ask...where does Sean say anything about PhillyClassic being a flea market? Oh yeah I see it...the one sentence where he talks about the 12 vendors and 50-60 guests at PC 2000...4 years ago...other parts about PC talk about explosive growth.

 

I have no opinion of Sean, I've never dealt with the guy, and I've never met him...I do see a lot of people in this thread getting very heated...AGAIN...over children's toys & games...why?

[MegaManFan]

Even though I said I would have nothing further to say on the subject, recent details that I've discovered have brought to my attention that Mr. Kelly had some obligations he has failed to meet, and that even though he no long sells the multi-cart his webpage is still up and has not been updated to reflect that information. While I do stand by my original statement that I received both the items I ordered from Mr. Kelly and was fully satisfied by them, I can't in clear conscience say that I think it's right for him to continue to advertise a product he no longer sells and then get angry at people for asking about it, especially when he's got unfulfilled orders that have already been paid for. To anybody I might have offended in this thread who has not been satisfied or refunded by Mr. Kelly, I apologize. If he clarifies his position on his website (or takes it down) and either makes good on outstanding orders or clears those orders by returning any payments fod goods not received, then I'll stand by my original defense. He hasn't done anything to me personally, but the fact that he hasn't met his obligations to people who I know whose word I would trust on something like that disturbs me a great deal.

[Guest cvo]

I retract my earlier statement about people thinking that Sean Kelly is God's gift to the hobby. I was using that statement as a hyperbole, but since some of you missed the aspect of that, I will retract it and replace it with a more easy to understand statement: people are willing to overlook Sean's poor attitude and some business practices he has, and it boggles my mind because hobby or not, you should question whether or not you really want to do business with someone who doesn't understand how to conduct business appropriately.

 

Some of you don't get it because you don't know who is getting the bad end of some of his transactions besides some of the people posting in this thread. That's fine, but there are people who are hesitant to post anything about any past or present bad transactions and dealings they've had with Sean b/c of the people who are so quick to jump to his defense and say that he's done good things for the hobby, etc. So these people have had to resort to PM's and such to communicate their displeasure with Sean when they shouldn't be afraid to say anything at all. There are more people out there than you think that have had poor dealings with Sean that either are too hesitant or afraid to say anything due to possible retaliation or flaming from others in the hobby, or just don't care enough to say anything and will leave it at that. However, I believe that in a hobby this small and intimate, that if someone is dealing poorly with some of us, then the rest of us ought to know. Your reputation is gold in this hobby, and with good reason.

 

I am a stickler for getting what you paid for, but I am an even bigger stickler for not letting jerks get away with being jerks. I was contacted by someone who is currently having some trouble dealing with Sean, and this person is one of the nicest people in this hobby, and one of the nicest people ever in general. To think that someone like Sean is trying to take advantage of him or is treating him rudely and insolently really burns me.

[MsPacBitch]

So CGE is going to San Jose?

 

Everyone knows... when your show-of-shows is too big for Vegas, San Jose is the only place big enough to host you!

 

 

As for Sean... I'm sorry to hear that he's giving a nice person a hard time, especially for an item that has been paid for. Like I said before... Sean was always rude, slow, and possibly drunk, but he eventually did follow through with his commitments. I wish you luck, whoever you may be. I think you'll get your items eventually. Sean is many things, but I don't think he's an outright thief.

[Guest cvo]

So CGE is going to San Jose?

 

Everyone knows... when your show-of-shows is too big for Vegas, San Jose is the only place big enough to host you!

 

 

C'mon, didn't you know? Vegas can handle large conventions like Comdex and CA World, but they can't handle a show like CGE.

 

As for Sean... I'm sorry to hear that he's giving a nice person a hard time, especially for an item that has been paid for. Like I said before... Sean was always rude, slow, and possibly drunk, but he eventually did follow through with his commitments. I wish you luck, whoever you may be. I think you'll get your items eventually. Sean is many things, but I don't think he's an outright thief.

 

I hope he does get his item as well. It may take him another 8-10 months to get it, but by golly he will get it!