I negged a seller today

[the.golden.ax]

Tis the season to be greedy.

 

I bought a necklace for my daughter from an eBayer on the 14th.

 

The item came in great shape, fast.

 

However, I paid $6.50 for shipping.

 

The product was delivered in a bubble envelope with $1.52 postage on it.

 

I messaged the seller to let them know that 427% over the actual postage for

shipping and handling is both wrong, against eBay policy, and in my opinion gouging.

 

For $6.50 one would expect shipping in a box, perhaps even Priority mail during the busy season.

 

Even if they just said they were sorry, or did not reply, I would have let it go and gotten over it.

 

Instead they wrote back: Hard luck, so sorry, that's what I charge.

 

This caused me to see red..... on the screen when looking at their feedback a few moments later.

 

I don't usually do that sort of thing. I did agree to the fee when I purchased no matter how wrong.

 

It was that fee coupled with the reply, they may as well have asked me to kiss their ass.

 

AX

Edited December 18, 2008 by the.golden.ax

[jetset]

As well you should have negged him.

 

It wouldnt be a bad idea to post his ebay ID here as well to warn others. There should be a "bad ebay user" sticky in the marketplace forum like he bad trader alert thread....

[Almost Rice]

good for you. I would have negged on a reply like that. I have not negged the person that overcharged me because he was just a slightly more conciliatory and he refunded me the difference in the service provided.

[Prodos8]

I well desrved neg imo.

 

I recently purchased several items from a seller and he combined them and refunded a portion of the shipping fee without me even asking. The shipping was so cheap anyway that I really didn't want to bother with emailing the guy and getting a quote, but he did it none the less. Needless to say I was quite shocked and amazed -- in a good way.

[Mirage]

The last time I had the OP's experience and I called the seller on it, I was simply told that I couldn't neg him because neg's are solely for sellers that are scammers or outright frauds. Things like poor shipping practices, extreme overcharging, etc, are not valid reasons for giving a neg. I never looked into the official rules, but I believe he was full of s***, and if he isn't full of s*** then ebay is. Someone's full of s*** on that.

[Albert]

The last time I had the OP's experience and I called the seller on it, I was simply told that I couldn't neg him because neg's are solely for sellers that are scammers or outright frauds. Things like poor shipping practices, extreme overcharging, etc, are not valid reasons for giving a neg. I never looked into the official rules, but I believe he was full of s***, and if he isn't full of s*** then ebay is. Someone's full of s*** on that.

I would have negged him for that alone.

 

..Al

[maximebeauvais]

yes I hate people that charge the big price.

 

however, if the price of the shipping was posted in the action.....then you agree to pay the fee..... + you received the item safely within a reasonable time (less then 4 days of shipping....you paid on 14 we are the 18)

 

sorry to say that but no reason for a neg feed.....

[Frostbite Bailey]

Thats why I like sellers who charge actual shipping, none of this inflated shipping BS. I just bought a game on Chase the Chuckwagon and the seller actually put $1.76 back into my PP account for charging too much shipping; now that is the way to do business. I am pretty sure he is a member here.

[Mirage]

yes I hate people that charge the big price.

 

however, if the price of the shipping was posted in the action.....then you agree to pay the fee..... + you received the item safely within a reasonable time (less then 4 days of shipping....you paid on 14 we are the 18)

 

sorry to say that but no reason for a neg feed.....

 

In my case, it was posted in auction as 'actual charges', which it wasn't, and the item was not received safely (worst packaging I've ever seen). And according to the seller, that wasn't a reason for a neg. Ahem... right, okay buddy. But anyway, that was my experience, not the OP's.

[Captain Beard]

Thats why I like sellers who charge actual shipping, none of this inflated shipping BS.

Are you saying you don't think sellers should be able to charge handling fees to cover their costs?

'Cuz last time checked, boxes, envelopes, gas, packing tape, pens, bubble wrap and whatever else we need to get your stuff to you all cost money. Not to mention that everyone else on the planet charges for their time, why shouldn't sellers -- doing a good packaging job can actually be fairly time consuming, and especially at this time of year, waiting in line at the post office can cut a sizable chunk out of your day. Seems pretty reasonable to me to charge $1 or so over the cost of postage to cover those costs.

 

No doubt there's lots of sellers who take advantage of this and have extremely overinflated charges (and I won't do business with them), but to suggest that "exact shipping" is the only acceptable amount is pretty one-sided.

 

(BTW, goldenax -- your neg was justified. Feedback is supposed to be about informing others what kind of experience they can expect, not some kind of grade school "everyone gets a gold star" bs. So informing other potential buyers that this seller is rude and charges lots of extra in fees without providing anything in return is completely reasonable.)

Edited December 18, 2008 by Captain Beard

[Mirage]

Thats why I like sellers who charge actual shipping, none of this inflated shipping BS.

Are you saying you don't think sellers should be able to charge handling fees to cover their costs?

'Cuz last time checked, boxes, envelopes, gas, packing tape, pens, bubble wrap and whatever else we need to get your stuff to you all cost money. Not to mention that everyone else on the planet charges for their time, why shouldn't sellers -- doing a good packaging job can actually be fairly time consuming, and especially at this time of year, waiting in line at the post office can cut a sizable chunk out of your day. Seems pretty reasonable to me to charge $1 or so over the cost of postage to cover those costs.

 

No doubt there's lots of sellers who take advantage of this and have extremely overinflated charges (and I won't do business with them), but to suggest that "exact shipping" is the only acceptable amount is pretty one-sided.

 

(BTW, goldenax -- your neg was justified. Feedback is supposed to be about informing others what kind of experience they can expect, not some kind of grade school "everyone gets a gold star" bs. So informing other potential buyers that this seller is rude and charges lots of extra in fees without providing anything in return is completely reasonable.)

 

It's not unreasonable to charge something for packing and/or handling. 3-5 times the shipping cost in the majority of cases probably is unreasonable. Unless it's something that needs some really out-of-the-ordinary packing, and then it should be worked out with the buyer. The best sellers describe their charges in the auction listing, and don't say "actual shipping costs only", then charge 3-5 times that.

 

Totally agree with your assessment about goldenax's neg being justified. That's what neg feedback is for, not solely for "outright scammers". Too many shady ebay sellers anymore, ruining it for the good ones.

[maximebeauvais]

so what's next...If someone charge 1$ we should neg him righ away?

 

like someone said, handling is sometime part of the shipping price.

 

I have sent 4 box this week....

 

one cost 18$ and I have asked 15$

one cost 13$ and I have asked 15$

one cost 5$ and I have asked 6$

 

I'm not doing that for a business and I do take the time to go to postal office, get a rate, come back, tell seller the rate...etc. Just an estimation and bang !!!!

 

anyway, I'm done.

[Albert]

I'm not doing that for a business and I do take the time to go to postal office, get a rate, come back, tell seller the rate...etc. Just an estimation and bang !!!!

It's really worthwhile to buy an inexpensive digital scale if you do a moderate amount of shipping. This allows you to give buyers very accurate shipping costs and you and the buyer will have fewer surprises in the end.

 

..Al

[jetset]

Thats why I like sellers who charge actual shipping, none of this inflated shipping BS. I just bought a game on Chase the Chuckwagon and the seller actually put $1.76 back into my PP account for charging too much shipping; now that is the way to do business. I am pretty sure he is a member here.

 

Which is proof positive the whole "my time and supplies cost money" line is 99% dogshit.* Ebay sellers are pulling the scam only to cover the ebays fees which is not only a scumbag thing to do, it's against the rules. CTCW sellers don't have the fees to make up for and if they did most sellers there are more in it for the hobby than profit. Also further proof why ebay had to fix the feedback system. this guy clearly deserved a neg. A year ago though he wouldn't have gotten one because Ax would have been afraid of the retaliatory neg.

 

 

*The 1% being the few that charge a reasonable amount over the actual shipping cost. Boxes, bubble wrap, shipping peanuts do cost, but were talking pennies on the dollar.

[kroogur]

A 427% markup is crap and the guy deserved the neg you done good

[Captain Beard]

*The 1% being the few that charge a reasonable amount over the actual shipping cost. Boxes, bubble wrap, shipping peanuts do cost, but were talking pennies on the dollar.

It really all depends on what you're shipping and how you ship it.

When a seller charges $8.00 and then uses wadded newspaper and a free Priority Mail box to send it for $5.00, I think that's lame. But for my record store, I buy high-quality LP shipping boxes, which are oddly sized and much better suited for records than free USPS boxes, and those cost real money (around 75-90 cents each, and that's for the smallest size.)

Bubble mailers cost around 35-50 cents each, depending on how many you buy at a time.

Bubble wrap, on the other hand, I'd argue is downright expensive -- $45 for 175ft. That's cheap if you only need one sheet per order, but adds up fast when you need to use a lot.

And again, almost every other job on the planet figures that your time is worth something, but buyers never consider that when bitching about sellers. I pack my stuff extremely well, and that takes time. I can slap a cart in a mailer in no time flat, but packing up 15 games takes a little more time, and a couple big boxes of LPs takes even longer (especially if you add in the time needed to doublecheck the order for accuracy, make a record of the transaction, leave feedback, send the buyer and e-mail and possibly respond to questions or concerns they may have.) If I worked in a brick and mortar store's shipping department, I'd be earning at least minimum wage, which works out to around $1.00 per package, assuming 6-7 orders are filled every hour (which is actually quite a lot, depending on their size.) Notice that doesn't include the trip to the post office (which also burns gas) or the time I spent posting the auction ad (which I also had to pay for.)

 

Jetset -- have you ever worked a customer service job, let alone actually tried to run a business?

Because first of all, anyone who ever has will tell you that every 10th customer or so is a pain-in-the-ass, but mainly because you don't seem to grasp that "pennies on the dollar" adds up to a shitload of money over hundreds of orders and that packages don't magically advertise, pack and deliver themselves. I work 40-50 hours a week -- just because I do it at home on my own computer (another business expense, btw, which I could deduct if I worked in an office, but can't because of the idiocies surrounding the home-based business tax code) doesn't mean my time has no value. Every single solitary thing you've ever bought from a store was marked-up to cover costs AND make a profit -- why do you begrudge homesellers that same opportunity?

Edited December 18, 2008 by Captain Beard

[BigO]

I'm not doing that for a business and I do take the time to go to postal office, get a rate, come back, tell seller the rate...etc. Just an estimation and bang !!!!

It's really worthwhile to buy an inexpensive digital scale if you do a moderate amount of shipping. This allows you to give buyers very accurate shipping costs and you and the buyer will have fewer surprises in the end.

 

..Al

Though I only ship occasionaly, I picked up a Mettler-Toledo PS60 about a year ago. Best 6 bucks I ever spent at a thrift store.

No surprises=good.

Edited December 18, 2008 by BigO

[ninermaniac]

I know it's tough to do sometimes but with a response like that he deserved it. If he added in that handling charges would be a part of that then that is different. If not his problem.

[jetset]

*The 1% being the few that charge a reasonable amount over the actual shipping cost. Boxes, bubble wrap, shipping peanuts do cost, but were talking pennies on the dollar.

It really all depends on what you're shipping and how you ship it.

When a seller charges $8.00 and then uses wadded newspaper and a free Priority Mail box to send it for $5.00, I think that's lame. But for my record store, I buy high-quality LP shipping boxes, which are oddly sized and much better suited for records than free USPS boxes, and those cost real money (around 75-90 cents each, and that's for the smallest size.)

Bubble mailers cost around 35-50 cents each, depending on how many you buy at a time.

Bubble wrap, on the other hand, I'd argue is downright expensive -- $45 for 175ft. That's cheap if you only need one sheet per order, but adds up fast when you need to use a lot.

And again, almost every other job on the planet figures that your time is worth something, but buyers never consider that when bitching about sellers. I pack my stuff extremely well, and that takes time. I can slap a cart in a mailer in no time flat, but packing up 15 games takes a little more time, and a couple big boxes of LPs takes even longer (especially if you add in the time needed to doublecheck the order for accuracy, make a record of the transaction, leave feedback, send the buyer and e-mail and possibly respond to questions or concerns they may have.) If I worked in a brick and mortar store's shipping department, I'd be earning at least minimum wage, which works out to around $1.00 per package, assuming 6-7 orders are filled every hour (which is actually quite a lot, depending on their size.) Notice that doesn't include the trip to the post office (which also burns gas) or the time I spent posting the auction ad (which I also had to pay for.)

 

Jetset -- have you ever worked a customer service job, let alone actually tried to run a business?

Because first of all, anyone who ever has will tell you that every 10th customer or so is a pain-in-the-ass, but mainly because you don't seem to grasp that "pennies on the dollar" adds up to a shitload of money over hundreds of orders and that packages don't magically advertise, pack and deliver themselves. I work 40-50 hours a week -- just because I do it at home on my own computer (another business expense, btw, which I could deduct if I worked in an office, but can't because of the idiocies surrounding the home-based business tax code) doesn't mean my time has no value. Every single solitary thing you've ever bought from a store was marked-up to cover costs AND make a profit -- why do you begrudge homesellers that same opportunity?

 

I've always said in all of my shipping rants that a few bucks for costs is reasonable. But not to pad profit. Ever.

[Captain Beard]

I've always said in all of my shipping rants that a few bucks for costs is reasonable.

My apologies then, if I mischaracterized your position.

But not to pad profit. Ever.

I agree here too and also support your belief (and eBay's rules) that padding s&h to account for eBay/PayPal fees is wrong.

Few brick and mortar stores charge extra for credit card purchases because customers get pissed (and it's against the CC rules) and it's exactly the same thing. Paying such fees is a cost of doing business and should be accounted for in your initial pricing, not tacked on later as a hidden cost.

[nonner242]

I did the same a couple day ago, I bought a "like new" copy of Contra Hard Corps Cardboard Genny Game. Got it fast but it was crushed....cuz.....he mailed it in a plain yellow mailer..WHY?

No bubble wrap,card board in it ....just the game!

I wrote back for two days, all I wanted was some acknowledgment and maybe a partial refund for the box, not game.

I bought it for the box mostly but I'll take ANOTHER copy of the game.

So he was alittle snippy on his first response, "you got what was pictured" (which he stated prior to be near mint no crushing) so replied just asked "why would you mail this "like new" game in that non protecting envelope?"

His reply..."YOU SHOUDA GOT INSURANCE!"

I read that and my eyes started to hurt as they screamed out in unison FUMF!

And I went right to the feedback and left him a NEG and alittle description.

Even if I got the INS on it, he prob would of mailed it that way anyhow, and I know how hard it is to get $$ back from the P.O.

I NEVER LEAVE NEGS, I ROLL with most losses thru EBAY, but he was such a ass!

A "sorry dude if you buy from me again I will give you some S&H discount or upgrade you to Priority" or $2-$3 refund would of saved hime from a NEG, Anything but......"YOU SHOUDA GOT INSURANCE!"

SCREW YOU!

I ALWAYS Ship like I would like it shipped to me! It makes ppl HAPPY!

[Albert]

I ALWAYS Ship like I would like it shipped to me! It makes ppl HAPPY!

Yep, same here. There's no way you would have gotten the post office to reimburse you if it the game was shipped in an envelope. They require that the item you're insuring be properly packaged. Putting a boxed video game in an envelope certainly would not fit that bill. It sucks that there are so many bad sellers out there. You have to explicitly ask people to ship in a box and get confirmation that they will before putting in a bid. I even do that for non-game items that come in a box, as many sellers will just slap the shipping stickers on the item and not even bother enclosing it in another box.

 

That dolt deserved the negative as well.

 

..Al

[shadow460]

I got charged $5 for shipping on a loose UMD movie. That's a fair amount for being shipped in a box, even if it goes first class. It was shipped in a large letter size envelope with a typical postage stamp. That was grounds for a neg, IMO, but not without contacting the seller. In addition, the UMD shell was badly scratched, yet advertised as mint. ONce again, grounds for neg if the seller won't work it out.

 

Seller's response to my email? None.

Response to my neg? "It cost me $7 to drive to the post office to ship, and the item was MINT as described."

I filed response to that saying that getting to the PO is the seller's responsibility, not mine, and that the disc was, in fact, damaged.

 

I don't really care what the shipping charge is, as long as it is fully disclosed before the sale is finalized. Let me decide if it is fair before I commit to buy. I think 10 to 20% of the actual shipping charge is a fair surcharge for time and materials. Or just increase the starting bid a little bit and tack on free shipping within your country.

 

Also, if you buy and trade occasionally, save the materials you get when you get stuff in the mail. When it's time to ship again, simply re use them. I've re-used bubble mailers within boxes in lieu of bubble wrapping games quite a lot.

Edited December 19, 2008 by shadow460

[17daysolderthannes]

I don't even think twice about what people charge for shipping, I just consider the price+shipping the price and decide from there if its worth it. I don't care if someone wants to sell me a $30 item for 99¢ + $29 shipping. From what I hear, people started doing that to circumvent eBay fees, but that may have changed more recently. I don't blame you at all for negging him with response, that was a really unprofessional thing to say. If he was even half competent he would've said "that price includes all handling and packaging fees prior to the actual shipping" or even been more honest and just said "I do it to reduce my seller fees." I'm kind of getting fed up with some of the idiots selling things on eBay/Amazon lately. Granted, its hard to ask for good customer service when dealing with $10-$20 worth of items, but if you aren't going to do it right, don't sell it. I'm really annoyed with people on Amazon that list it as "Very Good" condition and you get it and it has food all over it or even worse mold/verdigris. I just recently had not one but TWO separate sellers have excellent working laserdisc players listed and when I got them they both were broken. Neither seller adequately packed the player (I even warned the second seller that the first one had been damaged in shipping) nor wrote "fragile" anywhere in any form on the box. When I ship out those atari computer games, those bad boys are getting wrapped in bubble wrap and getting warnings written like they're made of 1mm thick glass.

[Albert]

Seller's response to my email? None.

Response to my neg? "It cost me $7 to drive to the post office to ship, and the item was MINT as described."

LOL $7 to drive to the post office my ass. I love how these idiots won't take preventative measures to properly ship items and are only concerned once they get negative feedback.

 

..Al