HiassofT Posted November 11, 2011 Share Posted November 11, 2011 Nice! Do you know the baud rate or other details of this kind of transmission? Sure :-) Both Supercopy and BiboDos boot in a quite similar way: First sector 1 is loaded from the drive (128 bytes at standard speed). This boot-code then loads the highspeed SIO code from the drive (524 bytes at standard speed), then the software (supercopy / BiboDos) is loaded from the drive - approx 4k, at high speed (pokey divisor 9, approx. 55kbit/sec). In case of BiboDos the software is loaded in 2 chunks of approx. 4k each. so long, Hias Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrMartian Posted November 11, 2011 Share Posted November 11, 2011 I disassembled the 1050 rev. B ROM and found the transmit routine. It takes 51 cycles per data bit and 549 cycles/byte at 1MHz, which comes out to 19608 baud and 1821.5 bytes/second. I don't understand why the routines were written with the timing off, since it has a lot of time wasted in delay loops and could have been fixed. The 1050's CPU is twice as fast as the 810's (1MHz vs. 500KHz) and the only thing extra the routine does is compute checksum, and yet the 810's transmit routine is actually closer timing-wise (19230 baud and 1886.8 bytes/sec). I remember optimizing my code when I did the Indus GT Ultraspeed hack, to minimize the inter-byte and end of sector overhead to make the transfer as fast as possible.. I wonder how much overall time could be saved by doing this for any of the drives... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HiassofT Posted November 11, 2011 Share Posted November 11, 2011 I remember optimizing my code when I did the Indus GT Ultraspeed hack, to minimize the inter-byte and end of sector overhead to make the transfer as fast as possible.. I wonder how much overall time could be saved by doing this for any of the drives... Yes, this could save some time, especially at higher transfer speeds. In AtariSIO I send the bytes back-to-back, but some of the older highspeed routines couldn't cope with it (at 57600 bit/sec), so I had to implement another quirk-mode where I added a second stopbit when sending data (and of course disable this immediately after sending, so the next received byte would be OK). The code is still in there, but I haven't enabled it for ages since I'm now only using my own highspeed SIO code :-) Another quite time consuming part of the SIO protocol are the mandatory gaps, especially before/after the command frame. This usually takes some 1.5-2ms per SIO transaction, time enough to transmit some 20-25 bytes at divisor 0. Today I implemented support for 8192 bytes sectors in AtariSIO and tested it with my flasher software (I use 8k banks in the flash software, so I just have to read 1 sector per bank :-). It works really well and the speed is quite impressive - approx. 16 seconds for 128k (1 second per 8k bank), including SIO transfer and flash programming. I made 2 recordings, one at divisor 0 (~125kbit/sec) and another one at divisor 8 (standard PC "highspeed SIO", 57.6kbit/sec). Be careful, the latter contains a really nasty high-pitch tone! so long, Hias flash-8k-divisor0.mp3 flash-8k-divisor8.mp3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrMartian Posted November 11, 2011 Share Posted November 11, 2011 I made 2 recordings, one at divisor 0 (~125kbit/sec) and another one at divisor 8 (standard PC "highspeed SIO", 57.6kbit/sec). Be careful, the latter contains a really nasty high-pitch tone! Somewhat off topic, but I wanted to know how reliable you've found running at 57.6k, where the Atari is expecting around 59k at that divisor.. If 57.6k is close enough, I could fairly trivially do US in the Trak drives.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HiassofT Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 Somewhat off topic, but I wanted to know how reliable you've found running at 57.6k, where the Atari is expecting around 59k at that divisor.. If 57.6k is close enough, I could fairly trivially do US in the Trak drives.. Running at 57.6k has always been extremely reliable for me, never had any problems with it. But I also have to add that I'm living in "PAL land", so my Pokey expects 59115 bits/sec (compared to 59659 bit/sec in "NTSC land"). So it would be better to also get some feedback from NTSC users. As for the exact frequencies, and possible user-feedback about working/non-working, there are a few things to keep in mind: At divisor 8 Pokey's late sampling (bits are sampled 4 or 5 Atari clock cycles after the center of the bit) starts to become significant. Usually a bit would be 30 Atari cycles long and you'd have a (maximum, theoretical) tolerance of 28.5 to 31.5 cycles per bit (+/- 5%). This late sampling kind of shifts everything by 0.4 or 0.5 cycles per bit, at 30.4 (or 30.5) cycles per bit Pokey would sample the stop bit at it's exact center, and the (again, theoretical) tolerance would be 29 to 32 cycles per bit. So, in NTSC land this translates to a minimum baud rate of some 55930 bit/sec, an "ideal" baud rate of 58680 and a maximum of 61700 (I hope I got the math correct . Of course, these are again all theoretical, absolute maximum values, in practice you should stay within +/- 3% (not 5%) to allow for jitter, low slewrates and other deviation. When comparing user experiences it's also important to keep in mind that not all PC serial ports have perfect rates of 19200 / 57600 bit/sec. The old 8250/16550 serial cards (with a real 8250 chip) used a 1.8432 crystal, divided by 16 resulting in a baud-base of 115200 and "perfect" 19200/57600 bit/sec. Most onboard serial ports (included in those "Multi I/O" chips from Winbond et al) derive their serial clock from a 24 MHz crystal divided by 13 (or 48 divided by 26), and then again divided by 16, resulting in a baud base of 115385 bit/sec and thus 19231/57692 bit/sec. Other addon cards / USB-serial chips etc can different again, use a PLL / clock synthesizer to generate the baudrates or whatever. They might either result in "perfect" baudrates or rates that are off by a different factor. I just checked with my current PC (some 3 years old, Gigabyte P35-DS3R mainbard): the (single, sigh...) onboard serial port has the 19231/57692 baudrates, my addon serial card (16C950 based with maximum rate of 921.6kbit/sec) generates "perfect" baudrates of 19200/57600 bit/sec. So, coming back to your original idea: I assume the Trak uses an UART? If yes, and if it's exact baud-rates aren't too off from the values I mentioned, I'd just give it a try and see if it works. Chances aren't too bad, I think! so long, Hias Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoodByteXL Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 Thanks anyway, I especially love the very very very high speed on Sio. That is almost as fast as my parrallel I/O of the BlackBox! It's incredible! Hm, I remember the Black Box being much faster than SIO at Pokey divisor 0 . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marius Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 Hm, I remember the Black Box being much faster than SIO at Pokey divisor 0 . Your memories can be colored. I was referring and comparing to the speed of my blackbox, and the mp3 Hiassoft send in his first reply. That 'fastest' I/O sound on that mp3 is just as fast as my blackbox boots a DOS 2.5 partition. It might be a bit faster, but it is definitely not much faster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+wood_jl Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 This thread is awsome! Big thanks to Hias for posting all those MP3s!! Music to the ears, of people who grew up with A8. For the rest of my life, the highest speed SIO beeps will always conjur memories of "serious shit!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
576XE Posted May 23, 2014 Share Posted May 23, 2014 Cool! Finest sounds for SmartPhones! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FatMagic Posted May 23, 2014 Author Share Posted May 23, 2014 Cool! Finest sounds for SmartPhones! Exactly what I wanted them for Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mclaneinc Posted May 23, 2014 Share Posted May 23, 2014 Well these days you can just boot up Altirra and set it to the drive of your choice to get whatever SIO noise you want and it will even record it for you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryan Posted May 23, 2014 Share Posted May 23, 2014 Exactly what I wanted them for Just caught your Brian Regan reference. Have some squeeze-bottle-peanut-butter-jelly-croutons for me! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FatMagic Posted May 23, 2014 Author Share Posted May 23, 2014 (edited) Just caught your Brian Regan reference. Have some squeeze-bottle-peanut-butter-jelly-croutons for me! Mmmm scrumptious! I think I will have another! Delectable! As was the first! I love Brian Regan's material, definitely my favorite comedian. I have the "Take Luck" shirt, probably one of my favorite shirts Edited May 23, 2014 by FatMagic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryan Posted May 23, 2014 Share Posted May 23, 2014 Mmmm scrumptious! I think I will have another! Delectable! As was the first! I love Brian Regan's material, definitely my favorite comedian. I have the "Take Luck" shirt, probably one of my favorite shirts Yeah, me too. I saw him a little while back and I wish I'd had better seats since half the show is his expressions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muzz73 Posted May 23, 2014 Share Posted May 23, 2014 Man, we are such nerds... isn't it great?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Synthpopalooza Posted May 24, 2014 Share Posted May 24, 2014 Since we're on the subject of Atari sounds, thought I'd share this link: https://soundcloud.com/synthpopalooza/machine-language-synthetik-fm This a remix track I did for X-Sonic, a local synthpop artist here in Tennessee. The song is called "Machine Language". For this mix, I used actual Atari sounds recorded from my Atari 1200XL, including the control-2 buzzer, the CSAVE casette buffer sound, and of course the disk access. So yes, the Atari 8-bit is a very musical computer! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atari8warez Posted May 27, 2014 Share Posted May 27, 2014 Well these days you can just boot up Altirra and set it to the drive of your choice to get whatever SIO noise you want and it will even record it for you You won't get this with Altirra format-USDoubler-SD.mp3 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atari8warez Posted May 27, 2014 Share Posted May 27, 2014 I noticed nobody uploaded US Doubler sounds, USD is soo sad and lonely now..... boot-USDoubler-DD.mp3 boot-USDoubler-SD.mp3 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mclaneinc Posted May 27, 2014 Share Posted May 27, 2014 You won't get this with Altirra format-USDoubler-SD.mp3 There's always one Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FatMagic Posted May 27, 2014 Author Share Posted May 27, 2014 I noticed nobody uploaded US Doubler sounds, USD is soo sad and lonely now..... boot-USDoubler-DD.mp3 boot-USDoubler-SD.mp3 This is music to my ears! Thanks for posting these Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
576XE Posted May 27, 2014 Share Posted May 27, 2014 I need something like submarine DIVE-DIVE signal. My current is : "Conn, Sonar, Have a new contact bearing zero seven five! Designated Sierra One ..." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
576XE Posted May 27, 2014 Share Posted May 27, 2014 And I beleive that I'll kill all in Metro station! When they even try to hear my Incoming Call supplied by Fat Magic!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
576XE Posted May 27, 2014 Share Posted May 27, 2014 And many thanks to Synthpopalooza because of... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frankie Posted May 29, 2014 Share Posted May 29, 2014 There is one missing. A Percom reading DD disks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Synthpopalooza Posted May 30, 2014 Share Posted May 30, 2014 Well, in fairness ... I only used sounds that I could get from the equipment I had on hand: An Atari 1200XL with a 1050 drive. Altho one of the sound fx in the track is not an Atari at all, but my Alesis MMtT8 sequencer saving out the cassette buffer data for the very song itself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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