I Love Getting Screwed by eBay Sellers

[Albert]

Well, I learned a lesson today, something I should obviously already have known--always read the fine print on an auction before you buy it. Actually, I learned a few lessons today..

 

I was looking for color toner for the printer I use to print labels and manuals. I usually search on eBay as I've gotten some pretty good deals on toner before, better than paying the generally high prices for it from most places. Well, I saw one company selling a set of four carts (CMYK), but didn't want to wait for the auction to end. I wrote to the seller (using the email link in their auction) asking if they had more sets available, that I'd like to buy a set immediately, and how much for shipping to 44052. I quickly got a response back with a quote, and I then PayPal'd the seller the funds. This seller had over 12,000 feedback, 99%, and I didn't look at the feedback history.

 

The auction picture had a picture of genuine OEM toner for the printer, which is what I wanted.

 

The package arrived today. I opened the box and was dismayed to find third-party toner, completely different than what was pictured in the auction. I immediately wrote the seller telling him that this is NOT what I was expecting and that I would like to exchange it for genuine OEM toner or get a refund. The seller then responds,

 

"Hello

If you go back to the listing and read it you will see that it states

that the box pic is used for reference only. Thanks much for your email."

 

I of course go look at the auction and in fine print sure enough it states that the photo is for reference only. I then go look at the seller's feedback and see 34 negatives in the last month, and most of them are for this type of misrepresentation. Oh, that's another lesson--look at recent feedback even if the feedback rating looks good on first glance (something I know better to do). This seller also has several individual toner carts (as opposed to sets) for the same printer, using the same OEM pictures instead of actual pictures of the third-party carts he's selling.

 

So now I'm stuck with toner I will not use, as I've had poor experience using third-party toner before (I experimented once, since it is less expensive). I now have to waste my time putting these up on eBay myself to sell them, since the seller basically told me to screw off (and he hasn't responded to the last email I sent him, not surprising). I could file a dispute in PayPal, but they will surely decide in the seller's favor since A) The shipment is trackable and B) "Is it toner? Yep! As described!" It would tie up the funds for a bit for the seller, but I doubt the seller cares about that with the volume they do. I can't even really use the auction as a defense, since I did not buy from the auction, but bought from the seller directly (so there's another potential lesson). And I can't leave negative feedback for this crook, and he knows that, so has little reason to even give me the time of day, much less give me a refund on this toner.

 

I really despise that there are so many disreputable sellers on eBay. What a cesspool.

 

..Al

[homerwannabee]

Sorry to hear that. Seems like there are jerks on Ebay who will shade the truth as much as possible just to get an extra penny. Apparently their mindset seems to be "Honesty is not the best policy."

[crunchysuperman]

Ebay should have a policy against using stock photos.

[Albert]

Ebay should have a policy against using stock photos.

Will never happen I'm afraid. They endorse the use of stock photos if you sell something like a CD, DVD or book. You just put in the bar code or ISBN number and you can choose to use ebay's own stock photo of the item.

 

It really does suck that as a buyer you have to be extremely vigilant to protect yourself from jerks like this, and that when you do make a mistake that the deck is stacked in favor of the seller and as a buyer there's little you can do. With any legitimate company (like Amazon.com or Newegg, etc.) if you wanted to return something, even if you simply didn't like it, you could do so without any problems (possibly having to pay a restocking fee, at worst). But in the eBay environment, people can make sales like this and hide behind fine print, stock photos, and eBay's desire not to step on the sellers who make them all the big money.

 

..Al

[Christophero Sly]

I'm sorry to hear about your ebay problems. I know just how frustrating it is as a buyer to be left with no real recourse when a transaction goes sour.

[BigO]

Like there's no way they could just take a picture of the product that the actually sell on an apparently regular basis. It's pretty clear what the intent of that arrangement is.

Edited November 15, 2007 by BigO

[Albert]

Like there's no way they could just take a picture of the product that the actually sell over and over and over. It's pretty clear what the intent of that arrangement is.

Yes, and no mention anywhere in the auction that these aren't third-party toner carts. Once I got his, "tough shit" email, that just confirmed what his intent was all along (not that I really needed proof).

 

..Al

[Tempest]

Is third party toner really that different? Excuse my ignorance, but I always thought toner was toner (boy that sounds like a bad setup for a toner infomercial).

 

Tempest

[Albert]

Is third party toner really that different? Excuse my ignorance, but I always thought toner was toner (boy that sounds like a bad setup for a toner infomercial).

Yes, it can make a difference. I bought some a while ago (back when it first became available from a third-party company for this printer) and there was a noticeable difference in the smoothness of the prints. With the third-party toner there was more visible "dithering", for lack of a better word. As soon as I replaced those toner carts with OEM carts, that issue went away, confirming it was the third-party toner.

 

..Al

[Prodos8]

Hello

If you go back to the listing and read it you will see that it states

that the box pic is used for reference only. Thanks much for your email.

Thats when you wanna go 'Falling Down -- the customer is always right' on 'em.

 

What a smug reply -- I bet you can't wait to order from him again. I think eBay is fast becoming hopless for buyers.

[Flojomojo]

I don't want to blame you as the victim here, Albert, since this seller is obviously a tool. But as you pointed out, Ebay is "buyer beware," just like any other flea market. You really should have checked into those 34 negative feedback comments before bidding. If you leave a negative comment, you're likely to get one in return. I'd probably leave a "faint praise" positive comment like "good communication, price and shipping, BUT item was not as described. Be careful!"

 

Here's a nice little Greasemonkey script that I use on Ebay's site. It adds a "show only negative" button to the default filters so you can see all of the red comments at once without having to wade through them. For a user with tons of transactions, it will take a little while to run, but it's worth it to screen out boobs like this.

 

http://userscripts.org/scripts/show/5060

 

People dump on Ebay because of the minority of bad traders there. I vastly prefer Ebay to dealing with printers -- darned moving parts and expensive consumables are the absolute worst IMHO.

[midnight magicman]

I wrote to the seller (using the email link in their auction) asking if they had more sets available, that I'd like to buy a set immediately, and how much for shipping to 44052. I quickly got a response back with a quote, and I then PayPal'd the seller the funds.

 

Excuse me Albert, but I think you may be overlooking something important here.

 

Because you purchased the item(s) independent of eBay, Paypal won't consider this covered under the eBay seller protection policy. I'd call paypal & tell them that the funds were unauthorized since the item was misrepresented. Once they find out the item wasn't paid through eBay, I wouldn't be surprised if they put the $ back in your account.

 

Also, eBay doesn't like it when sellers sell their merchandise independent of them (they want a piece of EVERY transaction). So you may first want to email this dillweed & threaten to inform eBay of this if he refused to refund your $. After all, it's not like he can leave you negative feedback right?

 

Peace

[+remowilliams]

Is third party toner really that different? Excuse my ignorance, but I always thought toner was toner (boy that sounds like a bad setup for a toner infomercial).

Absolutely. I used a third party toner once, print quality was crap. Never made that mistake again though I have seen others do it many times.

[Albert]

Because you purchased the item(s) independent of eBay, Paypal won't consider this covered under the eBay seller protection policy. I'd call paypal & tell them that the funds were unauthorized since the item was misrepresented. Once they find out the item wasn't paid through eBay, I wouldn't be surprised if they put the $ back in your account.

Unfortunately this is not the case. PayPal's Seller Protection Policy is valid outside of eBay sales. The only recourse I would have is to claim that the item is "significantly not as described" and given the seller meets all the criteria for the seller protection policy, I seriously doubt they would rule in my favor. Here is the policy:

 

https://www.paypal.com/us/cgi-bin/webscr?cm...side#spp-policy

 

Also, eBay doesn't like it when sellers sell their merchandise independent of them (they want a piece of EVERY transaction). So you may first want to email this dillweed & threaten to inform eBay of this if he refused to refund your $. After all, it's not like he can leave you negative feedback right?

This is true, but they still got their PayPal transaction fee for this sale, and if they reverse the transaction they will lose that. So I don't really see any incentive for PayPal to reverse the charge.

 

..Al

[Buyatari]

Two things.

 

1. The more complaints on file the more likely they go with the buyer. Even if you lose you help the next guy. Also if a ton of others complained before you then you get refunded no problem.

 

2. Since its not on ebay there is no small print to point to. They can't say what is listed in an ebay auction applies to seperate sale outside of eBay. Only what you put in your paypal payment. If it differs in description from that you stand a good chance esp if other have complained to paypal in the past about the same thing. Yes they keep a tally.

 

Also helps to call and talk to a manager.

[Albert]

Two things.

 

1. The more complaints on file the more likely they go with the buyer. Even if you lose you help the next guy. Also if a ton of others complained before you then you get refunded no problem.

 

2. Since its not on ebay there is no small print to point to. They can't say what is listed in an ebay auction applies to seperate sale outside of eBay. Only what you put in your paypal payment. If it differs in description from that you stand a good chance esp if other have complained to paypal in the past about the same thing. Yes they keep a tally.

 

Also helps to call and talk to a manager.

I may call to see what they say. I do agree that if many people have complained about this seller (which certainly seems to be the case given their volume), it's possible they may give me the benefit of a doubt. I have never had to call PayPal before for something like this, though, hopefully they have a number somewhere on the site. I remember looking some time ago and having a problem finding one.

 

..Al

[midnight magicman]

I have never had to call PayPal before for something like this, though, hopefully they have a number somewhere on the site. I remember looking some time ago and having a problem finding one.

 

..Al

 

Albert,

 

Here's the # I use.

 

888-221-1161 (6am-midnight CST)

 

Al

[Dino]

Ebay is "buyer beware," just like any other flea market.

 

At least at the flea market you get to see the goods you are buying. Ebay is like entering a flea market blindfolded

[Albert]

I have never had to call PayPal before for something like this, though, hopefully they have a number somewhere on the site. I remember looking some time ago and having a problem finding one.

 

..Al

 

Albert,

 

Here's the # I use.

 

888-221-1161 (6am-midnight CST)

 

Al

Thanks, I'll try calling that tomorrow.

 

..Al

[Albert]

Ebay is "buyer beware," just like any other flea market.

At least at the flea market you get to see the goods you are buying. Ebay is like entering a flea market blindfolded

Yeah, it's much harder to misrepresent items you are selling in a physical venue such as that. eBay is the ultimate haven for scammers who can hide behind questionable auction descriptions, knowing eBay will do nothing to stop them. eBay fully has it within their power to put police auctions of this nature, but they will not do so as that would cut into their revenue stream. If Google or someone else comes out with a competing service (one can only hope), it will be interesting to see if they allow sellers of this nature to flourish as they have on eBay.

 

..Al

[Omegamatrix]

A little off topic but what type of printer are you using Al, and what type of toner? Just curious.

[Albert]

A little off topic but what type of printer are you using Al, and what type of toner? Just curious.

I was intentionally being a bit ambiguous with that.

 

..Al

[SINGLE TOOTH]

Albert will never disclose his secret recipe.

 

Anyway, that does suck. I used to always look over every auction very suspiciously, but now I found myself almost buying an auction without reading the fine print. It's like all those sellers with 3rd party controllers, and a picture of the 1st party one. So annoying..

 

Now If I see a stock photo, I just assume it's not. I didn't consciously try to make that association, but that's how bad it got.

 

I'm slowly growing to hate ebay.

[Dino]

i ALWAYS avoid auctions with stock photos

 

Albert will never disclose his secret recipe.

 

Anyway, that does suck. I used to always look over every auction very suspiciously, but now I found myself almost buying an auction without reading the fine print. It's like all those sellers with 3rd party controllers, and a picture of the 1st party one. So annoying..

 

Now If I see a stock photo, I just assume it's not. I didn't consciously try to make that association, but that's how bad it got.

 

I'm slowly growing to hate ebay.

[Albert]

i ALWAYS avoid auctions with stock photos

It's pretty common for stuff like this. But it's not a stock photo of the item being sold, that's the problem. It's a stock photo of a completely different item. It's like selling a Ford Taurus and putting up a picture of a Lexus ES350. They both run on the same roads and will get you where you want to go, but they are from completely different manufacturers and their quality varies quite a bit.

 

..Al