Developers scared of Ps3?

[AtariJr]

True, Nintendo does have a great collection of launch titles. Being that the Wii is just an upgraded cube, I'm sure it makes it easy to create games for it...or to get away with the fact that several of their games were for the cube originally but were (easily) ported to their new system instead.

 

wow thats just ignorant. For the 9 millionth time its not just a cube. It is roughly twice as powerful as an xbox, so the graphical quality is going to be much better than you think. And its also harder to make the controll perfect than you think. Also, most of those titles ARE original to the Wii, not GC "ports". Considering the graphics on most of those couldnt be done on a wii, and the control is totally reliant on the controller i dont see your point. Sonic Wildfire, Project Hammer, Metroid Prime III, Smash Bros Brawl, Red Steel, Rayman, Call of Duty, Medal of Honor, Wii Sports, Excitetruck, Wii Music, DBZ Tenchiitchi, Trauma Center, Elebits, Disaster Day of Crisis, Dragon Quest, Final Fantasy CC 2, Madden, Wario Ware, Resident Evil, etc, etc, where ALL made with the Wii (formally Revolution) in mind from the START of production. The only games that i can say were not like this from the start were Mario Galaxy, Zelda, and Metal Slug. So id say they are doing pretty well in keeping the idea of "ports" away and making each game oringal as possible. As far as launch titles, i think nintendo will have no problem emtying out my wallet the fall as there are WAY too many games that interest me.

[carpecarne]

True, Nintendo does have a great collection of launch titles. Being that the Wii is just an upgraded cube, I'm sure it makes it easy to create games for it...or to get away with the fact that several of their games were for the cube originally but were (easily) ported to their new system instead.

 

wow thats just ignorant. For the 9 millionth time its not just a cube. It is roughly twice as powerful as an xbox, so the graphical quality is going to be much better than you think. And its also harder to make the controll perfect than you think. Also, most of those titles ARE original to the Wii, not GC "ports". Considering the graphics on most of those couldnt be done on a wii, and the control is totally reliant on the controller i dont see your point. Sonic Wildfire, Project Hammer, Metroid Prime III, Smash Bros Brawl, Red Steel, Rayman, Call of Duty, Medal of Honor, Wii Sports, Excitetruck, Wii Music, DBZ Tenchiitchi, Trauma Center, Elebits, Disaster Day of Crisis, Dragon Quest, Final Fantasy CC 2, Madden, Wario Ware, Resident Evil, etc, etc, where ALL made with the Wii (formally Revolution) in mind from the START of production. The only games that i can say were not like this from the start were Mario Galaxy, Zelda, and Metal Slug. So id say they are doing pretty well in keeping the idea of "ports" away and making each game oringal as possible. As far as launch titles, i think nintendo will have no problem emtying out my wallet the fall as there are WAY too many games that interest me.

 

Sorry, I didn't make myself clear. First, you can consider me a large supporter of the Wii: I don't care for any of the other two consoles and never will. Nintendo's philosophy on gaming is in accord with what I personally believe.

 

Second, when I said, "just an upgraded cube", I meant the actual hardware (CPU, GPU, RAM) is upgraded cube hardware. If you believed me to mean that the system is just a "gamecube with a peripheral" I can see how anyone could have made that mistake and I should be more careful. What I was trying to say was that because it is Cube hardware x2, we are able to have such great games from the start since programming for it is so easy. Because its philosophy is that it's not a graphics machine, developers are not having to figure out a new system architecture nor forced to come up with eye-dropping graphics from the get go: they are able to focus on game mechanics and gameplay. And because the public knows the wii is not about graphics either, they can get totally psyched about Zelda and not whine about, "Ug, it looks soooo last gen!". Plus, down the road I'm positive the Wii will have people turn their heads and say, "the Wii can do THAT?!"

 

In all cases the Wii wins!

 

Sorry for sounding ig'nant Reading it again, I realize I was trying to make a complex point in two sentences.

Edited August 6, 2006 by carpecarne

[CPUWIZ]

wow thats just ignorant. For the 9 millionth time its not just a cube. It is roughly twice as powerful as an xbox, so the graphical quality is going to be much better than you think.

 

Actually, you are dead wrong, it isn't even as powerful as the first XBOX.

[AtariJr]

True, Nintendo does have a great collection of launch titles. Being that the Wii is just an upgraded cube, I'm sure it makes it easy to create games for it...or to get away with the fact that several of their games were for the cube originally but were (easily) ported to their new system instead.

 

wow thats just ignorant. For the 9 millionth time its not just a cube. It is roughly twice as powerful as an xbox, so the graphical quality is going to be much better than you think. And its also harder to make the controll perfect than you think. Also, most of those titles ARE original to the Wii, not GC "ports". Considering the graphics on most of those couldnt be done on a wii, and the control is totally reliant on the controller i dont see your point. Sonic Wildfire, Project Hammer, Metroid Prime III, Smash Bros Brawl, Red Steel, Rayman, Call of Duty, Medal of Honor, Wii Sports, Excitetruck, Wii Music, DBZ Tenchiitchi, Trauma Center, Elebits, Disaster Day of Crisis, Dragon Quest, Final Fantasy CC 2, Madden, Wario Ware, Resident Evil, etc, etc, where ALL made with the Wii (formally Revolution) in mind from the START of production. The only games that i can say were not like this from the start were Mario Galaxy, Zelda, and Metal Slug. So id say they are doing pretty well in keeping the idea of "ports" away and making each game oringal as possible. As far as launch titles, i think nintendo will have no problem emtying out my wallet the fall as there are WAY too many games that interest me.

 

Sorry, I didn't make myself clear. First, you can consider me a large supporter of the Wii: I don't care for any of the other two consoles and never will. Nintendo's philosophy on gaming is in accord with what I personally believe.

 

Second, when I said, "just an upgraded cube", I meant the actual hardware (CPU, GPU, RAM) is upgraded cube hardware. If you believed me to mean that the system is just a "gamecube with a peripheral" I can see how anyone could have made that mistake and I should be more careful. What I was trying to say was that because it is Cube hardware x2, we are able to have such great games from the start since programming for it is so easy. Because its philosophy is not that it's a graphics machine, developers are not forced to come up with eye-dropping graphics from the get go: they are able to focus on game mechanics and gameplay. And because the public knows the wii is not about graphics, they can get totally psyched about Zelda and not whine about, "Ug, it looks soooo last gen!". Plus, down the road I'm positive the Wii will have people turn their heads and say, "the Wii can do THAT?!"

 

In all cases the Wii wins!

 

Sorry for sounding ig'nant Reading it again, I realize I was trying to make a complex point in two sentences.

 

your cool, i jumped the gun as well. Yea your points are valid, im just sick of idiots saying that the wii is a gamecube iwth a new controller, there is sooo much more that the system offers with graphics only being one of many. The sad thing is that im more excited about aiming my bow in arrow then looking at near to real life graphics on ps3. Ive always been about wanting the next prettiest thing, but i think DS really did change my outlook on that.

[carpecarne]

wow thats just ignorant. For the 9 millionth time its not just a cube. It is roughly twice as powerful as an xbox, so the graphical quality is going to be much better than you think.

 

Actually, you are dead wrong, it isn't even as powerful as the first XBOX.

 

Interesting, I know you have a dev kit, and I am wondering how you made this assumption, because from what I heard, while the Wii and Xbox have roughly the same speed processor, the wii's powerpc processor is much more efficient than the celeron in the Xbox. Plus while the XBOX has 64 megs of DDR SRAM the Wii has 64 megs of Ti-SRAM - TI is supposedly faster correct?

 

I can't find the article but there was a developer at G3 who was said that the gamecube was actually more powerful than the xbox or ps2, but because it had such limited RAM, developers didn't want to spend time optimizing their code.

 

If anyone can find that article, cudos!

[carpecarne]

OK, I found it: I read it over at macrumors.com

 

"Interestingly, the devs at Blitz Games explained to me that the GameCube was actually the most powerful system of current gen (which actually surprised me). I knew that the G3 in the GameCube should be able to possibly outperform the Celeron/P3 hybrid in the XBox, but I commented that I thought the GameCube had less RAM and a slower GPU. He agreed, though noted that the RAM was faster and said that the trick was that the GPU could do a lot of stuff for free in the hardware that the XBox's GPU could not, though the XBox's GPU was faster. So when utilized properly the GameCube could potentially push out the best graphics, and he pointed out Twilight Princess and Resident Evil 4; but for ports, it's not that well optimized for the system and the XBox's faster GPU wins out, that's why ports always look best on the XBox, because it had the fastest GPU.

 

It was an interesting conversation. He told me that he expected to see great graphics out of the Wii, because the GameCube was potentially so powerful and it was just a vastly overclocked GameCube. Not on par with the XBox 360, but still good."

 

http://forums.macrumors.com/archive/index.php/t-202138.html

[CPUWIZ]

Interesting, I know you have a dev kit, and I am wondering how you made this assumption, because from what I heard, while the Wii and Xbox have roughly the same speed processor, the wii's powerpc processor is much more efficient than the celeron in the Xbox. Plus while the XBOX has 64 megs of DDR SRAM the Wii has 64 megs of Ti-SRAM - TI is supposedly faster correct?

 

You are absolutely correct about the CPU and RAM, however, in order for me to explain why, I would have to break the NDA. Sorry, but I am not going to do that.

 

I can't find the article but there was a developer at G3 who was said that the gamecube was actually more powerful than the xbox or ps2, but because it had such limited RAM, developers didn't want to spend time optimizing their code.

 

That is definately incorrect, the XBOX is the most powerful system of the current generation.

[carpecarne]

 

You are absolutely correct about the CPU and RAM, however, in order for me to explain why, I would have to break the NDA. Sorry, but I am not going to do that.

 

Fair enough.

 

 

That is definately incorrect, the XBOX is the most powerful system of the current generation.

 

Look above to see another one's opinion. I, on the other hand, will not claim a thing since I am no programmer.

Edited August 6, 2006 by carpecarne

[ubersaurus]

Check out Joystiq.com

 

Atari wont be making a game for for the ps3 now till either early or late 2007. SNK released today that they dont want to make a game for it till 2009-2010!!, practically when the system will be dead. It seems the high price point, lack of enough systems for launch, and sony's attitude in general about the system is starting to scare away developers who already have launch titles scheduled for systems like the Wii . (Dragon Ball Z Tenchitchi -atari, Metal Slug Anthology - SNK)

I'd rather hear about Capcom and Konami's plans for the PS3, rather than minor third-party companies like Atari and SNK...

Ding ding ding we have a winner. I'm suprised anyone actually cares about SNK anymore given the complete derth of quality found in their modern titles (and lets face it older ones as well). KOF11 looks good but one good game doesn't offset 10 crappy ones.

 

 

You're telling me that KOF11, Sam Sho 6, Neo Geo Battle Colosseum, you're saying that these all suck?

 

You're telling me that Samurai Shodown Special, KOF 2k2, Matrimelee, Metal Slug 5, KOF 2k3, and Maximum Impact 2 all suck?

 

Have you put ANY time into these games?

[sega saturn x]

Check out Joystiq.com

 

Atari wont be making a game for for the ps3 now till either early or late 2007. SNK released today that they dont want to make a game for it till 2009-2010!!, practically when the system will be dead. It seems the high price point, lack of enough systems for launch, and sony's attitude in general about the system is starting to scare away developers who already have launch titles scheduled for systems like the Wii . (Dragon Ball Z Tenchitchi -atari, Metal Slug Anthology - SNK)

I'd rather hear about Capcom and Konami's plans for the PS3, rather than minor third-party companies like Atari and SNK...

Ding ding ding we have a winner. I'm suprised anyone actually cares about SNK anymore given the complete derth of quality found in their modern titles (and lets face it older ones as well). KOF11 looks good but one good game doesn't offset 10 crappy ones.

 

 

You're telling me that KOF11, Sam Sho 6, Neo Geo Battle Colosseum, you're saying that these all suck?

 

You're telling me that Samurai Shodown Special, KOF 2k2, Matrimelee, Metal Slug 5, KOF 2k3, and Maximum Impact 2 all suck?

 

Have you put ANY time into these games?

Well screw me for not being able to play imports, and aside from that I said kof 11 looks good very good even. Battle colosseum from what I've heard is pretty terrible and after chaos I have no desire to give it a try. And yeah metal slug 5 did suck, can't remember a single interesting thing about the game. And no thanks to 3-D kof games screw that noise.

Edited August 7, 2006 by sega saturn x

[AtariJr]

wow thats just ignorant. For the 9 millionth time its not just a cube. It is roughly twice as powerful as an xbox, so the graphical quality is going to be much better than you think.

 

Actually, you are dead wrong, it isn't even as powerful as the first XBOX.

 

well he was close at least... some people actually think the ps2 is the most powerful

[Atarifever]

wow thats just ignorant. For the 9 millionth time its not just a cube. It is roughly twice as powerful as an xbox, so the graphical quality is going to be much better than you think.

 

Actually, you are dead wrong, it isn't even as powerful as the first XBOX.

Bah, it's still over-powered I say. Anything beyond the Genesis is over-powered.

 

Seriously though, you said the controller seemed good right? As long as that's alright, I don't care if it's an N64 wrapped up in hockey tape with Wii drawn on with a sharpie. If I want power, I'll just play a 360.

[CPUWIZ]

Bah, it's still over-powered I say. Anything beyond the Genesis is over-powered.

 

LOL

 

Seriously though, you said the controller seemed good right? As long as that's alright, I don't care if it's an N64 wrapped up in hockey tape with Wii drawn on with a sharpie. If I want power, I'll just play a 360.

 

Indeed, the controllers are awesome, the possibilities are endless.

[King_Salamon]

Bah, it's still over-powered I say. Anything beyond the Genesis is over-powered.

 

LOL

 

Seriously though, you said the controller seemed good right? As long as that's alright, I don't care if it's an N64 wrapped up in hockey tape with Wii drawn on with a sharpie. If I want power, I'll just play a 360.

 

Indeed, the controllers are awesome, the possibilities are endless.

 

What are some of the ideas being kicked around for the controller? I don't want you to give away brainstorming sessions worth of work but I'm just curious as to some of the uses being thought about by designers/developers.

 

Seems like the Wii could become an outlet for shooters, this is something I never would have suspected.

 

As you are familiar with the controllers capabilities, any ideas on how well a precision game like Trauma Center will be? I know it can handle DS resolutions but on a TV screen there would be a need for better accuracy (wouldn't it?).

[darklord1977]

The high price might scare off some of the crappier developers, but that might be a good thing. Honestly, not having Atari develop something for your console is almost a plus. Does SNK still publish games? I havent paid much attention to them.

 

Tempest

ive read that certin publishers cant get hold of the development kits for the ps3 or they just dont want to deal with that system all together because of the blu ray. and other programming issues

[darklord1977]

i dont understand why 2d is evil in their minds. and who cares if its a neo geo port, if its a good game then its a good game.

i agree...its the gameplay that matters some 2d games even look better than some of the newer games on the market its all on how they are presented.

[sega saturn x]

i dont understand why 2d is evil in their minds. and who cares if its a neo geo port, if its a good game then its a good game.

i agree...its the gameplay that matters some 2d games even look better than some of the newer games on the market its all on how they are presented.

SNK doesn't make that kind of 2-D, in fact most of SNKs games look awful. Those chunky low res sprites were fine in the early 90's but look awful now. Hell they looked pretty old in 1995 as well when compared to capcoms games.

[AtariJr]

i dont understand why 2d is evil in their minds. and who cares if its a neo geo port, if its a good game then its a good game.

i agree...its the gameplay that matters some 2d games even look better than some of the newer games on the market its all on how they are presented.

SNK doesn't make that kind of 2-D, in fact most of SNKs games look awful. Those chunky low res sprites were fine in the early 90's but look awful now. Hell they looked pretty old in 1995 as well when compared to capcoms games.

 

really? all my snk games on my sega saturn are beautiful and near to pure arcade perfection ... and im sorry, but the speed, and handdrawn beauty of those 2d graphics cannot compair to 3D.. you just can recreate those games in 3d well, it just doesnt work..

[Gabriel]

i dont understand why 2d is evil in their minds. and who cares if its a neo geo port, if its a good game then its a good game.

i agree...its the gameplay that matters some 2d games even look better than some of the newer games on the market its all on how they are presented.

SNK doesn't make that kind of 2-D, in fact most of SNKs games look awful. Those chunky low res sprites were fine in the early 90's but look awful now. Hell they looked pretty old in 1995 as well when compared to capcoms games.

 

Amen.

[n8littlefield]

While SNK graphics have dated, they still have a very distinct personality/artstyle that helps them stand the test of time better than many others. Stuff like Metal Slug may look pixelated, chunky and low res, but they do it with a graphical style that actually suits that limitation.

 

To me, it's comparible to the fact that in 10 years, we'll likely all be used to high polygon counts, high def TV's and insanely detailed graphics, but a game like Ico will still look good because it works around the limits of it's hardware by using a very unique style that will likely be ageless.

[figgler]

Sure, I'll buy that. It's more about style than anything else. It's the same reason I'd readily welcome a new 8 bit Mega Man game.

[Starscream]

While SNK graphics have dated, they still have a very distinct personality/artstyle that helps them stand the test of time better than many others. Stuff like Metal Slug may look pixelated, chunky and low res, but they do it with a graphical style that actually suits that limitation.

 

To me, it's comparible to the fact that in 10 years, we'll likely all be used to high polygon counts, high def TV's and insanely detailed graphics, but a game like Ico will still look good because it works around the limits of it's hardware by using a very unique style that will likely be ageless.

 

Ico looks like shit through component on a HD display

 

But I get your point.

Edited August 8, 2006 by Starscream

[darklord1977]

i dont understand why 2d is evil in their minds. and who cares if its a neo geo port, if its a good game then its a good game.

i agree...its the gameplay that matters some 2d games even look better than some of the newer games on the market its all on how they are presented.

SNK doesn't make that kind of 2-D, in fact most of SNKs games look awful. Those chunky low res sprites were fine in the early 90's but look awful now. Hell they looked pretty old in 1995 as well when compared to capcoms games.

when i refer to 2d i always think of capcom.. capcom is the best period (street fighter series marvel, x men etc) even midway (mortal kombat) ranks up there as well ...although snk had good 2d titles..I still play my neo geo aes system, those games rocked..and are still fun. but the quality of the stuff they put out now is poor.

Edited August 9, 2006 by darklord1977

[sega saturn x]

i dont understand why 2d is evil in their minds. and who cares if its a neo geo port, if its a good game then its a good game.

i agree...its the gameplay that matters some 2d games even look better than some of the newer games on the market its all on how they are presented.

SNK doesn't make that kind of 2-D, in fact most of SNKs games look awful. Those chunky low res sprites were fine in the early 90's but look awful now. Hell they looked pretty old in 1995 as well when compared to capcoms games.

 

really? all my snk games on my sega saturn are beautiful and near to pure arcade perfection ... and im sorry, but the speed, and handdrawn beauty of those 2d graphics cannot compair to 3D.. you just can recreate those games in 3d well, it just doesnt work..

I'm not endorsing 3-D titles over 2-D, to me that's just nonsense. And those games are arcade perfect alright, but on a board that by that time was over half a decade old and had reached it's limits. SNKs games were hot when they were new and impressive for the fact they ironically looked far more realistic than the games on capcoms CPS-2. But when CPS-2 hit its stride SNK board was looking worse for wear, but rather than upgrade they kept plugging away mainly due to budget reasons.

 

I mean compare street fighter alpha or darkstalkers to art of fighting or king of fighters. Should kof 11 a game that came out this year really look worse than a game that came out in 1995? If SNK got their act togther I would actually care about their releases again. Re-draw your sprites for starters and round out your cast with characters that are actually interesting. SNK ripped off everything about capcoms games but the things that made them special.