Rom Hunter Posted June 15, 2006 Share Posted June 15, 2006 Ok, we have started with filling up some gaps, starting with Absolute Entertainment. Who owns better scans of these: http://axtelius.se/palimages/418.jpg http://axtelius.se/palimages/500.jpg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudolphy Posted June 15, 2006 Share Posted June 15, 2006 @Dino: No problem. I am still interested in our deal and cant wait to see the pics Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dino Posted June 16, 2006 Share Posted June 16, 2006 Romhunter, the scan is not the best. i've never used this camera before so I couldn't get it to focus more clearly. will this do or should i have another go? whats the best setting for me to get a clear photo? Cheers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudolphy Posted June 16, 2006 Share Posted June 16, 2006 Here is a better one Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dino Posted June 16, 2006 Share Posted June 16, 2006 Here is a better one Much better! That one looks ready to go into the PAL database. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gvb Posted June 16, 2006 Share Posted June 16, 2006 Here is a better one Much better! That one looks ready to go into the PAL database. Ok, here you go. Hope this "retouched" one is acceptable. If someone could please upload it to the PAL DB, slap a label & rarity on it, then I can go out for my holidays with a clean consience For the record: it's downsized already. Thanks, Geert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gvb Posted June 16, 2006 Share Posted June 16, 2006 (edited) And while I'm at it (packing bags at the last minute rules), I've inserted the DB record including photo just yet. So please ignore my previous request If anyone please could put a rarity value on it.. Thanks again, Geert Edited June 16, 2006 by gvb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rom Hunter Posted June 17, 2006 Share Posted June 17, 2006 Added the game: http://www.atarimania.com/detail_soft.php?...ERSION_ID=18465 There's an option on your digital camera for taking close-up pictures. Best distance is 6 cm. from the object. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gvb Posted June 17, 2006 Share Posted June 17, 2006 Added the game:http://www.atarimania.com/detail_soft.php?...ERSION_ID=18465 Ah, OK sorry. I thought this cart was meant for the general PAL Database. There's an option on your digital camera for taking close-up pictures.Best distance is 6 cm. from the object. Depends on your camera. Not to start an off topic debate, but my regular shots are from +- 80cm away. Best results through a flatbed scanner though. Geert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rom Hunter Posted June 18, 2006 Share Posted June 18, 2006 Ah, OK sorry. I thought this cart was meant for the general PAL Database All (correct) entries of the PAL Database are also in the Atarimania database. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dino Posted June 19, 2006 Share Posted June 19, 2006 Ah, OK sorry. I thought this cart was meant for the general PAL Database All (correct) entries of the PAL Database are also in the Atarimania database. Romhunter, I havent had a chance to go through the Atarimania database in great detail, but are all the correct Atarimania PAL entries also in the PAL rarity database? The reason I ask is because there are a lot of deficiencies in the PAL rarity guide and maybe they can be plugged by the Atarimania database?? As an aside, the Space war cart is down as a pirate in the PAL rarity guide, yet it has the same label as the time warp funvision cart. shouldn't they both be down as either priates or funvision titles? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rom Hunter Posted June 19, 2006 Share Posted June 19, 2006 (edited) Romhunter, I havent had a chance to go through the Atarimania database in great detail, but are all the correct Atarimania PAL entries also in the PAL rarity database? No. Atarimania has 1500 known to exist PAL titles in its database That's twice as much as the PAL rarity database. As an aside, the Space war cart is down as a pirate in the PAL rarity guide, yet it has the same label as the time warp funvision cart. shouldn't they both be down as either priates or funvision titles? They're both Funvision. Their labels and stickers connect them as Funvision titles: http://www.atarimania.com/lst_soft-MENU-2-...I-SOFT_LIB.html Edited June 19, 2006 by Rom Hunter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
t1n Posted June 19, 2006 Share Posted June 19, 2006 OK i've lost the plot with the Pal Rarity and the Atarimania DBs because I've been away a while. Are both purporting to be as verified as possible? Also I don't see any variation recording in the Pal Rarity (even like the distinction between 'silver' and 'grey' re-releases) is that being ignored for Pal Rarity? If I've got some variations I don't see pics of in either, should I put them in this thread? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rom Hunter Posted June 20, 2006 Share Posted June 20, 2006 (edited) Would be great. Thanks. BTW: both databases contain only known to exist cartridge titles. Edited June 20, 2006 by Rom Hunter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spirantho Posted June 20, 2006 Author Share Posted June 20, 2006 OK i've lost the plot with the Pal Rarity and the Atarimania DBs because I've been away a while. Are both purporting to be as verified as possible? Also I don't see any variation recording in the Pal Rarity (even like the distinction between 'silver' and 'grey' re-releases) is that being ignored for Pal Rarity? If I've got some variations I don't see pics of in either, should I put them in this thread? While I can't really speak for the AtariMania database, I can speak for the PAL Rarity list. One of the points of creating is what such that any number of (trusted) collectors can contribute to it - the AtariMania DB is a closed one, the PAL Rarity one more open. The other major difference is that we have a rarity field in the rarity DB. Also, though, there's less attention paid to small differences between labels - it's more of a simplified record of the rarity of PAL carts than a complete database of everything Atari. Eventually hopefully the PAL Rarity database will be merged into the AtariMania one, when it's at a state where we can safely say it's 99% complete. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dino Posted June 21, 2006 Share Posted June 21, 2006 OK i've lost the plot with the Pal Rarity and the Atarimania DBs because I've been away a while. Are both purporting to be as verified as possible? Also I don't see any variation recording in the Pal Rarity (even like the distinction between 'silver' and 'grey' re-releases) is that being ignored for Pal Rarity? If I've got some variations I don't see pics of in either, should I put them in this thread? While I can't really speak for the AtariMania database, I can speak for the PAL Rarity list. One of the points of creating is what such that any number of (trusted) collectors can contribute to it - the AtariMania DB is a closed one, the PAL Rarity one more open. The other major difference is that we have a rarity field in the rarity DB. Also, though, there's less attention paid to small differences between labels - it's more of a simplified record of the rarity of PAL carts than a complete database of everything Atari. Eventually hopefully the PAL Rarity database will be merged into the AtariMania one, when it's at a state where we can safely say it's 99% complete. The reason why I initially asked the question is because if the atarimania database is much more comprehensive, couldn't we leverage off the entries in that database where completing the PAL rarity database. Given the Atarimania database has only confirmed entries, it would be a matter of getting the list of PAL games and adding any entries that are not in the PAL rarity guide and assigning a rarity value. My gestimate is taht the PAL rarity guide is only about 50% complete? Could we get it to 90% complete through this exercise? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spirantho Posted June 21, 2006 Author Share Posted June 21, 2006 Given the Atarimania database has only confirmed entries, it would be a matter of getting the list of PAL games and adding any entries that are not in the PAL rarity guide and assigning a rarity value. I take your point... but how would we assign a rarity value? Because the PAL rarity guide only has carts that the contributors have seen we can get some kind of a feel for its rarity... but if none of us have seen the cart except by hearsay (i.e. the AtariMania database) it'd be impossible to get any kind of meaningful rating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deathtrappomegranate Posted June 21, 2006 Share Posted June 21, 2006 The Atarimania 8-bit software database does have rarity values, and the problems are just as you suggest. In fact, assigning rarity values is pretty difficult anyway, without dealing with items that few people have seen. The best that can probably be done is to get some kind of agreement about how to assign rarity values, but even that is far from straightforward. I wonder what happened with IBP's relative ebay frequency tables? OK, that approach is very inaccurate, but it might at least provide a few pointers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spirantho Posted June 21, 2006 Author Share Posted June 21, 2006 In fact, assigning rarity values is pretty difficult anyway, without dealing with items that few people have seen. The best that can probably be done is to get some kind of agreement about how to assign rarity values, but even that is far from straightforward. I wonder what happened with IBP's relative ebay frequency tables? OK, that approach is very inaccurate, but it might at least provide a few pointers. Exactly - that's why the PAL rarity database is an open project. Having a closed project is too subjective, so you get the really daft entries like on AtariAge where Waterworld is a 9 when it should be a 7 or so, and like on the DP guide where Super Cobra and Tutankham are rated ER despite the fact they're plentiful outside the States. Because we have an open guide we can reach a happy medium as to the _real_ rarity. In fact if you look back at the earlier posts in this very thread, that's part of the reason this thread exists. As for IBP's work - it's not the same. He was recording the frequency of carts sold in the UK, I believe - but that includes NTSC ones that have been imported and sold by people like retrodogg. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rom Hunter Posted June 21, 2006 Share Posted June 21, 2006 (edited) Because the PAL rarity guide only has carts that the contributors have seen we can get some kind of a feel for its rarity... but if none of us have seen the cart except by hearsay (i.e. the AtariMania database) it'd be impossible to get any kind of meaningful rating. Spirantho, Let's get this clear for once and for all: All the titles in the Atarimania database do exist (except for some rumored Home Vision titles, which happens to be my personal obsession). And this is my hearsay list: * Air & Sea Battle (Air-Sea Battle) * Ammunition * Base * Basket Ball (Basketball) * Baumeister (Master Builder) * Bea Attack * Brick Kick (Frisco) * Bump Ball * Cat & Mouse (Cat Trax) * Chinese Konshu (Dancing Plate) * Defence (Defender) * Demond * Donkey Kony (Donkey Kong) * Doom Room (Room of Doom) * Duck Fighting (Deadly Duck) * Duck Shoot (Kampf um die Schatzinsel) * Evil Attack * Flying Saucer (Base Attack) * Frooger (Frogger) * Funnix * Galaga * Helicopter Rescue * Hero & Beauty (King Kong) * Jaw (Jawbreaker) * Jump Ice (Frostbite) * King of World * Kung Fu (Karate) * Lasser * Lie Low * MAECH * Missile Attack (Missile Command) * Mr. Gobbler (Pac-Man) * Number Zapper * OOPS * Pacman (Pac-Man) * Panda (Panda Chase) * Phantom Tank I * Plant Patrol (Planet Patrol) * Robot * Scream (The Earth Dies Screaming) * Skirun (Ski Run) * Ski Runner * Slock * SN-3201-1 * Sneak Attack * Space Ark * Star Raid * Super Ray (Sky Alien) * Tennis * Tennis I * Tennis II * Tennis III * Thunder Birds or Tank Attack (Thunderground) * Treasure Island (Duck Hunt or Duck Shoot) * Turmel (Turmoil) * Valleyball (RealSports Volleyball) * Wolf und Schwein (Pooyan) * Wolf Fighting * Year 3000 (Mission 3,000 A.D. Not added to the database, simply because I don't know if they really exist. Edited June 21, 2006 by Rom Hunter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dino Posted June 21, 2006 Share Posted June 21, 2006 Because the PAL rarity guide only has carts that the contributors have seen we can get some kind of a feel for its rarity... but if none of us have seen the cart except by hearsay (i.e. the AtariMania database) it'd be impossible to get any kind of meaningful rating. Spirantho, Let's get this clear for once and for all: All the titles in the Atarimania database do exist (except for some rumored Home Vision titles, which happens to be my personal obsession). And this is my hearsay list: * Air & Sea Battle (Air-Sea Battle) * Ammunition * Base * Basket Ball (Basketball) * Baumeister (Master Builder) * Bea Attack * Brick Kick (Frisco) * Bump Ball * Cat & Mouse (Cat Trax) * Chinese Konshu (Dancing Plate) * Defence (Defender) * Demond * Donkey Kony (Donkey Kong) * Doom Room (Room of Doom) * Duck Fighting (Deadly Duck) * Duck Shoot (Kampf um die Schatzinsel) * Evil Attack * Flying Saucer (Base Attack) * Frooger (Frogger) * Funnix * Galaga * Helicopter Rescue * Hero & Beauty (King Kong) * Jaw (Jawbreaker) * Jump Ice (Frostbite) * King of World * Kung Fu (Karate) * Lasser * Lie Low * MAECH * Missile Attack (Missile Command) * Mr. Gobbler (Pac-Man) * Number Zapper * OOPS * Pacman (Pac-Man) * Panda (Panda Chase) * Phantom Tank I * Plant Patrol (Planet Patrol) * Robot * Scream (The Earth Dies Screaming) * Skirun (Ski Run) * Ski Runner * Slock * SN-3201-1 * Sneak Attack * Space Ark * Star Raid * Super Ray (Sky Alien) * Tennis * Tennis I * Tennis II * Tennis III * Thunder Birds or Tank Attack (Thunderground) * Treasure Island (Duck Hunt or Duck Shoot) * Turmel (Turmoil) * Valleyball (RealSports Volleyball) * Wolf und Schwein (Pooyan) * Wolf Fighting * Year 3000 (Mission 3,000 A.D. Not added to the database, simply because I don't know if they really exist. Wht we should be doing therefore is getting all the Atraimania entries except the Homevision titles into the PAL rarity database, even if we cant assign an accurate rarity. we can then work on rarity in the open forum, but at least the entries will be there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spirantho Posted June 23, 2006 Author Share Posted June 23, 2006 Wht we should be doing therefore is getting all the Atraimania entries except the Homevision titles into the PAL rarity database, even if we cant assign an accurate rarity. we can then work on rarity in the open forum, but at least the entries will be there. I see what you mean, but because the AtariMania list isn't 100% verified I'm loathe to let all the entries in unless we can prove they exist as PAL. To see what I'm on about look at thread http://www.atariage.com/forums/index.php?s...p;#entry1088665 where Rom Hunter is putting a cart into the database on the assumption that it's PAL. There's two ways of doing it: 1) Rom Hunter's way - where the cart is assigned PAL or NTSC status based on probability. This way the list is most complete, but may be inaccurate. 2) My way - where the cart is only entered when it's confirmed PAL. This way the list isn't as complete, but the entries are all reliable. It's just two ways of doing it - swings and roundabouts and all that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dino Posted June 24, 2006 Share Posted June 24, 2006 Wht we should be doing therefore is getting all the Atraimania entries except the Homevision titles into the PAL rarity database, even if we cant assign an accurate rarity. we can then work on rarity in the open forum, but at least the entries will be there. I see what you mean, but because the AtariMania list isn't 100% verified I'm loathe to let all the entries in unless we can prove they exist as PAL. To see what I'm on about look at thread http://www.atariage.com/forums/index.php?s...p;#entry1088665 where Rom Hunter is putting a cart into the database on the assumption that it's PAL. There's two ways of doing it: 1) Rom Hunter's way - where the cart is assigned PAL or NTSC status based on probability. This way the list is most complete, but may be inaccurate. 2) My way - where the cart is only entered when it's confirmed PAL. This way the list isn't as complete, but the entries are all reliable. It's just two ways of doing it - swings and roundabouts and all that. Point taken. I just thought we may have been able to speed up the process, but I gusess its best to have the quality controls in place from the outset. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dino Posted June 24, 2006 Share Posted June 24, 2006 Romhunter, I havent had a chance to go through the Atarimania database in great detail, but are all the correct Atarimania PAL entries also in the PAL rarity database? No. Atarimania has 1500 known to exist PAL titles in its database That's twice as much as the PAL rarity database. As an aside, the Space war cart is down as a pirate in the PAL rarity guide, yet it has the same label as the time warp funvision cart. shouldn't they both be down as either priates or funvision titles? They're both Funvision. Their labels and stickers connect them as Funvision titles: http://www.atarimania.com/lst_soft-MENU-2-...I-SOFT_LIB.html Sorry Rom, I meant its incorrect in the PAL rarity guide, not Atarimania. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rom Hunter Posted June 24, 2006 Share Posted June 24, 2006 (edited) My first task is to add a title to the database that is known to exist. My second task is to gather information about the title (not only checking if it's PAL or not, but a hell of a lot more than that). Atarimania's Taiwan section contains (at the most) ten titles that are stated as PAL, while they could be NTSC. Again: I will change them into NTSC as soon as I have the proof they are. Until then, they are PAL, based on my knowledge. Amen. Edited June 24, 2006 by Rom Hunter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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