Fire buttons on standard controllers just don't work.

[Tom_Explodes]

This is horribly disappointing. Put new flex circuits in and everything. All the other buttons work just fine, but the fire buttons do nothing. Used a screwdriver to make contact, worked on everything, except the fire buttons, naturally. Any help would be great. Thanks.

[jetset]

So did the screwdriver work? Clean the buttons under the actual button with a pencil eraser or better yet tape/glue a small sliver of tin foil onto the black dots under the fire button. Worked like a charm on mine. Also clean the actual circuit with a pencil eraser (then some rubbing alcohol to get the remainder of the residue off.

[Tom_Explodes]

Used a screwdriver to make contact, worked on everything, except the fire buttons, naturally.

 

No, it didn't work, as I said.

 

EDIT: Also, the mylar circuits are brand new, s'far as I know.

Edited December 25, 2007 by Tom_Explodes

[BigO]

Do the fire buttons on any controller work on that console? Maybe it's not the controller. If you don't have any known good controllers then with the proper pinout in hand and a little caution, you should be able to trigger the fire buttons at the console connector pins with a piece of wire. All of the switches in the controller are just plain old switches that can be simulated by a plain ol' piece of wire. (Or borrow a known good controller from somebody.)

[Tom_Explodes]

Now that you mention it, the fire buttons on both controllers I have don't work in either port. Do you know where I could find a pinout?

 

Nevermind. Found it. So I should just put a piece of wire on the proper pin, or what? I'm a bit confused. Sorry.

Edited December 25, 2007 by Tom_Explodes

[BigO]

Now that you mention it, the fire buttons on both controllers I have don't work in either port. Do you know where I could find a pinout?

 

Nevermind. Found it. So I should just put a piece of wire on the proper pin, or what? I'm a bit confused. Sorry.

 

Sorta. The wire needs to connect two pins. Take a look at this schematic: http://www.atarihq.com/danb/images/5200stik.jpg

Pin 15, ground, is common to both fire buttons. The buttons are on pins 13 and 14. So, on a working console, you should be able to connect pin 15 to pin 14 for one fire button and connect pin 15 to pin 13 for the other fire button.

 

To be clear, I'm talking about eliminating the controller completely by touching pin 15 on the console port with one end of the wire and pin 13 or 14 with the other end of the wire, being careful not to touch any other pins accidentally. You should be able to use the Start button then unplug the controller to do this test.

 

If you have an old PC with a 15 pin game port connected via ribbon cable to the main board, you could unplug that from the PC and plug it into the console to make it easier and safer to do these test connections. That's what I used to connect up to a proto board for developing controllers and taking measurments of what's going on at the controller port.

[Prodos8]

In addition to the above recommendations, you could also test the controllers indepent of the console by using a meter to check for continuity between pin 13 (bottom fire) & 15 (gnd) and pin 14 (top fire) & 15 gnd when the appropriate button is pressed. Strip two small pieces of wire on both ends and stick one end into the pins indicated and hold the meter's leads on the other ends while you press fire. Having a second person hold the leads or press fire will help dramatically.

[BigO]

Prodos8's suggestion would be a lot easier to do than mine if you have an ohmmeter. If the controller appears to be working, you could test the console port to confirm the diagnosis of a 5200 in need of repair.

 

This prompted me to go back and look at the schematic again to see what all uses the ground. It turns out that only the fire buttons use it. In theory, you could have a broken wire somewhere in the ground connection. I'd check continuity from the plug all the way through to the fire buttons. One side of each of the buttons should connect through to pin 15 out at the end of the cable.

Edited December 25, 2007 by BigO

[Tom_Explodes]

Did all the controller recommendations, thanks for the pinout stuff. It appears the problem is with the idiot carbon contact points. Also, apparently parts of the circuit were out of place. They've been moved and the games are somewhat playable now with this one controller. Gonna redo the other tomorrow. Probably end up getting the gold dot buttons from Best, as, like I said, the carbon dots suck on these ones, hence the poor connectivity. Thanks, you guys, for all your help.

[jetset]

Save your $$ and just use tin foil. I'm sure the gold ones work great, but they're a bit pricey.

[+remowilliams]

Probably end up getting the gold dot buttons from Best, as, like I said, the carbon dots suck on these ones, hence the poor connectivity.

Mixing the crappy worn carbon dots with a new flex circuit is a ticket to unhappiness.

 

The gold dot button assemblies also have the advantage of a better tactile response and feel over the stock ones.

[BigO]

There is a paint-on rejuvenating material for those carbon dots. I picked up some to revive some remote controls, but haven't used it yet. It's probably more expensive than the gold dots.

[Tom_Explodes]

I want to say thanks a LOT to all of you guys here. Man, I love this forum. I found instructions which mentioned a hole punch and glue or something in another thread... Basically, we stuck double sided tape on alluminum foil, used a hole punch and little scissors and put the little things on the contacts for the fire buttons. They are also slightly bigger around than the contacts, so the contact area is better... long story short, the controllers work GREAT now. Wizard of Wor with functioning controllers is a blast! Adventure II is also the awesome. YAY CHRISTMAS!

[jetset]

Told ya. Tin foil rules!

 

It does suck applying the littlepieces if you have fat fingers like I do, but it's worthwhile in the end.

[Bruce Tomlin]

Basically, we stuck double sided tape on alluminum foil, used a hole punch and little scissors and put the little things on the contacts for the fire buttons.

That was the way I did it back in the '90s. Of course now I know about foil tape; an enormous roll of it costs $7 at Wal-Mart. I've been using it for covering EPROM windows.