thomasholzer Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 I got Menace and Shadow of the Beast on my Atari 8-bit disks somewhere (found Menace, still searching for Shadow...) Could someone finish writing those two games and release them? Hint, hint.... Or wouldn't Psygnosis allow it anymore nowadays? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kuestenturm Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 Are you sure that you mean MENACE and SHADOW OF THE BEAST for the ATARI XL/XE? If so, can you please post the XFD or ATR-images? kuestenturm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kuestenturm Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 Just found the images on the web ... http://www.jetbootjack.com/JBJ_oldgamesdownloads.html and http://www.jetbootjack.com/JBJ_oldgamesindex.html kuestenturm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetboot Jack Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 Thomas, C'mon - you know very well what can and cannot be done with those items... I have no SOB source code, and non will be supplied unfortunatley. However I have always said I am happy for anyone to take a look at the Menace techniques and do something with them (other than Menace)... sTeVE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thomasholzer Posted June 26, 2007 Author Share Posted June 26, 2007 (edited) Thomas, C'mon - you know very well what can and cannot be done with those items... I have no SOB source code, and non will be supplied unfortunatley. However I have always said I am happy for anyone to take a look at the Menace techniques and do something with them (other than Menace)... sTeVE Hi Steve, that is a shame though. So basically these excellent Harlequin games for the A8 will be lost forever. I reckon you should do a 'Games that weren't' feature in Retro Gamer, the A8 gets to little support in there. Edited June 26, 2007 by thomasholzer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetboot Jack Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 Not lost, just unfinished - but I actually like 'em that way - shows what nearly was sTeVE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.Amiga500 Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 Even though Shadow of the Beast is a "Game that wasn't" on the A8, I don't feel that it's any great loss because it's just a failed port of a game originally written for the Amiga. If you want to play it that badly, play it on the Amiga where it was meant to be played. It would be a different story if it was an awesome A8-designed game that never made it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FastRobPlus Posted June 27, 2007 Share Posted June 27, 2007 I agree - they were Amiga games so the only nostalgia is in seeing what they looked like. On that note - I would like to see Centurion - Defender of Rome on the A8 to see how it translated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetboot Jack Posted June 27, 2007 Share Posted June 27, 2007 (edited) Always encouraging to hear positive things, really inspiring... If no ports were ever done stuff like Beef Drop or Castle Crisis would have never made it out - or do those comments not apply to those games Perhaps if you looked at Harelquin's proposed catalog you would see that there were both original games (Plastron, Project Xanthien, Paintz) as well as conversions planned... sTeVE Edited June 27, 2007 by Jetboot Jack Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thomasholzer Posted June 27, 2007 Author Share Posted June 27, 2007 Yeah, there's always one, isn't there....anyhow, I reckon SOTB already looked awesome on the A8. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dzozef Posted June 27, 2007 Share Posted June 27, 2007 Centurion? http://www.atarimania.com/detail_soft.php?...;VERSION_ID=985 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.Amiga500 Posted June 27, 2007 Share Posted June 27, 2007 Always encouraging to hear positive things, really inspiring... If no ports were ever done stuff like Beef Drop or Castle Crisis would have never made it out - or do those comments not apply to those games Perhaps if you looked at Harelquin's proposed catalog you would see that there were both original games (Plastron, Project Xanthien, Paintz) as well as conversions planned... sTeVE You're overreacting. I didn't say I don't like ports. My point was that Shadow of the Beast is not a game that has been lost forever. It exists in the format it was designed for. It's not like those many tragically nearly-finished original games that we'll never see. Besides, even if Shadow of the Beast was somehow released for the A8, it would absolutely suck compared to the Amiga version because the A8 (awesome computer it was for its time) is a decade behind Amiga technology. That's like me wishing for Half-Life for my A500. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetboot Jack Posted June 27, 2007 Share Posted June 27, 2007 (edited) And this community wonders why people who can and did make games for this platform walk away from it: even if Shadow of the Beast was somehow released for the A8, it would absolutely suck Well thank you Mr.Amiga500, personally I had pretty high hopes for the project myself at the time. sTeVE Edited June 27, 2007 by Jetboot Jack Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevin242 Posted June 27, 2007 Share Posted June 27, 2007 (edited) And this community wonders why people who can and did make games for this platform walk away from it: even if Shadow of the Beast was somehow released for the A8, it would absolutely suck Well thank you Mr.Amiga500, personally I had pretty high hopes for the project myself at the time. sTeVE It wouldn't necessarily suck, it might be quite impressive for the XL/XE series, but what made the Shadow of the Beast games so great was the cool effects that were unique to the Amiga (parallax scrolling, extra half brite color, cool pan flute 4 voice stereo soundtrack and so on...) that could never be duplicated on the Atari 8 bits, so I can see what the original poster is saying if you want to play Menace or SOB then play the Amiga versions... I am not against ports for the 8bit but would like to see games that the Atari 8bit could pull off that never materialized one example is Sinistar which may actually be released one day when we are all old and gray or older and grayer as the case may be!! That said, out of morbid curiosity or perhaps just my love of the XL/XE platform I would love to see someone try. A Shadow of the Beast style game could be done very well if it was made with the Atari 8bits limitations in mind and also used all of the XL/XE platform's tricks. Edited June 27, 2007 by kevin242 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emkay Posted June 27, 2007 Share Posted June 27, 2007 (edited) It's not like those many tragically nearly-finished original games that we'll never see. Besides, even if Shadow of the Beast was somehow released for the A8, it would absolutely suck compared to the Amiga version because the A8 (awesome computer it was for its time) is a decade behind Amiga technology. That's like me wishing for Half-Life for my A500. Actually, the game wouldn't suck if it was there "in the past". At least game cartridges with extra ram/rom storage for graphics data, would have done miracles. Until today it is not to understand (for me at least), why there never was a "Dragon's Lair" on the A8. The 256 colours were yelling after it.... real fullscreen and 4 channel Digi were possible aswell.... for a great entertainment on the living room TV set. Being very expensive in 1979, in 1983 (and later) people would have bought those Cartridges with ROM/RAM expansions. Edited June 27, 2007 by emkay Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
www.atarimania.com Posted June 27, 2007 Share Posted June 27, 2007 It's not like those many tragically nearly-finished original games that we'll never see. Besides, even if Shadow of the Beast was somehow released for the A8, it would absolutely suck compared to the Amiga version because the A8 (awesome computer it was for its time) is a decade behind Amiga technology. That's like me wishing for Half-Life for my A500. More like you believing in ultra-conservatism... Of course it won't look as good as on the Amiga but why would it necessarily suck? Why do so many people STILL think all the A8 needs is games with primitive gameplay and graphics? Is there some kind of law preventing coders to try new things and go beyond four-color programs with 1980-looking graphics? With no progress, a platform dies and reactions such as yours are one of the causes of the A8's demise. -- Atari Frog http://www.atarimania.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thomasholzer Posted June 27, 2007 Author Share Posted June 27, 2007 Always encouraging to hear positive things, really inspiring... If no ports were ever done stuff like Beef Drop or Castle Crisis would have never made it out - or do those comments not apply to those games Perhaps if you looked at Harelquin's proposed catalog you would see that there were both original games (Plastron, Project Xanthien, Paintz) as well as conversions planned... sTeVE You're overreacting. I didn't say I don't like ports. My point was that Shadow of the Beast is not a game that has been lost forever. It exists in the format it was designed for. It's not like those many tragically nearly-finished original games that we'll never see. Besides, even if Shadow of the Beast was somehow released for the A8, it would absolutely suck compared to the Amiga version because the A8 (awesome computer it was for its time) is a decade behind Amiga technology. That's like me wishing for Half-Life for my A500. Obviously he never played the C-64 version: http://www.gb64.com/game.php?id=6735&d=18&h=0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.Amiga500 Posted June 27, 2007 Share Posted June 27, 2007 More like you believing in ultra-conservatism... Of course it won't look as good as on the Amiga but why would it necessarily suck? Read my post! I said "it would absolutely suck compared to the Amiga version". How could it not? Shadow of the Beast even pushed the Amiga's capabilities, so how could it possibly get close on an A8? Why do so many people STILL think all the A8 needs is games with primitive gameplay and graphics? Is there some kind of law preventing coders to try new things and go beyond four-color programs with 1980-looking graphics? Did I say the A8 needs primitive games?? Holy Sasquatch, people!! Read what I bloody wrote. I'm saying the loss of A8 Shadow of the Beast is no great loss because it exists on Amiga - the platform it was meant for. It's not a game that was completely lost. How many times do I have to say that? With no progress, a platform dies and reactions such as yours are one of the causes of the A8's demise. OK, yes. It was me. I caused the A8's demise. Let me inform you: The A8 is dead. The C64 is dead. The Amiga is dead. Even I know that and I'm using an Amiga to type this. You people need to lighten up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
www.atarimania.com Posted June 27, 2007 Share Posted June 27, 2007 Read my post! I said "it would absolutely suck compared to the Amiga version". How could it not? Shadow of the Beast even pushed the Amiga's capabilities, so how could it possibly get close on an A8? I never wrote such a thing... It could've been a good game in its own right with very nice technical specifications for the Atari. There were a lot of games ported to both 8-bit and 16-bit computers at the time and even some of the tougher conversions to smaller formats sometimes came up better on the "lesser" platforms. Did I say the A8 needs primitive games?? Holy Sasquatch, people!! Read what I bloody wrote. I'm saying the loss of A8 Shadow of the Beast is no great loss because it exists on Amiga - the platform it was meant for. It's not a game that was completely lost. How many times do I have to say that? Given how harsh your response was, my feeling was your post was clearly implying it... OK, yes. It was me. I caused the A8's demise. At the time and I'm speaking generally here... Let me inform you: The A8 is dead. The C64 is dead. The Amiga is dead. A pretty subjective notion anyway. I think there's still room for progress and there are several programs out there proving my point... -- Atari Frog http://www.atarimania.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevin242 Posted June 27, 2007 Share Posted June 27, 2007 OK, yes. It was me. I caused the A8's demise. Let me inform you: The A8 is dead. The C64 is dead. The Amiga is dead. Even I know that and I'm using an Amiga to type this. You people need to lighten up. Wait a minute you are the guy who killed off the Atari 8 bit and the Amiga? Thanx alot!!! Seriously, what kind of an Amiga setup are you using to post here? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TMR Posted June 27, 2007 Share Posted June 27, 2007 Read my post! I said "it would absolutely suck compared to the Amiga version". How could it not? Shadow of the Beast even pushed the Amiga's capabilities, so how could it possibly get close on an A8? By being a good, playable game... sadly that's where the whole thing falls over because Shadow of the Beast wasn't particularly good as a game.; sure, it looked pretty, sounded amazing at the time and i used it for demonstration to help sell a hell of a lot Amiga 500 packs, but it's a pretty weak game when y'strip it back and start worrying about the actual gameplay. i do think it's a pity that the Atari 8-bit didn't get a port because what was done looked pretty solid from what i've seen and it would at least have been a good audial and visual showcase for the platform. Me, i wouldn't have actually played it but i didn't play the Amiga one after a couple of very frustrating hours and i own the C64 version on cartridge and it's only booted once in a blue moon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thomasholzer Posted June 27, 2007 Author Share Posted June 27, 2007 (edited) Let me inform you: The A8 is dead. The C64 is dead. The Amiga is dead. Even I know that and I'm using an Amiga to type this. Maybe you should inform Retro Gamer, one of Britains best selling gaming magazines, because they haven't noticed (excellent Amiga feature in issue 39). Edited June 27, 2007 by thomasholzer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goochman Posted June 27, 2007 Share Posted June 27, 2007 Read my post! I said "it would absolutely suck compared to the Amiga version". How could it not? Shadow of the Beast even pushed the Amiga's capabilities, so how could it possibly get close on an A8? By being a good, playable game... sadly that's where the whole thing falls over because Shadow of the Beast wasn't particularly good as a game.; sure, it looked pretty, sounded amazing at the time and i used it for demonstration to help sell a hell of a lot Amiga 500 packs, but it's a pretty weak game when y'strip it back and start worrying about the actual gameplay. i do think it's a pity that the Atari 8-bit didn't get a port because what was done looked pretty solid from what i've seen and it would at least have been a good audial and visual showcase for the platform. Me, i wouldn't have actually played it but i didn't play the Amiga one after a couple of very frustrating hours and i own the C64 version on cartridge and it's only booted once in a blue moon. Glad to hear this - I played the ST version and didnt 'get it' - I figured it was a 1/2 hearted ST port vs just being a so so game Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetboot Jack Posted June 27, 2007 Share Posted June 27, 2007 As a small startup we realized that getting some products out that had a high profile would be a good way of getting our business up and running. At the time (late 80's) SOTB was an exciting game that had sold good numbers on ALL formats - so an A8 conversion was a way of getting something out the public would recognize - we also contracted Menace and Barbarian too from Psygnosis. I scoured around and landed similar deals with Grandslam, System 3 and Elite - to produce A8 versions of their hits for Harlequin to publish. Our plan was to combine that with some original products where we did not have to pay for rights - history proved were unlucky with our timing. Mr.Amiga500 - pointing out something is not to your taste is cool, just remember it is YOUR opinion not a fact. So perhaps for you A8 SOTB would absolutley suck, but for all those non Amiga owning A8 owners it might have been a great way to spend £10, and swim with the mainstream games industry for a while... sTeVE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emkay Posted June 27, 2007 Share Posted June 27, 2007 By being a good, playable game... sadly that's where the whole thing falls over because Shadow of the Beast wasn't particularly good as a game... ROTFL.... That's exactly what I think about this game. It only lived by the AMIGA Features (phantastic colour , movement and sound) and had a horrible gameplay. It also crashed everytime on my 2000 after playing it a while.... Don't know whether the chipset was the problem or the Kickstart 1.3. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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